And The Next Thing You Know is a podcast about how our lives go exactly not as we planned them. No matter how hard we cling to our plans for college and career and relationships and creative goals, it's actually the disruptions in our lives, the wrenches and the tangents, that throw us in a different direction and force us to inhabit these beautiful, messy, trauma filled, disappointing, gorgeous, sexy lives, despite ourselves. Find us, and host Suzie Sherman, at nextthingpodcast.com; nextthingpod on fb, gmail, & patreon; soozenextthing on insta & twitter.
The banana peel is by Max Ronnersjö. Theme and interstitial music is by Jon Schwartz.
Shawna Virago Metaphorically Punches Lou Reed in the Face
And The Next Thing You Know podcastEpisode 015: Shawna Virago
Photo by Lindsay Gauthier, courtesy of Shawna Virago
This is my conversation with Shawna Virago. Shawna is an indie punk/roots/folk musician and singer-songwriter, and the Artistic Director of the San Francisco Transgender Film Festival.
In this episode, we talk about coming up in the eclectic L.A. music scene in the 70s and 80s, seeing artists like Screamin’ Jay Hawkins, Bo Diddley, and gay punk rocker Tom Robinson live, and what it was like gigging at frat parties while trans.
Photo by Lydia Daniller, courtesy of Shawna Virago
We also talk about Shawna’s move to San Francisco, and Shawna’s surprising and nourishing meet-cute with longtime partner, the choreographer and Fresh Meat Productions Artistic Director, Sean Dorsey. Since the 1990s, Shawna and Sean have done some heavy lifting in the queer and trans communities in the San Francisco Bay Area and beyond to create vibrant trans visibility, community, and culture.Read a lovely piece about Shawna and Sean in the Advocate.Musical interludes in this episode are from Shawna Virago’s “Eternity Street,” used with permission. Find Shawna at shawnavirago.com and support Shawna on Bandcamp.
Shawna Virago Metaphorically Punches Lou Reed in the Face: The Spotify Playlist
I made a playlist to accompany this episode! It’s got original songs from Shawna, along with a bunch of the artists we talk about in the episode, including Bo Diddley, the Chiffons, X, Bowie, T. Rex, Amanda Lear, Jayne County, and many more! The Spotify Playlist Is Here
Queer history, activists, authors, and institutions referenced in the episode
On Planets, Poetry, and Patent Law with Oliver Strimpel
And The Next Thing You Know podcast Episode 014: Oliver Strimpel
Oliver Strimpel in the field. Photo courtesy of Oliver and Harriet Strimpel
In this episode of And The Next Thing You Know, I talk with the creator and host of the podcast Geology Bites, Oliver Strimpel.
If you’re curious about what drives plate tectonics, or about the composition of rocks and the amazing amount of information they contain about Earth’s prehistoric climates, if you’ve ever wondered what shapes a mountain ridge, or a canyon, Geology Bites is a podcast for the geoscience informed and the just curious alike!In the episode, we talk about the path Oliver has taken from his childhood in India, marveling in the Himalayas, to his PhD work in astrophysics studying galaxy clusters.
Oliver then worked at the Science Museum in London, and parlayed that work to his move to the United States in the 1980s to direct the Computer Museum in Boston. Oliver’s career path then took a sharp turn to patent law, and we talk about how the language of patents is kind of like poetry, and helps with podcast editing, as it turns out. Through it all, Oliver is driven by genuine curiosity and joy in learning about how the cosmos works, and the ingenuity humans use to understand it.
Find Oliver’s podcast Geology Bites at geologybites.com or in your podcast app.
Continuity and correction
A note on the timing of this episode and some corrections: At the beginning of the episode, Oliver says he started his podcast “last July” and that really means July of 2020, because it was already July of 2021 when we sat down together to talk. Later on, Oliver mentions that he’s about to publish episode number 37, which was his conversation with guest, Steve D’Hondt, about 100-million-year-old bacterial colonies living in the abyssal clay at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean.
That episode of Geology Bites was also posted back in July of 2021. Geology Bites is soon to break 60 episodes. I am posting this episode of And The Next Thing You Know several months after Oliver and I sat down to talk, so the time registry between our conversation and this episode are out of sync. My apologies for the continuity confusion.One more correction, also at the beginning of the episode, Oliver guesses that Nanga Parbat is about the “fifth or sixth” highest peak in the world; it is in fact, the ninth highest peak.
Speaking Up and F*****g Up with Kati Douglas
And The Next Thing You Know podcastEpisode 013: Kati Douglas
Arlene Easterwood Photography
Early childhood educator and photographer Kati Douglas and I talk about her career in the education field and what her first few years in leadership were like. We talk about what it’s like to deal with white supremacy as a biracial Black mom of Black kids with a Black partner. We also talk about how her struggle with postpartum depression catalyzed a radical career path change, and how she puts equity and justice at the center of all her work.
You can find Kati’s absolutely gorgeous photography atxilophotography.com and @xilophotography on instagram.
Themes we discuss in the episode
Early childhood education, leadership in education, San Francisco, Oakland, post-partum depression, self-care, mental health, parenting, photography, career path, career transitions, relationships, Black Lives Matter, institutional oppression in education, Black experience in parenting, making art, grief.
References we talked about in the episode
The wonderful Buen Dia Family School, serving preschoolers in the Mission in San Francisco. Kati’s principal at Flynn Elementary in San Francisco was Dr. Karling Aguilera-Fort, now a superintendent of schools in Southern California.We talk in the episode about the acquittal of Treyvon Martin’s murderer, and about the murder of George Floyd, and the Black Lives Matter movement. Learn BLM herstory here.
Thank you to ALL my patrons for making this podcast happen, and for making it better! And a special shout out, as always, to my Failure and Redemption level patrons: Noah, Melissa, Marck, Lisa, Kurt, Kristina, Jen, Jeannie, Heather, Elyse, Liz, Eidell, Bonnie, Barry, and Amy, and to my Serendipity level patrons: Steve and Cyndi, Micharelle, Laurie, Kristi, Dorian, Brittany and Jodi.You, too, can become a patron of the show at patreon.com/nextthingpod. Patrons now get billed only when I release an episode, so you won’t even get billed monthly! Set it and forget it, and I’ll give you a heads-up before you get charged. This is a one-person operation,
Dana Morrigan Sings in Her Own Voice
And The Next Thing You Know podcastEpisode 012: Dana Morrigan, epic karaoke host
Photo of Dana Morrigan by Tristan Crane, from their series Here Portraits.
Today, I talk with Dana Morrigan, wonderful human, wry wit, queer nonbinary transfeminine spoken word artist, writer, performer, and epic karaoke host! It’s about her quest for self-knowledge across many parts of her life: in her cultural affiliations, in her work, in her relationships, in her gender and sexuality, in finding her creative callings. And the through-line is really that the process of finding ourselves is lifelong, and, if you’re doing it right, you can help other people find themselves, too.
Themes we talked about in the podcast
We talked about: growing up in the Catskills of the ‘60s and ‘70s; identifying with cultural outlaws like Tiny Tim and Harpo Marx, and identifying with genderfluid and sexually free hippie culture; we talked comedy and improv; performance; writing, both creatively and professionally; copywriting; the demands of academia; heteronormative relationship expectations; gender and sexual discovery; finding the language to better understand oneself; the lifelong project of integrating one’s sense of self and belonging; finding and creating community; queer and trans performance; queer open mic; karaoke…and so many other things!
Keep up with Dana’s karaoke, spoken word, and other creative projects on her social channels! Karaoke With Dana on Facebook@KaraokeWithDana on Instagram and @KaraokeWithDana on Twitter
Dana's performance history
One of the main open mic events Dana performed at was The SF Queer Open Mic. They no longer hold events, but you can still find the community and archive online.Dana also participated in the Fresh Meat Festival of Trans and Queer Performance.
I Was a Conservative Christian. Now, I’m a Polytheist Clown Nun.
And The Next Thing You Know podcastEpisode 011: Kurt Granzow/Sister Krissy Fiction
Kurt Granzow and his inner beast!
Coming out as a conservative Christian, and gay, at the same time
Kurt Granzow came into himself as a gay man at the same time that he found support as a conservative Christian in a Lutheran community in the San Francisco Bay Area in the early ’90s. What came next was a decade of communion and pursuit of ministry within the church, all the while denying his own need to express his true sexuality and capacities for an authentic kind of personal, queer love in his life. This included a heterosexual marriage and divorce, an inner reconciliation of the pain in himself and the pain he caused others, and a project moving forward of personal accountability and operating, literally, in good faith.He’s spent the last two decades finding queer and spiritual community outside the church, and is now also known as Sister Krissy Fiction of the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence, an international order of queer nuns “promelgating universal joy and expiating stigmatic guilt!”
Kurt as Sister Krissy Fiction of the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence
Themes we talked about in the podcast
Coming out as gay in the early ’90s; coming out as a conservative Christian; conservative Lutheranism and conservative Christian theology; the so-called “ex-gay” movement; LGBTQ parents; pressure in the church toward heterosexual marriage; missionary travel; being closeted; September 11; Portland, Oregon; exploring liberal Christianity, paganism, and neo-paganism; the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence; gay and trans Pride; examining and leveraging white cis privilege to work against oppression of people of color and trans folks.
Cultural references in the episode
Why Morrissey is a dickA good summary from Forbes about how J.K. Rowling confirmed her commitment to trans exclusionCrystal Frasier on TwitterThe downfall of Exodus International, and the “ex-gay” movementThe Sisters of Perpetual Indulgencea href="http://wehoville.com/2020/04/07/the-radical-faeries-at-40-rainbow-capitalism-or-queer-liberat...
And The Next Thing You Know podcastEpisode 010: Shawn Drinks from a Lucky Fountain
When I pitched my guest, Shawn, about coming onto the show, my original idea was just talking to her about her career change from being a lawyer to becoming a psychotherapist. She counter-pitched me a story that I couldn’t resist.She said, and I’m paraphrasing, “Let me tell you about that time I drank from a lucky fountain.” And from here our story departs. This conversation is about several consequential events in Shawn’s life. The subjects are emotionally heavy, but there is so much joy and levity and emotional wisdom that Shawn brings to her story. This conversation just glows.
Themes we talked about in the episode
Psychology, therapy, mental health, spirituality, travel, family, queer families, marriage, relationships, breakups, parenting, pregnancy, abortion, grief, adoption, adoptee experience, career path, queer, lgbt, lgbtqqia, Bay Area, Hawaii, Spain.
References in the episode
The fountain at CovadongaShawn’s Your Fellow Traveler pagePsychology and spiritual frameworks referenced in the episode: Attachment theoryCognitive behavioral therapyPsychodynamic approach Wilhelm Reich/Reichian psychotherapyCore shamanismDiamond ApproachJudith Blackstone
Thanks so much to all my patrons for the support you give me at any level. You’re doing it! You help make this show happen, and I appreciate you so much! And, as always, a particular shout out goes out to my Failure & Redemption level patrons: Bonita, Barry, Liz, Jen, Melissa, Noah, Elyse, Amy, Jeannie, and Heather, and my Serendipity level patrons: Dorian, Emily and Brittany.
We are And The Next Thing You Know
Our official HQ is atnextthingpodcast dot comwhere you’ll find complete transcripts and detailed show notes for every episode, all the social links and subscribe buttons, and the archive of every episode.
Support the show by becoming a patron!patreon dot com/nextthingpodJoin the discussionfacebook dot com/nextthingpodInstagram dot com/soozenextthing
Heartfelt, honest storytelling
Relatable people telling the stories of the twisty paths of their lives. It's a window into the ways that each of our lives is unique despite the apparent similarities. As the stories unfold it becomes very clear how the person sharing was shaped by the events that led them where they are.
Suzie's interview style is gentle but just probing enough to turn over stones. Delightful!
I enjoyed Nannette’s episode as a student and admirer of death in all its many manifestations ( currently working on a book ). I have never heard of a death doula but it totally makes sense . I might want to talk about dying with Nannette myself !
I am also at a fork in the career path - in contemplation of a minor tweek to my long term path out of need for more job satisfaction and joy and time to think . I’m a woman of a zillion jobs too and I can relate and also find myself inspired at a time where other people’s reaction to the possibility I am working on has been less than .
Suzie does such good interviews. The Janessa episode brought tears to my eyes and made me laugh. So good.