72 episodes

This podcast series is aimed at helping us to transcend our fear and anger so that we can be more engaged in the world in a way that develops love and compassion.

Thich Nhat Hanh’s calligraphy ‘The Way Out Is In” highlights that the way out of any difficulty is to look deeply within, gain insights and then put them into practice.

"The Way Out is In" is co-hosted by Brother Phap Huu, Thich Nhat Hanh's personal attendant for 17 years and the abbot of Plum Village's Upper Hamlet, and Jo Confino, who works at the intersection of personal transformation and systems change.

The podcast is co-produced by the Plum Village App and Global Optimism, with support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation.

The Way Out Is In Plum Village

    • Religion & Spirituality
    • 5.0 • 2 Ratings

This podcast series is aimed at helping us to transcend our fear and anger so that we can be more engaged in the world in a way that develops love and compassion.

Thich Nhat Hanh’s calligraphy ‘The Way Out Is In” highlights that the way out of any difficulty is to look deeply within, gain insights and then put them into practice.

"The Way Out is In" is co-hosted by Brother Phap Huu, Thich Nhat Hanh's personal attendant for 17 years and the abbot of Plum Village's Upper Hamlet, and Jo Confino, who works at the intersection of personal transformation and systems change.

The podcast is co-produced by the Plum Village App and Global Optimism, with support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation.

    Happy Farmers Change the World (Episode #69)

    Happy Farmers Change the World (Episode #69)

    Welcome to episode 69 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.



    With Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu away, leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino holds the fort with a special episode about the art of land regeneration, happy farming, and reconnecting deeply to nature. This time, Jo is joined by special guests and happy farmers Mick McEvoy and Sister Trang Lam Hy (Sister Forest of Joy), two of the people behind the Happy Farms agroecology project in Plum Village.The conversation touches upon many topics, from Zen philosophies, the Diamond Sutra, and deep ecology, to seasonal planting and practicing mindfulness while working the land; producing food AND caring for the Earth; collective awakening and beginning anew; empathy for our food; reclaiming the nobility of the farmer; the importance of growing (beautiful) vegetables in a time of polycrisis – even in small quantities; land regeneration and Zen Buddhism; Thich Nhat Hanh’s gardening metaphors; and more.Enjoy and thank you for listening!







    Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/  



    And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 



    With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/







    List of resources 



    The Happy Harmhttps://thehappyfarm.org/ 



    Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing‘The Five Earth Touchings’https://plumvillage.org/key-practice-texts/the-five-earth-touchingsHappy Farms: ‘Reverence for the Land’https://plumvillage.org/articles/reverence-for-the-land 



    ‘Happy Farm: Rewilding – Healing, Regeneration, and Transformation for the Land’https://www.parallax.org/mindfulnessbell/article/happy-farm-rewilding/ 



    Sutras: ‘The Diamond That Cuts through Illusion’https://plumvillage.org/library/sutras/the-diamond-that-cuts-through-illusionDharma Talks: ‘Free from Notions: The Diamond Sutra’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/free-from-notions-the-diamond-sutra 



    Deep ecologyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_ecology 



    Vandana Shivahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vandana_Shiva 



    Grow It Yourselfhttps://giy.ie/ 



    Eating Meditationhttps://web.plumvillage.app/meditations/eating-meditationMary Oliverhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_OliverThe Bodhi Treehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhi_Tree 



    Global North and Global Southhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_North_and_Global_South Braiding Sweetgrasshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braiding_Sweetgrass







    Quotes



    “I can pivot 360 degrees, and I can see countless examples of what Thich Nhat Hanh refers to as interbeing, this interconnectedness of all life.” 



    “Happy Farm literally grounds people in [mindfulness] practice.”



    “We are the Earth that carries us.”



    “Go home to nature and let nature heal you.”



    “Thay was a revolutionary to bring the community of humans, the community of practice, out into the forest to practice walking meditation every day. And that is so unique and healing in and of itself.”



    “We’re probably the first generation, at least in the Global North, that have been separated in our choices, and how our communities and cultures have evolved to be separate from the gifts and knowledge of how to grow some of our own food. And in rediscovering how to do that, we took a lot from and have a lot of reverence for the ancestors: our blood ancestors, our family, our spiritual ancestors, and our land ancestors, those who lived on these lands. And many people lived on these lands here, in Plum Village, going way back into historical times when people hunted in these valleys or farmed these lands. And all our neighbors around us still farm these lands, not just on the Happy Farm.” 



    “Vandana Shiva say

    • 1 hr 24 min
    Showing Up at Work (Episode #68)

    Showing Up at Work (Episode #68)

    Welcome to episode 68 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.



    In this episode, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino discuss Right Livelihood in Buddhism. After starting with what this means, they dive more deeply into practical steps and examples. How can we find joy, feel deeply connected, and also make a positive impact on the world through our daily work?



    The conversation also touches upon ‘bringing our cosmic body to work’; the insight of responsibility; the difference between doing what we love and doing what we’re good at; ego and compassion in the workplace; planning for the future while being in the present; and much more. 



    The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu.



    Enjoy and thank you for listening!







    Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/



    And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 



    With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/







    List of resources 



    Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing 



    Dharma Talks: ‘Right Livelihood and True Love’ https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/right-livelihood-and-true-love 



    Dharma Talks: ‘The Noble Eightfold Path’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-noble-eightfold-path 



    Koanhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koan 



    Dharma Talks: ‘Our Cosmic Body’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/our-cosmic-body 



    Buddha Mind, Buddha Bodyhttps://www.parallax.org/product/buddha-mind-buddha-body/ 



    Sister True Dedicationhttps://www.instagram.com/sistertruededication/ 



    The Art of Livinghttps://plumvillage.org/books/the-art-of-living







    Quotes



    “Each and every one of us has a spiritual dimension inside that we can generate wherever we go, and that is a contribution to what we want to build.” 



    “By being we do more effectively.”



    “Don’t just do something, sit there.”



    “Time is being, time is to be alive.”



    “When you have anger, it can be a bell of mindfulness that tells us when we see injustice, when we see suffering. And we can be with that anger. And that anger can become a voice for us, to have empathy, to have compassion. Because compassion can come from anger sometimes. It can come from what we’re seeing, because it tells us that this is wrong. But if we allow anger to always be there and not transform, and we don’t channel it into another energy, then we will become one with exactly that outer energy that made us angry in the first place.”



    “Sometimes silence is the loudest noise.”



    “Why not be soft? Why not be kinder? That softness and that kindness are very loud in a moment of big aggression. The kindness, the softness becomes a louder action because it shows our humanity; it shows the heart of love.”



    “Thay emphasized that all of us have a Buddha body. We have [the potential for] awakening inside of us – we just have to cultivate it. And there are moments that we’re not a Buddha. That’s okay. But remember that we have Buddha nature inside of us.” 



    “Thay had a calligraphy that really informs us about deep interbeing: ‘The piece of bread in your hands is the body of the whole cosmos.’ And that is for us to have a deep understanding that this piece of bread didn’t just come from nowhere, nothing. It’s the whole lifetime of the existence of time and space. And it’s a miracle to have this piece of bread. So be grateful. Hold it with gratitude. Hold it with reverence. Eat it with gratitude. Eat it with reverence.”

    • 1 hr 27 min
    Stepping into Freedom – Live Recording with Q&A Session (Episode #67)

    Stepping into Freedom – Live Recording with Q&A Session (Episode #67)

    Welcome to episode 67 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.



    This inaugural live recording of the podcast was made in London, England, on April 5th, 2024, before a sold-out audience of more than 400 people. For the first half of this episode, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino explore what it means to step into freedom in the light of Buddhist teachings, drawing on insights from the life and teachings of Thich Nhat Hanh, and including much needed practical steps which can be applied to our daily lives. Their conversation touches upon the pressure of perfection; layers of freedom; the best time to make a decision; experiencing gratitude; true happiness; vulnerability as an expression of love; working with the feeling of ‘not enough’; and much more.The second half of the episode consists of a live question-and-answer session, with questions from the audience covering a wide range of topics: ways to embrace suffering; compassionate sharing; ending wars by cultivating peace; the joy of missing out; cultivating aspirations; empathy and mindfulness; and more.  



    And this time you can even enjoy two short meditations guided by Brother Phap Huu.Thank you for listening! 







    Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/



    And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 



    With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/







    List of resources 



    Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing 



    Stepping into Freedom: An Introduction to Monastic Buddhist Traininghttps://plumvillage.org/books/stepping-into-freedom 



    ‘Cong Phu Journal – Everything You Need to Know About the Practice Notebook’ https://plumvillage.app/cong-phu-journal-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-practice-notebook/



    Old Path White Clouds: Walking in the Footsteps of the Buddha https://plumvillage.org/books/old-path-white-clouds-2 



    Rains Retreathttps://plumvillage.org/articles/now-we-have-a-path-2023-24-autumn-winter-rains-retreat 



    Christiana Figuereshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christiana_Figueres 



    Dalai Lamahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalai_Lama 



    World Wildlife Fundhttps://www.worldwildlife.org/







    Quotes



    “We’re all looking to feel free, to be ourselves, to find happiness, to be recognized, to love and be loved. It’s at the core of our deepest aspiration in life. And yet, oftentimes, we don’t feel like that. We feel disturbed in our mind; we suffer from anger or frustration; we’re too busy; we have many obligations in our lives; we’re constantly bombarded with news and social media. And so we experience a dissonance between this wish to be free and our everyday lives.”



    “Practicing mindfulness is, first, a practice of mere recognition, to call our habits by their name and to recognize the sources of energy that emerge in us. That, already, is the first step towards freedom. And freedom is a continuous energy and a continuous insight that we are cultivating. Thich Nhat Hanh was very firm when he said we all have the ability to have freedom, but here freedom doesn’t come from outside in, but is what we cultivate from the inside.” 



    “Thay wasn’t ever using the war to affirm who he was. He was free from that. And that is something that I still aspire to walk towards. And when we talk about cultivating, it is very practical; it’s not just a mindset. Mindset is like a will – but, for us, aspiration has to go alongside action. So, very concretely, in the Plum Village tradition of Buddhist practice, in all of our Dharma, we have to engage in everyday life.” 



    “Thich Nhat Hanh was once asked, ‘Wh

    • 2 hrs 4 min
    The Practice of Gratitude (Episode #66)

    The Practice of Gratitude (Episode #66)

    Welcome to episode 66 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.



    This time, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino talk about the practice of gratitude and its power to shine a light in even the darkest circumstances. Their conversation touches on many aspects of gratitude, from the way it has been viewed in Buddhism since the days of the Buddha, to gratitude for life, gratitude as a gift and a rebalancer, and gratitude even when things don’t go well.  



    Brother Phap Huu further talks about nourishing our deep connection to interbeing; opening our hearts to suffering; loneliness in the monastic community;  gratitude for the Earth, all living beings, and (even) minerals; the feeling of ‘enough’; the Cong Phu Sheet; and more. And why is gratitude a such a difficult practice, even when there are many opportunities to apply it?



    Jo delves into daily practices of gratitude; coming back into balance; Christmas presents and meaninglessness; approaches to economic development in Bhutan; and more. 



    The episode ends with a short meditation on gratitude guided by Brother Phap Huu.







    Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/



    And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 



    With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/







    List of resources 



    The Way Out Is In live recordinghttps://wakeuplondon.org/thewayoutisin/ 



    Bodhicittahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhicitta 



    Old Path White Clouds https://plumvillage.org/books/old-path-white-clouds-2 



    Anandahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%80nanda 



    Shariputrahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Śāriputra 



    Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing 



    Bhutanhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhutan 



    The Alchemisthttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Alchemist_(novel) 



    Dharma Talks: ‘The Three Doors of Liberation or the Three Dharma Seals’ https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-three-doors-of-liberation-or-the-three-dharma-seals-sr-chan-duc-italian-retreat-2018-05-04‘Cong Phi Journal – Everything You Need to Know About the Practice Notebook’ https://plumvillage.app/cong-phu-journal-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-practice-notebook/



    Maudgalyayanahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maudgalyayana 



    ‘A Teacher Looking for His Student’https://plumvillage.org/poems 



    Brother Bao Tang (Brother Treasure)https://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/brother-bao-tang



    Gratitude for the Four Elements (short audio meditation by Brother Phap Dung) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWQlmyXF7fc







    Quotes



    “When we really touch the present moment with the deep insight that ‘what I have here is enough’, we start to touch freedom. But a lot of us are afraid to come home to ourselves. And the whole art of meditation is learning to come home.”



    “Gratitude is a practice and a muscle that we need to develop. Because if we have a practice of gratitude, then being grateful is going to flow much more easily.”



    “There is a lot of suffering today, but if we focus solely on that suffering, we may also lose the light. Therefore, gratitude becomes a light that we want to protect, to give us hope, to help us know why we are doing what we’re doing, for the activists to know what they are protecting, for the people who are calling out injustice to be grateful that, as human beings, we can use our voices to speak about suffering.”

    • 1 hr 24 min
    Taming Our Survival Instinct (Episode #65)

    Taming Our Survival Instinct (Episode #65)

    Welcome to episode 65 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.



    This episode is the second to be recorded live in front of an audience, in the Still Water Meditation Hall of Upper Hamlet, Plum Village, France.



    This time, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino are joined by frequent guest Sister True Dedication (Sister Hien Nghiem). Together, they discuss ‘manas’: in Buddhism, “an aspect of the mind that wants to believe we’re separate, wants to crave after all the pleasures of life, wants to avoid suffering, and does not like the idea of moderation.” 



    The two monastics begin by defining manas and their larger context, as well as sharing relevant examples from their lives and the community, to support a better understanding of these concepts. The live discussion touches upon topics such as right diligence, watering the right seeds in us, Buddhist psychology, understanding how the mind works, the laws of moderation, reality checks, the importance of community in taming manas, the seven characteristics of manas, and much more.



    The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu.Enjoy!







    Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/



    And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 



    With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/







    List of resources 



    Sister True Dedicationhttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/sister-hien-nghiem 



    The Way Out Is In: ‘Understanding How Our Mind Works (Episode #28)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/understanding-how-our-mind-works-episode-28 



    Sister Lang Nghiemhttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/sr-lang-nghiem 



    Yogacharahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogachara 



    The Way Out Is In: ‘Shining Light (Episode #63)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/shining-light-episode-63 



    Dharma Talks: ‘Manas Consciousness, Teachings on Buddhist Psychology Retreat, 1997’ https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/manas-consciousness-thich-nhat-hanh-teachings-on-buddhist-psychology-retreat-1997 



    Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing 



    Mahayanahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahayana 



    ‘51 Mental Formations’https://plumvillage.org/transcriptions/51-mental-formation 



    Dharma Talks: ‘The Noble Eightfold Path’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-noble-eightfold-path



    Classes: ‘(Class #13) Right Diligence’https://plumvillage.org/library/classes/class-13-right-diligence







    Quotes



    “Mindfulness has to be a verb. Compassion has to be a verb. We have to practise compassion for ourselves.”



    “If you want a child to stop playing with something, you have to give him something else to play with.”



    “Mindfulness is always to be mindful of something. The energy of mindfulness is like a light that we are able to generate, and we can shine that light towards ourself.” 



    “Our manas is what keeps us alive, and we take care of it with nonviolence, with compassion, and with the insight of interbeing and nondiscrimination. Thay is known for his worldly or political nondiscrimination, but his insights on nondiscrimination extend to our whole being, our whole mind, and what it means to be human. And there’s so much compassion and nonviolence in that.” 



    “We always say understanding – true, real understanding, right understanding – will generate compassion. And compassion is one of the elements of true love for oneself and for others.” 



    “In the path that Thay has opened up for us, we are allowed to show up with our whole self, including all our shortcomings, and it’s such a special feeling to be accepted for who you

    • 1 hr 49 min
    Ripening Moment by Moment (Episode #64)

    Ripening Moment by Moment (Episode #64)

    Welcome to episode 64 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.



    This episode is the first to be recorded live in front of an audience, in the Still Water Meditation Hall of Plum Village, France, during a retreat, rather than in Thay’s Sitting Still hut. 



    Together, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino explore the Buddhist concept of ripening, or the Fourth Dharma Seal of Plum Village: the understanding that the care, love, attention, and commitment we put into what’s important in life take time to ripen, and that we shouldn’t expect instant results.



    Brother Phap Huu starts off by introducing the first Three Dharma Seals and why Thay created them, before digging deeper into the Fourth Dharma Seal, the main theme of this episode; the process of ripening; the life journey of the practice; and much more.



    Jo brings examples of lifelong journeys of forgiveness, and explores trust versus control, dharma rain, and more.And: how can we all apply this practice of ripening to our own lives?



    The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu. 







    Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/



    And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 



    With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/







    List of resources 



    The Way Out Is In – Live recording informationhttps://wakeuplondon.org/thewayoutisin/



    ‘The Four Dharma Seals of Plum Village’https://plumvillage.org/articles/the-four-dharma-seals-of-plum-village 



    Sutras: ‘Discourse on the Dharma Seal & the Three Doors of Liberation’https://plumvillage.org/library/sutras/discourse-on-the-dharma-seal-the-three-doors-of-liberationInterbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/InterbeingThe Way Out Is In: ‘The Three Doors of Liberation (Episode #18)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/the-three-doors-of-liberation-episode-18 



    Dharma Talks: ‘Three Doors of Liberation’ https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/three-doors-of-liberation-br-phap-khi-italian-retreat-2018-05-01/



    ‘The Doors of Liberation’https://www.lionsroar.com/the-doors-of-liberation-may-2014/ 



    Mahayanahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MahayanaDharma Talks: ‘Right View: Understanding the Roots of Our True Happiness’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/right-view-understanding-the-roots-of-our-true-happiness 



    Old Path White Cloudshttps://plumvillage.org/books/old-path-white-clouds-2



    Fragrant Palm Leaves https://plumvillage.org/books/1998-neo-ve-cua-y-fragrant-palm-leaves



    Sister Chan Khonghttps://plumvillage.org/about/sister-chan-khongSister Lang Nghiemhttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/sr-lang-nghiem 



    Sister True Dedicationhttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/sister-hien-nghiem







    Quotes



    “When we practice meditation and mindfulness to come home to the here and now, we start to discover that the present moment is the only moment in which we can be alive. And the present moment embraces the past as well as creating the future.”



    “If we don’t have darkness, the light won’t have a chance to appear.”



    “It is impossible to physically go back to the past, but I can bring the past into the here and now, and heal it by being right here, right now. By this present moment, I am creating a new path.”



    “The world is created by our mind.” 



    “The insight of ripening allows us to understand that the path of practice is a wonderful journey, and that it takes time and space for things to mature, for things to transform, for things to heal. When we hear about ripening, we may think of a tree – say, an orange tree. It takes time for the seed to be planted. For the roots to de

    • 1 hr 40 min

Customer Reviews

5.0 out of 5
2 Ratings

2 Ratings

Linda Charlotta ,

Wonderful podcast

This is one of the most inspiring and insightful podcasts around. I’ve been listening to it since it started and each episode is a gem, cultivating a kinder world. Both Joe and Brother Phap Huu are really funny and their guests bring extra ingredients to the varied discussions too. The podcast is suitable for everyone who cares about peace inside oneself and manifesting it in the world. I can’t recommend it highly enough. Thank you for this wonderful offering!

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