Real Talk With Susan & Kristina

KJK
Real Talk With Susan & Kristina

Have you ever wished for a comprehensive guide to help navigate those challenging and uncomfortable moments in parenting? We're Susan Stone and Kristina Supler—full-time moms and dedicated student attorneys at KJK. Our careers in student advocacy provide a unique perspective, but fundamentally, we're two moms sharing the wisdom gathered from our experiences at home and in the courtroom. Our podcast delves into the essential aspects of parenting, covering a wide spectrum of topics. We dissect trends, examine case studies, and draw from expert opinions in each episode, aiming to equip you with insights on raising resilient kids in our constantly changing world. Please join us as we delve into some 'Real Talk.'

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    Real Talk: Navigating College Acceptance Season

    Welcome to this week's episode of Real Talk! In this installment, hosts Susan and Kristina delve into the high-stakes world of college admissions alongside guest Davida Amkraut. As the trio navigates the aftermath of a particularly competitive admissions season, they offer invaluable insights, tips, and tricks to help listeners make informed decisions. With the college acceptance landscape resembling a bloodbath this year, many students have found themselves admitted to schools that weren't necessarily their first choice. Parents, this episode is essential listening as the team breaks down what you need to know before sending your child off to college. And for upcoming seniors, they provide crucial advice on staying ahead of the curve and crafting a strategic plan for the college application process. Tune in for a candid discussion packed with insider knowledge and practical guidance!   About Davida Amkraut: Davida is an Independent College Consultant who serves as the saving grace for students and families in crisis who are navigating the complex college application process. Whether a student finds themselves in trouble and is applying to college for the first time, or is transitioning from one university to another due to a Title IX or other university-related misconduct claim, Davida helps young adults shape their stories so that they gain acceptance into college.   TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone: Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina Supler. We are full time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversations.   Susan Stone: Last week was accepted students weekend for Tori. Can you believe it?    Kristina Supler: what a big, big like- How do you feel now that you know where she's going?   Susan Stone: Oh my gosh. First of all, for the listeners out there. My youngest just accepted college. She will be going to Ringling College in Sarasota, Florida, which is an art school.   Kristina Supler: Fabulous.    Susan Stone: To have it done for the final time was crazy. And our guest today, I also know has three kids, but I think all of them are out of college. Welcome back to Davida Amkraut .    Davida Amkraut: Thank you. Thank you. I actually have one still in college. He's just finishing his sophomore year, so.    Kristina Supler: Well, we're glad you're able to join us again.Our listeners probably remember you from some of your prior recordings with us and welcome back.    Davida Amkraut: It's good to see you guys. Yeah.    Susan Stone: Where is your youngest? Northeastern    Davida Amkraut: am I that's my middle. He's graduating in May from Northeastern. He's graduating in two weeks, and my youngest is at George Washington University.    Susan Stone: And how was his experience there?    Davida Amkraut: Loves loves loves loves it.He's in the pre physical therapy program there. So he's having  wow that's back. That's back to your that's your basic simpler. Yeah. Therapy. Yeah.   Susan Stone: may be great for everyone out here. Christina's family's in    Kristina Supler: PT Bizz    Susan Stone: So, DeVita, you've got a lot of career changes lately. Why don't you catch our listeners up with what you're doing?    Davida Amkraut: Yeah, so I'm still doing.I still am running my own private practice where I assist. This past year, I had about 55 kids from all across the country, actually, who I worked with, on college admissions. But I also joined a high school team, in the Bronx, where I'm working at a Jewish high school in the Bronx, and I am on their college counseling team.   So it's really fascinating for me to see both sides of the table. Right. So I'm working with kids from my computer, but then I'm also working with kids in person, and I've had a lot of access to admission officers, which has been amazing. I've been on advocacy calls for my students. For the listeners who don't know what that means is, prior to decisions being released, if schools allow it, we we have a call with the admission officer for our our rep for our region, and we're sort of able to pitch our case, you know, and, you know, tell them a little bit,    Kristina Supler: So  you can literally lobby for a particular student to have a spot at assembly Davida Amkraut: Only at certain schools. A lot of schools have done away with these advocacy calls, calls because it prevents and prevents inequity, because not every counselor has the time to make 400 phone calls for their students. But because we're at a smaller school, our caseload is a little bit smaller. So we do have the ears and eyes of some counselors who are still very happy to talk to us.   So, for example, Cooper Union, which is an engineering and architecture school in Manhattan. I don't know if you    Susan Stone: I looked at Cooper Union with Tory.    Davida Amkraut: Yeah. So I actually was able to talk to Cooper about my student, who they were considering for a regular decision, and give them an update about everything that he's been doing since he last applied in person. And then they were able to ask me questions, and it was like a 15 minute phone call. but it's a fascinating thing, right? To be able to have that access. Some schools will just call and give you the numbers of who is going to get in and who's not going to get in by names, actually. But you can't really advocate at that point because it's already done deal    Susan Stone: done deal.    Davida Amkraut: But they do give the courtesy to the admission, you know, the college counselors to let them know what our decisions are going to be so that we can be there for the students on the receiving end.    Susan Stone: Could you have done that for your private clients?   Davida Amkraut: No no no no no. They will never speak to independent office counselors at all. No.    Susan Stone: So what can the independent college counselor do that's different from the in-house school college counselor?    Davida Amkraut: So I always say the in-house school college counselor is not only well, it depends on if it's a college counselor or if it's a high school counselor. So you'll see that that verbiage has changed, because if it's a high school counselor, that counselor and I know in Beachwood in Shaker, they are high school counselors as well as college counselors.So not only are they dealing with a college process, they're also dealing with a social, emotional piece for every single student in that high school. So they have a very, very big, big caseload. You know, if they're dealing with social, emotional and college, college sort of doesn't always take, you know, the front seat to that. So an independent counselor can help identify schools.   They can help keep the kids on deadlines. They can do read throughs of essays. They could help position them a little bit better and look at their activities and say, you know, you're applying to an engineering program. You have nothing engineering on your application. We need to get you involved with something. A counselor at a large public school probably doesn't have the bandwidth to do that, right.   They're just looking at doing a cursory review. They're going on scatter grams, which is the, you know, the Naviance score to see where they have sent other kids in their school and making a guess about where the kids should apply without really having that in-depth consultation. If that makes sense    Susan Stone: When you have a kid, let's say you have five kids at your high school all looking at George Washington. Can you advocate for all five or do you have to?    Davida Amkraut: You probably wouldn't. We probably wouldn't advocate for all five. We would choose the one that we think would probably be the most successful, or the one that they would really want. looking at the profile and looking at and also knowing that that might not be that student's first choice.Right. We have that Intel. So we would never advocate for a school if it's an early action or if it's a regular decision for a school that we know that the kid would never go to. Does that make sense? We know what    Susan Stone: they're right, kid. But let's say you have three kids. I'm going to say a popular school this year.They want Michigan and they're dying to get into Michigan. Do you pick the best horse?    Davida Amkraut: Well, Michigan doesn't let advocacy calls. Are you surprised by that? They, they have a    Kristina Supler: no, because they don't need to. I mean, that they get the best of best.    Davida Amkraut: They had 75,000 applications this year for a class that's housed. That was their numbers for this year.That was 70,000 early action. Right. So who knows how many additional people who had in their regular season. Right. So a lot of kids will not apply during that early action because they want to use that time to get their grades up, for instance. Right? So then they'll hold back their application until the January 1st to really show their, you know, the upward trajectory. So that's only 70,000 early action applications for our class of 7,000. Right.  Kristina Supler: So what are your takeaways from this past, you know, season? I mean what did you see, what trends and what lessons, you know, were learned for students who are, you know, on the brink for next year?    Davida Amkraut: Yeah. Well, I would say actually, funny you should ask that.But just yesterday we had two bombshells just dropped on our laps on April 11th that two of the big schools are now going to require testing. Harvard and Cal Tech announced April 11th that they're gonna require testing, which is very, very it's it's so hurtful to so many counselors who are listening that to    Kristina Supler: Other schools announced that to  in the Ivys   Davida Amkraut: They did it before th

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    Real Talk: Cuddle Caution - Student's Guide to Consent & Boundaries

    Students sometimes enjoy cuddling, but innocent acts can sometimes lead to serious Title IX cases. These situations are more common than you might expect. Join Susan and Kristina in this episode of Real Talk as they discuss common pitfalls, focusing on important aspects like communication, conversation, and consent. Tune in for essential insights, and be sure to share this information with your students.   LINKS MENTIONED IN THE SHOW: https://studentdefense.kjk.com/   TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone: Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina Supler. We are full time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversations.   Susan Stone: Nice to see you on this dreary, rainy day.    Kristina Supler: Indeed, it is.    Susan Stone: It is. Well, we're going to talk about something that's actually good to do on a rainy day.    Kristina Supler: Ooh, tell me more. What could that be?    Susan Stone: Cuddling.    Kristina Supler: Who doesn't love cuddling?    Susan Stone: My gosh. You know what? I'm mourning the fact that my youngest is about to go to college. And we talked about this on prior podcasts, but do you remember we used to have younger kids. But back in the day.    Kristina Supler: My kids love to CUDDLE Yeah,    Susan Stone: There's nothing like that. Cuddling up a little kid, especially on a rainy morning.   Susan Stone: Couldn't agree more.   Susan Stone: I love it.    Kristina Supler: Well, why are you talking about cuddling today, Susan? Do I go with this?   Susan Stone: Well, we're going to get there because, as you know, nobody sees us and things until something goes wrong. And what is that saying? Everything's fine till somebody gets poked in the eye. Do you remember that thing?    Kristina Supler: Yes.    Susan Stone: Well, we're going to talk about cuddling going wrong. But first, let's just talk about why do we cuddle? I mean, I was doing a little research on cuddling and did you know that cuddling produces oxytocin and basically makes you feel good and safe?   Kristina Supler: Well, that's interesting because I suppose and you know, you're the special ed wiz, if you will, is it could one argue that cuddling is kind of like a form of O.T. in a way, occupational therapy or stimulating you in some way?    Susan Stone: Well, we know it improves sleep. There are some studies out there that says it actually boosts the immune system and it, believe it or not, lowers blood pressure. That's crazy, isn't it?    Kristina Supler: Now that I didn't see that one coming, I'm just thinking about like some of our little kids and people with sensitivities to touch and touch can be a good thing. And also maybe something that can be triggering.    Susan Stone: Yeah, exactly. Well, I would say that in early childhood, cuddling definitely leads to attachment parenting. You really form bonds.   Kristina Supler: Well, that like when you first have your baby and they want to put the baby on your chest for the. What does that kangaroo care? What was it called?   Susan Stone:  I think it's kangaroo care. It's been a minute   Kristina Supler: and they have had a baby.    Susan Stone: Yeah, but I think your point is well taken that some children actually are averse to touch, you know, like that feeling. But most people do. And a little simple hug or cuddle is wonderful for parents. And I'm a big fan of parents being physically affectionate with children. But.   Kristina Supler: but there's always a but    Susan Stone: but we're not here to talk about parents snuggling their babies,    Kristina Supler: I think as part of our podcast. It's funny, every episode there's sort of a theme of, in reality, things that are nice. Most of the time innocent sure and then put them on a college campus and the title nine world. And of course, there's always room for things to go wrong. So are we talking about cuddling in the context of Title Nine today?    Susan Stone: We are. Because one person's innocent, platonic, asexual cuddling can be another person's prelude to a hookup.   Kristina Supler: Indeed, indeed. And that actually makes me think we've had over the years we've had quite a few cases that are sort of rooted in, I don't know, cuddling going wrong, if you will, though I think it probably depends on who you ask. Right?   Susan Stone: Well, I just learned that there is a definitional difference between cuddling and snuggling.    Kristina Supler: Now this is totally new to me.Tell me more. I'm very interested.    Susan Stone: Okay. I read by Rabbi Google. You know, the go to source of all things.    Kristina Supler: When you're done, I'm going to tell you something that I just came across on Rabbi Google.    Susan Stone: Okay, good. So cuddling his arms around someone and snuggling is rubbing up and wiggling against a person.    Kristina Supler: Okay, that makes sense.   Susan Stone: It does?   Kristina Supler: Yeah.    Susan Stone: How do you think it makes sense? Supler    Kristina Supler: Because snuggling. It makes me think about, like, getting cozy and, like, under a blanket. And you're sort of, I don't know, inching up and just, like, being warm. And as I'm saying this, I'm realizing I don't even I don't know, it just makes sense to me that one's different.   Susan Stone: Well, so maybe we're not here really to talk about cuddling. Maybe we're here to talk about snuggling when that goes wrong,    Kristina Supler: Perhaps. But you reminded me, actually, not too long ago, I saw this headline about how in Manhattan, because of course, you can find anything in Manhattan, there are actually    Susan Stone: I love the Big Apple    Kristina Supler: professional cuddling services where people charge $150 an hour to cuddle in a platonic way because people are seeking out like that touch therapy thing.   Which made me think of the OT question I asked you earlier. How about that though? Truly, anything you want can be found in New York.    Susan Stone: It can be. But let's go back. And that's interesting. It may be kind of creepy. I don't know how I feel about it, but let's go back to college, because in college there are people who like to have what they call cuddle buddies.   Kristina Supler: Sure. And I think that from the perspective of Title nine, how can things go wrong? I mean, it's really in essence, any sort of touching or physical contact, if it's unwelcome, could perhaps give rise to a claim for sexual harassment.   Susan Stone: So let's set the stage for our listeners. It's late. You've already gone out. The bars have closed.So it's what, 2 a.m.    Kristina Supler: sure. I guess it depends what state you're in, but I think two AMs a reasonable time.    Susan Stone: Okay. And you know, nothing good happens at 2 a.m..    Kristina Supler: Nothing.    Susan Stone: Nothing. So it's 2 a.m. and you decide to watch a little Netflix and chill for your evening out. Maybe you've had a beer or two or ten and you decide to cuddle and accidentally you might even fall asleep and or not. And the cuddling to one person, they're tired. They want to go to sleep, but to the other person they get aroused, duu duu dun   Kristina Supler: Sure. I mean, I think one could argue that that is a natural consequence of cuddling    Susan Stone: and a hand might wander.    Kristina Supler: It's possible,    Susan Stone: and a hand might wander without consent.    Kristina Supler: Indeed.    Susan Stone: And there's your title nine.    Kristina Supler: Yeah. I mean, the whole at the heart of the Title nine analysis was the issue of unwelcomeness. And then also, you know, a conversation. It makes me think Conversations we often have with our students of any age is sort of impact versus intent, you know? But I didn't mean for anything, you know, to be upsetting or offensive, but it was received that way by someone else. And so what do you do with that? And that's really, in essence, what all of our Title nine cases are about, cause I don't think anyone ever says, I intentionally did X, Y, Z to hurt someone. It's always I didn't mean to or something was misunderstood or misconstrued. And then you have the, you know, the consequences of whatever the circumstance was. And that's often what we're navigating through is sort of the the gray.    Susan Stone: Well, because the definition of content send can be words or actions. And so what is an action? I thought we were cuddling. I thought we were getting closer. I thought you also were romantically interested in me. And so I thought it was a natural move on my part to move my hand. And the other person's thinking, wait, you didn't even talk to me? But that's not the definition of consent. It's words or actions. And I think that's where the confusion comes from.    Kristina Supler: Well, and I'm going to say this, that, you know, sort of a prevailing viewpoint might be that, well, come on, please. Everyone knows that cuddling is just sort of a gateway to a hookup. How would you respond to that?    Susan Stone: I don't even think that's true because as we started our whole podcast, parents cuddle children, but as we have worked our way through this issue, I think the confusion comes from the difference between cuddling and snuggling. And I think that college students don't spend enough time as they're creating these cuddle buddies to determine, is it truly platonic?   How do you know that you might feel platonic, and the other person might actually have feelings, and the cuddling or snuggling enhances those feelings.    Kristina Supler: So, I hear you. But then I guess let me ask you this. It sorts of circles back to what I very in artfully tried to define before the

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    Real Talk: Exploring Who We Are, What We Do, and How We Came Together

    In this week's episode of 'Real Talk,' Susan and Kristina uncover the secret to their successful partnership. Join them for a hilarious exploration of their working relationship, their practice,and the valuable lessons learned during their nearly decade-long collaboration. So grab a cup of coffee and join them for a candid conversation about what makes their professional bond so special.   LINKS MENTIONED IN THE SHOW: https://studentdefense.kjk.com/  https://www.amazon.com/Yes-Your-Kid-Parents-Todays/dp/1637743807  https://www.instagram.com/stonesupler/   TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone: Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina Supler. We are full time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversations.   Kristina Supler: Susan ever since the Super Bowl.   Susan Stone: Oh no, oh no. Don't say it.   Kristina Supler: I have a secret guilty pleasure. I confess to you and our listeners out there like,   Susan Stone: Oh my God here, it's coming.   Kristina Supler: But I am totally, completely obsessed with the dunking Dunkin Donuts commercials, the Ben Affleck Matt Damon commercials. Did you see those during the Super Bowl?   Susan Stone: Okay. Not only did I see them, but I saw us in Ben and Matt.   Kristina Supler: That's what I thought.   Susan Stone: I know.   Kristina Supler: What is about those two. I was so drawn to it. I can't stop watching when they're there walking in. We got touchdown, Tommy. On the key.   Susan Stone: You love that one.   Kristina Supler: I love that one.   Susan Stone: Touchdown Tommy on the keys. Okay, Because here's what it is. They've been together a long time working and kind of separating.Yeah. We're not childhood friends, but.    Kristina Supler: No, we're not.   Susan Stone:  But it's been.   Kristina Supler:  It's been a minute.   Susan Stone: It's been a second. Collaborating,   Kristina Supler: Creativity   Susan Stone: Creativity. And, you know, they drive each other crazy, which we do sometimes.   Kristina Supler: We do. We do. But there's humor there. I can't even tell you how much it made me laugh when Matt Damon looks at Ben Affleck and he's like, how do you like them donuts?   Susan Stone: Oh my God.   Kristina Supler: I’m so sorry.   Susan Stone: Okay. The line I loved is sometimes it's really hard to be your friend or remember, I would do anything for you. This is anything. And I know those moments because in our working relationship, in our friendship, we ask an absolute a lot from each other.   Kristina Supler: Oh yeah. It's it's really it's been it's been quite a journey we've been on for the past. I don't even know how long it's been.   Susan Stone: for the listeners out there. And those of you who are in Greek organizations, I hard rushed Sue Blur to be my law partner. I remember saying, Join me in this practice. And you're like, Well, I still want my criminal defense and you still do.   Kristina Supler: I still do. You do. I do.   Susan Stone: But mostly we represent students out there and we do handle a lot of criminal defense and we deal do with that. We still deal with sex issues   Kristina Supler: all day, every day.   Susan Stone:  It was a hard sell getting you in, but we made it and it's been actually almost ten years.   Kristina Supler: So why are we talking about this today? Why what is the point of this episode of this topic? Are our listeners are like what we're gone from done kings and Matt Damon and Ben Affleck to to the two of you are   Susan Stone: Dunking’s or dukin?   Kristina Supler:  it's done Kings Kings because they're kings I swear folks she’s  really smart   Susan Stone: I just feel like what Dunkin Donuts like   Kristina Supler:  Yeah it is but in the commercial they were getting creative. Okay okay,.   Susan Stone: Guys that's what life is like in the office and why I do   Kristina Supler: And that by the way I knew when I met her I said, she's the one for me.   Susan Stone: Absolutely. Guys, please stop. I'm menopausal I’ll pee in my pants. Okay, so how. Here's the thing, guys.   Kristina Supler: For real.   Susan Stone: For real.   Kristina Supler: In all seriousness,   Susan Stone: In all seriousness, we do handle your serious legal issues, but it's hard work and you really have to grind a lot of hours and there's got to be a lot of trust in the person you work with. And there's got a lot there's got to be a lot of synergy. And I think that we're doing this episode to show that we really are more than law partners, that we will be like being together.   Kristina Supler: Absolutely. This is sort of a behind the scenes episode, if you will. And I mean, I think that aside from, you know, our spouses and significant others and friends and family member, people who know us really closely, some people are surprised to hear and learn of how much time we spend together. And we always say, well, it's good thing we really like each other because our work is grueling. There's so many hours and traveling and dealing with tough topics. It's important that we have a really good relationship with each other to get through it all.   Susan Stone: Yeah, we don't get enough time being buds. We try, I agree with, but we really don't because at the end of the day we want to go home and be with our friends and our family and get a little break from each other.But it has almost been ten years.   Kristina Supler:  I know that's crazy to think about. So let's go back in the time machine and you tell our listeners, take it back a little. Austin Powers Yeah, How? Let's talk about how we met. Like what was our first encounter?   Susan Stone: We met, Yeah, Yeah. So it's funny, I was a working at my old law firm and Cristina's boss at her firm actually merged into us for a hot sec.   Kristina Supler: That's right.   Susan Stone: Hot, sec    Kristina Supler: hot sec. I just had my second child.   Susan Stone:  I can't believe that   Kristina Supler: lot of professional transition going on, but, you know,   Susan Stone: and we're talking high school for your oldest, and that little one is about to become his own young king in the theater.   Kristina Supler: Yes. He is a man of the art. Yeah, But yeah, I mean, I remember it was like 2013 ish, maybe even further back than that, b   Susan Stone: But a little bit closer to when the Obama regulations came out in 2011.That’s scary guys.   Kristina Supler: I know. And I remember I'm plugging away doing my thing. Susan's in her world of what At that point, general litigation in special education.   Susan Stone: Well, and I was in the beginning of starting my own practice, and I knew I didn't want to do it alone. I knew I needed a buddy with me because it's just let's face it, it's more fun. Life is more fun with a friend. And we had a project, a case came in that required both skill sets.   Kristina Supler: I remember I got a call for a student at a very reputable university in the area, very infamous school in terms of Title nine. And I got the call saying, Hey, do you do title 9 work? My son's got this issue.He's been accused of sexual assault. And at the time I vaguely knew what Title nine was, but I knew that I knew sex, sexual assault. Right. And so, like,   Susan Stone: just came out so awful. It's like you just keep it all, you   Kristina Supler: I  know, the how you try to avoid the the puns. They're just right there and you fall into   Susan Stone: Keep it clean. Keep it clean This is a family show.   Kristina Supler: But I remember talking to you and saying, Susan, I have this case. I feel like you would be, you know, good person to partner with on it. And you're like, Yeah, I've done some of those as well and the rest is history.   Susan Stone: And you know what's interesting to talk about, when we get tense at those moments of tension, it's usually fear.   Kristina Supler: I agree.   Susan Stone: When we have fear   Kristina Supler:  uncertainty, fear   Susan Stone: or exhaustion.   Kristina Supler: That too,   Susan Stone: I do have to share a story with what a good law partner Kristina supler is. And what a good friend. Supler is. my gosh. Two weeks ago I got hit with the virus. It was one of the nastiest viruses in my life. I will say for me, it was worse than COVID. I was.   Kristina Supler: You were so sick. I don't. I don't know the last time I've seen you that ill. I mean you were writhing in pain. You were literally lying on the floor of your office. Susan Stone: yeah. Guys, I was in a dress with heels,   Kristina Supler: a Prada dress, I might add.   Susan Stone: It was a beautiful vintage Prada, and I had a very nice bike.Black heel, little Lu bu little red showing on the bottom. Loved it. And I was in so much pain and I was sweating. And we actually had a very important 3:00 meeting and I had to be there. I laid on my floor because I was not going to miss that meeting. No holding my stomach got up, turn my camera on and would turn my camera off to puke.It was so ugly. And then you drove me home and I wore to Mass. And then you got sick. So that's just like crazy,   Kristina Supler: I’m still on antibiotic .    Susan Stone: Just the gift that keeps on giving.   Kristina Supler: That's right.   Susan Stone: So, what we get out of it is really important. I think the feeling of you always have my back and I always have your back. And   Kristina Supler:  Absolutely. Because, I mean, so much of our work is rooted in absolute uncertainty and there's very little like black and white, you know, clear answers for our cases. And so you're sort

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    Real Talk: How Can Parents Address Bullying?

    In this week's episode of 'Real Talk,' Susan and Kristina dive deep into the topic of bullying. Discovering that your child is either being bullied or is the one doing the bullying can be incredibly challenging for parents. However, it's crucial to be informed. Join us in this episode to learn about the necessary steps you should take, the responsibilities schools have, and how you, as a parent, can ensure your child is protected. Tune in for valuable insights and practical advice. LINKS MENTIONED IN THE SHOW: https://studentdefense.kjk.com/ https://www.instagram.com/stonesupler/  TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone:  Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina Supler. We are full time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversations.   Susan Stone: Well, good morning.    Kristina Supler: Good morning, my friend.    Susan Stone: Gosh, I don't know about you, but I'm exhausted. I’m just so tired. Every bone in my body feels tired.    Kristina Supler: It's funny you say that, because this morning, for the first time in an unknown eternity, my alarm went off to go to the gym, and I chose not to get up. I went back to bed and then another hour and a half to sleep.   Susan Stone: I've had a lot of those mornings and I'm wondering what's contributing to the exhaustion. Any ideas on your part? I just think it's we're really busy.    Kristina Supler: We've had a busy January. We've had a lot of hearings. We have a lot of tough cases that I think we both really care about. And, you know, our work is it's not work that you can do if you don't care. You know, I mean, what do you think?    Susan Stone: Yeah, You know, I try very hard and I know you do to to separate work from home because our family does. Yeah, but I take it home. I carry it in my heart. I carry every client in my heart. And it's hard.    Kristina Supler: It's hard to turn off your brain at night and stop thinking about these really significant issues that, you know, we've spent hours all day sorting through. But then you go home and, you know, my children are younger, obviously, as you know, I'm in mom mode cooking dinner and helping with homework. And last night we were making cookies for a school presentation on Friday, and it was kind of like, my gosh, the last thing I want to do, but you have to do it.   Susan Stone: You've got to do it. And I know that I worked last night after I made dinner and I just was losing patience for the client and it was more just fatigue on my part.   Kristina Supler: Yeah.    Susan Stone: So I need to recharge and so do you. What do you do to recharge?    Kristina Supler: that's a good question, because it can be a couple of different things. For me, sometimes it's just having a weekend that's unscheduled, you know, not having a million activities, but then also sleep and exercise and just sort of having some time for myself and not feeling like I'm running around all weekend, you know, taking care of other people. But I mean, what about you?    Susan Stone: Yeah, I don't know. I, I don't know. I keep thinking about it. It's a moving needle. But one of the things I do know is that we do let work move into our home space, and it keeps me up in the middle of the night. So I got to get better at that. And if any of you listeners are out there and have some ideas and yes, I already do practice yoga and healthy.   Kristina Supler:  mindfulness,    Susan Stone: I've got that mindfulness.But you know what's been coming in a lot and I just thought we talk about it. We're getting a lot of calls about bullying again.   Kristina Supler:  We are. And we get those cases and those calls, I should say, all the time. I mean, every year. But I do feel like in January there's always a bit of an uptick in bullying, say, issues. And it's really for students of all ages, wouldn't you agree?    Susan Stone: Yeah. I wonder if you think it has anything to do with the crappy weather.   Kristina Supler: I hadn't thought of that. maybe we're in Cleveland and it was like literally zero a couple of weeks ago, and no one's outside moving around. Everyone's cooped up in homes. That could be a thought. Susan Stone: Yeah, it could be. But so the questions that come in is, if your child's accused of being the bully, how can you help defend my child? If your kid is bullied, what can I do? How do I stop it? Do have a lawsuit? There's a lot of issues related that you would call an attorney for if your child's involved in bullying.   Kristina Supler: Yeah, I mean, and I think that so often in these initial meetings when we're meeting with parents and children alike, you know, one of the first questions we get is, should I sent my kid to school tomorrow? Should I put my kid out of the school? And it's like, okay, we got to deal with this one step at a time. We got a lot to unpack here, but you know, there's not a one size fits all answer. I would say in any of the cases.   Susan Stone:  I have a personal question. Were you ever bullied?   Kristina Supler:  Wow.    Susan Stone: did I touch a personal nerve    Kristina Supler: or was I a bully    Susan Stone: or were you the bully? Yeah,    Kristina Supler: I sincere bully believe I was not a bully.   Susan Stone: Everybody thinks there not the bully    Kristina Supler: will be someone out there who feels who feels otherwise. Who, you know, I ran with in fifth grade, but I. I don't think I was. But, you know,    Susan Stone: We’ll find out    Kristina Supler: The universe  has a way of telling us these things, right?    Susan Stone: wow. We're going to get an email from someone to you sure hear about you bullied me in the fifth grade.   Kristina Supler: I this does remind me. I had it's funny, I was saying fifth grade. I had a personal variance that that that deeply scarred me and is still with me to this day. I still carry it with me    Susan Stone: is it juicy.    Kristina Supler: Well, I mean, at the time it was. Yes, yes, yes, yes.    Susan Stone: Do share come on I want to know   Kristina Supler: .I had a group of friends.   Susan Stone: Were they friends or quote friends?    Kristina Supler: Well, I mean, friends in the way that anyone's friends during adolescence that, you know, one day, one day you're the coolest kid in school and then the next day no one will talk to you for no reason, and you're not really sure why. But then 48 hours later, you're back on top. So I had a group of girlfriends who I did view as my friends. I thought we were true friends. Now, in hindsight, you know, what was the quality of the relationship? That's something I would like to have    Susan Stone: Are you still friends with them now.   Kristina Supler: No,   Susan Stone:  okay, then they weren't friends.  Kristina Supler: Yeah, no, no contact. Having contact since, I don't know, 30 years ago. But there there was a boy I had a crush on and my friends convinced the boy to ask me out.   Susan Stone: Now, what The first of all was the boy's name. Come on, Dish.    Kristina Supler: The boy's name was Brad.   Susan Stone: Okay, So did Brad actually in fifth grade ask you out to pizza or what did that even mean? At that age    Kristina Supler: That ended well, that's it. Yeah. What? What did it mean? I'm still asking myself that, but I assure you, it was very significant at the time. We were. We were boyfriend girlfriend. I don't know. Like, we didn't we didn't go anywhere. We didn't meet in public. We this was obviously pre cell phones and social media.    So I supposed dating someone was like an eight minute phone call at 7 p.m. before your parents needed the phone because this was also before you know, people have like multiple lines in their house. And I was like, listen, my house. We were all sharing one phone.    Susan Stone: And so multiple lines in the stone house, I assure you no    Kristina Supler: it it's hot, hot competition in my house to get on the phone in the evening. So at any rate, I liked this boy Brad. And one day out of nowhere, he realized that he, too, like me, wanted me to be his girlfriend.   Susan Stone: So this is not a sad story. This is awesome.    Kristina Supler: but wait, there's more. So I am just over the moon thinking, you know, I'm like, Wow, this is.    Susan Stone: It's Brad. Brad.    Kristina Supler: Well, you'll always have or not. Fast forward, I don't know if it was two days later, three days later, I don't know a certain period of time passed and I'm in gym class and I find out that Brad Shortbread asked me out, but it was really like on a dare or like it was in concerted effort with these like, plans with my friends.   And really it was just to humiliate me. And of course, I found all of this out. And I mean, girl, I was crying hysterically. I ran out of gym class. I was crushed because the humiliation and the worst part about it wasn't just okay, it was joke. Brad doesn't like me. Like, okay, you know, the betrayal. The betrayal that I everyone else had this joke.   I was on the outside. Everyone else knew what was going on. They were talking about me and I wasn't, you know, it was just. Yeah, the betrayal, the devastation, the pain.   Susan Stone: Did you go to school the next day?    Kristina Supler: Girl? Are you kidding me? My parents were like, you know, get over it go back to school. You’re fine   Susan Stone: That was my parents. For sure    Kristina Supler: There is no cadwelding you know, let's talk about this. How does that make you feel that? No, no, none of that.    Susan Stone: Yeah, I didn't have that either.   Kristina Supler:  Catholic grade school. So, you know, back in the day, Catholic grade school. I mean, I will

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  5. 31 THG 1

    Real Talk: Decoding Teen Slang

    In this week's episode of 'Real Talk,' Susan and Kristina take on the daunting task of deciphering the ever-changing slang of today's kids. From navigating linguistic rollercoasters to tackling new words and phrases that pop up daily, they show that staying in the know is not just essential but also a fun challenge. Join them for some laughs and linguistic acrobatics as they take on today’s latest trends. TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone: Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina Supler. We are full-time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversations. Have a fun podcast today, Supler.   Kristina Supler: What are we talking about?   Susan Stone: We are going to talk about decoding teen slang and trends.   Kristina Supler: Oooo, fun, I like it.   Susan Stone: Yeah. Before we launch into our podcast today, can I just say it is so flipping cold out.   Kristina Supler: Oh my gosh. It is freezing out. To our listeners out there, We are in Cleveland where it's a balmy four degrees or one degree, depending upon the device you look at, and it is just frigid.   Susan Stone: Okay, So hubby last night noted that there are no terms for cold and it's been called an ‘arctic blast’. You ever thought that we were experiencing…    Kristina Supler: I feel like I've heard like local weather people use different iterations of Arctic blast. Arctic freeze. I don't know.   Susan Stone: All I know is I was trying to walk the dogs yesterday and it was truly a miserable experience for me and the dogs. They didn't even want to go out and go to the bathroom. It was awful.   Kristina Supler: Funny, I had the same experience this morning when I took my two dogs out. It was like quick rush, take your business and get back inside. But even inside, Freezing. Freezing, freezing, freezing.   Susan Stone: Yeah, and didn’t you have… What happened with your uh… was it your, was it your water heater? Your power? What happened this weekend?   Kristina Supler:  So, Cleveland got a big storm over the weekend and yeah, I didn't have power for 24 hours so I was, we were away. It's fortunate that we were away but it was a little nerve racking in terms of, I don't know, bad things happening in the house. Fortunately, my husband informed me that power has no impact on our heating system because we have steam. I didn't really know. Yes, but yeah, food in the fridge, all those fun issues that Midwesterners deal with, so on and so forth. But here we are today and hopefully we've got something light and funny that can warm things up.   Susan Stone: Yeah. You know what we did yesterday? I took my youngest and we went and saw Mean Girls.   Kristina Supler: Oh I read about the like re- uh, relaunch of that movie. I’ve never seen it. Tell me about it.   Susan Stone: Well, I love the original. And the original was amazing. Rachel McAdams, Lindsay Lohan,   Kristina Supler: I was gonna say isn’t Lindsay Lohan in it. That's. Yeah, the two comes to mind.   Susan Stone: Yeah. And that was one of her. And she's in the remake.   Kristina Supler: How’s she looking these days?   Susan Stone: She's looking gorgeous.   Kristina Supler: Really, good! Good.   Susan Stone: Shout out to you, Lindsay. You are aging fine. But I will say, Tori, my 18 year old, did not like the movie at all.   Kristina Supler: Really? Why? Now, did she had she seen the original or. No?   Susan Stone:  No, she had. She just thought.   Kristina Supler: the remake was not hitting her right?   Susan Stone: No. She thought it was insulting to her intelligence.   Kristina Supler: Why is that?   Susan Stone: Well, she felt like it didn't capture the original flavor of bullying. And she thought bullying is such an important topic that they sort of made fun of it and made light of it and made it seem ridiculous.   Kristina Supler:  So let me ask you, was there any, like redeeming message or takeaway for viewers of the movie? Any lessons to be learned?   Susan Stone: I mean It was the same lesson be kind, be nice, blah, blah, blah. I'm not trying to put down.   Kristina Supler: Sure that's and that's a good one, but it's a little basic.   Susan Stone: But the way it was delivered, that's the word   Kristina Supler: Basic.   Susan Stone:  It was basic. Yeah. So, you know, I wanted to love it. I want it to because I love the original and I know there's now the musical and, you know I love me a Musical.   Kristina Supler: You love a Musical.   Susan Stone: Oh my gosh. I mean, there isn't a musical that I don’t rush and see.   Kristina Supler: I think it's so funny that we're talking about this because I have to imagine while and I've experienced that, sometimes people think that as lawyers we’re, you know, reading the news and thinking about Supreme Court opinions and all these, you know, intellectual things, and here we are, “Hey, Supler I saw Mean Girls yesterday”.    Susan Stone: But on to our topic about the way kids talk and how language changes. So I was, I did a little research. Truthfully, I forgot the fun terms I used when I was in high school or were popular in the eighties.   Kristina Supler: Okay, lay it on me.    Susan Stone: Okay. Ready?   Kristina Supler: Ready.   Susan Stone: Gag me with the spoon. Did you say that?   Kristina Supler:  Never. No. I can honestly say no. I never said Gag me with a spoon.   Susan Stone: Ready?   Kristina Supler: Ready.   Susan Stone:  Eat my shorts.   Kristina Supler: Uh that, that I'm familiar with through one, Bart Simpson. You really said that? You said eat my shorts.    Susan Stone: I didn't, but others did.   Kristina Supler: I just. What does is it really mean? Like, like.   Susan Stone: Do you think it means Bug off? Maybe. I think that's what it means. Eat my shorts.    Kristina Supler: Okay.   Susan Stone: And gnarly.   Kristina Supler: Now, Now. Okay. Who doesn't know? Gnarly. Sure. I think gnarly still kind of with us. The West Coast vibe a bit. I don't know.   Susan Stone: So, Let's talk about some of the terms. I didn't know that well. Proposed by our fine marketing department.   Kristina Supler: Let me ask you, though, what's what generation were you? Are you?   Susan Stone: I am the beginning of Gen X.   Kristina Supler: Ohhhh.   Susan Stone: Babies baby   Kristina Supler:  Sure, sure, sure, sure.   Susan Stone: Madonna spoke. You can't see me Voguing. Voguing, guys.   Kristina Supler: Best music video ever. Ever! What's interesting about that is I think of myself as a Gen Xer, but actually, I shudder to admit this. I don't want to admit this, but I must. I am technically the beginning of millennials.   Susan Stone: There is nothing about you that’s a Millennials   Kristina Supler: I don't identify that way. I really see myself as a Gen Xer like the nineties vibe, but I guess according to the internet, according to Wikipedia or what have you, I'm technically a first year millennial.   Susan Stone: That's interesting that I’m a Gen Xer. I was a latchkey kid, and for those of you who don't know what that is, my mom went to work and I had a, what was it, a shoestring with a key.   Kristina Supler: You literally had a key on a shoestring.   Susan Stone: I literally had a key on a shoestring.   Kristina Supler: I didn't know that was a real thing.   Susan Stone: That's why they called it ‘latchkey kids’ Supler. It's a real thing.   Kristina Supler: Well, I have to confess, I grew up in a house that we never locked. I never had a key.   Susan Stone: That's a beautiful thing.   Kristina Supler: It actually is.   Susan Stone: That’s a beautiful thing .And I was the MTV generation who didn't remember Tabatha Sorenson. So cute. And I was on MTV once.    Kristina Supler: No.   Susan Stone: Yeah, I danced.   Kristina Supler: Tell me more.   Susan Stone: There's not that much to tell.   Kristina Supler: On the Grind? Were you on MTV on the Grind?   Susan Stone: It was one of those shows, you literally waited in line and when they told you to dance, you danced. It's hilarious.   Kristina Supler: But was it the Grind? Yes or no?   Susan Stone: I don't think so.   Kristina Supler:  Because I really hope that it was.   Susan Stone: And my roommate in college had a picture of Ronald Reagan above her bed.   Kristina Supler: (Laughing) What did she love him?   Susan Stone: She loved him.   Kristina Supler: Was she attracted to him?   Susan Stone:  I don’t know Ronny was hot. Ronny was hot.   Kristina Supler: Sensible citizen. Oh my God. Now that is the funniest thing.   Susan Stone: Okay, guys Let’s talk about some words and then we can respond to what this generation is "saying. And I am going to mispronounce it, but ’gyat’.   Kristina Supler: I, I just can't with this one. With this one, I just can't. I am told, so for all of our listeners out there, I've only recently come to learn this, this word, this phrase, and apparently it is a high compliment. It is a major, major compliment to give someone indicating that their derriere is large.    Susan Stone: Yeah. I asked my daughter, do you know what ‘gyat’ is? She’s just like ass. I'm like, okay.   Kristina Supler: Yeah. So I guess it rhymes with squat or bought    Susan Stone: or fiat.   Kristina Supler: And then it can also be, I guess I'm told, an acronym for something about the backside being thick. I don't know.   Susan Stone:  But I have to be honest, I've never heard it used in my house.   Kristina Supler: I've never heard it use

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  6. 17 THG 1

    Real Talk: Parenting Through Tough Conversations

    Welcome to Real Talk with Susan and Kristina! In this episode, we’ll dive into the importance of addressing uncomfortable topics with your children. Join us as we explore why these difficult conversations are crucial for your child's well-being and navigating life's challenges. Gain practical tips on addressing sensitive subjects, fostering open communication, and dive into real-life situations drawn from our cases and personal experiences with our own children. LINKS MENTIONED IN THE SHOW:  https://studentdefense.kjk.com/  https://www.instagram.com/stonesupler/ https://www.amazon.com/Yes-Your-Kid-Parents-Todays/dp/1637743807 TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone: Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina super. We are full time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversations.   Susan Stone: Okay. This is Martin Luther King Day, and we're in our new studio. What do you think about our new digs? Miss Supluar.    Kristina Supler: I like it. Fix some adjustment. But I. I actually. I think it's nice. It's cozy. It's more intimate.   Susan Stone: that is interesting. Well, hopefully not as interesting as our topic today, which is parenting through tough conversation. Anything recent you want to share from the old simpler house?    Kristina Supler: Funny you should ask. So recently we had a little tough conversation parenting moment in my household with my daughter and some Netflix content. Let me tell you, these these parent settings and these accounts, number one parent listeners out there, if you don't know how to do that and check for content and age-appropriate restrictions, please do so. Very important because if you don't, your child has unfettered access to everything, and I learned that on Netflix. If you don't put on like parental controls and kids are watching like they can access NC 17 material, there's some steamy stuff on there.    Susan Stone: You know what? I had no idea, but I want to know where to find that steamy material. (Laughing) Kidding    Kristina Supler: After a long day of work, Susan's going home and firing up the Netflix.   Susan Stone:  But my kids are older, so I don’t have to worry about it.   Kristina Supler: So, you can do that. That's right. That's right. But yes, there are these settings. Make sure you have you know, how they work, and they're turned on and fired up and good to go. But so, it was brought to my attention by, I'll just say, a family member    Susan Stone: a family member   Kristina Supler: that said, hey, you might want to give an eye towards, you know, what your daughter's looking at. And I said, my gosh, thank you for telling me. Because I think it's important to not always say, my child would never do that. You have to sort of be open to the possibility of your kid doing anything.    Susan Stone: Well, Supler considering you are a coauthor on a book saying, yes, your kid, it would be slightly hypocritical if you didn't think your own kid could do something.   Kristina Supler: Indeed, indeed. And to our listeners out there, check out. Yes, your kid available at all. Booksellers    Susan Stone: I did not mean for that to be a plug.   Kristina Supler: no no.   Susan Stone: But I was topical.   Kristina Supler: I had to seize the moment. So at any rate, I said, Well, let me do some digging and you know, you like to call me investigators Suplar   Susan Stone: Oh my gosh.For the listeners out there, nobody and I mean nobody can get to the bottom of different facts. Like my law partner Kristina Suplesr. So, what did you do?    Kristina Supler: Well, so I start doing a little a little digging just late light investigation. Let's say I call my husband and loop him in to what's before us. I get his thoughts. And I was like, you know, before before having that parent child moment, I want to get my own facts right so that I know. So I sort of like a little, I want to say test, but I suppose it is test like is my is my when I confront my daughter, will she be truthful with me or not? So that you know, I know where to go with the conversation. So we did some investigating and digging that my husband got all in on it and like for hours were testing iteration of what you can and can't do with these shows and what record shows up in this and that. Just to know, you know, what what actually happened, it is best we could. Of course. And it was interesting because my daughter eventually had a conversation. She said, Mom, I wasn't watching those shows.   Susan Stone: And is it true?   Kristina Supler:  I went through that viewing history up, down, left and right. You can download spreadsheets. We did all these simulated tests and delete history.    Susan Stone: Tacky for me, way too tacky.    Kristina Supler: The shows weren't there, so I don't know if look, we don't know what happened and who did what, but what I do know is that I saw no evidence that my daughter did what she was accused of doing.   Susan Stone: So, Not your kid,   Kristina Supler:  not my kid, fortunately. But that is not to say that it could never be my child. And I actually think you and I are both like very real about that possibility. That notwithstanding what we do for a living in conversations we have at home, things still happen.    Susan Stone: Yeah, we have difficult conversations with our clients every day.   Kristina Supler: Every day.   Susan Stone: And it is a skill.   Kristina Supler:  absolutely. And I would say it's a skill that requires cultivation and over time it's a skill you improve with experience, which is true of most things, but tough conversations, it's you get better at having them, but they don't ever really get easier.   Susan Stone:  It's not fun. But here's the deal. In today's day and age, what we're finding is that having tough conversations with your kids is more important. And at the same time, we're seeing a lot of conflict avoidance and it's creating bigger issues. Kristina Supler: I totally agree. I totally agree. And I will tell you, from our perspective as lawyers, of course, we want to help all of our clients and get the best outcome possible. But, you know, success. We arrest a lot. What's your success rate? And we sort of often say, well, you know, it's relative because every case is different. And the reality is, is that you can't always have a perfect outcome in every case. But the cases that hurt the most are the ones where we look at each other and we're like, this didn't have to happen this way.    Susan Stone: I agree. And when we talk to parents about why, why have the tough conversation? Because let's face it, nobody likes to confront their kid. Nobody wants to cause an argument.    Kristina Supler: No.   Susan Stone:  it's a fight.    Kristina Supler: No, you want to have nice, fun conversations about what are you getting for dinner and what's going on at school. But the reality is these tough conversations are so important because really, at any age, they're essential for helping, I think, keep your child safe, even when your child's a young adult.   Susan Stone: What I find is even when you're getting pushback from a particular child, they still hear you.    Kristina Supler: Oh absolutely. I totally agree. I totally agree. They hear you. And I think there's also just a component of sort of communicating to your child that you care and, you know, whether it's just that you want to see the best for them in all ways and it's okay to make mistakes. It's okay to be curious, but you just have to be smart about the choices you're making here.   Susan Stone:  You know what? Kids need to know where their parents stand on issues.    Kristina Supler: I totally agree. I totally agree. And, you know, that's a tough one in this day and age, because I think that, you know, we're in a country that's so divided and there's all these political issues, cultural issues, religious issues.I mean, you name it every day. There's some like very hot ticket controversial thing on the news. But I think it's so important as our children are being, you know, bombarded with content from tick tock and who knows where else that they know what their parents think that they know. You're like my mom and dad say that's important or my mom and dad or say that that's really dangerous, that it's just giving some structure to your kids.   Susan Stone: Talk about how to have a conversation, because you know what we know how students behave when confronted and we're not going to sell you the bull, that it's going to go swimming. This isn't a sitcom. Life is not a sitcom. So you might have pushback. You may have a temper tantrum. I've heard even of situations where things have gotten physical between parent and child. Things can go really wrong.   Kristina Supler: Oh I believe it.   Susan Stone:  Yeah,    Kristina Supler: I believe it. Especially with teens. And when there's hormones and angst and rage about life being unfair, I absolutely.    Susan Stone: So, when you're going to have a conversation. I think first time in place.    Kristina Supler: Yes. So what what do you think? What are your preferred times and places?    Susan Stone: It's hard. I at first thing, I'm a working mom,    Kristina Supler: Mhmmm   Susan Stone: so I can't do after school. That's not realistic for me.   Kristina Supler:  Right.   Susan Stone:  Ideally, that really is the best time, right when they get home from school.    Kristina Supler: Well, depending on age though, I don't know if your kids are younger. If they're older, they probably have sports or job or other stuff after school. But I hear you.    Susan Stone: I like where they're a captive audience. So ideally, again, the car is a great place because where are they going to go?   Kristina Supler: I agree with t

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  7. 06/12/2023

    Real Talk Podcast: The Insider's Guide to Summer Camp Success

    On this episode of Real Talk, Susan and Kristina are joined by Dr. Christopher Thurber for an insider’s guide to summer camp success.     Dr. Thurber has dedicated his professional life to improving how trusted adults nurture others and to enhancing the lives of adventurous youth. A graduate of Harvard and UCLA, Dr. Thurber has served as a psychologist and instructor at Phillips Exeter Academy since 1999. Over the past 25 years, he has been invited to lead workshops on five continents.   His best-selling family resource, The Summer Camp Handbook, was recently translated into Mandarin to help launch the youth camping movement in China. And his most recent book, The Unlikely Art of Parental Pressure, was described by The Atlantic as “a tour de force” and “the rare parenting book that respects both parents and children.”   Dr. Thurber’s research and writing have focused on homesickness prevention and healthy parenting, especially in the domains of pressure and learning from mistakes.     LINKS MENTIONED IN THE SHOW: https://drchristhurber.com/  https://www.exeter.edu/faculty/christopher-austin-thurber  https://www.amazon.com/Yes-Your-Kid-Parents-Todays/dp/1637743807   SHOW NOTES:   Introduction and the importance of planning for children’s summer camp (00:21) Introduction of Dr. Christopher Thurber (00:57) Ideal age for children to start attending overnight summer camps (1:53) Benefits of longer stays at camps and how they affect homesickness and personal growth (3:07) Insights into the positive impacts of summer camps on children's social skills and self-confidence (5:54) Choosing the right summer camp and what to look for (7:34) The role of camp advisors and the best time to start looking for summer camps (9:19) Indicators of a camp’s quality (10:14) Tips on how to vet summer camps (11:46) Addressing homesickness and how to prepare your child for camp experiences (14:32) Impact of technology and social media on children's camp experiences (17:00) Guidance on managing communication with children at camp (19:19) Advice for parents on conversations to have with their children before sending them to camp for the first time (22:55) Importance of not making 'pickup deals' with children and fostering independence (24:24) Tips for selecting the right camp (26:00) Conclusion with final advice for parents on preparing for the camp season and fostering a positive experience for their children (28:00)   TRANSCRIPT: Susan Stone: Welcome back to Real Talk with Susan Stone and Kristina Suler. We are full-time moms and attorneys bringing our student defense legal practice to life with real candid conversation. Susan Stone: Kristina, believe it or not, even though we're looking outside and there's a lot of snow out there, yuck. Did you know what time it is? Kristina Supler: Well, umm, if I'm thinking about what we're going to talk about today, I'm gonna guess that we're in the time of year that despite the snow outside, we have to start planning for our children's summers. Susan Stone: And especially summer camp. Believe it or not, if you want your child to go to one of the more, uh, popular summer camps, now is the time that you would register. And it's hard to think about it because like Santa Claus hasn't even come down that shoe. Kristina Supler: I know, and I'm particularly excited to speak with today's guest because I'm in, in my own family, wrestling with the idea of sending my son off to camp. And so this is, I'm really looking forward to today's talk. Susan Stone: We might learn a little something on real talk. Why don't you introduce our guests? Kristina Supler: Sure. Today we are joined by Dr. Chris Thurber, who has dedicated his professional life to improving how adults nurture others and enhance the lives of youth. A graduate of Harvard and UCLA, Dr. Thurber has served as a psychologist and instructor at Phillips Exeter Academy since 1999. Susan Stone: I've heard of it. Kristina Supler: Sure, he's written some books. His best-selling family resource is the Summer Camp Handbook, which has been translated into Mandarin. Believe it or not, and more recently, he has authored The Unlikely Art of Parental Pressure, which was described by the Atlantic as, “the rare parenting book that respects both parents and children”. Dr. Thurber's research and writing have focused on homesickness prevention, healthy parenting and helping children learn from mistakes. So Doctor Thurber, thanks for joining us today. Dr. Chris Thurber: Thanks for having me as a guest. Yeah, I'm excited to be here. Susan Stone: So it's so funny. I was thinking about summer camp and I still remember that when my oldest, whose birthday it is today, happy birthday, Alex. But when she was in 3rd grade, I went on a field trip to Maine with her and we looked at camps together. Kristina Supler: I can only imagine. Ohh camp touring. What a life. Susan Stone: Yeah, it was great. We had the best bonding time, but the question is for you. I chose for to be a rising 4th grader as a time to go to camp. We looked at camps when she was a rising 3rd grader. In your professional opinion, what is the best time to send students away for a summer camp and experience? And I just have a second part to that question. I chose a camp where I just threw my kid in for seven weeks because I was told on from a well-known Cleveland area psychologist that they do better with a longer stint because when you do a shorter stint, just as you're getting over homesickness, you're yanking them away. Thoughts? Dr. Chris Thurber: Well, in terms of what age a child should be at overnight summer camp and I, I do think that like any experience overnight timer camp is not for everyone. But I would say that in my experience as a parent, as a researcher, as a psychologist, there's probably a camp for everyone. And I think it's a perfect complement to the traditional classroom setting. So a way of boosting kids social and emotional learning, a way of increasing their social skills, their confidence, their sense of adventure. And there's wonderful research to support all of my life experience and anecdotal evidence. The age at which a young person might go to overnight camp for the first time depends a lot on their previous life experiences and a little bit on their personality, and I think the way I would answer that question is not by giving you a number like 7 years old or 8 years old or 9 years old. But I could say that most overnight camps uh would take children as young as seven or eight. So that tells you something about 150 years of trial and error has landed us at that age, but for particular child, it really is gonna depend on that parent or primary caregiver looking carefully at that child's readiness, which depends a lot on what previous experience that child has had away from home. I don't know for Alex, but I would imagine that she had spent overnight at a friend's house, or she'd been at her grandparents house without you there for a couple of days. And that's the perfect sort of preparation for multiple weeks at an overnight camp. Susan Stone: And do you have a thought about the second part of my question, 4 weeks versus 7 weeks or maybe even shorter depending on the camp? Dr. Chris Thurber: Well, I haven't in my experience noticed a difference in the factor that your friend cited, which is intensity of homesickness. In fact, this was what I wrote my dissertation on was homesickness and have followed the research that's been done since then, quite closely enough to know that there isn't a difference in, say, homesickness intensity between someone who's staying at camp for two weeks versus 4 weeks versus 7 weeks. That again, I would say your friend was right in that longer stays and I would say four weeks or more result in a more immersive experience for young people and that shorter stays just a few days are a good taste of what? Overnight camp is like, but aren't gonna create the kind of social bonds and result in the sort of self-reliance and you know, willingness to try new things that will happen with a longer stay. Susan Stone: That's exactly what I learned at that time. That you'd really takes a good chunk of time like 4 weeks as the minimum before you can really develop the friendships, develop leader styles, or even reinvent yourself. You could be that nerd at school and that fabulous person at camp. It's a chance of really defining yourself. Kristina Supler: Sounds like a good movie. Dr. Chris Thurber: It is very cool in that way. Well, it's a good movie and an even better experience. It's one we, you know, we underestimate sometimes. I think the social pressures that young people feel in elementary school even and you mentioned the unlikely art of parental pressure that I wrote with Hank Weissinger. We took a look at a lot of the research that's been done and were surprised ourselves to see how pernicious the effects of unhealthy pressure are for even elementary school age children and a lot of it is about pressure to conform, conform to dress, conform to preferences for favorite TV shows and how you present yourself online. So there are a lot of different domains of conformity, all of which happily evaporate at the best camps, and I think that that sort of reinventing yourself and boost in self-confidence can happen in as little as two weeks. I would also agree with you that a longer stay like 4 or 7 is going to strengthen that young person's confidence. Kristina Supler: Dr. Thurber, I'm curious to hear your thoughts for our listeners out there, parents with the child, let's just say in grade school age is irrelevant, but a child who's maybe only slept at grandparent's house or has had maybe one or two sleepovers with a friend family member, whomever, what advice would you give those parents for sort of the building blocks to help ease your child into this experience to go

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Have you ever wished for a comprehensive guide to help navigate those challenging and uncomfortable moments in parenting? We're Susan Stone and Kristina Supler—full-time moms and dedicated student attorneys at KJK. Our careers in student advocacy provide a unique perspective, but fundamentally, we're two moms sharing the wisdom gathered from our experiences at home and in the courtroom. Our podcast delves into the essential aspects of parenting, covering a wide spectrum of topics. We dissect trends, examine case studies, and draw from expert opinions in each episode, aiming to equip you with insights on raising resilient kids in our constantly changing world. Please join us as we delve into some 'Real Talk.'

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