Conversational Selling Nancy Calabrese

About Nancy Zare: Dr. Nancy Zare is a sales psychologist, holding an MSW in Organizational Planning and Development and a Ph.D. in Social Work and Organizational Development from Boston College. She is also a founder of multiple ventures, including Rapport Builderz, which helps salespeople develop relationships with prospects that lead to new business, and the author of several books. She helps her clients learn the right words and know the right approach to attract new businesses without appearing "sales-y." Using her knowledge of human behavior and experience in sales, she started Rapport Builderz, where she advises service-based entrepreneurs on how to prospect online, generate leads, open sales conversations, follow up, and get hired. Check out the latest episode of our Conversational Selling podcast to learn more about Nancy.

In this episode, Nancy and Nancy Zare discuss the following:
• AlikeAbility™ System for turning prospects into clients
• Four personality styles and how they influence communication and decision-making
• Techniques for quickly identifying a prospect's communication style
• The intersection of psychology and sales
• Use of spirituality to enhance communication and connection in sales
• Emphasis on focusing on the buyer's perspective rather than just the selling process

Key Takeaways:
o Once you know their style, you're ready to connect their language quickly and authentically, which can translate into doing business together.
o The more you understand how that buyer makes decisions, the better you can communicate with them in a language they understand and can embrace.
o My focus is on how buyers buy, not how to sell.
o Talk so your buyer says: "Wow, I feel comfortable with you!"
"I've discovered that there are four different ways that people are hardwired, and they communicate and make decisions based on one of four personality styles. And they actually coordinate with the quadrants of the brain. And so, when you speak to people in general, it turns out that you're only connecting maybe 25 % of the time with someone. The other 75%, you're not speaking their language. Hence, your words fall flat, and you're not making connections. " – NANCY
" I was born a psychologist. It's true. My parents had a stormy marriage, and I was the youngest child, the only girl in this family. And I watched these adults and my older brothers. I mean, everybody was in a tizzy. And so, I was watching all of this, trying to figure out my place in this, you know, family. And it turns out that around the age of 10, I saw a TV show with an idea of how to get people to get along. So, I tried it on my folks. And I did, and they let me, which is a surprise, but I think it indicates, Nancy, just how distraught they were with their own relationship. Or maybe they saw something in their daughter that suggested I could help them. At the end of this conversation, I turned to my Dad; both parents were present, and both were native-born, English-speaking adults. I translated and said to my Dad, "This is what Mom needs you to do so she'll feel loved." And I turned to my Mom and said, "And this is what Dad needs for you to do so he will feel respected." And notice the words changed, and that's because Mom was the I in DISC. She was the one who needed lots of love, attention, you know, that sort of thing. And Dad was much more the S. He needed respect. He needed a system." – NANCY
"Well, spirituality is definitely a big part of who I am. I may have majored in psychology, but I minored in philosophy. So, I've always been intrigued by understanding, you know, what's the meaning of it all and, you know, what's going on behind me. And, by the way, that's very typical of the I. The I tends to be one of those, you know, thinking in the stratosphere and thinking about doing things of significance beyond self. And so, spirituality to me is important because it allows me to connect again in an authentic way, to bring my heart,

About Ryan Pollyniak: Ryan Pollyniak is a Cloud Transformation Executive at Western Computer, a Microsoft Gold Partner specializing in Microsoft Dynamics 365 Cloud solutions. Ryan is a seasoned sales professional with a rich background in the Microsoft Dynamics space. Before joining Western Computer in 2015, Ryan spent significant time with an ISV (add-on solution) in the Microsoft Dynamics ecosystem, working closely with partners to sell products to companies using Microsoft Dynamics. Catering to medium- to enterprise-sized businesses, Ryan is well-versed in ERP and CRM strategies and is heavily involved in the Microsoft Dynamics Channel. Check out the latest episode of our Conversational Selling podcast to learn more about Ryan.

In this episode, Nancy and Ryan discuss the following:

• Understanding ISVs in the Microsoft Dynamics Space
• Aligning sales and marketing strategies for success
• Prioritizing ideal prospects and avoiding shotgun approaches
• The importance of transparency and alignment in sales conversations
• Critical strategies for ensuring customer satisfaction in complex engagements
• The role of CRM in organizational success

Key Takeaways:
o Building that network in a closed ecosystem is a continuous act.
o You can never let your ego or feelings get in the way of treating people correctly because they will come back around.
o If you sell people things that they don't need, it'll come back to bite you.
o We're not satisfied if we don't have a satisfied customer at the end of an engagement.
"And there's a great book out there called Essentialism that focuses on how well some organizations have done that in the past to great effect. So, when taking that line of thought, you want to ensure that your marketing messaging and target audience align with the projects you want to bring in as an organization and what you want your salespeople to follow up on. Otherwise, you end up with a shotgun approach of, you know, getting all kinds of leads in terms of high volume and high quantity, but maybe not particularly the type of companies that you would want to be working with. And that leads to your salespeople getting frustrated, sorting through endless low-value leads. There's a huge cost to that organization." – RYAN
"I don't try to convince people very much, which sounds a little bit silly in a sales scenario, but I'm not a big believer in really trying to persuade as much as I am trying to help prospective clients understand once I've identified that we have a good fit and I understand what the client is looking for. It's really about explaining that and making sure that they understand why I am in the position I'm in with all my experience in this industry and why I think the solution is a good fit. And I've had people tell me right out of the gate, 'We're trying to narrow down prospective vendors. Give me the short story; why should I go with you guys?' And I say, my answer to that, Nancy, is, and it takes people back sometimes, is, 'I don't know that we are the right fit yet. Can we talk a little bit more?'" – RYAN
" Be honest with people and do what you're good at. Don't try to be all things to everyone, and keep yourself organized in your CRM. That's critical. If your boss is asking you to update CRM or if you're the boss and you're asking people to update CRM, I'm a big believer in systems. Nobody—I can't speak for everybody, but I can't keep everything straight in my head or on paper. I need systems, I need reminders, I need processes. And I think any good salesperson is going to follow those. Any good sales organization will have best practices established in terms of how to use the system and get the most out of it. So don't fight CRM. It is there to help." – RYAN
Connect with Ryan Pollyniak:
o LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/microsoftdynamicssolutions/
o Western Computer: https://www.westerncomputer.com/
Try Our Proven, 3-Step System, Guaranteeing Accountability and Tran

About Carlos A. Alvarenga: Carlos A. Alvarenga is an independent researcher, writer, and coach. His new book, "The Rules of Persuasion: How the World's Greatest Communicators Convince, Inspire, Lead—and, Sometimes, Deceive" (Post Hill Press, 2023), not only explains how persuasion works in all forms of human communication but also presents a clear and effective model that can be used in both personal and professional lives. Before his current roles, Carlos was the Executive Director of World 50 Labs, the member-innovation team at World 50, Inc. Before that, he served as a Principal in Ernst & Young's Advisory Practice and as a Managing Director at Accenture. Additionally, he was an adjunct professor at the Robert H. Smith School of Business at the University of Maryland. Currently, Carlos is pursuing his Ph.D. in language, writing, and rhetoric at the University of Maryland. Check out the latest episode of our Conversational Selling podcast to learn more about Carlos.

In this episode, Nancy and Carlos discuss the following:
• What motivated Carlos to become an expert in persuasion
• Importance of defining persuasion and its application in leadership
• The impact of persuasion on sales effectiveness
• The distinction between coercion, manipulation, and persuasion
• The potential for persuasion to be used for both good and evil
• Exploring the dark side of persuasion with historical examples

Key Takeaways:
o It's hard to be good at something you can't define.
o Persuasion is a fundamental human activity.
o Persuasion is getting someone to willingly, rationally, and ultimately control their faculties and accept that what you say is true.
o And the opposite of persuasion is coercion. If I explain to you why doing something is a good thing, that's persuasion. If I trick you, that's manipulation.
"I explained in the book that if we take these three modes—character, argument, and emotion—we can divide each into seven elements. So, the seven parts of character include, for example, the language you use, your history, where you come from, and these kinds of things. There are seven elements of argument: evidence, logic, and witnesses. Then, there are seven kinds of emotion: positive, negative, contemplative, etc. When I had these 21 elements, I needed a metaphor to help clarify it for me and the reader. I went back to high school chemistry and said, it's like a periodic table. Every message I've ever looked at, and I've looked at thousands, combines these 21 elements. So that's step one. It's like learning chemistry, right, Nancy? First, start with elements like carbon, hydrogen, and whatever else you will use. Then, you learn some very simple formulas. Learn the elements that work for you, which ones you feel comfortable working with, and which you like to work with, and then start putting them to work. Within an hour of coaching, I've seen people become better at this because they now understand that if they use their origin as one of the elements, people will want to believe them more." – CARLOS
"Logic is one of the seven elements of argument, so it's on the periodic table. It certainly can be used, right? And people who are doctors and scientists often use logic to persuade. We have broadly spoken about two types of education. If you want to use logic, you can become a philosopher, right? And become a logician and get a PhD in logic. You can become a lawyer. Lawyers also get trained in the use of logic to persuade. But it's one of the 21 elements. We are often persuaded, and we are more often persuaded, I think, by other things. Because you must go to specialized schools to use argument well, most people are not experts at it, either in creating or receiving logical persuasion. So, we tend to be persuaded more by character, for example, or emotion. They operate in different ways. And so, logic is certainly helpful. But I always challenge executives. I say I want you to start persuading me using nothing

About Hamish Knox: Hamish Knox is a member of the global Sandler network. Hamish supports private organizations in Southern Alberta create and maintain a scalable, repeatable, consistent sales engines and an engaged, motivated team by holding them accountable to implementing the structures, systems, and processes shared in our sessions. Before joining the Sandler network, Hamish worked in various industries, including media, communication services, software, and professional sports, which melded his passions for sales and education. Hamish was named the 2020 David H. Sandler Award winner, Sandler's highest honor, becoming the first Canadian trainer to receive that award. He was the first two-time author in the Sandler network, writing books on topics no one likes to talk about. His first book was on Accountability the Sandler Way, and his second on Change the Sandler Way. Sandler Home Office regularly invites Hamish to speak at Sandler's train-the-trainer conferences and Sandler's public Sales and Leadership Summit in Orlando. Check out the latest episode of our Conversational Selling podcast to learn more about Hamish.

In this episode, Nancy and Hamish discuss the following:
• Hamish's motivation to move to Sandler
• The importance of having systems in place for success by design, rather than success by default, in sales organizations
• Differentiating on how you sell, not what you sell
• The value of David H. Sandler Award
• Accountability and the fear of change in sales
• The importance of making the conversation about the buyer and not about the seller's needs

Key Takeaways:
o Without systems, it's very much, you know, flying by the seat of your pants, which is a cliche that gets bandied about.
o Sandler is not just about a bunch of cheesy lines or techniques or saying these seven things; you'll always get the meeting or the order.
o If we don't have accountability, if we don't have the boundaries defined, our salespeople are going to make it up.
o I genuinely love what I do.
"You know, people, what's the cliche about people fear three things: death, taxes, and change? Because our brains are wired to keep us safe, which usually means stuck. Because no matter where you believe that we all came from, whoever, you know, the listeners out there, wherever you believe that humanity emerged from, ultimately, our brains are still wired that way, right? Our brains are still looking for the lions and the saber-toothed tigers that are going to eat us. And so, ultimately, change used to mean that you died, or you went hungry, and then you died. So, you were dead, but you were just more or less full in your stomach when you died. And so, our brains are still back there. So, no one likes change. And the book Change the Sandler Way is really about the human side of change because, ultimately, Nancy, change is super simple. Like, it's, we don't have a CRM today, we do have a CRM tomorrow. That's change. Human beings don't change, they transition, and transition is almost like the five stages of grief. And so that book is all about how we support leaders who go through these same emotions well before their team members actually manage a successful change. I recently saw that 89% of all corporate change initiatives fail. Yeah, like it was a number that blew my mind. And you think about how many probable billions of dollars are spent on these initiatives from buying the product or service and having the team meetings and getting things going to have it fail that much. There's got to be a better way." – HAMISH
"Sandler is a number of things. So, number one, it's about differentiating on how you sell, not what you sell. Because what we sell is a commodity in the minds of our buyers. It doesn't matter what we're selling. And the only way to differentiate a commodity is typically by price. And so, with Sandler, we seek to create clarity with our buyers. I was talking to a very, very successful entrepreneur yesterday. We're i

About Usman Sheikh: Usman Sheikh is the visionary founder and CEO of xiQ, an award-winning B2B sales and marketing platform. With the fusion of generative AI (x GPT), behavioral science, and a curated up-to-the-minute business corpus, xiQ is revolutionizing the industry with its groundbreaking personality-driven sales approach. As a futurist and design thinker, Usman aims to humanize B2B sales and marketing by harnessing the power of generative AI and psychology. Through xiQ, sellers gain the ability to understand the mindset of prospective buyers, facilitating hyper-personalized engagement throughout the sales cycle. Usman strongly believes in achieving excellence through disciplined and relentless execution. Check out the latest episode of our Conversational Selling podcast to learn more about Usman.

In this episode, Nancy and Usman discuss the following:
• The transformative power of AI in B2B sales and marketing
• xiQ's use of generative AI, behavioral science, and chat GPT to personalize sales approaches
• The evolution from pre-internet to the internet era and now to the AI era
• How AI simplifies tasks, saves time, and enhances productivity
• The importance of understanding personality-driven sales

Key Takeaways:
o AI made it so much simpler, gives one that information in seconds, and saves hours of time that would have been spent.
o What used to take me six hours out of my day has now been reduced to 30 minutes.
o We need to master AI. We need to make it work for us.
"And we use AI to help you formulate these kinds of capabilities, bringing them into sales to personalize the sales engagement. Nobody wants to talk to somebody who doesn't know who you are, doesn't understand your problems, and cannot empathize with or relate to your actions. They're just in there to sell, and nobody's interested in that, especially in high-ticket sales. So, it becomes increasingly important to be able to find the sweet spots of the person within their personality and cater to them so you can have a better chance of winning." – USMAN
"We're not a plug-in to LinkedIn, although I think we get a lot of data from LinkedIn. Think of our platform as an independent search engine; we throw a very wide net out there to collect information. So, you type in the name of a person in their company and start looking for them. You find the person by clicking on them if there is more than one. And it goes, fetches information, analyzes it, and makes a prediction call. All of it, less than three seconds." – USMAN
"So, we were living in the pre-internet era. Would that be correct? I was. I saw the internet come. You did, right? And everything was paper-based. If you needed to look up a person or do some research, you had to use Encyclopedia Britannica or one of those, right? There was no Google. It was a different world. And the big brands that were there were those serving Yellow Pages and all that stuff. Those were the brands. But then came the internet age, Google and Yahoo, and now ZoomInfo and Salesforce, and all of these became tools that people used, right? And the old Yellow Pages and so on didn't translate into becoming the ZoomInfo of the business world. It was like the Yellow Pages of the business world in the pre-internet days, right? And so, two things happened. The way we did business changed. Secondly, the players that provided the technology changed as well, and the solutions changed as well. Now, we're entering the AI era. It's a big leap. So, if the internet was a thousand to the paper-based era, then AI is a hundred million to the thousand. That's the big leap, okay? Because it can crunch out this big data and make sense of it in microseconds, right? And so, it can crunch a lot of data to do that, right? Pretty much the whole internet, right? And then some. So, but you know, we as humans need to be able to access that data, that much data in a consumable manner to be interesting." – USMAN
"I think not to be afraid

About Kelly Lichtenberger: Kelly Lichtenberger has a strong background in sales and marketing, with experience in various leadership roles. From 2021 onwards, she has worked as the Global Head of Sales Development at Avanan. Before this, she worked at The InsideOut Technologies Company as a Principal, focusing on building and optimizing Inside Sales teams. From 2017 to 2019, Kelly held multiple roles at Razberi Technologies, including Vice President of Marketing and Inside Sales. She was key in delivering network video recording, cyber security, and remote health management solutions during her time there. Before that, Kelly was the President of Consulting Services Group (CSG), where they provided superior customer experience and implemented top talent and technologies for business success. Kelly was also involved in building high-performance sales teams and instituting best-selling processes at Carousel Industries as the Vice President of Inside Sales. Overall, Kelly Lichtenberger has a wealth of experience in sales development, marketing, and team management and has consistently demonstrated success in driving revenue growth and achieving results. Check out the latest episode of our Conversational Selling podcast to learn more about Kelly.

In this episode, Nancy and Kelly discuss the following:
• Value of the human element in sales despite advancements in AI
• Overcoming fear of rejection in cold calling
• Differing views on the use of scripts in sales calls
• Building and maintaining successful inside sales teams
• Role of emotional intelligence (EQ) in prospecting and sales
• Benefits of emotional intelligence for women in sales
Key Takeaways:
o You can have a script, but knowing how to play within that keeps the human element there.
o Women do phenomenally at sales.
o The worst answer in sales is "maybe."
o We all have a mutual benefit for everybody, being happy and wanting to stay.
"I still very much believe in the human element. We hear a lot about AI and tools, what these tools can do, and what this system can do. We miss a big part of the sales cycle when we leave out the human element. I talk to my team often about this, and I think what happens is it comes down to skill set. There are a lot of people who don't have the skill set to use the phone as a selling device appropriately. So, it's easier to say it doesn't work and it's dead. The more people say that, the more it helps me and my teams because it opens the doors. Fewer people are calling, so I'll get through." – KELLY
"So, when you think about emotional intelligence, it's the same as EQ. People have heard of IQ, which is knowing how. EQ is knowing you. Emotional intelligence encompasses self-awareness, self-regulation, motivation, empathy, and social skills. It's really about adding the human element into sales. When working with a team, I tell them, "We're not going in to sell on step one of the first conversation. We're looking at how to build a relationship, even in your personal life. It's about being you." One of the things that people forget to do often is to focus so much on the product know-how and forget that there's an actual person on the other end. Do we understand their role? Their pain points? What would be helpful to them in their position? If you're facing rejections, know how to handle it, pivot, and not get upset if you have a day where there are many hang-ups or didn't get through and set up the demo. Knowing that motivation, if you're not doing those things again, how do you turn something like cold calling into a skill set and not just give up because it's not working for you? Many people do. Then again, they want to say, "This didn't work." Well, maybe it's that you didn't work on that one." - KELLY
"So, active listening is a big part of emotional intelligence, which comes in a few places. It's going to come into social skills. It will come into self-awareness, but really, the social skills of understanding. Kn