The Backstage Pastors Podcast

Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz
  • 5.0 (3)
  • Christianity
  • Updated Monthly

The Backstage Pastors Podcast is dedicated to the unique challenges and opportunities facing executive pastors and second-chair leaders in churches and nonprofits. Hosts Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz share hard-earned insights and introduce listeners to diverse leaders doing meaningful work behind the scenes. Together, they offer practical, actionable conversations designed to strengthen the ministries and people they quietly support.

  1. Aug 5

    Micro-church movements with Lucas Pulley

    Most executive pastors spend their careers helping churches grow by building systems, hiring staff, and delegating responsibilities. But what happens when the goal isn't building a larger Sunday gathering at all? In this episode, Phil sits down with Lucas Pulley of the Underground Network to explore one of America's largest microchurch movements. Lucas shares his own ministry journey—from campus ministry in Illinois to leading decentralized networks of mission-focused microchurches—and explains how the Underground has developed systems that support hundreds of autonomous missionary leaders while preserving contextual freedom. The conversation explores what defines a church, why mission is essential alongside worship and community, how decentralized networks stay healthy without becoming overly institutionalized, and what executive pastors in traditional church settings can learn from movement thinking. Whether your church is 100 people or 10,000, this conversation offers valuable insights into leadership, delegation, coaching, governance, and creating structures that empower people for mission rather than simply managing programs. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Drew  🗣️Follow the Underground Network 💻Tampa Underground 💻 Underground Network  📕On the Verge By Alan Hirsch & Dave Ferguson From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS 02:34 Lucas Pulley's ministry journey 10:48 What is the Underground Network? 16:16 Defining the microchurch model 20:20 Mission-specific vs. distributive microchurches 29:03 Building systems for decentralized leadership 37:32 Supporting networks across the country 41:35 Challenges of leading a decentralized movement 48:07 The place of microchurches within the broader Church 50:55 Final reflections and ministry resources – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    Micro-church movements with Lucas Pulley

  2. Jul 15

    Drew Hyun on Emotional Health for Executive Pastors

    Phil and Tyler sit down with Drew Hyun, Lead Pastor of Hope Church NYC and Executive Director of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship (EHD), to explore why emotional health is foundational for effective ministry leadership. Drew shares his ministry journey—from serving under Pete Scazzero at New Life Fellowship to planting Hope Church NYC and eventually stepping into leadership of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship. He reflects on how becoming a lead pastor revealed the importance of emotional health in ways he had never fully understood before. The conversation explores why executive pastors and highly driven leaders often struggle with emotional awareness, the relationship between emotional maturity and ministry effectiveness, and practical ways leaders can begin pursuing greater self-awareness. Drew also offers an inside look at the future of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship, including the School of Emotionally Healthy Leadership, a new Order of Emotionally Healthy Leaders, and Pete Scazzero's upcoming book on redefining success in ministry. This episode is a thoughtful invitation for church leaders to pursue both the Great Commandment and the Great Commission, recognizing that healthy ministry begins with healthy leaders. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Drew  🗣️Follow Emotionally Healthy Discipleship   💻Drew’s Website 💻 Emotionally Healthy Discipleship Website    📕Emotionally Healthy Discipleship Resources  ⛪️ Hope Church NYC From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS 02:54 Drew Hyun's ministry journey 09:12 Why emotionally healthy leadership matters 14:08 Growing in self-awareness as a leader 19:00 Practical first steps toward emotional health 23:50 Leading two organizations without burning out 35:09 The future of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship 42:00 Resources and next steps for church leaders 42:53 Wrap up – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    Drew Hyun on Emotional Health for Executive Pastors

  3. Jul 1

    Rich Birch on Building Churches that Keep Growing

    Rich Birch joins Phil and Tyler for a wide-ranging conversation about church growth, executive leadership, and helping churches remove barriers that prevent people from encountering Jesus. Drawing from decades of executive pastor experience and hundreds of conversations through the UnSeminary Podcast, Rich shares the mission behind his work and the insights he's gathered from one of the largest ongoing executive pastor surveys. The conversation explores what today's executive pastors are experiencing, including an encouraging sense of optimism alongside widespread staff exhaustion. Rich discusses why people—not finances or facilities—remain the greatest concern for executive pastors and offers practical ideas for improving staff health and leadership development. Rich also challenges a common assumption about church growth by arguing that many churches don't actually have a "back door" problem—they have a "front door" problem. He explains why churches should become obsessed with the guest experience, simplify every step of the first-time visitor journey, and intentionally build systems that help newcomers connect. Rich explains why personal invitations continue to be the single greatest driver of church growth and offers practical ways churches can equip and encourage their people to invite others consistently.   Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Rich  🗣️Follow UnSeminenary   💻UnSeminenary Website 💻 Executive Pastor Direct Survey     📕Unlocking Your Church's Invite Culture by Rich Birch 📕Church Growth Flywheel by Rich Birch ⛪️ Connexus Church From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS  07:55 – Rich's Mission and the Story Behind UnSeminary 11:20 – Executive Pastor Survey: Hopeful but Tired 20:40 – Why People Are Every Executive Pastor's Biggest Challenge 27:20 – The Front Door Problem: Helping First-Time Guests Connect 39:30 – Seeing Church Through the Eyes of a First-Time Visitor 42:00 – Building an Invite Culture That Fuels Growth 50:25 – Encouragement for Executive Pastors – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    Rich Birch on Building Churches that Keep Growing

  4. Jun 17

    Dan Reiland on Four Decades of XP Ministry

    Phil and Tyler sit down with longtime executive pastor, author, coach, and leadership mentor Dan Reiland. Dan reflects on his ministry journey, beginning as John Maxwell’s second intern and eventually becoming one of the pioneering executive pastors in the modern church movement. He shares stories from his years at Skyline Church, the Enjoy ministry, and his 25-year tenure at 12Stone Church. The conversation explores how the executive pastor role has evolved over the decades, the challenges and opportunities of church growth, and the importance of balancing organizational leadership with spiritual leadership. Dan offers a behind-the-scenes look at 12Stone’s decision to launch five campuses in a single Sunday, including lessons learned from rapid growth and the importance of strong systems. Dan also discusses the calling and partnership between senior pastors and executive pastors, recounting the remarkable story of how God led him and Kevin Myers into ministry together. The conversation turns to leadership development, mentoring, generational learning, and the growing challenge of helping leaders interpret culture in a rapidly changing world. Dan’s strongest leadership conviction after four decades in ministry is:prayer is not preparation for the work—it is the work.  Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Dan 💻Dan’s Website 📕Shoulder to Shoulder: Strengthening the Church by Supporting Your Pastor by Dan Reiland📕Amplified Leadership: Five Practices to Establish Influence, Build People, and Impact Others by Dan Reiland⛪️12Stone Church⛪️ Skyline Church From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS  03:50 – From John Maxwell’s Intern to Executive Pastor 08:26 – How the Executive Pastor Role Has Evolved 12:02 – Launching Five Campuses in One Sunday 19:00 – Supporting and Strengthening Senior Pastors 21:00 – God’s Calling to Partner with Kevin Myers 27:16 – Mentoring Leaders and Interpreting Culture 31:00 – Addressing Anxiety in Today’s Generation 32:05 – Prayer as the Foundation of Church Growth 35:03 – Developing One More Leader – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    Dan Reiland on Four Decades of XP Ministry

  5. Jun 3

    The Accidental Executive Pastor with Becca Knudsen

    In Episode 10 of Backstage Pastors™️, Phil and Tyler sit down with Becca Knudsen, Executive Pastor at Arvada Vineyard Church, to discuss her unique ministry journey, leading alongside a nationally influential lead pastor, and navigating major organizational transitions. Becca shares how an unexpected path—from Young Life leader to opera student to church administrator—ultimately led her into executive pastoral leadership. The conversation explores the realities of serving at a church whose lead pastor, Jay Pathak, also serves as the national director of Vineyard USA. Becca reflects on the spiritual, organizational, and personal challenges that accompanied that transition, including increased responsibility, leadership development, and organizational growing pains. She also provides an inside look at Arvada Vineyard’s decision to move away from a multi-site model and transition campuses into independent churches. Becca explains the discernment process, lessons learned, and why the church would still choose to plant churches in the future—while intentionally building toward eventual independence. Mentioned Resources ⛪️ Arvada Vineyard Church💻 Learn more about the Vineyard movement📅 Check out the Vineyard Gatherings📅The Church Hub Cohorts From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS  03:47 – Becca’s Unconventional Journey into Ministry Leadership 13:18 – Leading Alongside the National Director of Vineyard USA 20:16 – The Challenges of Organizational Change and Staff Transitions 22:45 – Why Arvada Vineyard Reconsidered the Multi-Site Model 27:00 – Discernment, Independence, and Church Planting Strategy 35:00 – How the Congregation Experienced the Transition 37:32 – Building a Staff Rule of Life 42:00 – Sabbath, Solitude, Friendship, and Sustainable Ministry 46:00 – Final Leadership Reflections and Closing Thoughts – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    The Accidental Executive Pastor with Becca Knudsen

  6. May 20

    Why Healthy Churches Need Better Systems with Tim Stevens

    In this episode of Backstage Pastors™️ Podcast, Phil and Tyler welcome veteran executive pastor and leadership consultant Tim Stevens for an in-depth conversation on ministry leadership, organizational health, and sustainable service in the second chair. Tim reflects on nearly 40 years of ministry experience spanning nonprofit leadership, Granger Community Church, Vanderbloemen, Willow Creek, and now Leading Smart. The conversation explores the evolving role of the executive pastor, including the tension between being highly executive-minded versus deeply pastoral. Tim shares insights from his e-book 40 Lessons in 40 Years: Wisdom for the Long Haul, unpacking lessons about visionary leaders and integrators, why systems are actually pastoral tools, healthy governance, leadership burnout, and managing energy for long-term ministry health. Tim also gives listeners an inside look at stepping into Willow Creek during one of the church’s most difficult seasons and explains how focusing on “the next right thing” helped guide the rebuilding process.  Guest Resources 🗣️Follow Tim 📕40 Lessons in 40 Years: Wisdom for the Long Haul 💻 Right Roles Assessment💻LeadingSmart.com🎙️Tim’s Podcast 📅Leading Smart 2026 Gathering  From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS  04:05 Introducing Tim Stevens 07:18 Tim’s Ministry Journey and Leadership Background 10:18 Executive Pastor Wiring and Leadership Styles 13:42 40 Lessons in 40 Years 15:26 Why Visionary Leaders Need Integrators 18:01 Why Systems Are Pastoral 22:00 Sustainable Leadership and Managing Energy 26:06 Board Alignment and Healthy Governance 30:30 Leaving Church Ministry for Vanderbloemen and Leadership Consulting 34:10 Rebuilding Willow Creek Through Crisis 39:58 How Leading Smart Helps Churches Thrive – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    Why Healthy Churches Need Better Systems with Tim Stevens

  7. May 6

    How To Be Second with Nathan Young and Dave Hartman

    In this episode of the Backstage Pastors™️ Podcast, Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz welcome Nathan Young and Dave Hartman, co-authors of How to Be Second to discuss the identity, strengths, and challenges of second-chair leadership. The conversation explores why some leaders are uniquely wired for supporting roles, how executive pastors and operational leaders thrive, and why being second is not a stepping stone but a meaningful destination. Guest Resources 🗣️Follow David  🗣️Follow Nathan 📕How to Be Second by Nathan Young and Dave Hartman 💻How to Be Second website: howtobesecond.com  From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS 01:31 Phil’s Upcoming Church Projects and Travel 03:31 Introducing How to Be Second 06:00 Why Nathan and Dave Wrote the Book 10:00 Discovering the Identity of Second-Chair Leaders 17:17 The Difference Between “2s” and “2ICs” 24:23 Who the Book Is Really For 29:48 Imposter Syndrome and “Knowing What 10 Is” 33:07 What They Would Add to the Book Today 39:39 Final Encouragement and Resources – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    How To Be Second with Nathan Young and Dave Hartman

  8. Apr 15

    Clay Scroggins on How to Lead When You're Not in Charge

    Phil Taylor interviews Clay Scroggins, former leader at North Point Community Church and author of How to Lead When You're Not in Charge. Clay shares his journey from engineering student to pastor, his experience serving in multi-site church leadership, and his transition into speaking and consulting. The conversation centers on leadership without authority—particularly relevant for executive pastors and second-chair leaders. Clay unpacks the myth that leadership requires a title and emphasizes influence as the true currency of leadership. He shares practical examples from both church and corporate environments, highlighting the importance of relational influence, emotional intelligence, and patience. They also discuss navigating organizational limitations, creating “pockets of greatness,” and leading oneself when broader change isn’t possible. Clay addresses the tension of ambition in ministry, distinguishing between selfish ambition and healthy, God-honoring drive. The episode also explores challenges like leading change in resistant environments, working under well-known leaders like Andy Stanley, and discerning when it’s time to stay or leave a role. The conversation is both practical and deeply reflective, offering encouragement and wisdom for leaders serving behind the scenes. Mentioned Event The XP Summit. Phil Taylor will be presenting at this year’s XP Summit. You can get your tickets at: xpsummit.org Guest Resources 🗣️Follow Clay  📕How to Lead When You're Not in Charge by Clay Scroggins 💻clayscroggins.com 💻“Should I Stay or Should I Go?” (audio resource by Clay Scroggins) From Our Partners 💻 ⁠The Church Hub⁠: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org   Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ ⁠Get Phil's Newsletter⁠ ✉️ ⁠⁠phil@backstagepastors.org⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@philtaylorxp⁠⁠  📚 ⁠Books by Phil⁠ 💻 ⁠backstagepastors.org⁠ 💻⁠plainjoestudios.com⁠  Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ ⁠⁠tyler@myxp.church⁠⁠ 🗣️ ⁠⁠@tylerdrewitz⁠⁠ 💻 ⁠myxp.church⁠ 💻⁠ridgelineprinting.com⁠ The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 ⁠Youtube⁠ 🍏 ⁠Apple⁠ 🎤 ⁠Spotify CHAPTERS [04:00] – Clay’s Ministry Journey [11:00] – The Myth of Leadership Titles [17:20] – Authority vs. Influence [25:18] – Creating a Pocket of Greatness [29:00] – When to Stay or Leave a Role [33:00] – Healthy vs. Unhealthy Ambition [39:00] – Leading Change Without Authority [43:00] – Working Under a High-Profile Leader [47:00] – Final Encouragement & Resources – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.  Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark

    Clay Scroggins on How to Lead When You're Not in Charge
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About

The Backstage Pastors Podcast is dedicated to the unique challenges and opportunities facing executive pastors and second-chair leaders in churches and nonprofits. Hosts Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz share hard-earned insights and introduce listeners to diverse leaders doing meaningful work behind the scenes. Together, they offer practical, actionable conversations designed to strengthen the ministries and people they quietly support.

Information

  • Creator
    Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz
  • Years Active
    2025 - 2026
  • Episodes
    15
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz
  • Show Website
    The Backstage Pastors Podcast