48 min
What can business learn from military logistics? With John McFall, ex-RAF and Amazon Web Services The Data Malarkey Podcast
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- Marketing
In this episode of the Data Malarkey podcast, data storyteller Sam Knowles welcomes John McFall, a master of logistics and Founder of the business SupplyChainWise. Logistics – a term that originated in the military – is defined as: “the process of coordinating and moving resources – people, materials, inventory, and equipment – from one location to storage at the desired destination”.
John, too, originated in the military, and he has deep and broad logistical experience of in both the military and business. He spent more than 15 years in the Royal Air Force, including tours of duty in some of the world’s toughest hotspots and under the most extreme conditions. These included active service in both Kandahar in Afghanistan, and Basra in Iraq.
John’s transition to civvy street saw him bring his logistics skills and know-how to the world’s fifth biggest business, Amazon, whose market capitalisation as of October 2023 – when we’re recording this episode – was $1.3 trillion. At Amazon, John looked after operations, supply chain, transportation, and logistics. Until the middle of last year, he was the Head of the Global Speciality Practice looking after those core disciplines for Amazon Web Services.
Our conversation was recorded remotely, via the medium of Riverside.fm, on 9 October 2023.
Thanks to Joe Hickey for production support.
Podcast artwork by Shatter Media.
Voice over by Samantha Boffin.
John teases out what he believes to be the similarities and differences between logistics in the military and civil domains. At a definitional level – and the end-to-end journey from extraction of raw materials, through manufacture, distribution, use, and recycling – logistics are the same whether you’re making jets or trainers. Tier 1 relationships are best; tier 3 and 4 usually the most tenuous and troublesome. Funding, tendering, and the typically-analytical individuals are also the same, as is the ubiquitous deployment of Excel.
Differences feature in purpose (profit vs defence) and also the Just On Time mantra of business logistics. Because of the sheer number of unknowns in the military theatre, Just On Time won’t cut it and the creation and storage of bulk inventory – “just in case” – is a characteristic of the military that business cannot tolerate. The operational certainties of business are often very different from the fluid operations of military logistics.
John’s detailed description of the interconnectedness of hardware, personnel, and systems in the military – across air, sea, and land – trigger two analogies for host Sam. The first – of the Wood Wide Web; the mycorrhizal network of fungi connecting all trees, so eloquently described in Merlin Sheldrake’s book Entangled Life – is perhaps a little poetic. But the second – of a market with competitors doing unpredictable things, imperfect knowledge, and the importance of taking decisions and not being paralysed by over-analysis – rings truer.
John identifies three magic numbers – the ‘Judas number’ of 12-14: the number of people who can be influenced by a charismatic individual; up to 100: the limit of one person’s direct influence by virtue of the number of connections and relationships we can hold in the human brain; and, 1,200-plus: the moment at which systems need to be in place.
Jeff Bezos’ legendary six-page memo – tabled at the start of Amazon meetings and read for 30 minutes before discussion – is John’s key for creating an effective, data-driven culture. It trumps charisma, extroversion, flashy slides, and emotional appeals every time and roots decision-making in evidence.
EXTERNAL LINKS
John’s business, SupplyChainWise – https://www.supplychainwise.com
John’s LinkedIn profile – https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnmcfall5/
To find out what kind of data storyteller you are, complete our data storytelling scorecard at http
In this episode of the Data Malarkey podcast, data storyteller Sam Knowles welcomes John McFall, a master of logistics and Founder of the business SupplyChainWise. Logistics – a term that originated in the military – is defined as: “the process of coordinating and moving resources – people, materials, inventory, and equipment – from one location to storage at the desired destination”.
John, too, originated in the military, and he has deep and broad logistical experience of in both the military and business. He spent more than 15 years in the Royal Air Force, including tours of duty in some of the world’s toughest hotspots and under the most extreme conditions. These included active service in both Kandahar in Afghanistan, and Basra in Iraq.
John’s transition to civvy street saw him bring his logistics skills and know-how to the world’s fifth biggest business, Amazon, whose market capitalisation as of October 2023 – when we’re recording this episode – was $1.3 trillion. At Amazon, John looked after operations, supply chain, transportation, and logistics. Until the middle of last year, he was the Head of the Global Speciality Practice looking after those core disciplines for Amazon Web Services.
Our conversation was recorded remotely, via the medium of Riverside.fm, on 9 October 2023.
Thanks to Joe Hickey for production support.
Podcast artwork by Shatter Media.
Voice over by Samantha Boffin.
John teases out what he believes to be the similarities and differences between logistics in the military and civil domains. At a definitional level – and the end-to-end journey from extraction of raw materials, through manufacture, distribution, use, and recycling – logistics are the same whether you’re making jets or trainers. Tier 1 relationships are best; tier 3 and 4 usually the most tenuous and troublesome. Funding, tendering, and the typically-analytical individuals are also the same, as is the ubiquitous deployment of Excel.
Differences feature in purpose (profit vs defence) and also the Just On Time mantra of business logistics. Because of the sheer number of unknowns in the military theatre, Just On Time won’t cut it and the creation and storage of bulk inventory – “just in case” – is a characteristic of the military that business cannot tolerate. The operational certainties of business are often very different from the fluid operations of military logistics.
John’s detailed description of the interconnectedness of hardware, personnel, and systems in the military – across air, sea, and land – trigger two analogies for host Sam. The first – of the Wood Wide Web; the mycorrhizal network of fungi connecting all trees, so eloquently described in Merlin Sheldrake’s book Entangled Life – is perhaps a little poetic. But the second – of a market with competitors doing unpredictable things, imperfect knowledge, and the importance of taking decisions and not being paralysed by over-analysis – rings truer.
John identifies three magic numbers – the ‘Judas number’ of 12-14: the number of people who can be influenced by a charismatic individual; up to 100: the limit of one person’s direct influence by virtue of the number of connections and relationships we can hold in the human brain; and, 1,200-plus: the moment at which systems need to be in place.
Jeff Bezos’ legendary six-page memo – tabled at the start of Amazon meetings and read for 30 minutes before discussion – is John’s key for creating an effective, data-driven culture. It trumps charisma, extroversion, flashy slides, and emotional appeals every time and roots decision-making in evidence.
EXTERNAL LINKS
John’s business, SupplyChainWise – https://www.supplychainwise.com
John’s LinkedIn profile – https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnmcfall5/
To find out what kind of data storyteller you are, complete our data storytelling scorecard at http
48 min