It has been a while since our last English edition of "Wie geht's", a podcast of conversations with people working in the arts, cultural policy and the creative sector, reflecting on how the coronavirus crisis affects the cultural sphere. Here we are back again with another international episode. Today's guest is Sue Kay, a consultant and trainer with vast expertise in arts management and cultural leadership. As Sue is working as a freelance educator, and researcher internationally, we will reflect on the situation of freelancers, but the main focus is the more general question what the current conjuncture means for the cultural sphere, cultural management and specifically leadership. Sue will talk about how cultural management training is already changing and should be changing, how we can best support cultural managers internationally, and, quite importantly, how suddenly we realise that we find expertise in areas and people who quite often are on the fringes of our western perspectives.