Agency Leadership Podcast Chip Griffin and Gini Dietrich

For years, agency advisors like Chip and Gini have implored agencies to be strategic and avoid being simple order takers. Owners were told that this shift was key to increasing profitability and client retention.







But has it gone too far? In this episode, Chip and Gini examine whether agencies have hit ‘peak strategy’ as suggested recently by Blair Enns.







They ask whether some agencies are overemphasizing strategy at the expense of implementation. They note that clients say they want their agencies to think strategically, but they also balk at explicit costs for strategic planning.







They maintain that agencies should incorporate strategy into their overall services without explicitly charging for it, and emphasize the need for balance between strategic planning and practical execution.







Chip and Gini also discuss proper pricing strategies, ensuring clients receive value without feeling nickel-and-dimed. The conversation highlights the necessity of delivering workable strategies tailored to client needs and the importance of understanding costs and pricing based on agency specifics.







Key takeaways









* Chip Griffin: “You need to be strategic. You need to be viewed that way, but you don’t need to rub it in the client’s face and make them pay for it explicitly in a line item on the invoice.”







* Gini Dietrich: “When we say you need to look at your pricing, you need to increase your prices, it’s because you have to fold in your account management and your results reporting and your data analysis and your strategy.”







* Chip Griffin: “A restaurant doesn’t offer someone wine and then itemize the glass because you’re not going to let them sit there and drink it straight out of the bottle. That’s how strategy should be. It’s the glass.”







* Gini Dietrich: “There’s a common occurrence that’s happening that I see happening more and more where people are asking one another what they’re charging for things. And I think that’s the completely wrong approach. When you’re thinking about pricing, you have to figure out what it costs you and price it that way.”









Resources









* Have We Hit Peak Strategy?











View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.







Chip Griffin: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.







Gini Dietrich: And I’m Gini Dietrich.







Chip Griffin: Gini, you know, strategy. Does strategy even matter? We don’t really care about strategy, do we? We just kind of amble forward. And that’s what we should do with our clients, right?







Gini Dietrich: We do care about strategy.







I think it’s in how we position it, that is different.







Chip Griffin: Oh, Really, the topic is, have we hit peak strategy? That’s something that Blair Enns of Win Without Pitching was writing about recently, and he was talking about how agencies have been encouraged to head towards strategy, to build for strategy, to demonstrate strategy to their clients, and he’s questioning now whether agencie...

In this episode, Chip and Gini discuss the widespread apprehension about AI in the agency world, urging listeners to embrace the technology rather than fear it.







They emphasize that AI will not replace jobs but will change the nature of work, making tasks more efficient and allowing for more strategic focus. The conversation also explores how agency owners can leverage AI to create new service models and improve client offerings.







Key takeaways









* Gini Dietrich: “I don’t think AI is going to replace us. I do think it’s going to change the way that we do our jobs. It’s going to make us more effective.”







* Chip Griffin: “One of the things that I hear is, it’s going to cut down our rates. Well, like for like, it ought to. If you’re not doing something new and different and additional, you absolutely should charge less for the things that AI is helping you do faster, because that’s what happens with all technology.”







* Gini Dietrich: “Technology is coming at us really fast, and the way that we adapt to it is what’s going to set us apart.”







* Chip Griffin: “Instead of freaking out about artificial intelligence, you need to use the other kind of AI – actual intelligence – to come up with a plan to move forward.”









Resources









* How AI is Shaping the Future of Communications (Spin Sucks podcast)







* What a pink “While You Were Out” message pad looks like









Related









* Is AI writing an agency’s friend or foe?







* Should AI upend your agency business model today?







* What does ChatGPT and generative AI mean for PR agencies?







* Introduction to generative AI for agencies











View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.







Chip Griffin: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.







Gini Dietrich: And I’m Gini Dietrich.







Chip Griffin: And Gini. I don’t have a witty opening. I just have a message for people. Stop being afraid of AI.







Gini Dietrich: Amen. Yes, totally agree. 100%. Yes.







Chip Griffin: The amount of hand wringing that I see, not just in the agency world, but elsewhere around AI.







Gini Dietrich: In general. Yeah.







Chip Griffin: You know, it’s going to take our jobs. It’s going to mean that we can’t charge clients as much. We’re going to lose business because of it. The we’re going to get scammed and conned because of it. It’s, I mean, just all of these things, it just take a deep breath folks. Take a deep breath. You don’t need to go out and disclose everything.

Are you finding biz dev harder in 2024 than you expected?







In this episode, Chip and Gini discuss the increased risk aversion and prolonged decision-making processes among clients and prospects in the agency industry, especially in light of economic uncertainties and the 2024 U.S. election. They emphasize the importance of agencies adapting by providing project-based work and suggest looking into using AI for optimizing tasks and offering new services.







The conversation also explores the benefits of flexible, short-term engagements and the potential pitfalls of long-term contracts.







Key takeaways









* Chip Griffin: “Something that agencies frankly should always be thinking about, but particularly in times like this is how do you offer less risky solutions, or at least things that appear less risky to the prospect if you want to close business in the near term. And, a lot of agencies don’t want to hear this, but that means doing more project work.”







* Gini Dietrich: “The flip side of a short-term engagement is it gives you the opportunity to know if they’re the right client for you because you’re not married to them for the next year.”







* Chip Griffin: “I think that agencies by and large today would say that they are more fearful of AI than hopeful for it. I think that is a giant mistake.”







* Gini Dietrich: “I don’t think the industry is quite here yet, but I think Artificial Intelligence is going to offer agencies a really big opportunity in the next couple of years.”









Related









* Is business slowing down for agencies in 2023?







* How to build accurate PR agency project budgets







* The challenges of project-focused agencies











View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.







Chip Griffin: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.







Gini Dietrich: And I’m Gini Dietrich.







Chip Griffin: And Gini, I really don’t have an opening today, so I guess…







Gini Dietrich: I was waiting patiently.







Chip Griffin: Yeah, I, I just, I, I couldn’t come up with something on the fly today. I don’t know whether my brain’s not working or what, but we’ll just, we’ll just have to dive right into the topic without that witty opening that I always have.







Gini Dietrich: Witty is in quotes.







Chip Griffin: Wow. Wow. Already taking shots at me in less than 30 seconds.







Gini Dietrich: You’re welcome.







Chip Griffin: Well, thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. Probably well deserved today since, you know, I couldn’t even come up with my bad opening. So what we are going to talk about though, is whether our, our clients out there in agency land are taking longer to make decisions and, and more risk averse when it comes to spending their organization’s money and what that means for agencies.







Here in, in mid 2024.







Gini Dietrich: Yeah. I mean, we talked earlier this year about how crappy 2023 was genera...

“If an employee is too critical to take vacation, your problem isn’t the employee.”







In this episode, Chip and Gini discuss the importance of ensuring that no one in an agency, including owners and key employees, is too indispensable to take time off. They explore the belief versus reality of being irreplaceable, and provide actionable strategies for agency owners to create processes allowing team members to take vacations without disrupting operations.







The conversation touches on company culture, employee empowerment, and the benefits of experimenting with practices like four-day work weeks and dedicated days for business focus.







Key takeaways









* Chip Griffin: “No one person should be that critical to the operation that they can’t step away for a week or even two, and be completely disconnected.”







* Gini Dietrich: “One of the things I like to see agency owners do is have one day a week where they’re totally solely focused on the business. And if you get in that habit, people are already accustomed to not having you for a day. They’re going to be okay for four more days as well.”







* Chip Griffin: “As the owner, you don’t have to solve all the problems yourself. If you have team members, you should be tapping into them.”







* Gini Dietrich: “Coach your team to delegate and do the right kinds of things so that they’re not micromanagers and they’re not control freaks. And that goes for the owners too.”









Related









* Should you force employees to take time off?







* What to do when you feel burned out as an agency owner







* Setting your agency’s PTO, vacation, and leave policies







* ALP 25: Unlimited PTO policies for agencies











View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.







Chip Griffin: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.







Gini Dietrich: And I’m Gini Dietrich.







Chip Griffin: And Gini, you know, I really want to take a week off here. But, you know, the show would not go on. So







Gini Dietrich: that is true. The show would not go on without you.







Chip Griffin: Well, so maybe this isn’t the best example for our conversation today.







So what we’re going to talk about today is a line that a friend of mine had in a LinkedIn post and the rest of the post is not really relevant to the conversation. But, as part of it, he had the line: “If an employee is too critical to take vacation, your problem isn’t the employee.” And that just really resonated with me because of the number of times that we have conversations with agency owners, where they either say







they have a team member they can’t have, can’t afford to have them take time off or they need to really tightly regulate when they take time off or the owner themselves feels like they can’t take time off because the agency can’t live without them. And I,

Don’t sugarcoat it when writing up a job description or interviewing potential new hires – painting a rosy picture that doesn’t match reality will only cause you headaches down the road.







In this episode, Chip and Gini discuss the importance of being open and honest about work expectations at your agency, including hours, tasks, and working conditions. They emphasize the need for clear communication during the hiring process to ensure the best fit between you and your employees.







None of this gives you license to abuse your team members, but it is better to acknowledge things that new employees may not like before you bring them on board and have a much bigger problem to solve.







Key takeaways









* Chip Griffin: “If you are an agency where you’re expected to work 60 hours a week because it’s the only way that the business can make ends meet, at least be honest with your employees about that up front.”







* Gini Dietrich: “Expecting employees to work 60 hours a week consistently is not going to fly. You shouldn’t be working more than 40 hours a week and they shouldn’t either.”







* Chip Griffin: “It’s not just around the number of hours or the working conditions. If there are other things that you know people have had concerns about, you should get that out on the table during the hiring process.”







* Gini Dietrich: “Line out what your expectations are, and then you will attract the kind of people that are a good fit for your business. And then you as the agency owner won’t be frustrated because they’re not living up to your expectations.”









Resources









* David C. Baker’s LinkedIn post









Related









* Recruiting the best talent for your agency







* Are you trying to hire unicorns for your agency?







* ALP 21: How to hire agency employees











View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.







Chip Griffin: Hello and welcome to the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.







Gini Dietrich: And I’m Gini Dietrich.







Chip Griffin: And Gini, I expect that we are going to take the next 60 hours to record this and get this show exactly perfect. We’re just going to keep going and going and going. No breaks, no sleep, no snacks, nothing.







Gini Dietrich: You will not want to see me at the end of 60 hours if that’s the case.







Not good.







Chip Griffin: Yeah, I, I’m not sure I look good at the start of the 60 hours, so probably another 60 wouldn’t be good.







Gini Dietrich: I would be cranky, hungry, tired.







Chip Griffin: But, but it, it does bring about the, the question, I mean, the agency industry has a well-deserved reputation built up over many decades.







Gini Dietrich: Yes.







Chip Griffin: For often being a very difficult place to work.

Gen Z employees tend to have a different (not worse!) approach to their jobs than the older generations do. Which means that as an owner, you need to evolve the way you communicate with and manage them.







In this episode, Chip and Gini discuss those differences and the importance of effective communication and feedback in managing and leading. They highlight the need for two-way feedback and setting clear expectations, which will in turn foster a culture of trust and creativity in the workplace.







Key takeaways









* Chip Griffin: “Because the nature of work has changed, it has changed the relationship between employers and particularly those newer to the workforce employees.”







* Gini Dietrich: “Gen Z are making demands in their professional lives that are annoying for us. Because it’s not the way that we did things, nor the way that we do things now. But I think it’s really smart and really healthy.”







* Chip Griffin: “I don’t have to be tethered to a physical desk. Our generation views that as a freedom, but if you never grew up in that fashion, it doesn’t feel that way. It feels like a tether that doesn’t ever allow you to fully disconnect.”







* Gini Dietrich: “Feedback is probably the number one thing. Once you do that, you start to prioritize the soft skills, you start to unbox creativity, and you start to create a level of trust that I think a lot of organizations don’t have.”









Resources









* Creating space for Gen Z to ‘ask everything’ will strengthen your team. Here’s how.









Related









* Managing Gen Z agency employees (and anyone else with less experience than you)







* CWC 17: Ann McCain on hiring and working with millennial PR professionals











View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.







Chip Griffin: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.







Gini Dietrich: And I’m Gini Dietrich.







Chip Griffin: And Gini, I think we’re going to talk about one of our favorite subjects today, Gen Z.







Yay! Because who doesn’t? I mean, you know, part of it is, you know, the old, we get older and so it’s all get off my lawn.







And, you know, we, when we were young, we had to walk uphill to school both ways, but I think there are indeed some differences with Gen Z that are worth discussing. And in part, this is based on our experiences, but in part, it’s also based off of an article that we’re linked to in the the show notes. it’s titled “Creating space for Gen Z to ask everything will strengthen your team and here’s how.” And so basically, what we’re going to focus on today is Gen Z and how you communicate with them effectively, how you can provide useful and meaningful feedback because They are, they are a little bit different than previous generations in how they approach work.







Gini Dietrich: Yeah. I mean, I think with our generation and even a little bit younger,