398 episodes

Crypto assets and blockchain technology are about to transform every trust-based interaction of our lives, from financial services to identity to the Internet of Things. In this podcast, host Laura Shin, an independent journalist covering all things crypto, talks with industry pioneers about how crypto assets and blockchains will change the way we earn, spend and invest our money. Tune in to find out how Web 3.0, the decentralized web, will revolutionize our world. Disclosure: I'm a nocoiner.

Unchained Laura Shin

    • News
    • 4.6 • 1.1K Ratings

Crypto assets and blockchain technology are about to transform every trust-based interaction of our lives, from financial services to identity to the Internet of Things. In this podcast, host Laura Shin, an independent journalist covering all things crypto, talks with industry pioneers about how crypto assets and blockchains will change the way we earn, spend and invest our money. Tune in to find out how Web 3.0, the decentralized web, will revolutionize our world. Disclosure: I'm a nocoiner.

    Is TRM Labs Blocking Addresses From DeFi Protocols? Ari Redbord Says No

    Is TRM Labs Blocking Addresses From DeFi Protocols? Ari Redbord Says No

    Ari Redbord, Head of Legal and Government Affairs at TRM Labs, talks about the sanctions on Tornado Cash, and the role of blockchain analytics tools in crypto. 
     
    Show highlights: Ari’s background as a federal prosecutor and his work for the US Treasury why regulators sanctioned Tornado Cash, according to Ari why the Ronin hack was important for regulators to start taking DeFi hacks more seriously the fact that for the first time the Treasury Department sanctioned software whether the Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) messed up whether regulators understood the impact on regular users the role of TRM and blockchain analytics tools in mitigating risk how decentralized applications use tools like the ones provided by TRM to comply with regulations and to block addresses why, if Ari were a regulator, he would focus on regulation guidance whether the sanctions on Tornado Cash are unconstitutional what the future of privacy in crypto looks like and whether the government is going after privacy technologies  
    Thank you to our sponsors!  
    1inch: https://1inch.io/
    Crypto.com: https://crypto.onelink.me/J9Lg/unconfirmedcardearnfeb2021
     
    Ari Twitter: https://twitter.com/ARedbord
     
    Tornado Cash Treasury Press release:  https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy0916#:~:text=WASHINGTON%20%E2%80%93%20Today%2C%20the%20U.S.%20Department,since%20its%20creation%20in%202019 Tornado Cash Sanctioned: https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/08/08/crypto-mixing-service-tornado-cash-blacklisted-by-us-treasury/ Developer arrested: https://www.fiod.nl/arrest-of-suspected-developer-of-tornado-cash/ TRM Labs blog post:  https://www.trmlabs.com/post/how-defi-platforms-are-using-data-from-trm-labs-to-respond-to-tornado-cash-sanctions Tornado Cash post on compliance: https://tornado-cash.medium.com/tornado-cash-compliance-9abbf254a370 Coin Center’s article authored by Jerry Brito and Peter Van Valkenburgh: https://www.coincenter.org/u-s-treasury-sanction-of-privacy-tools-places-sweeping-restrictions-on-all-americans/ Second Coin Center article authored by Jerry Brito and Peter Van Valkenburgh: https://www.coincenter.org/analysis-what-is-and-what-is-not-a-sanctionable-entity-in-the-tornado-cash-case/ Coin Center may challenge the US Treasury's decision to sanction Tornado Cash: https://decrypt.co/107475/coin-center-tornado-cash-ban-court Circle freezes USDC in sanctioned wallets: https://www.theblock.co/post/162172/circle-freezes-usdc-funds-in-tornado-cashs-us-treasury-sanctioned-wallets  Crypto exchange dYdX blocked accounts that received funds from Tornado Cash: https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/08/11/crypto-exchange-dydx-blocked-accounts-that-received-even-small-amounts-from-tornado-cash/ The possibility of forking Tornado Cash: https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2022/08/10/cloning-tornado-cash-would-be-easy-but-risky/ What the sanctions mean for privacy coins: https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/08/09/what-the-tornado-cash-sanction-means-for-privacy-coins/ Tornado Cash laundered $1.5 billion, according to Elliptic: https://hub.elliptic.co/analysis/tornado-cash-mixer-sanctioned-after-laundering-over-1-5-billion/ Celebrities get Dusted: https://decrypt.co/es/107090/tornado-cash-dusts-public-wallets-jimmy-fallon-brian-armstrong-steve-aoki-logan-paul Previous Coverage of Unchained: Tornado Cash Sanctioned. Did the Government Overstep Its Bounds?: https://unchainedpodcast.com/tornado-cash-sanctioned-did-the-government-overstep-its-bounds-ep-384/ The Chopping Block: Did OFAC Overstep by Sanctioning Tornado Cash?: https://unchainedpodcast.com/the-chopping-block-did-ofac-overstep-by-sanctioning-tornado-cash-ep-386/  
     
    Hacks linked to Tornado Cash Ronin: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/04/15/ronin-hack-north-korea-linked-to-615-million-crypto-heist-us-says.html
    Harmony: https://decrypt.co/104138/north-korean-attackers-behind-100m-harmony-hack-report
    Crypto.com: https://www.wired.com/story/crypto-hack-

    • 36 min
    The Chopping Block: Did OFAC Overstep by Sanctioning Tornado Cash?

    The Chopping Block: Did OFAC Overstep by Sanctioning Tornado Cash?

    Welcome to The Chopping Block! Crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, and Tarun Chitra chop it up about the latest news in the digital asset industry. In this episode, Laura Shin, host of Unchained and author of The Cryptopians, also joined the conversation. 
     
    Show topics: What Tornado Cash is and why it got sanctioned by the OFAC The difference between Tornado Cash and blender.io  Whether privacy is dead as a category and whether regulators are going after it How these sanctions have a negative impact on the funding of privacy projects How people within the industry can have different points of view, even when they understand the technology Whether the ban of Tornado Cash only means that malicious groups will just go and use other protocols Why regulation by enforcement sucks The asymmetry between the government’s sanction and the effort needed to push it back. What changes after the Merge for ETH in terms of centralization Whether some MEV solutions make Ethereum more centralized Why MEV is intrinsic to blockchains and whether it is impossible to get rid of it Why Proposer-Builder Separation is helpful for the network Whether MEV is illegal and the plausibility of major exchanges not extracting MEV Why Facebook has an MEV extraction business model, according to Tarun How some NFT exchanges are not enforcing royalties What Sudoswap is and how it works How the royalties were there to bootstrap the supply side of NFTs Why Tarun thinks music NFTs will never happen The economic reasoning around royalties The differences between NFT marketplaces like OpenSea and Magic Eden Whether NFTs have a real-world use How Dragonfly’s acquisition of Metastable brought Laura some old memories




    Hosts Haseeb Qureshi, managing partner at Dragonfly Capital https://twitter.com/hosseeb Tom Schmidt, general partner at Dragonfly Capital https://twitter.com/tomhschmidt Tarun Chitra, managing partner at Robot Ventures https://twitter.com/tarunchitra   
    Laura Twitter: https://twitter.com/laurashin


    Episode Links  
    Tornado Cash Treasury Press release: 
    https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy0916#:~:text=WASHINGTON%20%E2%80%93%20Today%2C%20the%20U.S.%20Department,since%20its%20creation%20in%202019
    Developer arrested: https://www.fiod.nl/arrest-of-suspected-developer-of-tornado-cash/
    Coin Center’s article authored by Jerry Brito and Peter Van Valkenburgh: https://www.coincenter.org/u-s-treasury-sanction-of-privacy-tools-places-sweeping-restrictions-on-all-americans/
    Second Coin Center’s article authored by Jerry Brito and Peter Van Valkenburgh: https://www.coincenter.org/analysis-what-is-and-what-is-not-a-sanctionable-entity-in-the-tornado-cash-case/
    Coin Center may challenge the US Treasury's decision to sanction Tornado Cash: https://decrypt.co/107475/coin-center-tornado-cash-ban-court
    Circle freezes USDC in sanctioned wallets: https://www.theblock.co/post/162172/circle-freezes-usdc-funds-in-tornado-cashs-us-treasury-sanctioned-wallets 
    Crypto exchange dYdX blocked accounts that received funds from Tornado Cash: https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/08/11/crypto-exchange-dydx-blocked-accounts-that-received-even-small-amounts-from-tornado-cash/
    The possibility of forking Tornado Cash: https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2022/08/10/cloning-tornado-cash-would-be-easy-but-risky/
    What the sanctions mean for privacy coins: https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/08/09/what-the-tornado-cash-sanction-means-for-privacy-coins/
    Tornado Cash laundered $1.5 billion, according to Elliptic: https://hub.elliptic.co/analysis/tornado-cash-mixer-sanctioned-after-laundering-over-1-5-billion/
    Celebrities get Dusted: https://decrypt.co/es/107090/tornado-cash-dusts-public-wallets-jimmy-fallon-brian-armstrong-steve-aoki-logan-paul
    Secretary of State deletes tweet: https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/08/08/us-secretary-of-state-tweets-deletes-claim-that-crypto-mixer-tornado-cash-is-north-korea-s

    • 1 hr 17 min
    Coinbase CPO Surojit Chatterjee Explains Why He Believes the Exchange Will Win

    Coinbase CPO Surojit Chatterjee Explains Why He Believes the Exchange Will Win

    Surojit Chatterjee, chief product officer at Coinbase, comes to talk about what products Coinbase is building, how it can thrive in such a competitive landscape, how to onboard billions of users into crypto, and much more. 
     
    Show highlights: how Surojit got into crypto and ended up at Coinbase what sets Coinbase apart from the competition how to bring billions of customers to crypto  Surojit’s mental model of a bridge between the fiat world and the crypto world how Coinbase is integrating its main app with Web3 whether crypto can become a utility rather than an investment asset how Coinbase is building a product in such a way that it attracts even “crypto-native” people what happened with Coinbase NFT Marketplace’s failure and whether the company will keep investing in NFTs whether Coinbase has lost crypto-embedded people among its employees how the partnership with BlackRock indicates how far crypto has come the amount of money that institutions could potentially pour into crypto how Coinbase will prevent itself from having the largest percentage of staked ETH how the company is monetizing the Coinbase wallet and what would happen to revenue if the trading volume were to move from the exchange to Coinbase wallet swaps why Coinbase is suffering a decline in trading volume whether Coinbase can compete with newer exchanges like FTX and Binance and why Surojit still thinks Coinbase will win why it is important to keep investing and building through this crypto winter Surojit’s take on the frontrunning of coins about to be listed on the platform why the Howey test (which determines whether something is a security) is outdated how Coinbase understands securities, and whether the firm thinks the tokens listed on the platform are securities how can Coinbase compete with decentralized exchanges like Uniswap why Surojit is worried about regulatory clarity and stablecoins how hacks and security give the crypto industry a bad reputation what Surojit’s dreams are for the industry Thank you to our sponsors!  
    Crypto.com: https://crypto.onelink.me/J9Lg/unconfirmedcardearnfeb2021
    Ava Labs: https://www.avax.network/
    Show Links  
    Surojit:  Twitter: https://twitter.com/surojit  
    Coinbase Q2 2022 Earnings: Shareholder letter: https://s27.q4cdn.com/397450999/files/doc_financials/2022/q2/v2/Q2-2022-Shareholder-Letter.pdf Summary: https://twitter.com/fintechintern/status/1557130836574539776?s=20&t=R-oDUTEaev-F8bPonC2q5Q Earnings call: https://s27.q4cdn.com/397450999/files/doc_financials/2022/q2/Coinbase-Q2%2722-Earnings-Call-Transcript.pdf  
    NFT Marketplace: Coinbase NFT launch: https://decrypt.co/99561/coinbase-nft-marketplace-150-users-first-day-public NFT Market data: https://dune.com/Marcov/0x-NFT-Market Gamestop NFT stats: https://dune.com/dataisking420/gamestopnft-stats Gamestop’s performance against Coinbase: https://decrypt.co/105069/gamestop-ethereum-nft-sales-dwarf-coinbase-nft  
    Partnerships BlackRock:  https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/03/24/blackrocks-fink-says-ukraine-war-could-accelerate-crypto-adoption-report/ https://blog.coinbase.com/coinbase-selected-by-blackrock-provide-aladdin-clients-access-to-crypto-trading-and-custody-via-b9e7144f313d https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2021/07/14/blackrock-ceo-larry-fink-seeing-very-little-demand-for-crypto-lately/ Integration with META: https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/08/04/meta-confirms-nft-rollout-across-100-countries-amid-coinbase-integration/  
    Regulation and lawsuits Insider Trading Court charges: https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr/three-charged-first-ever-cryptocurrency-insider-trading-tipping-scheme Cobie’s tweet: https://twitter.com/cobie/status/1550192546889998340 Brian Armsontrg’s tweet: https://twitter.com/brian_armstrong/status/1550162989881253889 Terra/UST lawsuit:  https://www.tbstat.com/wp/uploads/2022/06/1-main.pdf https://www.theblock.co/post/152942/coinbase-sued-in-relation-to-promoti

    • 1 hr 9 min
    Tornado Cash Sanctioned. Did the Government Overstep Its Bounds?

    Tornado Cash Sanctioned. Did the Government Overstep Its Bounds?

    Jerry Brito, executive director of Coin Center, talks about Tornado Cash, why it was sanctioned, and what this means for privacy in crypto. 
     
    Show highlights: what Blender.io is and how it relates to Tornado Cash how hackers have used Tornado Cash to launder money whether the Office of Foreign Assets Control made a mistake, according to Jerry how Americans were affected by the sanctions why Jerry believes OFAC should have done an analysis to estimate how many people would be impacted by its decision whether the sanctions should have been aimed at North Koren wallets and not the protocol whether the sanctions are unconstitutional and whether Coin Center will litigate this how Jerry believes Circle freezing USDC complicated everything what the famous people who received 0.1 ETH from random accounts via Tornado Cash should do  what would happen if someone forked the Tornado Cash code and deployed a copycat smart contract to a new address whether the sanctions signal the beginning of a privacy war on crypto how regulators are applying the same traditional rules with crypto as they use with centralized entities  
    Thank you to our sponsors!  
    1inch: https://1inch.io/
    Crypto.com: https://crypto.onelink.me/J9Lg/unconfirmedcardearnfeb2021
     
    Jerry Twitter: https://twitter.com/jerrybrito
     
    Tornado Cash Tornado Cash Sanctioned: https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/08/08/crypto-mixing-service-tornado-cash-blacklisted-by-us-treasury/
    Coin Center’s article authored by Jerry Brito and Peter Van Valkenburgh: https://www.coincenter.org/u-s-treasury-sanction-of-privacy-tools-places-sweeping-restrictions-on-all-americans/
    Circle freezes USDC in sanctioned wallets: https://www.theblock.co/post/162172/circle-freezes-usdc-funds-in-tornado-cashs-us-treasury-sanctioned-wallets 
    Crypto exchange dYdX blocked accounts that received funds from Tornado Cash: https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/08/11/crypto-exchange-dydx-blocked-accounts-that-received-even-small-amounts-from-tornado-cash/
    The possibility of forking Tornado Cash: https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2022/08/10/cloning-tornado-cash-would-be-easy-but-risky/
    What the sanctions mean for privacy coins: https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/08/09/what-the-tornado-cash-sanction-means-for-privacy-coins/
    Tornado Cash laundered $1.5 billion, according to Elliptic: https://hub.elliptic.co/analysis/tornado-cash-mixer-sanctioned-after-laundering-over-1-5-billion/
    Celebrities get Dusted: https://decrypt.co/es/107090/tornado-cash-dusts-public-wallets-jimmy-fallon-brian-armstrong-steve-aoki-logan-paul
     
    Hacks linked to Tornado Cash
    Ronin: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/04/15/ronin-hack-north-korea-linked-to-615-million-crypto-heist-us-says.html
    Harmony: https://decrypt.co/104138/north-korean-attackers-behind-100m-harmony-hack-report
    Crypto.com: https://www.wired.com/story/crypto-hack-nso-group-security-news/
    Nomad: https://decrypt.co/106459/crypto-bridge-nomad-exploited-190m-frenzied-free-for-all
    Previous Coverage of Unchained: Will the Nomad Mass Looting Change How Law Enforcement Treats DeFi Hacks?: https://unchainedpodcast.com/will-the-nomad-mass-looting-change-how-law-enforcement-treats-defi-hacks-ep-382/

    • 36 min
    The Chopping Block: How to Manage MakerDAO, With Hasu and Rune - Ep. 383g Block: How to Manage MakerDAO, With Hasu and Rune

    The Chopping Block: How to Manage MakerDAO, With Hasu and Rune - Ep. 383g Block: How to Manage MakerDAO, With Hasu and Rune

    Welcome to The Chopping Block! Crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest news in the digital asset industry. In this episode, Hasu, the gourmand of governance and Rune Christensen, chief mischief maker at MKR, discuss how to manage a DAO, their respective visions for MakerDAO, and much more. 
     
    Show topics:  
    What MakerDAO is, how DAI works and whether it is the “central bank” of DeFi How the visions for MakerDAO of Hasu and Rune differ Whether Maker should only hold highly liquid collateral assets Hasu’s mental model of DAI as eurodollars The role of real-world assets in backing DAI What the purpose of a DAO is and how it differs from a legal entity Whether people behave in their purest form within a DAO How DAI can create positive externalities and make a better world How crypto holders are not only in it for the money but also for the philosophy  What the “decentralized stablecoin trilemma” is Whether there’s a need for dollar-denominated collateral for DAI to work What “clean money” is according to Rune Why Rune thinks having a single council is not viable due to the political risks and whether the solution is to have multiple councils How to keep the principal-agent problem in check, according to Hasu Why Hasu believes council members wouldn’t pursue their own interests and go against the benefit of MKR token holders Whether a council would be corruptible and the dangers that it entails What kind of interests should be represented in the council Whether Maker can create more synthetic assets The iron law bureaucracy and how it relates to governance How to design the DAO to be steered in alignment with the token holders Whether ossification is a feature to be pursued, and where innovation happens How complexity is very expensive for an organization



    Hosts Haseeb Qureshi, managing partner at Dragonfly Capital https://twitter.com/hosseeb Tom Schmidt, general partner at Dragonfly Capital https://twitter.com/tomhschmidt Robert Leshner, founder of Compound  https://twitter.com/rleshner   
    Hasu Twitter: https://twitter.com/hasufl  
    Rune Christensen Twitter: https://twitter.com/RuneKek


    Episode Links  
    MakerDAO Hasu’s governance proposal: https://vote.makerdao.com/address/0xafaff1a605c373b43727136c995d21a7fcd08989#delegate-credentials Rune’s proposal - the endgame: https://forum.makerdao.com/t/the-endgame-plan-parts-1-2/15456 Proposal to add a lending oversight core unit: https://forum.makerdao.com/t/mip39c2-sp33-adding-lending-oversight-core-unit-love-001/15098 Previous Coverage of Unchained:  Rune Christensen of MakerDAO Part 1: How to Keep a Crypto-Collateralized Stablecoin Afloat: https://unchainedpodcast.com/rune-christensen-of-makerdao-part-1-how-to-keep-a-crypto-collateralized-stablecoin-afloat/ Rune Christensen of MakerDAO Part 2: How Dai Stayed at $1 While ETH Crashed From $1,400 to $85: https://unchainedpodcast.com/rune-christensen-of-makerdao-part-2-how-dai-stayed-at-1-while-eth-crashed-from-1400-to-85/ The Rise of MakerDAO: A Personal Journey:  https://unchainedpodcast.com/the-rise-of-makerdao-a-personal-journey/


    Real World Assets: Huntingdon Valley Bank (“HVB”) proposal: https://forum.makerdao.com/t/huntingdon-valley-bank-hvb-rwa-collateral-onboarding-risk-assessment/15828 $500 million allocation proposal: https://forum.makerdao.com/t/signal-request-asset-allocation-of-mip65-clydesdale/15922  
    The stablecoin trilemma: https://fluid.ch/stablecoin-trilemma/#:~:text=A%20deeper%20dive%20into%20the,decide%20on%20the%20stablecoin%20supply.

    • 1 hr 11 min
    Will the Nomad Mass Looting Change How Law Enforcement Treats DeFi Hacks?

    Will the Nomad Mass Looting Change How Law Enforcement Treats DeFi Hacks?

    Layne Haber, Co-founder of Connext Network, discusses the Nomad bridge hack, how it happened, and what can be done to prevent these exploits. 
     
    Show highlights: what Nomad is and how it works how the hack occurred and what the vulnerability was how much TVL the protocol had and how much of it was drained why the Nomad hack was unique how this exploit resembled the DAO hack on Ethereum the bounty program that Nomad offered and how hackers responded to it how Nomad is working with law enforcement, and the reasons why law enforcement has decided to get involved how Nomad has partnered with TRM Labs to help with tracking the hackers whether privacy developments in the crypto ecosystem will make it harder for law enforcement to track down hackers why cross-chain hacks happen so often what Layne thinks can be done to improve bridge security what mechanism can be implemented to prevent errors that enable these types of mass looting what Layne expects to see in the next few weeks around the Nomad exploit  
    Thank you to our sponsors!  
    Crypto.com: https://crypto.onelink.me/J9Lg/unconfirmedcardearnfeb2021
    Ava Labs: https://www.avax.network/
    Oasis: https://oasisl.ink/3Bo612R
    EPISODE LINKS  
    Layne Twitter: https://twitter.com/LayneHaber


    Nomad Hack:  https://www.theblock.co/post/160731/nomad-cross-chain-crypto-bridge-suffers-possible-exploit Sam Sun explaining the hack: https://twitter.com/samczsun/status/1554252024723546112?s=20&t=SHIZQRqJ00mmuZVXFKXuZg Nomad’s bounty program: https://twitter.com/nomadxyz_/status/1555293965049630722?s=20&t=RxH5UuWbBXiRLqu5gHDNyg Pranay Mohan’s thread: https://twitter.com/pranaymohan/status/1556402131325915137?s=20&t=RxH5UuWbBXiRLqu5gHDNyg $36 million recovered: https://twitter.com/nomadxyz_/status/1556681397993058304?s=20&t=makkX3SX1ezAXQSd6fdZYA   
    Cross-chain security:  Chainalysis article: https://blog.chainalysis.com/reports/cross-chain-bridge-hacks-2022/ Adam Cochran on crypto bridges: https://twitter.com/adamscochran/status/1554473323073093634?s=20&t=8YFw6sPEGfjvh12q8w7p-Q Vitalik’s take on cross-chain applications: https://old.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/rwojtk/ama_we_are_the_efs_research_team_pt_7_07_january/hrngyk8/ Previous Unchained coverage: The Chopping Block: How to Improve DeFi and Cross-Chain Bridge Security: https://unchainedpodcast.com/bridge-hacks-have-caused-1-billion-in-losses-heres-why-bridge-security-is-tricky/ Bridge Hacks Have Caused ~$1 Billion in Losses. Here’s Why Bridge Security Is Tricky: https://unchainedpodcast.com/bridge-hacks-have-caused-1-billion-in-losses-heres-why-bridge-security-is-tricky/  

    • 30 min

Customer Reviews

4.6 out of 5
1.1K Ratings

1.1K Ratings

graygler ,

DC episode

Smart insights on Washington this week

blablayaddayadda ,

No Bro Yo

Intelligent and informed discussion. Highly recommend. I’m a guy sick of hearing guys.

Missy Richland ,

Very informative

I have only been listening for the past 2 weeks however there is so much information discuss on this show. If your really in cryptocurrencies then you should most certainly listen to this show.

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