"The Cognitive Revolution" | AI Builders, Researchers, and Live Player Analysis Turpentine

In this episode, Nathan sits down with Nora Ammann, cofounder and CEO of PIBBSS (Principles of Intelligent Behavior in Biological and Social Systems), a research initiative focused on the principles of intelligent behavior in biological and social systems.

SPONSORS:
Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify powers 10% of ALL eCommerce in the US. And Shopify's the global force behind Allbirds, Rothy's, and Brooklinen, and 1,000,000s of other entrepreneurs across 175 countries.From their all-in-one e-commerce platform, to their in-person POS system – wherever and whatever you're selling, Shopify's got you covered. With free Shopify Magic, sell more with less effort by whipping up captivating content that converts – from blog posts to product descriptions using AI. Sign up for $1/month trial period: https://shopify.com/cognitive

With the onset of AI, it’s time to upgrade to the next generation of the cloud: Oracle Cloud Infrastructure. OCI is a single platform for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs. Train ML models on the cloud’s highest performing NVIDIA GPU clusters.
Do more and spend less like Uber, 8x8, and Databricks Mosaic, take a FREE test drive of OCI at oracle.com/cognitive

NetSuite has 25 years of providing financial software for all your business needs. More than 36,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, gaining visibility and control over their financials, inventory, HR, eCommerce, and more. If you're looking for an ERP platform ✅ head to NetSuite: http://netsuite.com/cognitive and download your own customized KPI checklist.

Omneky is an omnichannel creative generation platform that lets you launch hundreds of thousands of ad iterations that actually work customized across all platforms, with a click of a button. Omneky combines generative AI and real-time advertising data. Mention "Cog Rev" for 10% off.

X/SOCIAL
@labenz (Nathan)
@AmmannNora (Nora)
@eriktorenberg (Erik)
@CogRev_Podcast


TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00:00) - Introduction to Nora Amman and PIBS
(00:03:25) - Nathan's view that society is not ready for rapid AI development
(00:05:55) - Nora's framing of AI safety, alignment, and risks
(00:09:31) - The problem of epistemic access to future AI systems
(00:12:36) - Categorizing different research approaches to AI safety
(00:15:46) - Seeking epistemic robustness through plural perspectives
(00:19:00) - Expecting AI systems to continue getting more powerful and different
(00:21:13) - Nora's "third way" research approach using biological and social systems
(00:25:00) - Defining intelligence broadly across systems that transform inputs to outputs
(00:27:29) - Avoiding analogies and anthropomorphism when studying AI systems
(00:30:23) - Using multiple perspectives and assumptions to triangulate understanding
(00:35:13) - Translating concepts between domains more multifaceted than just "borrowing"
(00:38:15) - Learning from interdisciplinary practices like bioengineering
(00:42:05) - Key questions about the nature of intelligence and agency
(00:46:38) - Understanding hierarchical levels of agentic behavior
(00:49:32) - Aligning goals between individuals and organizations
(00:53:27) - Assessing the validity of assumptions and analogies about AI
(00:58:57) - Informing AI interpretability and evaluation with theory
(01:02:12) - Modeling interactions between AI systems
(01:04:56) - Using ecology as a framework for AI interactions
(01:07:46) - Developing a computational ecology theory
(01:11:45) - Learning from historical examples of societal transformations
(01:16:59) - Unprecedented speed and autonomy of AI development
(01:19:00) - PIBS programs for connecting researchers across domains
(01:23:39) - Seeking researchers to tie theory to concrete AI applications
(01:26:45) - Need for productive disagreement on AI risks and solutions

In this episode, Nathan chats with Josh Albrecht, CTO of Imbue. They discuss how to create agents for reasoning, reliability, and robustness. If you need an ecommerce platform, check out our sponsor Shopify: https://shopify.com/cognitive for a $1/month trial period. 

RECOMMENDED PODCAST:
Every week investor and writer of the popular newsletter The Diff, Byrne Hobart, and co-host Erik Torenberg discuss today’s major inflection points in technology, business, and markets – and help listeners build a diversified portfolio of trends and ideas for the future.

Subscribe to “The Riff” with Byrne Hobart and Erik Torenberg: https://www.youtube.com/@TheRiffPodcast

SPONSORS: 
Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify powers 10% of ALL eCommerce in the US. And Shopify's the global force behind Allbirds, Rothy's, and Brooklinen, and 1,000,000s of other entrepreneurs across 175 countries.From their all-in-one e-commerce platform, to their in-person POS system – wherever and whatever you're selling, Shopify's got you covered. With free Shopify Magic, sell more with less effort by whipping up captivating content that converts – from blog posts to product descriptions using AI. Sign up for $1/month trial period: https://shopify.com/cognitive

MasterClass https://masterclass.com/cognitive get two memberships for the price of 1
Learn from the best to become your best. Learn how to negotiate a raise with Chris Voss or manage your relationships with Esther Perel. Boost your confidence and find practical takeaways you can apply to your life and at work. If you own a business or are a team leader, use MasterClass to empower and create future-ready employees and leaders. Moment of Zen listeners will get two memberships for the price of one at https://masterclass.com/cognitive

Omneky is an omnichannel creative generation platform that lets you launch hundreds of thousands of ad iterations that actually work customized across all platforms, with a click of a button. Omneky combines generative AI and real-time advertising data. Mention "Cog Rev" for 10% off.

X/SOCIAL
@labenz (Nathan)
@eriktorenberg (Erik)
@CogRev_Podcast

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00:00) – Episode Preview
(00:07:14) – What does it mean to be a research company?
(00:10:25) – How is the reasoning landscape these days and how might it evolve?
(00:11:03) – Data quality is highly important
(00:21:15) – What’s the difference between good features and a good world model?
(00:27:31) – The impact of new modalities on reasoning
(00:29:15) – How much can reasoning and knowledge be separated?
(00:45:13) – Imbue demo and are they building their own LLMs or using others?
(00:49:37) – Does Imbue have a deal with Nvidia?
(00:57:48) – Carbs framework
(01:12:57) – Imbue’s involvement with policy and and AI safety
(01:16:23) – Takeaways from AI Safety Summit and Biden’s Order

In this episode, Nathan chats with Guillermo Rauch, CEO of Vercel, to discuss how AI might shape the future of code, software 2.0, and the open source question in AI. If you need an ecommerce platform, check out our sponsor Shopify: https://shopify.com/cognitive for a $1/month trial period.

SPONSORS:
Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify powers 10% of ALL eCommerce in the US. And Shopify's the global force behind Allbirds, Rothy's, and Brooklinen, and 1,000,000s of other entrepreneurs across 175 countries.From their all-in-one e-commerce platform, to their in-person POS system – wherever and whatever you're selling, Shopify's got you covered. With free Shopify Magic, sell more with less effort by whipping up captivating content that converts – from blog posts to product descriptions using AI. Sign up for $1/month trial period: https://shopify.com/cognitive

With the onset of AI, it’s time to upgrade to the next generation of the cloud: Oracle Cloud Infrastructure. OCI is a single platform for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs. Train ML models on the cloud’s highest performing NVIDIA GPU clusters.
Do more and spend less like Uber, 8x8, and Databricks Mosaic, take a FREE test drive of OCI at oracle.com/cognitive

NetSuite has 25 years of providing financial software for all your business needs. More than 36,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, gaining visibility and control over their financials, inventory, HR, eCommerce, and more. If you're looking for an ERP platform ✅ head to NetSuite: http://netsuite.com/cognitive and download your own customized KPI checklist.

Omneky is an omnichannel creative generation platform that lets you launch hundreds of thousands of ad iterations that actually work customized across all platforms, with a click of a button. Omneky combines generative AI and real-time advertising data. Mention "Cog Rev" for 10% off.

X/SOCIAL
@labenz (Nathan)
@rauchg (Guillermo)
@CogRev_Podcast

TIMESTAMPS
(00:00:00) - Introductory comments
(00:03:43) - Rauch's background in open source software like Mootools and Next.js
(00:04:27) - Overview of Vercel and the front-end cloud concept
(00:06:15) - Productivity gains from Vercel's front-end infrastructure
(00:14:50) - Sponsors: Shopify | Omneky
(00:21:00) - Rauch getting inspired by GitHub Copilot code auto-completion
(00:24:00) - Launching Vercel's own AI product vZero: production-ready UI code from natural language prompts
(00:29:17) - Sponsors: Oracle | Netsuite
(00:30:00) - Transition to discussing the future of software development
(00:34:12) - vZero surpassing Rauch's own hand-coded website on accessibility
(00:51:00) - Discussion about focusing on the full stack beyond just the AI model
(00:54:00) - Concept of Software 2.0 using data and AI instead of classical code
(00:56:00) - Maintaining software 1.0 while aggressively expanding into 2.0 paradigm
(00:56:12) - Philosophical support for open source and skepticism about risks
(00:57:12) - How open source software tends to quickly improve over time
(00:57:47) - Prediction that AI may "ossify" existing software 1.0 technologies
(01:01:12) - AI enabling more grassroots innovation like Mark Zuckerberg originally did
(01:07:00) - Concerns about regulatory suppression of open source AI progress
(01:03:00) - Unpredictability of new risks that could emerge like impersonation
(01:11:00) - Rejecting AI doom narratives but staying vigilant on capabilities
(01:12:00) - Concluding thoughts on embracing AI progress with appropriate caution

Nathan shares his perspective on Sam Altman’s firing from OpenAI, after being a part of the red team for GPT-4 and seeing how the board handled safety concerns. If you need an ecommerce platform, check out our sponsor Shopify: https://shopify.com/cognitive for a $1/month trial period. 

This is a developing story. This podcast was recorded on 11/21 at 12pm PST.

SPONSORS: 
Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify powers 10% of ALL eCommerce in the US. And Shopify's the global force behind Allbirds, Rothy's, and Brooklinen, and 1,000,000s of other entrepreneurs across 175 countries. From their all-in-one e-commerce platform, to their in-person POS system – wherever and whatever you're selling, Shopify's got you covered. With free Shopify Magic, sell more with less effort by whipping up captivating content that converts – from blog posts to product descriptions using AI. Sign up for $1/month trial period: https://shopify.com/cognitive

With the onset of AI, it’s time to upgrade to the next generation of the cloud: Oracle Cloud Infrastructure. OCI is a single platform for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs. Train ML models on the cloud’s highest performing NVIDIA GPU clusters.
Do more and spend less like Uber, 8x8, and Databricks Mosaic, take a FREE test drive of OCI at oracle.com/cognitive

NetSuite has 25 years of providing financial software for all your business needs. More than 36,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, gaining visibility and control over their financials, inventory, HR, eCommerce, and more. If you're looking for an ERP platform ✅ head to NetSuite: http://netsuite.com/cognitive and download your own customized KPI checklist.

Omneky is an omnichannel creative generation platform that lets you launch hundreds of thousands of ad iterations that actually work customized across all platforms, with a click of a button. Omneky combines generative AI and real-time advertising data. Mention "Cog Rev" for 10% off.

X/SOCIAL
@labenz (Nathan)
@eriktorenberg (Erik)
@CogRev_Podcast

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00:00) - Preview
(00:03:00) - Getting early access to test GPT-4
(00:05:38) - Realizing the immense capabilities and lack of safety measures in GPT-4
(00:08:03) - Concerns over OpenAI's slow start on safety after testing GPT-4
(00:15:38) - Sponsors: Shopify | Omneky
(00:17:34) - GPT-4's lack of safety measures and willingness to provide harmful information
(00:18:20) - GPT-4 suggesting assassination to slow AI progress
(00:21:00) - OpenAI unable to provide details on plans to control future models
(00:23:00) - The failure of GPT-4's "safety edition" to properly constrain unsafe behavior
(00:29:00) - Sponsors: Netsuite | Oracle
(00:29:39) - Discussing concerns over GPT-4 capabilities with AI experts and leaders
(00:33:00) - An OpenAI board member not having tried GPT-4 despite its importance
(00:35:00) - Urging the board member to investigate the divergence between capabilities and controls
(00:36:00) - Getting removed from the GPT-4 testing program by OpenAI
(00:44:00) - OpenAI subsequently showing more seriousness on safety after the GPT-4 experience
(00:54:00) - An example safety issue in GPT-4 that still persists
(01:00:00) - Speculation on what may have triggered the OpenAI board's removal of Sam Altman as CEO
(01:06:00) - Altman's "quaint" remark and acknowledgement of GPT-5 training
(01:21:57) - The absence of explanation from the board
(01:23:56) - How Microsoft will emerge
(01:28:00) - Questioning if pursuing AGI should be the singular goal
(01:32:36) - Should OpenAI be open source?
(01:42:00) - Innane regulation of AI 

The Cognitive Revolution is brought to you by the Turpentine Media network. 
Producer: Vivian Meng
Executive Producers: Natalie Toren, and Erik Torenberg
Editor: Graham Bessellieu
For inquiries about guests or sponsoring the podcast, please email vivian@turpentine.co

In this episode, Nathan and Erik discuss research out of Google Deepmind suggesting LLMs, Hemant Teneja’s responsible VC commitments, and why now is not the time for an ideological war on AI regulation. If you need an ecommerce platform, check out our sponsor Shopify: https://shopify.com/cognitive for a $1/month trial period. 

Ep Notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1nKSEPkVajUzjBAvQNUqUD3p5Pz-xaz0dp-DVR8KJCc0/edit

RECOMMENDED PODCAST:
Every week investor and writer of the popular newsletter The Diff, Byrne Hobart, and co-host Erik Torenberg discuss today’s major inflection points in technology, business, and markets – and help listeners build a diversified portfolio of trends and ideas for the future.
Subscribe to “The Riff” with Byrne Hobart and Erik Torenberg: https://link.chtbl.com/theriff

SPONSORS: 
Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify powers 10% of ALL eCommerce in the US. And Shopify's the global force behind Allbirds, Rothy's, and Brooklinen, and 1,000,000s of other entrepreneurs across 175 countries.From their all-in-one e-commerce platform, to their in-person POS system – wherever and whatever you're selling, Shopify's got you covered. With free Shopify Magic, sell more with less effort by whipping up captivating content that converts – from blog posts to product descriptions using AI. Sign up for $1/month trial period: https://shopify.com/cognitive

With the onset of AI, it’s time to upgrade to the next generation of the cloud: Oracle Cloud Infrastructure. OCI is a single platform for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs. Train ML models on the cloud’s highest performing NVIDIA GPU clusters.
Do more and spend less like Uber, 8x8, and Databricks Mosaic, take a FREE test drive of OCI at oracle.com/cognitive

NetSuite has 25 years of providing financial software for all your business needs. More than 36,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, gaining visibility and control over their financials, inventory, HR, eCommerce, and more. If you're looking for an ERP platform ✅ head to NetSuite: http://netsuite.com/cognitive and download your own customized KPI checklist.

Omneky is an omnichannel creative generation platform that lets you launch hundreds of thousands of ad iterations that actually work customized across all platforms, with a click of a button. Omneky combines generative AI and real-time advertising data. Mention "Cog Rev" for 10% off.

X/SOCIAL
@labenz (Nathan)
@eriktorenberg (Erik)
@CogRev_Podcast

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00:00) - Opening discussion of recent viral tweet claiming LLMs can't generalize
(00:03:27) - Waymo Safety Research 
(00:10:12) - Response to Google Deepmind’s research claiming LLMs can’t generalize
(00:15:08) - Sponsors: Shopify | Omneky 
(00:21:38) - Reproduction of the DeepMind research showing noise allows generalization
(00:26:02) - Helen of Transforrmers 
(00:30:15) - Sponsors: Oracle | Netsuite
(00:32:36) - Continuation of Google Deepmind discussion
(00:42:47) - “The AI Executive Order will only continue to look more foolish from here” 
(00:44:09) - The AI Scout mindset
(00:45:22) - Few humans can extrapolate beyond their training data
(00:48:45) - When does GPT-4 deceive its user? 
(00:49:58) - Voluntary Responsible AI Commitments from VCs 
(00:54:00) - Analysis of the commitments as basic common sense practices
(00:56:30) - No need for an ideological war 
(00:57:00) - Discussion of critical reactions framing the commitments as capitulation
(01:00:00) - Concerns about the voluntary commitments enabling harmful regulation
(01:03:00) - Rebuttal that self-regulation can avoid heavy handed regulation 
(01:08:00) - Self driving cars: the invisible lives you can save
(01:11:00) - Mysticism when it comes to AI
(01:12:03) - Suggestion that product liability law could address concerns
(01:15:00) - Challenge to defend rejecting product

In this episode, Nathan interviews Alex Watson, founder and CPO of Gretel AI, about the company's work in synthetic data. They discuss why we need synthetic data, Gretel’s new pre trained tabular LLM that creates synthetic data on a zero shot basis, privacy techniques to prevent LLM memorization, and more. If you need an ecommerce platform, check out our sponsor Shopify: https://shopify.com/cognitive for a $1/month trial period.

SPONSORS:
Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify powers 10% of ALL eCommerce in the US. And Shopify's the global force behind Allbirds, Rothy's, and Brooklinen, and 1,000,000s of other entrepreneurs across 175 countries.From their all-in-one e-commerce platform, to their in-person POS system – wherever and whatever you're selling, Shopify's got you covered. With free Shopify Magic, sell more with less effort by whipping up captivating content that converts – from blog posts to product descriptions using AI. Sign up for $1/month trial period: https://shopify.com/cognitive

ORACLE:
With the onset of AI, it’s time to upgrade to the next generation of the cloud: Oracle Cloud Infrastructure. OCI is a single platform for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs. Train ML models on the cloud’s highest performing NVIDIA GPU clusters.
Do more and spend less like Uber, 8x8, and Databricks Mosaic, take a FREE test drive of OCI at oracle.com/cognitive

NETSUITE:
NetSuite has 25 years of providing financial software for all your business needs. More than 36,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, gaining visibility and control over their financials, inventory, HR, eCommerce, and more. If you're looking for an ERP platform ✅ head to NetSuite: http://netsuite.com/cognitive and download your own customized KPI checklist.

OMNEKY:
Omneky is an omnichannel creative generation platform that lets you launch hundreds of thousands of ad iterations that actually work customized across all platforms, with a click of a button. Omneky combines generative AI and real-time advertising data. Mention "Cog Rev" for 10% off.

X/SOCIAL:
@labenz (Nathan)
@AlexWatson405 (Alex)
@Gretel_AI
@CogRev_Podcast

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00:00) - Intro
(00:03:02) - Origins of the company name Gretel AI and initial vision around enabling data sharing while protecting privacy
(00:05:16) - Alex's background in data privacy and compliance from his previous startup Harvest AI, acquired by AWS
(00:06:37) - Early experimentation with language models in 2020
(00:07:24) - Using synthetic data to create additional examples and improve detection of rare disease
(00:12:50) - Why use synthetic data?
(00:17:02) - Sponsors: Shopify | Omneky
(00:19:00) - Training models to recreate real-world data distributions and using validators to detect unrealistic outputs
(00:21:30) - Generating tabular data row-by-row
(00:24:40) - Pre-training the Gretel tabular LLM on diverse internet data sets
(00:30:40) - Sponsors: Oracle | Netsuite
(00:34:00) - Using an agent planning architecture
(00:37:40) - Having the agent determine when to use code vs the LLM for different parts of the data
(00:39:41) - Example use case of adapting models with synthetic data samples for long-tail cases
(00:43:00) - Using reinforcement learning to intentionally generate more diverse and representative synthetic data
(00:48:20) - The importance of alignment checks and controls while still providing model openness and flexibility
(00:51:16) - The potential of efficient, lightweight models compared to massive LLMs like GPT-4
(00:56:00) - Analogizing model specialization to specialized parts of the brain 
(01:06:04) - Using differential privacy techniques to prevent memorization and exposure of private data
(01:14:37) - Adding noise during training to blur memorization
(01:18:42) - Optimism that synthetic data quality issues reflect details not fully understood yet vs inherent problem