Walking With Dante Mark Scarbrough

Dante has been cagey about where he's from, using periphrastic phrasing to describe the Arno valley without naming it.
It was apparently the wrong thing to do . . . because one of the envious penitents is going to pick up the pilgrim's (and the poet's?) rhetorical games and push them much further into fully metaphoric space that is also somehow prophetic space, a diatribe against Tuscan corruption that borders on the incomprehensible at this moment before the speakers are named in Purgatorio XIV.
Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we play with truth and metaphor in the increasingly complex landscape of Purgatory.
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Here are the segments for this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:
[01:41] My English translation of the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIV, lines 43 - 72. If you'd like to read along or even continue the conversation about this passage, please see the page on my website for this episode at markscarbrough.com.
[04:11] The standard interpretation of the allegory of the Arno valley.
[08:59] One more level of complexity: the personification of the Arno.
[11:02] A third level of complexity: so much periphrasis!
[12:32] A fourth level of complexity: a beast fable added to the rhetorical strategy (hello, Sapía!).
[13:34] A fifth level of complexity: fraud, the end stop of the Arno and INFERNO.
[15:06] A final level of complexity: The Old Man Of Crete in INFERNO XIV.
[16:33] The interpretive or rhetorical muddle after the allegory of the Arno.
[18:18] The bloody nephew's rampage: a metaphoric space.
[26:56] The pay-off of intimacy?
[29:52] Possible blasphemy in the high-level poetics.

Dante has started a conversation with two envious penitents . . . a conversation he might not be ready for. They prove more than his rhetorical match. They also muddy the theology of Purgatory itself. Is that intentional? Or are we expected to understand their still-fallen state?
Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we explore more about the two envious souls who interrupt Dante's journey around the second terrace of Purgatory proper.
Please consider helping this podcast stay sponsor-free. You can help me with its many fees by donating at this PayPal link right here.
Here are the segments for this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:
[01:23] My English translation of the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIV, lines 22 - 42. If you'd like to read along or continue the conversation, please find the entry for this episode of the podcast on my website, markscarbrough.com.
[03:23] Dante's cagey periphrasis about the Arno may not have paid off.
[07:00] The first envious penitent is bestialized as he fastens his teeth into the meat of Dante's intentions.
[09:49] These penitent shades have lots of debt, even though one soul launches into a typical Dantean diatribe against Tuscany.
[14:43] How can good things happen in a fallen world? Only by moving the fence.
[16:55] Two inset tercets show the changing nature (or fence?) of COMEDY from a theological poem to an encyclopedic one.
[21:59] This passage contains the third and final use in COMEDY of a word for "snake."
[25:55] The problem with the diatribe is that is seems to remove culpability from humans . . . or at least, Tuscans.
[28:55] Rereading the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIV, lines 22 - 42.

Sapía has finished her amazingly complex speech with the pilgrim Dante . . . or has she? At the opening of Canto XIV, we're not sure who is speaking? Still Sapía? No, two envious souls, leaning against each other, almost gossiping about our pilgrim. And nothing satisfies envy quite like gossip.
Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we explore this new thing: the opening of a canto in COMEDY in which unnamed (and unknowable!) souls just starting talking out of the blue. Be on guard. They may not be all they seem at first blush.
Please consider supporting this podcast through your contribution. There are many fees associated with this work . . . and I'd like to keep it sponsor-free. You can help you with a donation at this PayPal link right here.
Here are the segments for this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:
[01:34] My English translation of the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIV, lines 1 - 21. If you'd like to read along or continue the conversation about this passage, please find this individual episode on my website, markscarbrough.com.
[03:31] Two penitent souls interrupt the action of PURGATORIO.
[06:00] The opening of canto XIV is a new thing in COMEDY, much as Sapía has identified Dante the pilgrim as a new thing in her world.
[08:19] There are two curious words in this opening dialogue: "our" and "sweetly."
[11:45] These two spirits are apparently quite intimate with each other. Will that intimacy pay off?
[12:50] One of the envious penitents divides Dante's soul from his body . . . and uses Dante's own words to address him.
[15:41] Dante is quite cagey when he answers their question, all the while putting his soul and body back together.
[20:16] Dante replies with one of his own favorite rhetorical techniques: periphrasis. Elsewhere in COMEDY, Dante is pretty forthcoming about his origins.
[22:53] Is Dante modest? Or cagey? Or "just" truthful?
[28:41] Rereading the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIV, lines 1 - 21.

We've spent three episodes with this penitent envious soul, Sapía. Now let's look at the entire interchange between her and our pilgrim, Dante . . . as well as the ways PURGATORIO, Canto XIII, reflects INFERNO, Canto XIII.
Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we talk about the increasingly complex ironies found in one of the most compelling souls in all of Dante's COMEDY.
If you'd like to help support this podcast by underwriting some of its streaming, licensing, hosting, domain, and royalty fees, please do so at this PayPal link right here.
Here are the segments for this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:
[01:23] Reading the entire passage with Sapia: PURGATORIO, Canto XIII, lines 85 - 154.
[05:58] If they're playing a rhetorical game, Dante the pilgrim started it.
[06:54] The structure of their exchange: his flattery--her truth (sort of)--his truth (sort of)--her request.
[09:23] The envious are hard to pick out from their landscape. Is that a thematic or even rhetorical problem?
[10:20] Sapía's discourse is either textured with irony or incredibly uneven. Why?
[12:17] PURGATORIO XIII has many parallels with INFERNO XIII.
[17:10] Moments in Sapía's passage to keep in mind for PURGATORIO XIV ahead.

In the concluding moments of Sapía's speech, we find her in dialogue with Dante the pilgrim . . . who is both forthcoming in his confessional stance and also cagey with his hiding his guide, Virgil.
She, too, is caught in her own rhetoric: getting what she wants but ultimately revealing herself as a soul who still has a lot more purgation ahead.
Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we explore the final words of one of the most intriguing characters in PURGATORIO, if not in all of COMEDY.
Please consider donating to support this podcast and cover its hosting, editing, licensing, streaming, domain, and royalty fees. You can do so at this PayPal link right here.
Here are the segments for this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:
[00:58] My English translation of the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIII, lines 133 - 154. If you'd like to read along or continue the conversation, please find the comment section for this episode on my website, markscarbrough.com.
[03:18] Dante's reply to Sapía is both cagey and confessional. Did she manipulate him into this ambiguous spot?
[09:27] Does Sapía misunderstand his place in the afterlife? But how can she, since she's already figured out that he's breathing?
[13:03] She turns his confession of pride into . . . comedy or flattery?
[14:12] Her changing notions of prayer exemplify the theological problems of prayer as a Christian act. Meanwhile, she lets the pilgrim know that she's figured him out even more.
[19:36] Sapía is going to spend a lot more time on the terrace of the envious, given her joy over Siena's misfortunes.
[24:59] Rereading the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIII, lines 133 - 154.

Sapía now tells her story to Dante the pilgrim . . . and it includes one of the most blasphemous lines in all of COMEDY.
Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we look closely at one of the most honest and blasphemous monologues in the poem . . . and as we grapple with Sapía's incredible skills in rhetoric.
If you'd like to make a contribution to support this podcast and help me cover its many fees, you can do so at this PayPal link right here.
Here are the segments of this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:
[01:39] My English translation of the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIII, lines 112 - 132. If you'd like to read along, print it off, or continue the conversation with me, please go to my website: markscarbrough.com.
[03:56] Indicators of Sapía's interiority.
[07:48] Her reaction to the Sienese battle of 17 June 1269.
[10:40] Sapía's right attitude toward God's will.
[12:41] One of the most blasphemous lines in all of COMEDY.
[14:54] Lighthearted folkloric storytelling amid her shocking honesty.
[18:48] The holy man who saves her: Peter Comb-Seller (or "Pettinaio").
[22:09] Honesty or manipulation?
[23:22] The logic of her monologue.
[25:13] Rereading the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XIII, lines 112 - 132.