A podcast about racial justice, anti-racism, and racial reconciliation. This podcast provides opportunities for white people to develop greater understanding and responsibility regarding race and racism. We bring you conversations and resources with a wide-range of experts and leaders. Hosted by psychologists Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck.
When You Say (Kind of) Racist Stuff, but Don't Mean To
It can be confusing and challenging for white folks who don’t see themselves as racist to acknowledge the subtle, and not-so-subtle, ways we exhibit racial biases and stereotypical thinking. This can be true even for people who are in close relationships with people of color and committed to being anti-racist.
In episode 12, Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck talk about racial microaggressions and the research of Chinese-American psychologist, Dr. Derald Wing Sue. Along the way they delve into the emotional process of taking responsibility to unlearn racial microaggressions in our own lives – a difficult and humbling experience, but hopefully transformative one as well.
Recommended resources for episode 12 (click on links provided):
Racial Microaggressions in Everyday Life by Derald Wing Sue.
How microaggressions are like mosquito bites (video: language warning)
Approaching Polarized Discussions About Racism
How can I get through to people who see things so differently than me? What if I lose all my credibility and influence?
These are questions we commonly hear, and have asked ourselves many times, when it comes to talking about race and racism. In episode 11, Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck discuss ways to approach these often polarized discussions in a pro-active, strategic, and relational manner. They also explore the importance of building coalitions in order to be effective and sustain this work for the long haul. They wrap up this episode emphasizing the need for humility and a willingness to take risks (with a few co-hosting bumps along the way).
Resources discussed in episode 11 (click on links provided):
Despair is Not a Strategy: 15 principles of hope
The Line of Dismissal: Pt. 1
“There’s at least one thing I know for sure: I am going to need allies in this fight. Isolation guarantees my ineffectiveness. Conversely, being part of a posse, however small, makes me harder to dismiss. So I commit to building a community of fellow rebels as I map my lines of dismissal.” -Abraham Lateiner
Fact check: Immigration doesn't bring crime to U.S., data say
*Our apologizes, in advance, to Abraham Lateiner whose anti-racism work we discuss in this episode. We realize we pronounced his last name wrong without any semblance of consistency.
Facing Our History. A Conversation with Allison Thomas
In episode 10, Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck talk with Allison Thomas about her passion for researching her ancestors who were enslavers dating back to the 17th century in Virginia. Allison shares her family’s legacy, with humility and emotional honesty. She also discusses how racial healing can only occur if we are willing to tell the truth and face our history as European Americans and the ongoing impact of slavery in our country.
Allison Thomas’ Bio:
Allison Thomas is a partner in Larger Than Life Productions and is currently producing for theater, film, and television. Allison produced the CG-animated movie, The Tale of Despereaux, executive produced Seabiscuit, and co-produced Pleasantville.
Allison also headed a public relations company specializing in technology start-up companies. Clients included Steve Jobs’ NeXT Computer, Pixar, and RealAudio. Prior to that, Allison worked in the public sector for President Jimmy Carter, Governor Jerry Brown, and Senator Alan Cranston.
Allison serves on the steering committee of the Southern California chapter of Coming to the Table, a national organization that provides leadership and resources for healing the wounds of racism rooted in slavery. Allison has also served on the boards of the USC School of Dramatic Arts, Oakwood School, and the California Women’s Law Center (co-chair), among others and was Los Angeles Public Library Commissioner for Mayor Richard Riordan. In 2004 The California Women’s Law Center honored Allison with their Pursuit of Justice Award.
Use of the term "enslaved people"
You may have noticed the term “enslaved people” was used in this episode rather than the word “slaves.” Here’s a brief article that speaks to the importance of using language that humanizes rather than dehumanizes others. Link here.
Resources discussed in episode 10 (click on links provided):
Coming to the Table
White Rage. The Unspoken Truth of Our Racial Divide
Sometimes There are More Important Goals Than Civility
The Luxury of Obliviousness
Additional resources Allison recommended for our listeners:
Witnessing Whiteness. The Need to Talk About Race and How to Do It
White Like Me: Reflections on Race from a Privileged Son
How Do You Share a Podcast for White People? Very Carefully
Sharing a podcast about race and racism is one thing. But when it’s specifically for white people, not surprisingly, there’s a lot of uncertainty about how to recommend this podcast to white friends and family. In episode 9, Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck offer some suggestions and challenges for how to help spread the word about the podcast, mindful of the sensitivity that often surrounds white people and racism.
Danielle also talks about a recent brush with podcast “fame” and Brandy cracks jokes about it the rest of the episode (minus the previously mentioned sensitivity).
Facing Ourselves' website
Brandy's blog about "repurposed space" for white people
1st Steps to Becoming Actively Anti-Racist
In Beverly Daniel Tatum’s well-known book, Why Are All the Black Kids Sitting Together in the Cafeteria? she makes a helpful distinction between being actively racist, passively racist, and actively anti-racist. Unlearning racial implicit (unconscious) bias is an important step towards becoming actively anti-racist in one’s identity and way of life. In episode 8, Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck explore what research tells us about unlearning biases and how to apply it in our daily lives.
This episode is a follow-up to episode 7, entitled Are All White People Racist? (No. Well, kinda of. Let us explain). In episode 7 Brandy and Danielle focus on what implicit bias is and how it can impact us in ways we don’t realize. In order to get the most out of episode 8 we recommend you listen first to episode 7.
Resources discussed in episode 8:
How to Tell Someone They Sound Racist
How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love Discussing Race
Blindspot: Hidden Biases of Good People
Can Science Help People Unlearn Their Unconscious Biases?
Online training program for white people committed to racial justice
30+ Resources to Help White Americans Learn about Race and Racism
Are All White People Racist? (No. Well, kind of. Let us explain.)
In order to try and answer that question you need to understand the difference between prejudice and racism, know what systemic racism is, and be aware of implicit racial bias. All of which, Drs. Brandy Liebscher and Danielle Beck talk about in episode 7.
Because this episode takes a more instructional approach, it’s been divided into two parts. In part 1, Brandy talks about racism vs. prejudice, systemic racism, and the importance of being actively anti-racist (even if you’re not overtly racist, which we hope you are not!). And in part 2, Danielle provides an in-depth, research-based explanation of implicit racial bias and how it impacts our daily lives.
An upcoming episode will focus on how to unlearn racial biases in our own lives.
Resources discussed in episode 7:
Rev. Traci Blackmon on showing up as an ally
Why Are All the Black Kids Sitting Together in the Cafeteria?: And Other Discussions About Race
What is Systemic Racism?
Is Reverse Racism a Thing?
Krista Tippet’s interview with Mahzarin Banaji
Review of Beverly Tatum’s book
Kirwan Institute for the Study of Race and Ethnicity
Blindspot: Hidden Biases of Good People
Customer ReviewsSee All
Love it, very needed
I just started listening to some of the episodes and already love it. It’s very constructive, enlightening, empowering, & necessary. The resources are so helpful as a European American trying to become anti racist and to raise a child as such. Thanks for making this show!
I appreciate very much these ideas and the support for White people who want to wake up and actively engage in anti- racism! I wish there were more episodes
I’ve learned so much
An informative conversation about racism between 2 friends and psychologists/educators. They do a great job balancing the the heavy issues with the lightness of their friendship. I appreciate their passion, knowledge and ability to communicate about this material in a time when I feel many are waking up. But there needs to be many more!