GrowthBusters Dave Gardner and Stephanie Gardner on sustainability

A new study debunks depopulation panic. For decades economists have perpetuated the false narrative, “If population growth reverses and begins to decline, the economy is doomed.” This belief has so frequently been repeated by economists, politicians, business people and the public, that it is generally taken as gospel. Psychologists have characterized the phenomenon as the illusory-truth effect, or believing something to be true if it’s repeated often enough, even if it is false.
For the first time in modern history, a handful of countries are witnessing actual population declines. The data is now available to separate reality from what has heretofore been baseless theory.
An October 2023 study conducted by Professors Theodore Lianos, Anastasia Pseiridis and Nicholas Tsounis, published in Humanities and Social Sciences Communications and featured on Nature.com examined volumes of economic data of twenty countries experiencing population declines. To their surprise, virtually every country with a contracting population enjoyed reduced unemployment, increased wages, and a larger real GDP per capita!
Guest-host Terry Spahr, Executive Director of Earth Overshoot, speaks with the study’s authors to illuminate their findings that dispel the firmly entrenched false notion that endless growth is the only path to economic salvation.
Guests:
Theodore Lianos 
Professor, Athens University of Economics and Business
Anastasia Pseiridis
Assistant Professor of Economics, Department of Economics and Regional Development
Panteion University
Regular co-hosts Dave Gardner and Stephanie Gardner are taking a break from the podcast while Dave runs for U.S. President this year. If you would like to guest-host a podcast, email us with details of the episode you would like to produce and host.

MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
Declining Population and GDP Growth
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-023-02223-7
Summary published at The Overpopulation Project
https://overpopulation-project.com/declining-population-and-gdp-growth/
Earth Overshoot
https://www.earthovershoot.org/
Dave Gardner's Campaign
https://davetheplanet2024.com
 
Give Us Feedback:
Record a voice message for us to play on the podcast: 719-402-1400 Send an email to podcast at growthbusters.org The GrowthBusters theme song was written and produced by Jake Fader and sung by Carlos Jones. https://www.fadermusicandsound.com/ https://carlosjones.com/
On the GrowthBusters podcast, we come to terms with the limits to growth, explore the joy of sustainable living, and provide a recovery program from our society’s growth addiction (economic/consumption and population). This podcast is part of the GrowthBusters project to raise awareness of overshoot and end our culture’s obsession with, and pursuit of, growth.
Dave Gardner directed the documentary GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth, which Stanford Biologist Paul Ehrlich declared “could be the most important film ever made.” Co-host, and self-described "energy nerd," Stephanie Gardner has degrees in Environmental Studies and Environmental Law & Policy.
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GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth – free on YouTube
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We made it VERY clear that Musk’s worries about population collapse are ill-founded, and that attracted thousands more listeners than usual to our podcast. How did that happen? What kind of comments did we get? Find out in this episode. And get important truths about overshoot and overpopulation.
 Plus, learn how we’ll give YOU the mic for an episode of the GrowthBusters podcast. We explain the long wait for this episode, and share our offer to listeners to “adopt” a future episode to discuss an aspect of limits to growth important to you.
 If you do want to guest-host an episode, email us your proposal. Include a paragraph or two about you, and a paragraph or two about your proposed topic, guest, approach, etc.
 MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
Eight Billion is Too Many: Don’t be a Twit About Overpopulation (Episode 73 of the GrowthBusters podcast)
https://www.growthbusters.org/8-billion-is-too-many/
This episode on YouTube (so you can read the comments)
https://youtu.be/cKPnJU59tHw?si=rmkxk4mU9YT3d5G7
Paul Ehrlich on The Limits to Growth (Episode 70 of the GrowthBusters podcast)
https://www.growthbusters.org/ehrlich-limits-to-growth/
GrowthBusters Podcast YouTube channel
https://youtube.com/@growthbusterspodcast
Dave the Planet 2024 (Dave Gardner’s campaign for U.S. President)
https://davetheplanet2024.com
GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth – Dave’s 2011 documentary, now available free on YouTube
https://growthbustersmovie.org
Episode graphic includes a photo of Elon Musk by Steve Jurvetson, CC BY 2.0 https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.0>, via Wikimedia Commons. We turned him on his side and added the fire.
Give Us Feedback:
Record a voice message for us to play on the podcast: 719-402-1400 Send an email to podcast at growthbusters.org The GrowthBusters theme song was written and produced by Jake Fader and sung by Carlos Jones. https://www.fadermusicandsound.com/ https://carlosjones.com/
On the GrowthBusters podcast, we come to terms with the limits to growth, explore the joy of sustainable living, and provide a recovery program from our society’s growth addiction (economic/consumption and population). This podcast is part of the GrowthBusters project to raise awareness of overshoot and end our culture’s obsession with, and pursuit of, growth.
Dave Gardner directed the documentary GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth, which Stanford Biologist Paul Ehrlich declared “could be the most important film ever made.” Co-host, and self-described "energy nerd," Stephanie Gardner has degrees in Environmental Studies and Environmental Law & Policy.
Join the GrowthBusters online community
https://growthbusters.groups.io/
GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth – free on YouTube
https://youtu.be/_w0LiBsVFBo
Join the conversation on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/GrowthBustersPodcast/

Make a donation to support this non-profit project.
https://www.growthbusters.org/donate/
Archive of GrowthBusters podcast episodes
http://www.growthbusters.org/podcast/
Subscribe to GrowthBusters email updates
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Explore the issues at http://www.growthbusters.org
View the GrowthBusters channel on YouTube


Follow the podcast so you don't miss an episode:

 

The Michigan Governor is apparently unaware that the world, the U.S. and even Michigan are overpopulated. Michigan population has been growing a little too slowly for her taste, so Whitmer has appointed a Chief Growth Officer and formed the Growing Michigan Together Council. Not surprisingly, her bottom line is to “spur economic growth.”
In an episode you should share with YOUR governor, you’ll get the details and find out why this news puts “a bee in Dave’s bonnet,” plus news about some outstanding new studies, a wonderful commentary in Newsweek, a crazy podcast you’ll like, and a possible candidate for U.S. President.
MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
A Just World on a Safe Planet: First Study Quantifying Earth System Boundaries
https://www.pik-potsdam.de/en/news/latest-news/a-just-world-on-a-safe-planet-first-study-quantifying-earth-system-boundaries
Gov. Whitmer Appoints Michigan’s First-Ever Chief Growth Officer (news release)
https://www.michigan.gov/whitmer/news/press-releases/2023/06/01/whitmer-appoints-michigans-first_ever-chief-growth-officer
Gov. Whitmer Establishes the ‘Growing Michigan Together Council’ to Focus on Population Growth, Building a Brighter Future for Michigan (news release)
https://www.michigan.gov/whitmer/news/press-releases/2023/06/01/whitmer-establishes-the-growing-michigan-together-council-to-focus-on-population-growth
Gretchen Whitmer Keynote Address at Mackinac Policy Conference
https://youtu.be/jTfnZbSZRpM
Arizona Announces Limits on Construction in Phoenix Area as Groundwater Disappears
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/01/us/arizona-phoenix-groundwater-limits-development-climate/index.html
Mass Immigration Experiment Gives Canada an Edge in Global Race For Labor
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com//nri/work/mass-immigration-experiment-gives-canada-an-edge-in-global-race-for-labor/articleshow/101100076.cms
Saying Out Loud What Others Won't Even Whisper About Climate Change – by Kirsten Stade
https://www.newsweek.com/saying-out-loud-what-others-wont-even-whisper-about-climate-change-opinion-1806109
Population Growth is the Main Driver of Increased Carbon Emissions, Study Finds
https://phys.org/news/2023-04-population-growth-main-driver-carbon.html
Crazy Town podcast – Post Carbon Institute
https://www.resilience.org/crazy-town-podcast/
Learn more about possible presidential campaign
https://davetheplanet2024.wixsite.com/dave-the-planet
Shop and Sell Your Clothes Sustainably With These 13 Buyback and Resale Programs
https://www.ecowatch.com/clothes-buyback-resale-programs.html
Recycle or Purchase Used Levi’s Jeans
https://www.secondhand.levi.com/trade-in

Give Us Feedback:
Record a voice message for us to play on the podcast: 719-402-1400 Send an email to podcast at growthbusters.org The GrowthBusters theme song was written and produced by Jake Fader and sung by Carlos Jones. https://www.fadermusicandsound.com/ https://carlosjones.com/
On the GrowthBusters podcast, we come to terms with the limits to growth, explore the joy of sustainable living, and provide a recovery program from our society’s growth addiction (economic/consumption and population). This podcast is part of the GrowthBusters project to raise awareness of overshoot and end our culture’s obsession with, and pursuit of, growth.
Dave Gardner directed the documentary GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth, which Stanford Biologist Paul Ehrlich declared “could be the most important film ever made.” Co-host, and self-described "energy nerd," Stephanie Gardner has degrees in Environmental Studies and Environmental Law & Policy.
Join the GrowthBusters online community
https://growthbusters.groups.io/
GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth – free on YouTube
https://youtu.be/_w0LiBsVFBo
Join the conversation on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/GrowthBustersPodcast/

Make a donation to support this non-profit project.
https://www.growthbusters.org/donate/
Archive of GrowthBusters podc

Are many vegans self-righteous, overbearing and insufferable in their efforts to recruit us? Would you believe “overpopulation” is still a taboo word? Or that human population numbers are still an “off-limits” topic at some conferences? This episode continues the conversation we began in episode 79 with five smart people:
 
Nandita Bajaj, executive director of Population Balance
Sarah Bexell, director of humane education at the Institute for Human Animal Connection at University of Denver
Paul Sutton, professor of geography & the environment at DU
Stephanie Gardner, co-host of the GrowthBusters podcast
Dave Gardner, co-host of the GrowthBusters podcast
 
 
MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
Population Balance
https://populationbalance.org
Population Denialism is Reminiscent of Climate Denialism - by Kirsten Stade
https://www.ipsnews.net/2023/05/population-denialism-reminiscent-climate-denialism/
Pro-Birth Policies Are Killing Us – by Nandita Bajaj and Kirsten Stade
https://www.newsweek.com/too-much-good-thing-pronatalism-killing-earth-opinion-1784197
 
Pronatalism & Overpopulation: The Personal, Cultural, and Global Implications of Having a Child (Course at Antioch University taught by Nandita Bajaj)
https://www.populationbalance.org/pronatalism-and-overpopulation-course
 
Backpedalling on Overpopulation – by Rory Cockshaw
https://www.rorycockshaw.com/blog/backpedalling-on-overpopulation
 
Trains, Plants and Condoms: How to Save the Planet in 3 Simple Steps – by Rory Cockshaw
https://www.rorycockshaw.com/blog/trains-plants-and-condoms
 
Winners Take All: The Elite Charade of Changing the World – by Anand Giridharadas
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/37506348
 
The Big Myth: How American Business Taught Us to Loathe Government and Love the Free Market – by Dr. Naomi Oreskes and Erik Conway
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/57693264
 
How Free-Market Fundamentalism Fuels Overpopulation Denialism & Undermines Democracy – Episode of The Overpopulation Podcast with Naomi Oreskes
https://www.populationbalance.org/podcasts/naomi-oreskes
 
President Condemns ‘Obsession’ With Economic Growth
Irish President Michael D Higgins speaks out against growth
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/04/28/president-condemns-obsession-with-economic-growth/
 
Welcome To MAGA World: Trump Wants 'Freedom Cities' Where Cars Can Fly, Parents Get 'BONUSES' for Having Babies and Huge Monuments are Built to 'True American Heroes' in 'Quantum Leap' Vision for the Future
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11818381/Trumps-2024-pitch-New-cities-flying-cars-babies.html

Give Us Feedback:
Record a voice message for us to play on the podcast: 719-402-1400 Send an email to podcast at growthbusters.org The GrowthBusters theme song was written and produced by Jake Fader and sung by Carlos Jones. https://www.fadermusicandsound.com/ https://carlosjones.com/
On the GrowthBusters podcast, we come to terms with the limits to growth, explore the joy of sustainable living, and provide a recovery program from our society’s growth addiction (economic/consumption and population). This podcast is part of the GrowthBusters project to raise awareness of overshoot and end our culture’s obsession with, and pursuit of, growth.
Dave Gardner directed the documentary GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth, which Stanford Biologist Paul Ehrlich declared “could be the most important film ever made.” Co-host, and self-described "energy nerd," Stephanie Gardner has degrees in Environmental Studies and Environmental Law & Policy.
Join the GrowthBusters online community
https://growthbusters.groups.io/
GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth – free on YouTube
https://youtu.be/_w0LiBsVFBo
Join the conversation on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/GrowthBustersPodcast/

Make a donation to support this non-profit project.
https://www.growthbusters.org/donate/
Archive of GrowthBusters p

Students in a DU ecological economics class discuss their biggest concerns and how our society might overcome them. Overshoot, polarization, the American Dream, politics, selfish individualism, and the capitalism growth imperative are among the topics explored – as GrowthBuster Dave Gardner sits down with leaders of tomorrow.
 
Dave is joined by Professor Paul Sutton at the University of Denver and students Lilia Davis, Julia Gainey, Cassienne Levan, Nathan Cox, Mikey Ford, Geordie Shonk, Elsa Krantz, and Alexandra Van de Water. Surprisingly, all the students seem to have a clear picture of how deadly serious our overshoot predicament is, but - just as surprisingly - optimism wasn’t found wanting.
 
MENTIONED:
 
GrowthBusters Campus Tour
https://www.growthbusters.org/campus-tour/
 
What Do College Students Think Their Future Holds? – Episode 65 of the GrowthBusters podcast
https://www.growthbusters.org/college-students-think/
 
Overshoot: World’s Best Introduction – Episode 57 of the GrowthBusters podcast
https://www.growthbusters.org/overshoot-worlds-best-introduction/
 
G7 Clean Energy Economy Action Plan - May 20, 2023 Statement
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2023/05/20/g7-clean-energy-economy-action-plan/

Five thought leaders break the silence on the role of human overpopulation in ecological overshoot –with an informed, engaging conversation about the subject. This is what intelligent discourse sounds like.
For thirty years, many people – some well-intentioned – have been trying to silence discourse about human overpopulation. One of our goals on the GrowthBusters podcast is to break that silence, and this episode does that well by bringing together three great thinkers – actually five, educators and crusaders on the subject. The occasion was a visit to Colorado by Nandita Bajaj, executive director of Population Balance and co-host of The Overpopulation Podcast.
Nandita designed & teaches the first graduate course on Pronatalism & Overpopulation: The Personal, Cultural, and Global Implications of Having a Child at the Institute for Humane Education at Antioch University. As a bonus, we were joined by her hosts from the University of Denver, Paul Sutton and Sarah Bexell. Sarah leads DU’s Center for Sustainability and teaches at the Institute for Humane Education. Paul is Professor in the Department. of Geography & the Environment, and teaches geographic statistics, population geography, and ecological economics.
The conversation covers a lot of ground – pronatalism, animal rights, human rights, and collaboration.
LINKS:
Pronatalism & Overpopulation: The Personal, Cultural, and Global Implications of Having a Child -Nandita’s course at Antioch University
https://www.populationbalance.org/pronatalism-and-overpopulation-course
Abortion Bans Are a Natural Outgrowth of Coercive Pronatalism – by Nandita Bajaj, in Ms. magazine
https://msmagazine.com/2022/06/07/abortion-bans-coercive-pronatalism-forced-birth/
Dismissal of “Population Alarmism” is Rooted in Pronatalist Ideology – by Nandita Bajaj
https://www.indepthnews.net/index.php/opinion/5709-dismissal-of-population-alarmism-is-rooted-in-pronatalist-ideology
Challenging Pronatalism Is Key to Advancing Reproductive Rights and a Sustainable Population – by Nandita Bajaj and Kirsten Stade
https://www.whp-journals.co.uk/JPS/article/view/819
Coercive Pro-Birth Policies Have Devastating Impacts on People and the Planet
 – in Newsweek, by Nandita Bajaj and Kirsten Stade
https://www.newsweek.com/too-much-good-thing-pronatalism-killing-earth-opinion-1784197
Population Balance
https://www.populationbalance.org/
The Overpopulation Podcast
https://www.populationbalance.org/podcasts
Countdown - by Alan Weisman
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17332183-countdown
Mechai Viraveidya
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechai_Viravaidya
Overpopulation Facts - The Problem No One Will Discuss - Alexandra Paul’s TedX talk
https://youtu.be/fNxctzyNxC0
Population Media Center
https://www.populationmedia.org/
The Green Growth Delusion – 1st installment of new series, Green Tinted Glasses – by Christopher Ketcham
https://www.truthdig.com/dig/green-tinted-glasses/
MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
 
Join the GrowthBusters online community
https://growthbusters.groups.io/
GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth – free on YouTube
https://youtu.be/_w0LiBsVFBo
Give Us Feedback:
Record a voice message for us to play on the podcast: 719-402-1400 Send an email to podcast at growthbusters.org The GrowthBusters theme song was written and produced by Jake Fader and sung by Carlos Jones. https://www.fadermusicandsound.com/ https://carlosjones.com/
On the GrowthBusters podcast, we come to terms with the limits to growth, explore the joy of sustainable living, and provide a recovery program from our society’s growth addiction (economic/consumption and population). This podcast is part of the GrowthBusters project to raise awareness of overshoot and end our culture’s obsession with, and pursuit of, growth.
Dave Gardner directed the documentary GrowthBusters: Hooked on Growth, which Stanford Biologist Paul Ehrlich declared “could be the most important film