The Jay Show The Jay Show

Al Fadi invited Jay and David to come on his show (CIRA International) and do an hour 'live-stream' unpacking the conundrum surrounding the problems concerning the many 8th - 10th century Qur'anic Qira'ats and Ahrufs.   They looked at the most damaging statements between Mohammed Hijab and Yasir Qadhi from their disastrous interview recorded on YouTube on June 8, 2020, and reacted to the statements.  Watch this hour live-stream to see what exactly transpired, and why Muslims today are so angered by what they are hearing concerning the problems surrounding the preservation of their Qur'an, causing many Muslims to now doubt the preservation of their Qur'an.

Muslims claim there is only ONE Qur'an in existence in the world today. Dr Jay Smith and al Fadi destroy that notion completely in this 22-minute episode.  One of Jay's colleagues, Hatun Tash, has been able to purchase 31 different Arabic Qur'ans in countries like Yemen, Jordan and Morocco.  So, how are they different? They have different dottings above and below the line. All of these dots were added to the texts in the 8th and 9th centuries, over 144 years and more after Uthman supposedly created the final canonized text of the Qur'an.  What's more these 31 different Qur'ans disagree with each other almost 60,000 times, proving that they are not at all the same Qur'an.  Now Muslims will say that these differing dots don't change the meaning of the texts at all. So Dr Smith and al Fadi decided to see if this was so, and only looked at around 20 examples of these different texts, proving that in every case, not only did they change what was being said, but often they changed the theology between the two texts as well.  So, what have we done in these 9 episodes:  We started with the two compilations written down (the first by Ab Bakr, the second by Uthman), referred to by the earliest traditions.   These traditions also tell us that once the final copy was finished, all of the other copies of the Qur'an which disagreed were burned, and that copies of the final canonised text, authorised by Uthman, were sent to 9 different provinces, yet we can't find even one of them today.  Of the 6 earliest manuscripts of the Qur'an which are extant today (including the Topkapi, the Samarkand, The Ma'il, the Petropolitanus, the Husaini, and the Sana'a codices), not one of them is from the 7th century, not one of them is complete, not one of them completely agrees with each other, and not one of them agrees completely with the Qur'an which we use today!  Jay and Al Fadi zeroed in on the lower layer of the Sana'a Palimpsest, which could be from the 7th century, though it only included 63 verses; yet, it had 70 manuscript variants when compared to the upper layer, and when compared with the Qur'an which we are using today. Dr Elizabeth Puin believes that this is proof of a nascent (earlier Qur'an), which was wiped off and then re-written over top around 705 AD to make way for a corrected text, suggesting human intervention from the very outset of the Qur'ans creation.

Jay & Al Fadi now go through the final 5 early Qur'anic manuscripts one-by-one and show that all of them are from the 8th century or later, and furthermore, each of them have manuscript variants (i.e. they have words or phrases which are different from the 1924 'Hafs' manuscript which we use today).  Some of these variants include erasures and coverings, which suggests the later Caliphs had these manuscripts changed, and in some cases wanted what they changed covered, so that people could not see what they had changed.  Not one of these Qur'ans are complete, some only a quarter to a half of the Qur'an.  Jay and Al Fadi looked at just one or two of the thousands of variants which have been found, suggesting that there was quite a bit of human manipulation and intervention in these earliest texts, proving yet again that the Qur'an was:  -Not eternal -Not sent down -Not complete -Nor unchanged  © Pfander Centre for Apologetics, 2017 (16,900)  If would like to help support Pfanderfilms, please click on this link: https://www.patreon.com/pfander

We now introduce some of the damaging material concerning how the Qur'an began.  Jay and al Fadi go through what we know from within the Islamic Traditions on how this book, the foundation for every Muslim, was created.  We've been told that there is only ONE Qur'an, yet when we go to Al Bukhari 6:509-510 which is the most authoritative place to find out just how the Qur'an was created, we find that there wasn't just one Qur'an written down, but TWO Qur'ans within a period of 20 years, the first during the time of Abu Bakr (632-634 AD), and the second during the time of Uthman (650-652 AD).  Yet, both were written by the secretary of Muhammad, Zaid ibn Thabit. And after the caliph had the second Qur'an finalized, he sent 9 copies to 9 different cities as the official Qur'an of that time.  Jay and Al Fadi go through in this episode all the problems these two first copies of the Qur'an create for Muslims who want to believe that the Qur'an was ever changed, or that the Qur'an we have today is the same which existed in the 7th century.  Yet, even more damaging, according to later traditions, even this final Qur'an was changed, deleted, parts forgotten, or abrogated, proving that decades later they were still changing the Qur'an.  The more we look at the Qur'an's history, the more we realize that the classical account of how the Qur'an was compiled begins to weaken and weaken.  Stay tuned, because it's going to get even worse!  © Pfander Centre for Apologetics, 2017 (16,655)

In our 2nd episode, Jay and Al Fadi review what the best Muslim scholars today say about our current Qur'an; namely, that there are extant Qur'anic manuscripts which were written at the time of Uthman (652 AD), that they are complete, that they are exactly the same as that which we have today, and that not a word, nay even a letter has been changed, nor even a diacritical mark!  By making such extravagant claims Muslim scholars have elevated the Qur'an to such a high level, putting it on such a high pedestal, that it should be easy to not only confront these claims, but show just how hopelessly out of touch these scholars are with the evidence which we now know about the Qur'an.  Jay and Al Fadi in this episode begin with these claims, and then finish by putting the gauntlet down, demanding that Muslims provide just ONE Qur'anic manuscript from the mid 7th century (thus from the time of Uthman), which is complete (thus all 114 Suras), and which is unchanged (thus exactly like the Hafs Qur'an which we use today).  © Pfander Centre for Apologetics, 2018 (16,608)

Muslims have always assumed 4 things about the Qur'an; namely that it was ETERNAL, that it was SENT DOWN to Muhammad, that it was COMPLETE by the time of Uthman, and that it is UNCHANGED, even today.  Jay and Al Fadi are going to confront the last two of those claims, that the Qur'an was complete at the time of Uthman, and that it is unchanged up to modern times.  To do that, they will introduce six problematic areas with the Qur'an; which include:  -The 2 compilations of the Qur’an -The 6 Earliest Manuscripts of the Qur’an -The Changes in the Earliest Manuscripts -The 2 Layers of the Sana’a Palimpsest -The 4 Carbon Dating Lab Reports -The 31 different Arabic Qur’ans  This is just the first and introductory episode which gets us into the many historical problems with the Qur'an.  It is obvious when we compare the Bible with the Qur'an that we don't make the same claims concerning our Bible that the Muslims make concerning their Qur'an.   Yet, because the Muslims make such amazingly wild claims about the Qur'an's authority, we then can easily investigate each of them, and ascertain whether any of their claims can be supported historically. As you will soon find out, none of them can.  Join us in this first of a 9-part series on the many historical problems with the Qur'an.  



© Pfander Centre for Apologetics, 2018 (16,600)