86 episodes

The Podcast & Community for Public Sector CIOs & CISOs.

Welcome to the The Public Sector Show by TechTables, featuring human-centric stories from C-level technology leaders. Hosted by Joe Toste, you'll gain valuable insights on current issues and challenges faced by top leaders.

Through interviews, speaking engagements, and live podcast tour events, we unite public sector CIOs, CTOs, CISOs, and technology leaders in fostering collaboration and meaningful connections in the ever-evolving technology landscape.

The Public Sector Show by TechTables TechTables Network

    • Government
    • 5.0 • 22 Ratings

The Podcast & Community for Public Sector CIOs & CISOs.

Welcome to the The Public Sector Show by TechTables, featuring human-centric stories from C-level technology leaders. Hosted by Joe Toste, you'll gain valuable insights on current issues and challenges faced by top leaders.

Through interviews, speaking engagements, and live podcast tour events, we unite public sector CIOs, CTOs, CISOs, and technology leaders in fostering collaboration and meaningful connections in the ever-evolving technology landscape.

    Ep.173 Exclusive Interview with 23rd Governor Arizona, Doug Ducey [2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour]

    Ep.173 Exclusive Interview with 23rd Governor Arizona, Doug Ducey [2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour]

    "Cybersecurity is homeland security, cybersecurity is national security." ~ Governor Doug Ducey
    I recently had the incredible opportunity to sit down with former Arizona Governor Doug Ducey for an exclusive interview on The Public Sector Show by TechTables. Governor Ducey served as Arizona's 23rd governor from 2015 to 2023, during which time he transformed the state into a national leader in cybersecurity and technology modernization.
    In this rare and candid conversation, Governor Ducey shares his firsthand experience prioritizing cybersecurity as Homeland Security. He discusses the innovative strategies his administration implemented to strengthen the "human firewall" and dramatically reduce the state's vulnerability to cyber threats.
    But, in case you aren't watching the video, I wanted to pass along a couple of the main points.
    Cybersecurity as Homeland Security
    Under Governor Ducey's leadership, Arizona prioritized cybersecurity as a critical component of homeland security. The state invested resources to improve cyber resiliency, recognizing that protecting citizens' data is just as important as physical security.
    Strengthening the "Human Firewall"
    Governor Ducey recognized that 90% of cyber breaches were due to human error. To combat this, he focused on strengthening the "human firewall" by requiring monthly cybersecurity awareness training for state employees using realistic phishing simulations. This hands-on defensive training approach, similar to how sports teams practice, enabled Arizona to dramatically reduce the percentage of employees falling for phishing attempts from 14% to 4%.
    Modernizing State Government through Technology Innovation
    Arizona took a cloud-first approach, moving from outdated on-prem data centers to Google's secure cloud platform. The state also established a Cyber Command Center to monitor and defend against constant cyber threats in real-time. In his final year, Governor Ducey passed the Whole of State initiative, investing $10 million to provide cybersecurity tools to local governments, protecting them from rising cyberattacks.
    Executive Leadership Strategies
    In this exclusive interview, Governor Ducey shares his perspective on executive leadership strategies, such as the Arizona Management System for operating government like a lean business. He discusses the importance of metrics, strategic planning, selecting the right people, and driving cultural change when working to improve an organization.
    Lessons from an Entrepreneurial Background
    Governor Ducey also shares lessons from his entrepreneurial background, including scaling Cold Stone Creamery, which shaped his approach to expanding the ice cream franchise from one store to over 1,400. His experience in the private sector influenced his leadership style and strategies for driving innovation and efficiency in state government. 
    ------

    Before we get into this week’s podcast, I wanted to give a special shout-out to TechTables podcast sponsors: SentinelOne, Verizon, and SAP.
    SentinelOne's AI-powered security platform to break down silos and protect this state's entire enterprise with real-time data and control. With seamless updates and overhead reduction securing 15,000+ endpoints across 25 agencies, SentinelOne partners to protect critical assets across states and agencies.
    Learn how SentinelOne empowers this state to stay secure or click here: https://assets.sentinelone.com/ghe/sentinelone-empowers
    Verizon Frontline is the advanced network for first responders on the front lines. It’s your mission. It’s your Verizon.
    More than 35,000 agencies rely on Verizon Frontline and its mission-critical solutions.
    Check out the solutions built for first responders or click here: https://www.verizon.com/business/solutions/public-sector/public-safety/
    Overwhelmed by Digital Transformation? Here's How One City Keeps Pace in the Digital Age.
    Provide residents and city employees with an even better, happier life through digital transformation.

    • 29 min
    Ep.172 Creating a Transformational IT Culture in Santa Barbara County with Chris Chirgwin, CIO, Santa Barbara County

    Ep.172 Creating a Transformational IT Culture in Santa Barbara County with Chris Chirgwin, CIO, Santa Barbara County

    Chris Chirgwin is the first Chief Information Officer for Santa Barbara County. Now you may know Chris from his remarkable journey in the news as the former CEO of Lanspeed, an IT services firm headquartered in Santa Barbara County, before selling his company.
    He transitioned from owning a successful small IT services business to becoming Santa Barbara County's CIO in 2022. Despite the challenges of navigating the public sector, Chris hit the ground running. He implemented EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System) principles to set core values, build a strong culture, and establish accountability through goal setting.
    Chris has now built a transformational IT department. With a team of 70 IT staff (out of 5,000+ employees and $1.5 billion dollar budget) and a focus on collaboration and empowerment, Chris has really nailed the importance of a positive work culture in attracting top talent. His leadership has led to key modernization initiatives, including a Workday ERP implementation, GIS consolidation, and a public safety radio upgrade.
    His entrepreneurial background brings a fresh perspective to Santa Barbara County and the public sector.
    Mark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour in Phoenix, Arizona, on April 1st-3rd, 2024. Chris will be joining us live on the podcast tour!

    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour
    Before we get into this week’s podcast, I wanted to give a special shout-out to TechTables podcast sponsors: SentinelOne, Verizon, and SAP.
    SentinelOne's AI-powered security platform to break down silos and protect this state's entire enterprise with real-time data and control. With seamless updates and overhead reduction securing 15,000+ endpoints across 25 agencies, SentinelOne partners to protect critical assets across states and agencies.
    Learn how SentinelOne empowers this state to stay secure or click here: https://assets.sentinelone.com/ghe/sentinelone-empowers
    Verizon Frontline is the advanced network for first responders on the front lines. It’s your mission. It’s your Verizon.
    More than 35,000 agencies rely on Verizon Frontline and its mission-critical solutions.
    Check out the solutions built for first responders or click here: https://www.verizon.com/business/solutions/public-sector/public-safety/
    Overwhelmed by Digital Transformation? Here's How One City Keeps Pace in the Digital Age.
    Provide residents and city employees with an even better, happier life through digital transformation.
    Download the Case Study Now or click here: https://www.sap.com/documents/2021/02/10c410bc-cc7d-0010-87a3-c30de2ffd8ff.html

    📬 Subscribe to the newsletter 

    In this episode, we explore how Santa Barbara County is pioneering new approaches to culture, accountability, and technology modernization under the leadership of its first CIO, Chris Chirgwin.

    Coming from the private sector as a small business owner, Chris shares his journey of implementing EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System) principles to transform the county's first-ever centralized IT department. 

    We dive into the importance of setting core values, creating a culture of achievement, and establishing visibility and accountability through goal setting. Chris also discusses key modernization initiatives like a new ERP system, consolidating GIS resources, and exploring AI use cases. 

    Tune in to hear how Chris drives collaboration, empowers his team, and leverages his entrepreneurial background to bring positive change in the public sector.
    🔖 Timestamps

    (0:00) Chris's transition from owning a small IT services business to becoming Santa Barbara County's first CIO
    (4:31) Navigating the differences between private and public sector leadership
    (8:38) Implementing EOS principles to set core values and build a strong culture
    (12:48) Using a Smartsheet to drive accountability and track quarterly goals
    (15:16) Attracting top talent through a positive work culture
    (18:31) Key modernization initiatives:

    • 47 min
    Ep.171 How to Find and Identify Great Leaders with J.R. Sloan, CIO, State of Arizona (special rerelease)

    Ep.171 How to Find and Identify Great Leaders with J.R. Sloan, CIO, State of Arizona (special rerelease)

    Featuring J.R. Sloan, CIO, State of Arizona (special rerelease)
    Mark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour April 1st-3rd, 2024 in Scottsdale, Arizona.
    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour
    Before we get into this week’s podcast, I wanted to give a special shout-out to TechTables podcast sponsors: SentinelOne, Verizon, and SAP.
    SentinelOne's AI-powered security platform to break down silos and protect this state's entire enterprise with real-time data and control. With seamless updates and overhead reduction securing 15,000+ endpoints across 25 agencies, SentinelOne partners to protect critical assets across states and agencies.
     
    Learn how SentinelOne empowers this state to stay secure.
    Verizon Frontline. The advanced network for first responders on the front lines. It’s your mission. It’s your Verizon.
    More than 35,000 agencies rely on Verizon Frontline and its mission-critical solutions.
     
    Check out the solutions built for first responders.
    Overwhelmed by Digital Transformation? Here's How One City Keeps Pace in the Digital Age.
    Provide residents and city employees with an even better, happier life through digital transformation.
    Download the Case Study Now
    --------
    📬 Subscribe to the newsletter
    Show Notes:
    In this episode of The Public Sector Show by TechTables, J.R. Sloan, the CIO for the state of Arizona, joins us to discuss the challenges and successes of leading digital transformation and technology initiatives within a federated state like Arizona. From managing relationships with over 120 agencies to measuring success in a human-centric way, J.R. shares key insights into his approach as a leader and the impact of his work on Arizona's digital experiences. Listen in to discover how J.R. Sloan's leadership is shaping Arizona's technology landscape and digital government program.
    Timestamps
    00:39 - Introduction to J.R. Sloan and his role as the CIO for the state of Arizona.01:37 - J.R. Sloan's journey and experiences within the public sector and the digital government program.05:32 - The parallels between serving franchisees in the private sector and serving the 120 different agencies in the public sector.06:23 - How success is measured in the public sector and the qualitative and quantitative metrics used for evaluation.08:39 - Maintaining a human-centric approach while engaging with team members and leaders across agencies.09:42 - The aspiration to deliver an Amazon-like digital experience for citizens and the efforts towards achieving this goal.11:08 - Empathy and understanding the citizen's perspective in driving digital experiences.⭐️ Leave a Review
    If you enjoy listening to the podcast, ⁠please leave a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts⁠ and let us know in your review who you want to see next on the podcast. Thanks!
    You can also Tweet us on ⁠@thejoetoste⁠ and tell us what lessons you learned from the episode so we can thank you personally for tuning in 🙏🙏
    🔗 Connect with TechTables
    LinkedIn TechTables ⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/company/techtables/⁠⁠⁠
    LinkedIn - Connect with Joe! ⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/jtoste/⁠⁠⁠
    Twitter ⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/thejoetoste⁠
    Follow us on Instagram! ⁠https://www.instagram.com/techtablespodcast/⁠
    Website ⁠https://www.techtables.com/

    • 11 min
    Ep.170 A CIO Roundtable: San Jose, Raleigh & Austin - Strategies for Tooling for Hyper Responsive Government Services with Equity & Beyond

    Ep.170 A CIO Roundtable: San Jose, Raleigh & Austin - Strategies for Tooling for Hyper Responsive Government Services with Equity & Beyond

    Featuring 
    Mark Wittenburg, CIO of RaleighRob Lloyd, Deputy City Manager of San JoseChris Stewart, former CIO of the City of AustinMark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour April 1st-3rd, 2024 in Scottsdale, Arizona.
    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour
    Before we get into this week’s podcast, I wanted to give a special shout-out to TechTables podcast sponsors: SentinelOne, Verizon, and SAP.
    SentinelOne's AI-powered security platform to break down silos and protect this state's entire enterprise with real-time data and control. With seamless updates and overhead reduction securing 15,000+ endpoints across 25 agencies, SentinelOne partners to protect critical assets across states and agencies.
     
    Learn how SentinelOne empowers this state to stay secure.
    Verizon Frontline. The advanced network for first responders on the front lines. It’s your mission. It’s your Verizon.
    More than 35,000 agencies rely on Verizon Frontline and its mission-critical solutions.
     
    Check out the solutions built for first responders.
    Overwhelmed by Digital Transformation? Here's How One City Keeps Pace in the Digital Age.
    Provide residents and city employees with an even better, happier life through digital transformation.
    Download the Case Study Now
    --------
    📬 Subscribe to the newsletter🏕️ Intro 
    In today's episode of The Public Sector Show by TechTables, we're joined with guests Mark Wittenburg, CIO of Raleigh, Rob Lloyd, Deputy City Manager of San Jose, and Chris Stewart, former CIO of the City of Austin from The Big Sky Live Podcast Tour.
    We dive into the complexities of digital equity and responsive government services in their cities. We also explore how these leaders leverage technology for community engagement during events and disasters, and discuss strategies to attract mission-driven talent in the increasingly competitive landscape of public sector employment.
    🎧 Tune in to learn more about:
    ✨ Provide more equitable access to city services through technology
    "we connected 160,000 people covered. 160,000 people with high speed wifi."
    ✨ Bridge the digital divide in your community
    "In Title I attendance areas, that's 80% at least. Free or reduced lunch, a proxy for poverty"
    ✨ Truly listen and respond to your constituents' needs
    "we actually try to co create services."
    ✨ Create internships and events to inspire future technologists
    "that internship pipeline gives us a head start."
    ✨ Build a culture that attracts and retains top talent
    "when you create a culture that attracts people, it solves a big chunk of your problem."
    ✨ Develop managers to lead effectively in a hybrid world
    "Hybrid work does require better managers."
    ✨ Collaborate across regions to solve complex problems like 
    "what are you going to do about the laws in North Carolina that restrict the cities from providing broadband?" ("It's trying to work with like the state with Jim Weaver is to start to look and say, ok, what are the things that we can do?")
    ✨ Communicate the meaningful impact of public sector IT work
    "the story we get to tell in public."
    Plus Q&A from Brent Byrnes at ExtraHop and Brad Booth from SentinelOne.
    🔗 Watch and listen: https://podcast.techtables.com/ep170-A-CIO-Roundtable-San-Jose-Raleigh-Austin-Strategies-for-Tooling-for-Hyper-Responsive-Government-Services-with-Equity
    📆 Ready to attend our next live podcast tour stop?
    Join us for the 2024 TechTables Phoenix Tour before sponsorship sells out! 
    3 spots left. 😱
    Don't miss this one-of-a-kind chance to be part of the live audience for interviews with today's top public sector technology leaders, and hear from fmr. Governor Doug Ducey live!
    ⏰ Only 45 days left until the Phoenix Live Podcast Tour!
    🔗 Visit https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour to learn more.

    ⭐️ Leave a Review
    If you enjoy listening to the podcast, ⁠please leave a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts⁠ and le

    • 45 min
    Ep.169 Breaking Down Data Silos: How Montana is Improving Data Sharing Across Agencies (and Reducing Friction and Streamlining Services) with Kevin Gilbertson, CIO, State of Montana, Carrie Albro, CIO, Montana Department of Public Health & Human Service

    Ep.169 Breaking Down Data Silos: How Montana is Improving Data Sharing Across Agencies (and Reducing Friction and Streamlining Services) with Kevin Gilbertson, CIO, State of Montana, Carrie Albro, CIO, Montana Department of Public Health & Human Service

    Featuring 
    Kevin Gilbertson, CIO, State of MontanaCarrie Albro, CIO, Montana Department of Public Health & Human ServicesAdam Carpenter, Chief Data Officer, State of MontanaMark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour April 1st-3rd, 2024 in Scottsdale, Arizona.
    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour
    Before we get into this week’s podcast, I wanted to give a special shout-out to TechTables podcast sponsors: SentinelOne, Verizon, and SAP.
    SentinelOne's AI-powered security platform to break down silos and protect this state's entire enterprise with real-time data and control. With seamless updates and overhead reduction securing 15,000+ endpoints across 25 agencies, SentinelOne partners to protect critical assets across states and agencies.
     
    Learn how SentinelOne empowers this state to stay secure.
    Verizon Frontline. The advanced network for first responders on the front lines. It’s your mission. It’s your Verizon.
    More than 35,000 agencies rely on Verizon Frontline and its mission-critical solutions.
     
    Check out the solutions built for first responders.
    Overwhelmed by Digital Transformation? Here's How One City Keeps Pace in the Digital Age.
    Provide residents and city employees with an even better, happier life through digital transformation.
    Download the Case Study Now
    --------
    📬 Subscribe to the newsletter🏕️ Intro 
    In this episode, we explore how the State of Montana is pioneering new approaches to AI, data sharing, and analytics to reduce friction for citizens and enable data-driven decisions.
    Featuring Kevin Gilbertson, CIO of Montana, Carrie Albro, CIO of Montana Health and Human Services, and Adam Carpenter, Montana's Chief Data Officer. We dive into success stories like fixing a decade-long sewer permitting issue, building a statewide justice data warehouse, and developing a resource referral engine to connect citizens to support services. Tune in to hear how Montana is improving cross-agency collaboration, empowering leaders with actionable insights, and leveraging technology for public good.
    📚 Timestamps
    00:00 How an unexpected phone call led Adam to become Montana's first Chief Data Officer
    04:31 Discovering data silos that prevented effective policy decisions
    08:38 Responding to legislature's demands for proof of IT strategy execution
    12:48 Carrie advocates for other agencies by asking the "tough questions"
    15:16 Pursuing constant improvement with "better is possible" mindset
    18:31 Applying Netflix culture principles to build a dream team
    21:10 Harnessing AI's potential to create major efficiency gains
    26:19 Empowering businesses by unlocking the state's data assets
    27:59 Overcoming 99-year record retention rules through master data
    30:35 Establishing reciprocal data relationships with local counties

    Mark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour, where we will dive deeper into these insights and explore the cutting-edge solutions driving innovation in the public and private sectors.
    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour

    ⭐️ Leave a Review
    If you enjoy listening to the podcast, ⁠please leave a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts⁠ and let us know who you want to see next on the podcast in your review. Thanks!
    You can also Tweet us on ⁠@thejoetoste⁠ and tell us what lessons you learned from the episode so we can thank you personally for tuning in 🙏🙏
    🔗 Connect with TechTables
    LinkedIn TechTables ⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/company/techtables/LinkedIn - Connect with Joe! ⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/jtoste/Twitter https://twitter.com/thejoetosteFollow us on Instagram! https://www.instagram.com/techtablespodcast/Website ⁠https://www.techtables.com/

    • 34 min
    ep.168 Racing to Get Left of Boom: How CXOs Stay Steps Ahead of Nation States like China and Russia with Jamie Grant, fmr. CIO, State of Florida & Morgan Wright, Chief Security Advisor, at SentinelOne

    ep.168 Racing to Get Left of Boom: How CXOs Stay Steps Ahead of Nation States like China and Russia with Jamie Grant, fmr. CIO, State of Florida & Morgan Wright, Chief Security Advisor, at SentinelOne

    [NEW EPISODE] - UNLOCKED FROM THE VAULT - Orlando Live Podcast Tour at the Loews Portofino Bay Hotel on Saturday, March 18th, 2023
    📬 Subscribe to the newsletter
    In a world of increasing cyber threats, how can government technology leaders try to stay a step ahead of nefarious hackers from China, Russia, and beyond? Our guests, former Florida CIO Jamie Grant and SentinelOne's Morgan Wright give us an inside look at the high-stakes cybersecurity race against bad actors and nation-states.
    Join us as Jamie and Morgan pull back the curtain on Florida's evolving cyberstrategy to get "left of boom" and prevent attacks before they happen. They'll discuss how AI, automation, and other innovative tools are being used to combat and outmaneuver complex threats.
    We'll also explore some of the unique public sector challenges around recruitment, retention, and procurement that Jamie's team overcame through creative problem-solving and a change in mindset.
    Connect with Jamie Grant here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jdubyagrant
    Connect with Morgan Wright here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/morganwright150/
    Mark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour April 1st-3rd, 2024 in Scottsdale, Arizona.
    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour
    Before we get into this week’s podcast, I wanted to give a special shout-out to TechTables podcast sponsors: SentinelOne, Verizon, and SAP.
    SentinelOne's AI-powered security platform to break down silos and protect this state's entire enterprise with real-time data and control. With seamless updates and overhead reduction securing 15,000+ endpoints across 25 agencies, SentinelOne partners to protect critical assets across states and agencies.
     
    Learn how SentinelOne empowers this state to stay secure.
    Verizon Frontline. The advanced network for first responders on the front lines. It’s your mission. It’s your Verizon.
    More than 35,000 agencies rely on Verizon Frontline and its mission-critical solutions.
     
    Check out the solutions built for first responders.
    Overwhelmed by Digital Transformation? Here's How One City Keeps Pace in the Digital Age.
    Provide residents and city employees with an even better, happier life through digital transformation.
    Download the Case Study Now
    🔖 Timestamps 
    0:00 - Intro
    3:00 - Morgan Wright on how 9/11 shaped his "left of boom" cybersecurity approach6:00 - Connecting dots across agencies to prevent attacks
    9:00 - Creative problem-solving strategies for cybersecurity12:00 - Government procurement disconnects15:00 - Emphasizing speed and agility in public sector18:00 - Automation's role in defending against nation-state threats21:00 - Recruiting and retaining talent in public service
    24:00 - Evolving workforce and technology for enhanced value27:00 - Driving value on cybersecurity offense
    30:00 - Pattern recognition across industries33:00 - Innovative cybersecurity philosophies and risk aversion
    36:00 - Entrepreneurial thinking in government
    39:00 - Florida's 2030 Cybersecurity Workforce Vision42:00 - Partnerships over headcounts in government45:00 - Economic barriers against adversaries48:00 - Handling continuous attacks on Florida
    51:00 - Rethinking Cybersecurity with AI54:00 - Inefficient procurement processes57:00 - Empowering teams in cybersecurity1:00:00 - Preparing for future threats1:03:00 - Automation and AI in network security
    1:06:00 - Local government technology adoption barriers
    Mark your calendars for the 2024 Phoenix Live Podcast Tour, where we will dive deeper into these insights and explore the cutting-edge solutions driving innovation in the public and private sectors.
    Learn more here: https://www.techtables.com/2024-phoenix-live-podcast-tour

    ⭐️ Leave a Review
    If you enjoy listening to the podcast, ⁠please leave a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts⁠ and let us know who you want to see next on the podcast in your review. Thanks!
    You can also Tweet us on ⁠@thejoetoste⁠ and tell us what lessons

    • 1 hr 7 min

Customer Reviews

5.0 out of 5
22 Ratings

22 Ratings

JBarlam ,

Must-Listen Podcast for Engaging Conversations

TechTables stands out with its interesting topics and high-quality guests. Each episode offers something intriguing and thought-provoking. The genuine passion from the host (Joe) shines through, making the discussions engaging and enjoyable. The caliber of guests brings depth and expertise to the conversations that I found highly applicable.

Nathan…D ,

Great Listen!

Toste offers a captivating blend of insightful discussion and up-to-date information. His dynamic interview style is engaging, while providing deep dives into tech trends. Highly recommend for anyone wanting to stay informed in the rapidly evolving tech landscape.

Jdawg1217 ,

Something you want to be a part of

There are events/meetings that you want to go to and then there are events that you want to be a part of. I have had the opportunity to be a part of 2 in person tech tables and after each event I found myself wanting to know when the next event was. The greatest thing about these meetings are that the guests are bouncing ideas and thoughts off of one another where it becomes more of a think tank!!
Joe and his team do an amazing job with these and I highly recommend attending and or listening into them.

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