17 episodes

Chiropractic Health Dr Srour Joins us LIVE with David Heffernan
Welcome to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. It's an off misquoted Shakespearean statement from back in the 1500s. But probably still hold some truth today when you talk to people. And you know, one of the things I've found over the last 30 years of practicing and doing personal injury work is people do like to bash lawyers until they've got a lawyer or need a lawyer. And so the thought behind this show was to talk about different areas of law types of law, trending topics of law. And one of the things I thought we'd do today, we're going to shift gears a little bit. My guest today is Dr. Charles. Sure, sir. All right. I got it. I got it. Right, totally. I'm only saying that one time, you're now Charlie, the rest of it. But he is a Doctor of Chiropractic. And we're going to talk about some of the interplay, I think, between lawyers between chiropractors, I want to talk about his practice, educate a little bit about types of injuries, treatments, and everything else that are there.
And I think there's a lot of similarities in some things, Charlie, so mark, and I did a show a few weeks ago, you know, hopefully, the governor will sign this, this change of law, and the auto law, which is going to get rid of PIP and the whole no fault scheme, which hopefully will then get rid of the one 800 car accident clinic and the chiropractic clinics that that you have there. So I think I think personal injury lawyers tend to get bashed a lot. I know chiropractors get bashed a lot, but but I want to show you that lawyers get bashed more, because I looked this up. So here's the ultimate list of lawyer jokes. Okay, you see how thick this is? Okay. Although it's a guy, it's got a few good ones. So how many lawyer jokes are out there? There's a lot of wager. Now there's only three, the rest are true stories. So but, but then I looked up chiropractor jokes. It's only like six pages. And frankly, there's only one that's any good in here. So how many chiropractors does it take to change a light bulb?
How many? Just one but it takes six visits. Okay, so, so here's, here's the thing, you know, I mean, I've been helping people in South Florida along with my partner Mark care for 30 years. I've never chased an ambulance. I've never run into the back of an ambulance. You know, and, and I know that, that your chiropractic business is far different from what the people see on the billboards in the advertisements to go back and forth. So let's talk about that a little bit. So let's talk about you. First off, you're from Canada, where you grew up. Alright, what brings you to the US. So I went to school, university, Toronto, then I graduated and did my chiropractic in California. Okay.
It was just far distance wise, it was far timezone wise. So I wanted to be on the East Coast, I kind of fell backwards with an opportunity to work with a group guy who was the chiropractor for the Miami Dolphins, and hired me on the spot over a phone call. And I came down to South Florida, and kind of fell backwards into a great office with a great philosophy, sports injuries, which was my passion. I played tennis as a kid, and competitively throughout until To this day, and I just had a good opportunity to work with this guy and in that environment, and we ended up treating, you know, the Miami Dolphins for many years, the Florida Panthers for many years, some of the Marlin players.
And you know, one thing led to another, I took over the practice, and my wife had kids and we and we love it here. And we've had you in South Florida since then. Yeah. So you run pro healthcare, which is where so pro healthcare is in North Miami.
It's a, you know, sports injuries was the base behind it. But since you know, practicing for 20 years, you start to expand into Family Health and some auto accidents. It's multidisciplinary. We do chiropractic, physical therapy, massage therapy we have, we have mental

First Off, Let's Kill All the Lawyers Attorney David Heffernan

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Chiropractic Health Dr Srour Joins us LIVE with David Heffernan
Welcome to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. It's an off misquoted Shakespearean statement from back in the 1500s. But probably still hold some truth today when you talk to people. And you know, one of the things I've found over the last 30 years of practicing and doing personal injury work is people do like to bash lawyers until they've got a lawyer or need a lawyer. And so the thought behind this show was to talk about different areas of law types of law, trending topics of law. And one of the things I thought we'd do today, we're going to shift gears a little bit. My guest today is Dr. Charles. Sure, sir. All right. I got it. I got it. Right, totally. I'm only saying that one time, you're now Charlie, the rest of it. But he is a Doctor of Chiropractic. And we're going to talk about some of the interplay, I think, between lawyers between chiropractors, I want to talk about his practice, educate a little bit about types of injuries, treatments, and everything else that are there.
And I think there's a lot of similarities in some things, Charlie, so mark, and I did a show a few weeks ago, you know, hopefully, the governor will sign this, this change of law, and the auto law, which is going to get rid of PIP and the whole no fault scheme, which hopefully will then get rid of the one 800 car accident clinic and the chiropractic clinics that that you have there. So I think I think personal injury lawyers tend to get bashed a lot. I know chiropractors get bashed a lot, but but I want to show you that lawyers get bashed more, because I looked this up. So here's the ultimate list of lawyer jokes. Okay, you see how thick this is? Okay. Although it's a guy, it's got a few good ones. So how many lawyer jokes are out there? There's a lot of wager. Now there's only three, the rest are true stories. So but, but then I looked up chiropractor jokes. It's only like six pages. And frankly, there's only one that's any good in here. So how many chiropractors does it take to change a light bulb?
How many? Just one but it takes six visits. Okay, so, so here's, here's the thing, you know, I mean, I've been helping people in South Florida along with my partner Mark care for 30 years. I've never chased an ambulance. I've never run into the back of an ambulance. You know, and, and I know that, that your chiropractic business is far different from what the people see on the billboards in the advertisements to go back and forth. So let's talk about that a little bit. So let's talk about you. First off, you're from Canada, where you grew up. Alright, what brings you to the US. So I went to school, university, Toronto, then I graduated and did my chiropractic in California. Okay.
It was just far distance wise, it was far timezone wise. So I wanted to be on the East Coast, I kind of fell backwards with an opportunity to work with a group guy who was the chiropractor for the Miami Dolphins, and hired me on the spot over a phone call. And I came down to South Florida, and kind of fell backwards into a great office with a great philosophy, sports injuries, which was my passion. I played tennis as a kid, and competitively throughout until To this day, and I just had a good opportunity to work with this guy and in that environment, and we ended up treating, you know, the Miami Dolphins for many years, the Florida Panthers for many years, some of the Marlin players.
And you know, one thing led to another, I took over the practice, and my wife had kids and we and we love it here. And we've had you in South Florida since then. Yeah. So you run pro healthcare, which is where so pro healthcare is in North Miami.
It's a, you know, sports injuries was the base behind it. But since you know, practicing for 20 years, you start to expand into Family Health and some auto accidents. It's multidisciplinary. We do chiropractic, physical therapy, massage therapy we have, we have mental

    Attorney David Heffernan talks Medical Malpractice and Mass Torts with Attorney Andrew Yaffa

    Attorney David Heffernan talks Medical Malpractice and Mass Torts with Attorney Andrew Yaffa

    First off, let's kill all the lawyers. I'm David Heffernan, I've been practicing personal injury law here in Miami and South Florida for nearly three decades. The goal behind this broadcast is to bring in other lawyers in varying fields and experiences to kind of maybe one by one start to take them off that kill list. And, and we can prove Shakespeare wasn't right in the 15th century, when he said it and everybody laughed about it. But my guest this morning, the only difficulty might be I think we can get him off the list. But he's a guy I know who oftentimes wanted to kill many lawyers, generally opposing counsel, but this morning, I'm really happy to introduce a very close friend of mine. Excellent, excellent lawyer. Andy Haffa.
    Thanks for having me on.
    So yeah, we're not going to ask you to take any lawyers off the list. Because I know, given you're passionate about your practice, and I will get into that. There's been times I've might have heard you out or a few things about killing other lawyers. So, we're going to try to table that and keep this more on the civil side of things.
    You and I've had many conversations about going back to trial by combat and how much better I would feel. And as badly as I would like to avoid being on anybody's hit list. I unfortunately, I found my way too many. And so as hard as you're going to work today, I don't know how successful you're going to be brother.
    All right. Well, I'm up for the test. So, let's see what we can do to get Andy off this list. Let's go back first and just talk about so you're a Miami native, correct?
    Well, basically, I we I've been here ever since I'm two I was born. My dad was in medical school in Richmond. And he when he moved down here for training, that's when I became a Florida native.
    Got it. Okay. So now though, tell me because your dad comes down here, very, very prominent surgeon knows me. Well, he's seen my insides. So, I got to give him credit for that as he took my appendix out, but Chief of Staff at Baptist I mean, many, many accolades, and just a top notch, top notch surgeon, great guy, and you go to law school. So where was where was that shift? And was there ever an interest in medical school?
    There still is. I was I was teaching at the middle school Medical School last night, believe it or not, okay. I ended up going to law school because my dad, who as you said, as a surgeon told me, he wouldn't do it again. And I took the L SATs and the MCAT. That's the test to get into medical school within a month of each other. And still, to this day, I entertained dreams of being a doctor. That's what I was always wanted to do. And I know I would have been a hell of a surgeon, that's for sure.
    No, no doubt about it. And but it's interesting because you go into law, and then followed by both of your brothers, Sam and Greg go into law who both have thriving careers. And we might have to get them on here. It might be easier to get off the list and you but we'll work on it. On those two so you get into the practice law. The other interesting thing about you so you and I go back three decades, because graduate, I always know how long you've been practicing. Because I got to figure out how long I have came out together, law clerk to different places together. But you're a little bit of a rarity in that. You went to a firm right out of law school. Grossman, a Roth at the time now Grossman Roth, yeah, often Cohen. But you've stayed there, the duration, you know, lawyers tend to start here, get a little experience here, kind of move and move around. So talk about that journey, because I think it's pretty fascinating that you've stayed there the whole time. And obviously, tremendous, tremendous firm. You know, nothing but great things to say about Stuart and Neil and everybody in that firm. And so you're a great, great fit and a great asset to that firm. But how is it that you wound up staying in the same place for 30 years?
    So I was blessed to have found Stuart and

    • 27 min
    Attorney David Heffernan Talks LIVE with Special Guest Attorney Dan Newman

    Attorney David Heffernan Talks LIVE with Special Guest Attorney Dan Newman

    Welcome to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. I'm David Heffernan, and I've been practicing personal injury law here for 30 years in South Florida goal behind this show, and we named it after the Shakespeare quote, although a lot of people argued that that was a compliment to lawyers, people still chuckled pretty loudly when it was. And when you talk to people today, they still think maybe not a bad idea to kill all the lawyers. So, the goal here today is to bring in other South Florida lawyers, different areas of law, kind of educate some people on it, maybe one by one, we can kind of take some people off the kill list. So, my guest this morning is a great, great friend been for the last 30 years. And a truly fantastic lawyer who does a lot of things that I know nothing about. So, this is definitely going to be entertaining, because I'm going to get to learn along but let me bring in Dan Newman, a partner Nelson Mullins. Dan, how are you?
    Great today, and hopefully I'm going to get off that kill list by the end of this show.
    Slowly, why did we get oh, yeah, the majority at least I don't know, we get everybody off that list with you. But we can get the majority of so. So, Danny, let's go back and talk. You went to George Washington, you studied finance? What was the path and why go to law school? Was that something that was always going to be done or had that come about?
    So, when I went to college, I thought I was going to go into the investment field investment banking or something investment-related. I was a finance major you said, Bachelor of Business Administration, I took a business law class and in my business, curriculum and undergrad, and that really gave me a passion for the law. I had a great, great teacher and, and he taught us about contracts and about business deals and about litigation and how disputes arise and how there are different arguments, and how to be an advocate. And that was fascinating to me. And so, after my junior year in college, I decided that I wanted to go to law school. And I wanted to be able to combine those two passions, the finance end, and the legal end, I knew I wanted to be a litigator, I knew that that was probably the best fit for my personality. And so that's, that's how it came about.
    Alright, so that now at least gives me an explanation as to how you know about contracts, because you and I had the same contracts teacher at University of Miami law school. And I don't think we learned a whole lot about contracts in that class. But we'll leave that alone for now. We had a lot of laughs, though. So, we become friends in law school, you get out of law school, you take a job with the SEC, and I think oh my god, that's fantastic. He's working for college football. Wasn't that sec. So, you go to New York for the Securities Exchange Commission. Let's talk about that. Because I think that's kind of fascinating.
    It was a great opportunity. It came about unexpectedly, there was the opportunity there. It was a bad time during that period of time, it was there was a banking crisis going on. And there was there was a little downturn in the economy. And someone told me there was an opportunity to go work at the SEC. That was a passion of mine. It was financed, it was securities, I took securities law in college, and learned about the securities laws learned about business and finance and tried to take courses fit for that, in law school. And as well as the securities class of law school, went up to the SEC interviewed, extremely passionate about what they did, what they do and continue to do. There they are, you know, they essentially are the overseer of our financial markets in many different ways. And I went up and I worked for what's called the enforcement division of the SEC. And our job was to enforce the securities laws. So, we would investigate potential violations and enforce those through legal actions, many cases settled or they go to trial. And, you know, in the

    • 31 min
    Attorney David Heffernan talks Maritime Law with Robert (Chip) Birthisel

    Attorney David Heffernan talks Maritime Law with Robert (Chip) Birthisel

    Welcome to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. That phrase Shakespeare wrote back in the 15th century that was uttered by Dick the butcher to raucous laughter and applause, which today still people kind of go…. not a bad idea. Although one of the things I love about it now this show is getting a little bit of traction, I get all these calls from lawyers saying “you know, that was actually a flattering thing”. I think today, they still might laugh and think killing all lawyers is a good start. I'm David Heffernan and I've been practicing personal injury law here in South Florida for the past 30 years now, which is scary to think about.
    The goal behind these shows is to bring in lawyers from varying walks of life and fields of practice, and talk about different areas of law, get to know some of these lawyers a little bit, and maybe one by one, we'll just start checking a few of these people off of the kill list. And my guest this morning, and I'm just absolutely thrilled to have because we had dinner with a lot of our classmates last night from 1991, graduating class at UVM Law School, which is where I met this gentleman. We've been friends for 30 years, one of my best friends, and one of the top maritime and Admiralty lawyers in the country. Chip Birthisel.
    Thanks, Dave, that's awfully nice stuff to say. And I wouldn't come on before because I didn't want to be killed.
    Well, the goal here today is maybe we get you moved off that list, one at a time. So, one of the things that I think is fascinating about you, and I want to get into what maritime and Admiralty law is, and everything else, and again, that's, we could spend a week talking about it. But one of the things I think is amazing about you is your story. And I and I want to go back, I want to go way back to a 17-year-old kid that wasn't quite sure where he was going in life. Was he going to be a dropout surfer? What was he going to do and, and made a pretty critical decision? So, talk about the decision you made at 17. And then I want to talk about the benefits that came out of that.
    Well, it's kind of funny, I at 17, I was dropped out of high school. I didn't see myself really going anywhere. My parents, I was fifth-generation Floridian my parents made the mistake to move me to Fort Worth, Texas, which was a long way from the coast that was a young surfer kid who lived up in Cocoa Beach, Florida. So, we went out to Texas, I didn't like it a whole lot, I figured the best way to get out of there would be to join the service. So, I joined the Coast Guard, which actually got me a wide goal to go to California and surf and get around the country. Every place there was a coast and surf. And so that's how I've gotten
    out now at least we know the motivation was I'll join somewhere where I can go surf. That was
    part of it. The other part of it was that the drummer for my band that I had back then in Texas, we broke up, he went back to Florida because he had some family issues. And so, the band broke up and I had to go and get a real job.
    All right, well, we're going to look at a long-storied career with the Coast Guard. But one of the things I think is amazing is the way you took advantage of the opportunities. So, you're a near high school dropout. But while you're in the Coast Guard, you're afforded the opportunity to get an undergraduate degree.
    Yeah, you know, I got to tell you back then it was a, I joined I wanted to boot I went to boot camp in January of 1975. It's a different world back then entirely. The military was a was a land of opportunity. I went in as a high school dropout made rate as fast as I possibly could move up, you know, enlisted ranks as fast as I possibly could. So, I started out as an E one. And then I retired 21 years later, as a lieutenant commander with a law degree. So, during that time that I was in, I was able to finish high school number one. Number two, went to University of San Francisco and got an undergraduate

    • 31 min
    Attorney Heffernan is joined by Attorney Martin G. Rubenstein to talk about Mass Torts

    Attorney Heffernan is joined by Attorney Martin G. Rubenstein to talk about Mass Torts

    Welcome back to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. I'm David Heffernan, I've been practicing personal injury law here in South Florida for nearly three decades. And the thought behind this show is that quoted Shakespeare line from the 15th century, which drew a lot of chuckles when it was issued, still rubs true today, sometimes you bring it up, and people have got their images of lawyers and whatnot. And so, the goal here is to talk to Donald has been local lawyers, we're going to have a little fun today we're branching out beyond South Florida. But to bring you a fantastic lawyer, a very good friend of mine, and probably just a better human being. But clearly, one we're going to be able to take off the kill list was all when all is said and done. Let me bring in Martin Rubenstein, who is the managing partner of Levy, Balldante Finney & Rubenstein in Philadelphia.
    Good morning, great catching up with you, brother, you know that it's, it's always fun. So, if this is an excuse to catch up, we're going to do it. So, let's talk a little bit about first just out of curiosity, you going to law school? What was behind that? Was this a family thing? Was this something you always wanted to do? What drew you into the law?
    So, I actually had always thought about the law. I think that my father who passed away last year had a gift of subtly delivering messages to his kids. And he did that with me. So, I'll give him a lot of credit for that. And then when I was in high school, I was at best a mediocre student, mainly, I just had an interest in other things. I think we all know about that stage of life. You know, on the preset. I was a senior, and I had a homeroom teacher, which means that's the person who just makes sure you're showing up, right? She was cut truthfully, she was kind of a floozy, everybody knew it, that that's the way she was. She came up to me one day in class and said, hey, guess what? You're on my speech and debate team. I said, really, like since when she said, since right now I just looked at your grades, you need it. So, she immediately you know, guilted and intimidated me. And the first thing that she asked me to do was to write a persuasive paper. This is 1974, okay. And it was about the Arab-Israeli conflict. She gave me a book, and she and this is on the heels of the Six-Day War from that lady. She gives me a book and she says, and by the way, you know, I'm Jewish, she says, you'll take the Arab side. And, you know, I really, like what are you kidding me, and she said, in her comment was the other side's too easy, you're going to take the Arab side, so kind of forced me to be an advocate for something, maybe I didn't believe it. And I really felt that was like a major moment for me, like, going through that. And I stayed with her. And I was not a particularly good speaker at that point in my life and she had me going to these speech tournaments, we'd have to speak for 15 minutes in front of these judges. So it was a wonderful experience, and coupled with my, you know, my father's not so subtle, you know, suggestions to me, that's kind of what led to it, I always want to, unlike you, Dave, and I know this about you, because you and I've done this together for 17 years, you and I always have tried to help those who need it. Usually, it's the end, it's always the individuals, it's the little guys, and, and taking on the bigger people has always just made it more fun,
    hotter percent, and we're going to leave into that. So. So you've been doing that taking on the big guy and representing that individual for close to 40 years in Philadelphia, and Mass Torts and nationwide. So, let's talk a little bit about your practice. Because I'd like to talk today about mass torts. And I know that's been a big emphasis, your practice is what draw it got you and I connected. And, and the beauty of that is, you know, you make these relationships through litigation, and then you look at, you know, 17 years or

    • 29 min
    Attorney David Heffernan is joined by Attorney Dean Kaire who has recently passed the Florida Bar.

    Attorney David Heffernan is joined by Attorney Dean Kaire who has recently passed the Florida Bar.

    Welcome to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. I'm David Heffernan. I've been practicing personal injury law here in Miami in South Florida for nearly three decades. The phrase, first off, let's kill all the lawyers is from 15th century Shakespeare play, drew a lot of laughs at the time, it's debatable on what it was actually supposed to mean. But the thought behind this show was, maybe let's not kill all of them. Let's take some South Florida lawyers, let's shine some spotlights on them. Let's talk about some trending topics in law. And maybe one by one, we can take them off the list. My guest this morning should be very easy to get off the list. When I say new member of the Florida Bar, we're talking about in the last 72 hours.
    Yeah, as of Monday at 11:30am. Alright, but who'skeeping score? What happened on Monday is this young man, who is my law partners son, passed the Florida Bar and got those results just 72 hours ago. We're going to talk about that, because it's no small feat. But first off, congratulations, and welcome to the bar.
    No, thank you. I really appreciate it. And thank you for having me on here today, of course,
    And you're going to realize now you get into the practice of law that Yeah, most people do want to kill all the lawyers. So, we're going to see what we can do to dispel some of that, but, but let's talk about passing the bar, we'll talk about present and then we'll work backwards and kind of go forward, passing the bar, because it's pretty surprising. Of 3343 people that sat for the bar back in July 27 2014 - 183, passed a 44% pass rate. So, no small feat in in in passing the bar, How's that feel?
    It feels great. It was a culmination of a lot of hard work, a rough summer, but after everything's, you know, fell through it all worked out in the end.
    Excellent, excellent. So, while it's a gruesome rate, I will put this out there that the University of Miami School of Law, the Dean went and I'm an adjunct faculty did have an 82% pass rate, which actually was up significantly. So, talk a little bit about Dean, we're going to talk about what you did in law school, but this was now totally online. I mean, it's a thing, you know, annually, people hit the convention center in Tampa, big thing, what were the thoughts of, of taking it online.
    So, my initial concerns, and I think a lot of my peers also had that same concern of when you're taking it in the Tampa test center, from what you hear, there's not a lot of things that are outside of your own control. So, if you're in the Tampa test center, and someone's rattling their pen, or clicking their pen or pencil, you're hearing all of that, but so is everybody else in the room. Now, when you're taking it online, depending on where you take it, you could be taken up by a busy intersection with fire trucks coming back and forth. Your fire alarm in your building can go off. And I know that's what actually happened at the NYU School of Law. They rented out rooms, right? Yeah, they rented out rooms to all their test takers who didn't have a place to take it, and they had a fire alarm go off in the middle of the exam. So, I feel like taking it online, that was a lot of nervous. nerve racking for a lot of different people just because there were so many factors that were probably outside of your own control.
    Yeah, it's interesting and I think they'll probably delve into that. And hopefully we're, we're moving past things that we get back to take it into person, but I talked briefly to my daughter about this because she's working on her master's. And she goes, the odd thing is you're sitting taking the test and you've got yourself in the screen up there. You know, somebody is watching you the whole time, right? It's not like a teacher just wandering up and down the hallway. So she goes, it's kind of an odd feeling. But let's go back a little bit. Okay. Obviously, your dad's a lawyer. Yeah, we'll say nice things about him. Your dad and I are law p

    • 27 min
    Attorney David Heffernan of Kaire & Heffernan talks with Attorney Jeff Rubin of Talianoff, Rubin & Rubin about Workers' Compensation

    Attorney David Heffernan of Kaire & Heffernan talks with Attorney Jeff Rubin of Talianoff, Rubin & Rubin about Workers' Compensation

    Welcome to another episode of First off, let's kill all the lawyers. That phrase was written by Shakespeare back in the 15th century that drew raucous applause and laughter when it was uttered. And even today still does. As people contemplate, it's not a bad idea to kill all the lawyers. I'm David Heffernan, I've been practicing law here in South Florida for about three decades. The goal behind these broadcasts is quite simple. Bring in local lawyers in varying aspects of law, get to know a little bit about them, why they got into law, what they did, and maybe just maybe, by the end of the show, we can take one off the list to save that lawyer. This morning, I have the pleasure of having not only a really good lawyer, but a good friend and possibly one of the nicest human beings I've ever known. Jeff Rubin joins me and, Jeff, you've been doing this a long time local guy, we got a lot to talk about. But let's just start off with how did you wind up becoming a lawyer?
    It's probably a family thing. The name of the law firm is Talianoff Rubin and Rubin. Talianoff is my maternal grandfather. And my maternal grandfather and my father actually practice law together back in the 60s and 70s. Having the family aspect of it, and then, you know, so sort of predestined that I would become a lawyer, enjoyed law school and went to Miami, loved it back in the back in the 80s, and graduated in 89. And then soon after that, my grandfather was thinking about retiring, so it was an opportunity to join the firm. And then eventually, the firm name became Talianoff, Rubin and Rubin. So, it's a family tradition. For about three years, we actually had three generations walking in the office.
    Let's talk about what they founded and then what type of law were they doing when they first started?
    My grandfather was really in the collection business, he did a lot of retail and commercial collection was very involved in local community organizations and collection agencies throughout the country. And he started something called the commercial law League of America. And that was the aspects of his types of law, he did lead to some probate and some wills and things like that. And then my father was a worker's compensation lawyer. So needless to say, I learned a lot from them, and, and became a collection lawyer and also a workers compensation lawyer, as well as some general practice.
    All right, and we're going to delve into that sort of pressure that that's the family lineage, was there ever a thought of doing something else?
    Gosh, I guess I look back, I would have probably been like a sailing coach or doing another passion or, or something like that. But, you know, when we went to law school, we went to undergraduate school, David, you know, it was you go to undergraduate school, and then you go right into a profession, but that is, are you going to get your masters you get a professional degree? And that really is not the way it works? I think today, right? I'm finding at least with my son, he went, got an undergraduate degree, worked for a while, and then realize what he needed to get a master's. So I think, for me, it was just something that I thought was a good thing to do. I wasn't interested in the other professions, there were really no business aspects in my family of things that I got turned on to. So it was sort of a natural fit. Well, and you're right, I do see that now. My daughter, for example, has been out in the workforce for a while graduated from Florida State is now going back to get her master's. Yeah. And I think it actually makes more sense unless you really know what you want to do. I think having some real-world experience, and then going back and go, Okay, how will this benefit me? Because I think a lot of times you got to analyze now, okay, does this further education, and I'm very pro-education. But sometimes I think, you know, people would go from undergrad to some sort of graduate program, just because to continue to become a

    • 31 min

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