13 episodes

And The Next Thing You Know is a podcast about how our lives go exactly not as we planned them. No matter how hard we cling to our plans for college and career and relationships and creative goals, it's actually the disruptions in our lives, the wrenches and the tangents, that throw us in a different direction and force us to inhabit these beautiful, messy, trauma filled, disappointing, gorgeous, sexy lives, despite ourselves. Find us, and host Suzie Sherman, at nextthingpodcast.com; nextthingpod on fb, gmail, & patreon; soozenextthing on insta & twitter.

Banana peel by Max Ronnersjö. Theme and interstitial music Jon Schwartz.

And The Next Thing You Know Suzie Sherman

    • Society & Culture
    • 4.8 • 34 Ratings

And The Next Thing You Know is a podcast about how our lives go exactly not as we planned them. No matter how hard we cling to our plans for college and career and relationships and creative goals, it's actually the disruptions in our lives, the wrenches and the tangents, that throw us in a different direction and force us to inhabit these beautiful, messy, trauma filled, disappointing, gorgeous, sexy lives, despite ourselves. Find us, and host Suzie Sherman, at nextthingpodcast.com; nextthingpod on fb, gmail, & patreon; soozenextthing on insta & twitter.

Banana peel by Max Ronnersjö. Theme and interstitial music Jon Schwartz.

    Dana Morrigan Sings in Her Own Voice

    Dana Morrigan Sings in Her Own Voice

    Photo credit: Tristan Crane, from their series Here Portraits.hereportraits.com

    Today, I talk with Dana Morrigan, wonderful human, wry wit, queer nonbinary transfeminine spoken word artist, writer, performer, and epic karaoke host! It’s about her quest for self-knowledge across many parts of her life: in her cultural affiliations, in her work, in her relationships, in her gender and sexuality, in finding her creative callings. And the through-line is really that the process of finding ourselves is lifelong, and, if you’re doing it right, you can help other people find themselves, too.

    We talked about: growing up in the Catskills of the ‘60s and ‘70s; identifying with cultural outlaws like Tiny Tim and Harpo Marx, and identifying with genderfluid and sexually free hippy culture; we talked comedy and improv; performance; writing, both creatively and professionally; copywriting; the demands of academia; heteronormative relationship expectations; gender and sexual discovery; finding the language to better understand oneself; the lifelong project of integrating one’s sense of self and belonging; finding and creating community; queer and trans performance; queer open mic; karaoke…and so many other things!

    Find Dana!Karaoke With Dana on Facebook@KaraokeWithDana on Instagram and @KaraokeWithDana on Twitter


    Henny Youngmanwikipedia.org/wiki/Henny_Youngman

    Tiny Timwikipedia.org/wiki/Tiny_Tim_(musician)

    Melville’s Bartleby, The Scrivenerwikipedia.org/wiki/Bartleby,_the_Scrivener

    Walter Sobchak doesn’t roll on Shabbosyoutube.com/watch?v=KmULYr1nsZ0

    Bob and Ray radio showswikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_and_Ray

    One of the main open mic events Dana performed at was The SF Queer Open Mic. They no longer hold events, but you can still find the community on Facebookfacebook.com/SFQueerOpenMicAnd at the SF Queer Open Mic archivequeeropenmic.com

    Dana also participated in the Fresh Meat Festival of Trans and Queer Performance freshmeatproductions.org

    El Rio in San Franciscoelriosf.com

    Glen Campbell performing “Rhinestone Cowboy”youtube.com/watch?v=8kAU3B9Pi_U

    Johnny Cash performing “A Boy Named Sue,” written by the great Shel Silversteinyoutube.com/watch?v=WOHPuY88Ry4

    At the very end of the episode,

    • 1 hr 26 min
    I Was a Conservative Christian. Now, I’m a Polytheist Clown Nun.

    I Was a Conservative Christian. Now, I’m a Polytheist Clown Nun.

    Kurt Granzow came into himself as a gay man at the same time that he found conservative Lutheranism in the San Francisco Bay Area in the early 90s. What came next was a decade of communion and pursuit of ministry within the church, all the while denying his own need to express his true sexuality and capacities for an authentic kind of personal, queer love in his life. He’s spent the last two decades finding queer and spiritual community outside the church, and is now also known as Sister Krissy Fiction of the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence, an international order of queer nuns promelgating universal joy and expiating stigmatic guilt!

    We talked about:

    Coming out in the early 90s; conservative Christianity and Lutheranism; conservative Christian theology; the so-called “ex-gay” movement; LGBTQ parents; pressure in the church toward heterosexual marriage; missionary travel; being closeted; September 11; Portland, Oregon; exploring liberal Christianity and paganism, neo-paganism; the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence; gay and trans Pride; examining and leveraging white cis privilege to work against oppression of people of color and trans folks. 

    References: Why Morrissey is a dicktheguardian.com/music/2019/may/30/bigmouth-strikes-again-morrissey-songs-loneliness-shyness-misfits-far-right-party-tonight-show-jimmy-fallonA good summary of how J.K. Rowling confirmed her commitment to trans exclusionforbes.com/sites/dawnstaceyennis/2019/12/19/jk-rowling-comes-out-as-a-terf/?sh=407c94275d70Crystal Frasier on Twittertwitter.com/AmazonChique

    The downfall of Exodus International, and the “ex-gay” movementtime.com/3065495/9-ex-leaders-of-the-gay-conversion-therapy-movement-apologize

    The Sisters of Perpetual Indulgencethesisters.orgThe Radical Faeries – a history of the Faeries by one of the co-founders, Don Kilhefnerwehoville.com/2020/04/07/the-radical-faeries-at-40-rainbow-capitalism-or-queer-liberationThe Trevor Project resources for LGBTQIAA youth and adult alliesthetrevorproject.org/resources

    Correction, for historicity’s sake, The LGBT group in 1990-1992, at De Anza College in Cupertino, California,

    • 1 hr 41 min
    Misfortunes Quote-Unquote

    Misfortunes Quote-Unquote

    When I pitched my guest, Shawn, about coming onto the show, my original idea was just talking to her about her career change from being a lawyer to becoming a psychotherapist. She counter-pitched me a story that I couldn’t resist.She said, and I’m paraphrasing, “Let me tell you about that time I drank from a lucky fountain.” And from here our story departs. This conversation is about several consequential events in Shawn’s life. The subjects are emotionally heavy, but there is so much joy and levity and emotional wisdom that Shawn brings to her story. This conversation just glows. Main themes:psychology, therapy, mental health, spirituality, travel, family, queer families, parenting, pregnancy, abortion, grief, adoption, adoptee experience, career path, queer, lgbt, lgbtqqia, Bay Area, Hawaii, Spain, relationships.References:The fountain at Covadongahttps://bit.ly/fountain7Shawn’s Your Fellow Traveler page: https://bit.ly/round1part1Psychology and spiritual frameworks referenced in the episode: attachment theorycognitive behavioral therapypsychodynamic approach Wilhelm Reich/Reichian psychotherapycore shamanismDiamond ApproachJudith Blackstone* * * * *We are And The Next Thing You Know. Thank you to ALL my patrons, and especially my Failure & Redemption level patrons: Bonita, Barry, Liz, Jen, Melissa, Noah, Elyse, Amy, Jeannie, and Heather, and my Serendipity level patrons: Dorian, Emily and Brittany.Our official HQ is at: https://nextthingpodcast.comJoin the discussion at: https://www.facebook.com/nextthingpod/Email us, or send us your own And The Next Thing You Know story by recording a voice memo on your phone and emailing it to:nextthingpod@gmail.comSupport the show by becoming a patron!https://patreon.com/nextthingpodBanana peel by Max Ronnersjö.http://maxronnersjo.tumblr.comTheme and interstitial music by Jon Schwartz.http://twitter.com/schwartstack. 

    • 1 hr 37 min
    A Cruisible of Sorts with Amelia Ray

    A Cruisible of Sorts with Amelia Ray

    *I was oblivious to the pun when I said it in the episode!

    Today’s episode marks the one-year anniversary of the podcast! I posted the very first episode in September, 2019, way back in the Before Times. I feel really proud of And The Next Thing You Know, and I’m so, so grateful for everyone who’s listening, and for all your support and love and retweets and telling your friends about the show, and for supporting us at Patreon, and for just being here with me in these extraordinary times. If you’re new to the podcast, welcome! If you’re an old friend of the show, thanks for sticking with us. 

    Today, I talk to Amelia Ray. Amelia is a musician based in Helsinki, and before that, San Francisco, and before that, Reykjavík, and before that, many many other ports of call. We talk about the circumstances that led her to become an avid traveler and eventually a performer aboard tropical cruise ships. 

    You never know when a three-hour tour could become a way of life…hashtag Gilligan’s Island, hashtag popculture references for old people. You’ll hear a few more of those in this episode. You’ll also get to hear Amelia sing her song “Constant Traveller,” recorded live during our conversation.

    Amelia is the creator of the Quarantuned Music Festival, the variety show Up, Up, and A Ray, and the MashUpheaval podcast, an all-request show wherein she dunks your chocolate in her peanut butter to create a tasty new blend of musical delights. 

    Find Amelia at

    AmeliaRayDotNetCatch the Up, Up, and A Ray show at

    upupandaray.comSubscribe to the MashUpheaval podcast wherever you listen to podcasts. 


    Support Amelia on Patreon at 



    Amelia’s got new singles in the hopper, so do drop by amelia ray dot net for updates!


    Major themes


    How we’re holding up during the COVID crisis, feelings about the Black Lives Matter uprising in the wake of George Floyd’s murder, travel to other countries, being a working musician, the process of creating music projects and uplifting others’ work, playing music on cruise ships, yacht rock, mental health, family and relationships.




    Comic and podcaster Lauren Flans



    Illustrator Patrick Strausshttps://www.instagram.com/pesdrawings/


    Family Tradition by Hank Williams, Jr.



    Global Giving: Coronavirus Relief Fund


    • 1 hr 29 min
    The Real Drug Was Checking Out.

    The Real Drug Was Checking Out.

    In this episode, I talk to my guest, Cisco, about how being sober isn’t just about not drinking booze. Cisco’s exploration of sobriety is no less than a spiritual quest, and it’s a daily examination of how he can be of better service not just to himself, but to the people in his life. We get into the weeds of his story by way of work pressures, sex clubs, racism, trauma, queer bar culture, and yeah, I figure out a way to squeeze in a reference to late stage capitalism in this episode too, if you’re keeping track. Cisco is a designer, a writer, a musician, and a human. Content warning for this episode – we talk about family sexual abuse. We also talk about youth sexuality, public sex, drugs, alcohol, and recovery.A correction: the “parable” I refer to about walking down a road and falling into a hole turns out to be a 1994 poem by Portia Nelson, titled “Autobiography in Five Short Chapters.” My apologies for not crediting her in the episode. You can find the poem by googling it, and here’s a cute, short video illustrating it:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSCA0EWR2REMajor themes: self-care, psychology, spirituality, sobriety, harm reduction, sexuality, othering and being othered, LGBTQQI culture, alcohol and drug use.

    We are And The Next Thing You Know. Subscribe in your podcast app, and tell your friends about the show on your social media with the hashtag #nextthingpod. Thank you to all our Patrons for making this show better! And special thanks to our Serendipity level Patrons, Emily, Brittany, and Dorian. 3 #nextthingpodRate or review us at iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/and-the-next-thing-you-know/id1478818695?mt=2&app=podcastSponsor the show at:https://patreon.com/nextthingpod

    Join the conversation at nextthingpod on Facebook.http://facebook.com/nextthingpodFind me, at soozenextthing on Instagram and Twitter. Send us your And The Next Thing You Know story. Just record a voice message on your phone, and email it to nextthingpod at gmail dot com. We might talk to you for an upcoming show!Check out our beautiful website where you can find all the episodes, full transcripts, and all the ways to participate in the #nextthingpod community. nextthingpodcast.comThe banana peel is by Max Ronnersjö. Music is by Jon Schwartz.

    • 1 hr 50 min
    Julia Serano Likes Scare Quotes

    Julia Serano Likes Scare Quotes

    Julia Serano is the author of the nonfiction books Whipping Girl, Excluded and Outspoken. She also just published a work of fiction called 99 Erics: a Kat Cataclysm faux novel. But wait, there’s more! She’s a biologist. She’s an activist. She’s a musician. And as you will be reminded in this conversation, Julia Serano is a “Notable Feminist Theorist.” And I’m putting that in, as she might say, “scare quotes.” 

    Julia sat down with me to talk about how her life changed in three surprising ways in the wake of her gender transition, but not because she transitioned. She became a writer, a feminist theorist, and she became more confrontational, sometimes even “bombastic,” rather than a person who just wanted to smooth things over. We also talk about Rush.Find Julia!juliaserano.commedium.com/@juliaseranopatreon.com/juliaseranosoftvowelsounds dot comWe are And The Next Thing You Know.Thank you to all our amazing Patrons, and a particular hat tip to Serendipity level contributors Brittany, Emily, and Dorian. If you give at any level, there’s extra good stuff at patreon.com/nextthingpodI’m still looking for your stories about how COVID-19 is changing your life. How are you feeling? How are you coping? Have you or someone you love been directly affected? If you want to share your thoughts, record a short voice memo on your phone, and email it to nextthingpod at gmail dot com.Find us at: nextthingpodcast.com nextthingpod : fb • gmail • patreonFind me, Suzie Sherman, at:soozenextthing : insta • twitterThe banana peel is by Max Ronnersjö.maxronnersjo.tumblr.comThe music by Jon Schwartz.twitter.com/schwartstack

    • 1 hr 32 min

Customer Reviews

4.8 out of 5
34 Ratings

34 Ratings

DStevensPDX ,

Heartfelt, honest storytelling

Relatable people telling the stories of the twisty paths of their lives. It's a window into the ways that each of our lives is unique despite the apparent similarities. As the stories unfold it becomes very clear how the person sharing was shaped by the events that led them where they are.

Suzie's interview style is gentle but just probing enough to turn over stones. Delightful!

Kahlikai007X ,


I enjoyed Nannette’s episode as a student and admirer of death in all its many manifestations ( currently working on a book ). I have never heard of a death doula but it totally makes sense . I might want to talk about dying with Nannette myself !
I am also at a fork in the career path - in contemplation of a minor tweek to my long term path out of need for more job satisfaction and joy and time to think . I’m a woman of a zillion jobs too and I can relate and also find myself inspired at a time where other people’s reaction to the possibility I am working on has been less than .
Thanks Suz!

Coatimundi1 ,

So good

Suzie does such good interviews. The Janessa episode brought tears to my eyes and made me laugh. So good.

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