天文播‪客‬ 中研院天文所的天文播客

這裡沒有張惠妹的歌「站在高崗上」提到的綠波海茫茫，在這裡只有黃土茫茫，而且缺氧。
由天文所主導之為阿塔卡瑪大型毫米及次毫米波陣列（簡稱”ALMA”）研發的「第一頻段接收機」於2016年被採用，並已於2021年開始接受訊號，聽聽科學家如何努力的刻服惡劣環境，堅持至今。努力工作時，又看到了哪些有趣的動物呢？且聽分曉。

背景音樂由 audionautix.com 提供

數月之後，隨著一座最新太空望遠鏡的發射升空，由天文學家精心設計的觀測計畫也將在離地球150萬公里的太空中開始付諸實踐，到底會發現什麼？仰望星空，令人引頸期待。其中的一份觀測計畫，是來自臺灣中研院天文所博士後研究 Dr. Sascha Zeegers（諸葛沙夏）團隊的提案。
本集節目中，沙夏要告訴我們，她為什麼醉心投入宇宙塵埃這個研究主題、她的期待與展望；不可少的，也聊一下這個大家已經等了20年的韋伯太空望遠鏡，可以用來做什麼。

本集內容為英語。
背景音樂由 audionautix.com 提供

Transcription:
Welcome to the Astronomy Podcast produced by Academia Sinica Institute of Astronomy and Astrophysics

I am show host of today, Lauren Huang. And, we are having our postdoc fellow Dr. Sascha Zeegers here with us. Hi, Sascha, we know that a space telescope is going to be launched into the space later this year, and, you're one of those who got the observation time to use it. Would you please explain for us what is this telescope aiming to do?
Thank you Lauren.
So the James Webb Telescope, which we also call JWST or Webb for short, will be the largest telescope that we ever send into Space. The whole telescope will be roughly as large as a tennis court. The mirror is 6.5 m in diameter. This telescope will be launched in October of this year. Because it is such a big telescope with very sensitive instruments it can observe things we have never been able to see before. We may be able to observe the atmospheres of exoplanets, look inside clouds of gas and dust and observe how stars are born. We can also look at the youngest, most far away galaxies in the universe and learn a lot more about the history of the universe.

Is it going to replace HST?
So I guess the answer to that is yes and no. We often compare this telescope to the Hubble space telescope, but the two telescopes are actually quite different. JWST is an infrared telescope, so it looks at the universe at a longer or redder wavelength. Hubble is more optimized at the wavelength where our eyes can see and the ultraviolet. This longer wavelength enables JWST to look inside molecular clouds to see how stars are born and it can explore the early universe and the youngest galaxies further. Hubble is still an amazing telescope though and to make our observations more complete over the spectrum we also requested time to observe with Hubble.

How long will this JWST telescope fly…?
We are usually cautious to say what the lifespan of the telescope will be, since we don't exactly know. Things may go wrong, although very often space telescopes operate far longer than expected. Hubble has been flying for around 30 years already.
We think that JWST should be able to operate for some time between 5.5 to 10 years and perhaps longer. It is certainly shorter than Hubble, since the mission is limited by the supply of hydrazine fuel needed to maintain the spacecraft’s orbit. It will also operate much further from Earth (1.5 million km), so unlike what was done with Hubble, we can't just go to the telescope and fix things which are not working properly. That is why people have done long and extensive tests on JWST from Earth.

How many people from Taiwan are involved in the proposals that that got the selected time of this round so there are three proposals from people in Taiwan that got accepted so one of them is someone from another university so not from our institute from ASIAA. But within ASIAA we have two people who are the principal investigator of a project so there are two different projects. And the project I work on and I'm the principal investigator of, there are two other people also working at ASIAA, Jointy Marshall and Ciska Kemper who are also involved in this project. It's called co-investigators.
So, you're leading the team? I'm reading the team yeah.

I heard some people said that the competition for th

"地球並不孤單，地球／太陽也不只我們這一組。"這情境，現代人都一清二楚，並不稀奇，但哲學家伊比鳩魯和鄧牧，早分別在西元前3百年和中國的元代都已想到過了，那可算是真厲害。至於，製作出一台望遠鏡來放眼向太空瞭望看看，那就比較更近代一點，已經是第17世紀的事了。
中研院天文所的 Dr. Gilles Otten 幫大家整理這段太陽系外行星從哲學走到科學之路。並解說為什麼非要用望遠鏡直接地看到單一行星不可，理由何在？到底有多難呢？目前為止有哪些技術困難已克服？最大的光學望遠鏡現在蓋到哪兒了？何時能啟用？聽說臺灣也有幫忙貢獻，是嗎？

本集內容為英語。

In this episode, Dr. Otten very briefly summarized how people thought about the issue of "planets around other stars" since millenniums ago.
Also, he will tell us, who firstly coined the word "exoplanet"? Is it easy or hard to discover exoplanets?
What are the challenges needed to be solved in order to photograph exoplanets?
What technical terms like Diffraction limit, Adaptive Optics and Coronagraph actually mean?
What are the current status of the biggest telescopes? Does Taiwan play a role?

Transcribe:
Welcome to Astronomy Podcast produced by Academia Sinica Institute of Astronomy and Astrophysics, or A-S-I-A-A, "ASIA A", a shorten name. Today’s show host: Lauren Huang. We are having Dr. Gilles Otten with us. Gilles is working for ASIAA, in Taiwan, helps building one of the world’s biggest telescope, and today he will tell us about Direct imaging exoplanet around another star. Hi, Gilles, thank you for coming in the middle of a pandemic.

Thank you.

Well, let's start the show! First question, since a long time ago people have thought about planets around other stars. Indeed a long, interesting history about discovering. Important questions we asked and always still want to ask. Gilles, how about… a summarization?
Sure. So there are a lot of written examples of philosophers who have wondered about the existence of planets around other stars. So, for instance, in the third century BC there was a Greek philosopher named Epicurus （伊比鳩魯）who thought there would be an unlimited amount of worlds and even in the 13th century there were philosophers such as the Chinese philosopher Deng Mu (鄧牧) who said it would be unreasonable to assume that there are no other worlds beyond our own. So this is uh…, it sounds almost like science fiction if you look back at it. And some of these philosophers even speculated about life on other planets. But now in the present day with the modern science we can of course form more structured questions than they ever could, like: is the role, the position of our earth unique or eventually we can probably answer this ultimate question whether there's life on other planets using scientific methods, which of course these philosophers never had.
Right, when did modern astronomers start responding to all of these questions and, what did they do?
So only after the first telescopes were invented in the early 17th century things really started to become more scientific. So just -I think- a few years or maybe even in the year after they invented the telescope Galileo Galilei discovered the first moons orbiting Jupiter and seeing this miniature solar system almost orbiting as if it was a tiny solar system like our own. It kind of validated the earlier philosophical comments. So yeah when you realize the earth and its moon are not really in a unique situation, you can really believe that all stars could have planets on their own and of course it didn't stop people from philosophizing, even scientists they can philosophize, but through the invention of this first telescope the first steps were made to this modern astronomy and the eventual discovery of exoplanets only 30 years ago.

So, who invented this word “exoplanet”? Which

唐朝詩人李白在「將進酒」中豪氣高歌：「黃河之水天上來」，敢問詩仙是否知道，天外之水都從何處來？
缺水令人愁，積水令人憂，水資源是民生大事，不僅如此，水還是科學家已知能用來判斷遙遠星球有無可能孕造出生命的重要指標，本集歡迎大家一起來多多認識：我們的水！

多年來用地面及太空望遠鏡詳細追蹤「星際水之旅」的天文學家 Daniel Harsono （漢字姓名：何英宏 ） ，在本集中為我們談「水」話題。
究極探討水在星際空間中不同條件下的不同分布量，科學一點一滴取得進展，從天文的光譜觀測獲知化學成分豐度，綜合天文物理的已知，目前所得的最新結論是，行星形成的過程可能很快。
最近Daniel 難能可貴的申請到競爭激烈的「韋伯太空望遠鏡」的觀測時間，到底他想用太空望遠鏡觀測什麼呢？他覺得那東西很重要的理由有哪些？請聽他的分享。

本集節目為英語。
逐字稿：
Welcome to Astronomy Podcast produced by Academia Sinica Institute of Astronomy and Astrophysics, I am Lauren Huang ~ So happy to have Dr. Daniel Harsono here with us today. Daniel is one of the guys who were awarded James Web Space Telescope time, or, the other way to put it, the time allows you to make observation using this very powerful space telescope, acronym JWST. A telescope people have been waiting for for 20 years. Totally, three projects submitted from Taiwan got the green light, and Daniel leads one of them. After graduated from the UCLA in America, Daniel moved to Netherlands and obtained master and PhD degrees from the Leiden University. Hi Daniel, is it right that Leiden is a world leading school especially famous for its astronomy department?
Very famous in terms of history(s), yes. Yes a lot of famous astronomers are from Leiden, but they have very famous law faculty and also physics department.
Right, we are going to talk about, again, the JWST telescope. Last time we interviewed Sascha Ziggers about the same topic, would you please tell us again what is this telescope aims to do?
So JWST is James Webb Space Telescope it is the next generation optical or infrared of after Hubble Space Telescope. So Hubble Space Telescopes maps the sky in the optical domain that's the same wavelength that human eyes can see but the James Webb Space Telescope will focus mostly in the infrared so that's the regions where human eyes cannot see and by moving to the infrared you can see cooler objects so much younger and much more distant than what Hubble can see. So with the James Webb Space Telescope, for example, you can study more of the first stars and the very distant universe and then also because James Webb is very sensitive you can try to see the dust features that are present in the infrared.
Right. By the way, which subjects were you best at? Math? Physics? Chemistry?
I think from my background it was mostly mathematics so yes it was mostly mathematics
And that helps a lot in doing astronomical research?
For astronomy what the interest me the most was black holes and neutron stars so that was the reason why i went to UCLA but in the end I did not study them. But yes! Math is helped a lot but i think in the end i was much better at doing programming rather than pure mathematics.
You've won the JWST observation time at the first cycle right? are you doing a "mapping" related project?
Yeah that's correct. Our proposal is to map so-called jet launching region. This is the region where young protostars try to release a lot of its energy so when a young star born a lot of material is ejected from the young star and this is in form of a jet or an outlaw and previous instruments have difficulties in mapping this hot region near the young star where the material is launched so ALMA does not actually gives you a really full picture of the jet launching region. So this is where uh JWST wi

能源及環保問題，是近來最夯的議題，本集中，中央研究院天文所的陳英同博士以三個正在進行的科學研究（太陽能、太空採礦、核融合發電）來介紹，由天文學所衍生出來的科學，如何可以商業應用，以期達到創造能源及減少污染。

背景音樂由Jamendo提供。

逐字稿：

各位好，您現在所收聽的是由中央研究院天文所所製作的節目：天文播客。

我們今天邀請到天文所的陳英同陳博士，來跟我們談一下，簡談如何運用現代的天文學，創造或節省更多的能源，歡迎陳博士。

其實天文學是一個非常古老的科學，物理在最之前也是從天文學開始演進過來。天文學這麽古老的科學如果在現代，由其大家對能源都很關心的當下，能夠提供一些幫助。

我們今天其實在時間有限的條件底下，我們簡談主要三樣東西就好了。

第一個是太陽能，第二個是近幾年非常有趣的一個行業，叫太空採礦，第三個是也非常敏感的發電方式，叫核發電。

我們先講第一個太陽能發電的部份。

太陽能在我們太陽系裡面的能源，以我們的壽命來講是取之不盡、用之不竭。

那它最主要的來源，當然是來自於太陽的輻射，那其實跟等一下要講的核能有很大的關係，只是目前在地球上所用的太陽能，是想辦法收集一些電磁波轉換成能源。

太陽能發展經很長一段時間了，已經你說從最早開始有電，直到做出來的目前商用非常普及的階段，已經經歷了100多年了，最早的應用就是在太空人造衛星的部分。因為太空人造衛星需要一些固定的充電的機制，那太陽能因為在太空中，其實沒有什麼遮蔽物，所以是一個最好的方式。

當然是除了帶上去的核能之外的最好的方式。

那我們先不要講說的很先進的，先講很普級的部份，天文其在這部分的幫助其實蠻大的，其實我們都知道太陽東升西落每天、每個小時、每分鐘都在不一樣的地點，其實你太陽能板如何調整到一個對的位置去接收太陽能，就變成一個很重要的議題。

雖然它需要相對應比較多的成本，可是我們只要投入這些成本之後，我們每一天，只要你是一個固定式，像台灣中南部非常常見的太陽能板，那是固定式的太陽能板，跟移動式的太陽能板的話，每一天接受到的能源，那可能可以差到一倍。

那這部分當然需要更多的就是研究讓整個成本降低之後，不管是製造的材質啊、或者是整個機構後面設計，在天文方面是可以提供很好的幫助。

那第二個部分就是講太空採礦。

那我們都知道目前不管是台灣或者全世界，在用電上面，工業用電其實佔了將近一半的比例，其實是非常非常的高。

那當然有人提到說，工業的污染降低或者能夠提供一些能源，想辦法製造更多能源給工業用，這些都是有種在挖東牆補西牆的概念。

其實太空採礦是做太陽系研究，當初算是意想不到的一個議題，我們後來發現在太陽系裡面有很多小行星存在很多礦物，包含碳、鐵、一些稀土元素，比地球上來講的話，開採相對的簡單不少。

當然有一些技術的限制，因為在太空中，跟我們現在技術比較算是新的技術，是有待開發的部份。但現在其實美國已經存在是3間、4間以上的公司，正在朝這個地方邁進。

為什麼這個太空採礦的項目對於地球上的能源有蠻大的關係度，假如我們能夠把這些重工業移到太空中，那太空中可以用大型太陽能板直接供電，沒什麼遮蔽物、沒有東升西落的問題，所以只要太陽能板不壞掉的話，工業用電上是沒有什麼太大的問題。

我們能夠把這些耗能的移到太空中的

本集的核心問題，不知道你有沒有想過？
怎樣在一片漆黑的宇宙裡確認一個黑黑的東西存在呢？

本集請到中研院天文所助研究員陳建州，簡單解釋一下「怎麼知道那裏有黑洞」的三種辦法。
投入天文研究也講究入場時機，陳建州的物理系是在台灣台大念的，後來去夏威夷，英國，德國，從事一種全地球人都覺得好浪漫的工作：看星星！（＝研究天文），主要領域在星系方面。
目前行情看好的是什麼研究呢？難不成……就是黑洞？
陳老師爽朗分享他的生涯選擇之道

快速瀏覽內容：
• (01:28) - 先講一下，到底什麼是黑洞，他黑的原因是什麼
• (02:31) - 「到黑洞家門口拜訪以求確認他在不在家」…並非不可能，但是……
• (03:07) - 哪一天真的可以到黑洞附近的話，會看到這景象
• (03:21) - 證明那邊是有黑洞的存在的第一種方式是，觀察黑洞附近恆星的繞行軌道
• (04:22) - 但這只能來看銀河系中心的黑洞
• (04:33) - 介紹「重力波」，是第二種辦法
• (05:46) - 第三種辦法是靠黑洞附近的熱氣體
• (06:15) - 黑洞附近看起來會好像一個甜甜圈
• (07:15) - 地球一樣大的望遠鏡…
• (07:26) - 有機會得諾貝爾物理獎，不是夢
• (08:22) - 現在投資是可以的

完整逐字稿放在：https://sites.google.com/asiaa.sinica.edu.tw/podcast/2

背景音樂由 audionautix.com 提供

附註：
想看像星際效應電影裡那個黑洞轉圈圈的動畫嗎？NASA有請專門的人做好了，以超級電腦模擬黑洞的360度gif影片，請參考NASA的網站：https://svs.gsfc.nasa.gov/13326
想更多認識中研院天文所參與黑洞觀測用的是哪些望遠鏡嗎？臺灣對史上首張黑洞影像貢獻了什麼 和 十問格陵蘭 這兩個小網頁可以滿足你的小好奇
TC 聊黑洞，也有英文版：How do you know there is a black hole? 有更多細節和投影片！感謝 TC！