People are often described as the largest asset in most organisations. They are also the biggest single cause of risk. This podcast explores the topic of 'human risk', or "the risk of people doing things they shouldn't or not doing things they should", and examines how behavioural science can help us mitigate it. It also looks at 'human reward', or "how to get the most out of people". When we manage human risk, we often stifle human reward. Equally, when we unleash human reward, we often inadvertently increase human risk.
Heather Watson, Dan Bennett & Paolo Mercado on BeSci in Large Organisations
How can we implement Behavioural Science in larger organisations?
On this episode, I’m doing a deep dive into practical Behavioural Science with three practitioners from across the globe, who talk about some of the projects they’ve been working on.
My guests are all from Ogilvy Consulting, a leading Behavioural Science practice and each work in different regions.
Heather Watson heads up Ogilvy’s North American BeSci team from Austin, Texas, Dan Bennett is responsible for the UK and is based in London and Paolo Mercado is in Manila.
To connect or learn more about them:
Heather - https://www.linkedin.com/in/heathernwatson/
Dan - https://www.linkedin.com/in/thebestdanielbennett/
Paolo - https://www.linkedin.com/in/paolo-mercado-0a4a8a17/
The idea behind the episode is to illustrate the breadth of challenges to which Behavioural Science can be put to use. You’ll hear about improving customer experience, protecting people who work in safety-critical industries by helping them to change their behaviour to be more compliant with safety protocols and how Behavioural Science can help improve sales of consumer products. We also explore some of the challenges of deploying Behavioural Science in larger organisations – the obstacles, both practical and political – and the fact that we can sometimes end up proposing counter-intuitive or unorthodox solutions, which work brilliantly but can defy the logic by which normal corporate decisions are made. But that’s the whole point. Behavioural Science allows us to come up with effective solutions to common business problems, that can’t easily be solved by traditional thinking.
It’s also an opportunity for us to preview Nudgestock, Ogilvy's annual festival of behavioural science and creativity and get some clues about what you can expect.
You can find out more about Nudgestock at www.nudgestock.com
To be notified when new episodes of the show are available subscribe to the podcast newsletter: https://www.getrevue.co/profile/humanrisk
If you enjoy this episode, you can find my discussions with other members of the Ogilvy BeSci team:
Maddie Croucher who talked to me about how BeSci can help fundraising: https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/maddie-croucher-on-behavioural-science-for-fundraising/
Sam Tatam introduced his book ‘Evolutionary Ideas’ on how Mother Nature can inspire BeSci solutions https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/sam-tatam-on-evolutionary-ideas/
Benoit de Fleurian explained how BeSci is helping to reduce anti-social behaviour https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/benoit-de-fleurian-on-preventing/
And, last but definitively not least, Rory Sutherland talked about Compliance https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/rory-sutherland-on-compliance/
Wiebe Wakker on Sustainable Adventures
How can we travel adventurously while still being sustainable? I’m a huge fan of exploring, but I’m also very conscious of my environmental footprint.
On this episode, I’m speaking to Sustainable Adventurer Wiebe Wakker. He’s a Dutchman who likes exploring the world in an environmentally friendly ways.
Wiebe came to my attention earlier this year when we went from Amsterdam to Dubai by train for an environmental conference. That wasn’t his first adventure. He’d previously spent 3.5 years travelling from The Netherlands to New Zealand by electric car. That journey means that Wiebe holds the current world record for completing the longest ever electric car trip in the world covering a distance of about 95,000 kilometres.
In our discussion, we explore what inspires Wiebe to undertake his adventures, what he’s learned from doing it and I explain how he’s influenced me.
To find out more about Wiebe, visit his website: https://plugmeinproject.com/
You’ll find him on social media:
Twitter - https://twitter.com/wiebewkkr?lang=en
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/plugmeintravel/?hl=en
LinkedIn - https://nl.linkedin.com/in/wiebewakker
During our discussion, we talk about:
Seat61.com - an amazing website for planning train adventures
Maddie Croucher on Behavioural Science for Fundraising
How can charities use Behavioural Science to be more effective at fundraising? It’s a question a number of listeners have asked me to explore; either because they work for charities or because they want to help their favourite causes to raise more money. Even if neither of those things apply, what we can learn from how charities can be better at raising funds, is relevant in other contexts.
My guest on this episode is Maddie Croucher, a behavioural science practitioner who specialises in interventions to support social impact work. Maddie has boosted fundraising income for Christian Aid, helped improve donor retention for DKMS - an international nonprofit bone marrow donor centre - and developed interventions to tackle malnutrition with The Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation.
She’s also the co-author of a book called Change for Better that provides practical help for fundraisers.
In our discussion, we talk about:
Change For Better, the book Maddie co-authored - https://www.dsc.org.uk/publication/change-for-better/
It's also available on Kindle - https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Change-Better-Bernard-Ross-ebook/dp/B09X5SDBKV/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1UVA9QO1BGHFU&keywords=Change+for+better&qid=1650660657&sprefix=change+for+better%2Caps%2C68&sr=8-1
The Jam Experiment — an experiment that highlighted how Choice Overload (having too many options) can make it harder for people to decide, so they often don’t bother. https://medium.com/@FlorentGeerts/the-jam-experiment-how-choice-overloads-makes-consumers-buy-less-d610f8c37b9b
Charity Water - a charity that seeks to address the fact that 771 million people lack basic access to clean and safe drinking water. https://www.charitywater.org/
Wikipedia’s annual fundraising - https://medium.com/@chriskfundraising/why-doesnt-social-proof-work-for-wikipedia-fundraising-65d55a047911
The Pillion Trust’s ‘F**k The Poor’ campaign - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rElgYNemi1A
Gift Aid, the UK scheme that allows taxpayers to increase teh size of tier charitable donations by reclaiming tax - https://www.cafonline.org/my-personal-giving/plan-your-giving/individual-giving-account/how-does-it-work/gift-aid
Nudgestock, Ogilvy’s Annual Behavioural Science Festival which this year is on June 10th - https://nudgestock.com/
The Ogilvy 2022 Behavioural Science Annual Report - https://www.ogilvy.com/ideas/behavioral-science-annual-2022
You can follow Maddie on Twitter - https://twitter.com/maddie_croucher
To be notified whenever a new episode of the show comes out, subscribe to the Human Risk podcast newsletter - https://bit.ly/3skhz1Q
David Loseby on Behavioural Procurement
What does behaviour have to do with procurement? On the face of it, not much. But as my guest on this episode David Loseby explains, behind every procurement and supply chain operation, there are human beings involved in the design and management of the processes.
In other words, they’re areas that present huge opportunities for human risk to manifest itself. As David, who specialises in helping companies to manage the behavioural dynamics behind operational decisions, explains, there are trade-offs that need to be made. Just in time processes can deliver lower costs by reducing the need to warehouse stock and tie up working capital. But, as we saw under COVID, they’re also extremely vulnerable when things don’t go according to plan.
If we ignore human decision-making and what can be done to mitigate the risks it poses. It’s also worth remembering that if companies have a procurement function, it means that the amount of money they’re spending on procurement activities is large enough to justify the function's existence. Which is great if they get things right. But not so good when they get things wrong.
David has over 25 years of experience at a senior executive/director level driving value and change through procurement and organisational transformation.
His varied background enables him to draw on not only his various global experiences, sector diversity and responsibilities within many Public Bodies as well as FTSE 100 companies.
During our discussion, we talk about
- David’s background & research: https://research-portal.uea.ac.uk/en/persons/david-loseby
- David’s book Soft Skills for Hard Business: https://www.cambridgeacademic.com/product/soft-skills-for-hard-business
- The VUCA framework short for volatility, uncertainty, complexity, ambiguity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volatility,_uncertainty,_complexity_and_ambiguity
- The COM-B model of behaviour change https://thedecisionlab.com/reference-guide/organizational-behavior/the-com-b-model-for-behavior-change
- The Tanker driver who was followed by a line of drivers, who discovered that he wasn’t carrying fuel: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-58767230
You can get hold of David via his LinkedIn page: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-loseby-cpochangeexecdir/
To be notified of new episodes of the show, subscribe to the Human Risk podcast newsletter: https://www.getrevue.co/profile/humanrisk
Professor Don Moore on Decision Leadership
What makes a good leader? When we think of leaders, we often imagine lone, inspirational figures lauded for their behaviours, attributes, and personal decisions. However, leaders also have an impact on the way people around them make decisions.
My guest on this episode is Professor Don Moore. Don is the Lorraine Tyson Mitchell Chair in Leadership and Communication at Berkeley Haas and serves as Associate Dean for Academic Affairs.
Don is the co-author of a book with Professor Max Bazerman called Decision Leadership: Empowering others to make better choices, that explores the idea of organisations in the 21st century as decision factories in which effective effective leaders are decision architects, enabling those around them to make wise, ethical choices consistent with their own interests and the organization’s highest values. As a result, a leader’s impact grows because it ripples out instead of relying on one individual to play the part of heroic figure.
To find out more about Don: https://haas.berkeley.edu/faculty/moore-don/
To learn more about Decision Leadership: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300259698/decision-leadership/
To hear Don’s previous appearance on the show:
To hear the previous episode of the show with Wendy Lambourne on Legitimate Leadership: https://www.humanriskpodcast.com/wendy-lambourne-on-legitimate-leadership/
Wendy Lambourne on Legitimate Leadership
What distinguishes a good leader from a bad one?
My guest on this episode, Wendy Lambourne is a proponent of Legitimate Leadership — the idea that to have real power, leaders need to have legitimacy. Not by dint of being appointed, but by the way in which they fulfil their role.
She believes that leaders stand or fall at the end of the day on the basis of their intent, or motive. Or to put it another way, whether they’re in the relationship to give to their people, or to get something out of them.
Since leadership is all about people leading other people, there’s lots of potential for human risk.
In our discussion we explore:
- how Wendy came to discover the idea of Legitkamte Leadership (LL);
- what LL means in practice;
- how leaders can manifest it;
- the difference between authority and power;
- what the implications are for businesses of adopting LL; and
- what Wendy has learned from teaching the framework to others.
To learn more about Legitimate Leadership see https://legitimateleadership.com/
To buy Wendy’s book: https://www.amazon.com/Wendy-Lambourne/e/B00CASM2C4?ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_5&qid=1614152045&sr=8-5
Insightful and engaging!
Christian and his highly knowledgeable guests take the already fascinating study of human risk and bring it to life through engaging and intellectual conversations designed to not only educate, but make you think harder about the world we live in and the role risk plays in it. Thanks so much for putting out such a superb show, Christian - keep up the great work!
Great format, great guests!
Christian Consistently delivers great context that at the same delivers a smile and a head scratch. He’s a terrific host and a thoughtful conversationalist. Keep up the good work!
Informative and amusing
Really enjoy the podcast! Unique topics and lively discussion.