On the Rights of Nature

Pella Thiel
  • 4.0 (4)
  • SOCIETY & CULTURE

On the Rights of Nature - we follow the transformative movement where people, by challenging the foundations of law, shift the story of how human society relates with the living world. In this podcast we will explore the emergence of expanding legal frameworks to include nature; rivers, lakes, mountains and land. We will hear from academics, activists, lawyers and indigenous voices who are doing this profound work.

  1. 5D AGO

    12. The Land that owns itself with Mari Margil

    This episode I am joined by Mari Margil, the Executive Director of the US Center for Democratic and Environmental Rights, to talk about their pioneering initiative to develop new frameworks where land can own itself. Mari is one of those pioneers in the rights of nature movement. She has served as the Associate Director of the Community Environmental Legal Defense Fund (CELDF). In 2008, she acted as a consultant to Ecuador's national Constituent Assembly, helping to draft the world's first rights of nature constitutional provisions. Mari works with national and local governments, tribal nations, indigenous communities and NGOs in Australia, the Philippines, Nepal, Sweden and elsewhere, to advance legal and policy frameworks regarding rights of nature.    Mari Margil supported us to write a proposal for including the rights of nature in the constitution of Sweden. This was then developed into a parliamentary motion by the green party, which has been presented several times. It was denied again just a few weeks ago. It is difficult to introduce RoN into law, which is why innovative measures like the land that owns itself is so interesting.    LINKS: Mari Margil Center for Environmental Rights https://www.centerforenvironmentalrights.org/team/mari-margil The Land that owns itself Center for Environmental Rights https://www.centerforenvironmentalrights.org/the-land-that-owns-itself First mountain to own itself Center for Environmental Rights https://www.centerforenvironmentalrights.org/news/crestone-eagle-pyramid-mtn-becomes-the-first-mountain-to-own-itself-indigenous-led-council-to-serve-as-guardian Mari Margils text on The Guardian: Our laws make slaves of nature. It's not just humans who need rights https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/may/23/laws-slaves-nature-humans-rights-environment-amazon The proposal to amend the swedish constitution with Rights of Nature:  https://naturensrattigheter.se/2019/05/15/amendment-for-the-rights-of-nature-in-the-constitution-of-sweden/ Earth rights conferences in Sweden  2017: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H82s6kmjr9w 2019: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHV2dhTk4FE

    40 min

  2. APR 23

    11. Is a River Alive? with Robert Macfarlane

    This is a special episode, a conversation between Robert Macfarlane, Pella Thiel and Ingrid Rieser as Macfarlane's remarkable new book, Is a River Alive?, was published in Swedish. Robert Macfarlane is a British writer and academic, best known for his lyrical books about landscape, nature, place, and language. He is Professor of Literature and the Environmental Humanities at the University of Cambridge, and his works - such as Mountains of the Mind, The Old Ways, Landmarks, and Underland - have won multiple awards, made him one of the leading voices in contemporary nature writing and even made him figure as a potential laureate of the Nobel Prize in literature. Is a River Alive? is a meandering story about waterbodies and their humans, investigating rivers as subjects with interests, needs, and agency.  The episode begins with a presentation by Robert, followed by a conversation hosted by Ingrid Rieser in a big lecture hall in KTH Royal Institute of Technology in Stockholm. The session ends with great questions from the audience. This is a collaboration with the podcast Forest of Thought and Environmental Humanities Lab at the KTH Royal Institute of Technology. LINKS:  Video version here: https://forestofthought.substack.com/p/live-is-a-river-alive Robert Macfarlane book Is a River Alive? https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/455147/is-a-river-alive-by-macfarlane-robert/9780241624814 The Swedish version of the book: Har floden ett liv? https://oceanbooks.se/bok/har-floden-ett-liv/ Environmental Humanities Lab on KTH Sweden - https://www.kth.se/ehl/kth-environmental-humanities-laboratory-1.1225452 Forest of Thought Podcast - https://forestofthought.com/

    1h 20m

  3. MAR 21

    10. Zoöps: Governance for the Living with Klaas Kuitenbrouwer

    Klaas Kuitenbrouwer is the director of the Zoönomic Institute in the Netherlands, one of the organisations with most experience in designing structures for organisational governance from a more-than-human viewpoint. They tend to the roots of the Zoöp movement, supporting organisations to become regenerative by adding a person with a special function: a Speaker for the Living. Klaas studied history at the University of Utrecht and has since the late 1990s worked at the intersections of culture, technology and ecology. A key element in his work is the intersection of different knowledge practices: technological, artistic, legal, scientific, and nonhuman. Currently he works as a senior researcher at Het Nieuwe Instituut in Rotterdam and was responsible for – among other projects – the Garden of Machines (2015), 51Sprints (2016) and Gardening Mars (2017). He co-curated the Neuhaus Temporary Academy for more-than-human knowledge (2019), where he initiated the Zoöp project. A Zoöp is an organisation that collaborates with the other-than-humans in its operational sphere. Together they work on ecological regeneration and foster the emergence of a regenerative economy, or human-inclusive ecosystem. The Zoöp model can be adopted by all organisations.   https://zoop.earth/en/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0016328725000461

    55 min

  4. FEB 11

    9. A Voice of Nature with Dominique Hes

    Dominique Hes is an author, educator and policy advisor with a PhD in Architecture and has been thinking about biomimicry, biophilia and regenerative development for a long time, publishing the award winning book 'Designing for Hope: Pathways to Regenerative sustainability', a decade ago. Her continued research centres on how to create a built environment that is good for people and the nature they are a part of. Dominique is the chair of Greenfleet, an NGO planting native forests in Australia and New Zealand. But our conversation is centered around her new role as the Voice of Nature on the Board of RegenMelbourne. This was a lively conversation, with a third participant, Max the parakeet who inhabits a cage behind Dominique as we speak, prompting us to briefly talk about animals as our helpers in getting a culture which has become a bit lost to find its way again. It is a long distance between Sweden and Melbourne, so there are small glitches in the conversation. Nature on the Board https://www.regen.melbourne/news/dominique-hes-nature-on-the-board

    56 min

  5. 11/20/2025

    8. The Embassy of the North Sea with Christiane Bosman

    In this episode, Christiane Bosman presents the Embassy of the North Sea. She talks about how the sea is often seen as empty space, where human activity can take place. Through using the frame of an embassy, she often gets access to spaces to represent the interests of the North Sea that would otherwise not be available. The Embassy began as an art project, which turned out to be a constructive point of access. The creative and wild perspective brought by art paved the way for deeper conversations and ways forward. Christiane also reports from the Confluence of European Waterbodies, recently held in Amsterdam. A large group of people representing 34 waterbodies - rivers, lakes, glaciers, lagoons, and seas - came together. Christiane Bosman studied museology, art history and communication management. She has over 15 years of experience in developing, curating and producing cultural interventions in the public domain, with a focus on human non-human relationships since 2019. Previously she worked at SKOR | Foundation Art and Public Domain and TAAK cooperative. As a freelancer she worked for various cultural clients such as Het Nieuwe Instituut (La Biënnale di Venezia and La Triënnale di Milano) and Public Art Amsterdam. At the Embassy of the North Sea she is public programme director since 2019, and Confluence of European Water Bodies lead, a network of over 35 grass roots interdisciplinary collectives all over Europe, working on the legal, cultural and political representation of water. Since June 2023 she is also curator at the Ministry for the Future. Links:  https://www.embassyofthenorthsea.com/over/ https://water-bodies.eu/

    42 min

  6. 09/22/2025

    7. Art and Artificial Intelligence speaking for Nature with Nonhuman Nonsense

    Nonhuman Nonsense is a research-driven art and design collective working in the realm of social dreaming and world-making. Their projects engage with the nonhuman: animals, objects, ecology, technology, and the spectres between and beyond categories. Nonhuman Nonsense sees nonsense as an antidote to "common sense" – embracing paradoxical stories to explore the ethical and metaphysical layers of our relationship with the (nonhuman) world.  In this conversation with Leo Fidjeland and Linnea Våglund of Nonhuman Nonsense we discuss the role of art in speaking for nature and how the arts may provide a bridge in troubled times: widening the field and deepening conversations on ethical and burning issues beyond polarized views. We focus on the recent project Council of Forest, a forum where nonhuman entities supported by AI deliberate on the fate of their shared home in the north of Sweden, the Vindelälven-Juhttátahkka Biosphere reserve. You hear from Salmon, Reindeer, Pine and Wind turbine as they eloquently describe their perspectives on the green transition. Through the project, Nonhuman Nonsense are asking if AI can embody the wisdom of a tree, a river or a reindeer herd? What does it mean to act in the forest's best interest? And what happens if we take nonhuman voices seriously? We also touch upon Nonhuman Nonsenes interplanetary campaign, recognising the legal personhood of Mars and Martians.   Nonhuman Nonsense: https://nonhuman-nonsense.com/about  Council of Forest: https://council-of-forest.com/ Planetary Personhood, a universal declaration of Martian rights https://planetarypersonhood.com/

    47 min

  7. 08/15/2025

    6. Rights of nature in Constitutional law - Hugo Echeverria

    Hugo Echeverria is an attorney who has worked in environmental law since 2001, with an emphasis on biodiversity conservation, the environmental rule of law, and the rights of nature. He is a member of the UN Harmony with Nature, as well as the IUCN World Commission on Environmental Law. Ecuador is the first, and still the only, country on the planet to recognize rights of nature in the constitution. Hugo has worked on a variety of cases to enforce this provision, contributing to some of the world's first jurisprudence on rights of nature. We talk about how it became possible for nature to be recognised as a rights holder in the constitution and how the Constitutional Court has weighed in lately to define what it means. Hugo describes some of the most significant cases, and discusses influence on international law systems. We also touch on the risk of the rights of nature being taken out at a potential revision of the constitution. Chapter 7, Article 71 in the Constitution of the Republic of Ecuador: "Nature, or Pacha Mama, where life is reproduced and occurs, has the right to integral respect for its existence and for the maintenance and regeneration of its life cycles, structure, functions and evolutionary processes." Read the whole chapter on the rights of nature: https://pdba.georgetown.edu/Constitutions/Ecuador/english08.html Article in Science co-authored by Hugo: Science and the legal rights of nature (2023) https://portal.research.lu.se/en/publications/science-and-the-legal-rights-of-nature  Inside Climate on the marine coastal ecosystems ruling in the Constitutional Court of Ecuador: A Court Says Coastal Marine Ecosystems Have Intrinsic Value - and Legal Rights https://insideclimatenews.org/news/17012025/ecuador-constitutional-court-marine-ecosystem-rights/

    53 min

  8. 06/30/2025

    5. Rights of Nature in the Philippines - Yolanda Esguerra

    Yolanda Esguerra is a passionate environmental and social justice advocate from the Philippines. She is a leading voice in the movement to integrate ecological justice into Philippine legal and social systems, the National Coordinator of the Philippine Misereor Partnership Inc, a network of over 230 civil society organizations and church groups which is the leader of the RoN movement in the Philippines. She has represented the Philippines in international forums, including the International Rights of Nature Tribunal. Our conversation is held shortly after the passing of Pope Francis and we talk about the leadership of the catholic church for RoN in the Philippines, as well as the importance of Laudato Si, Pope Francis encyclical letter on the care of our common home, the Earth. Links:  https://pmpi.org.ph https://laudatosimovement.org

    31 min
See All (13)

Ratings & Reviews

4
out of 5
4 Ratings

About

On the Rights of Nature - we follow the transformative movement where people, by challenging the foundations of law, shift the story of how human society relates with the living world. In this podcast we will explore the emergence of expanding legal frameworks to include nature; rivers, lakes, mountains and land. We will hear from academics, activists, lawyers and indigenous voices who are doing this profound work.

Information

  • Creator
    Pella Thiel
  • Years Active
    2025 - 2026
  • Episodes
    13
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2025
  • Show Website
    On the Rights of Nature

You Might Also Like