Original Jurisdiction David Lat

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One of the most consequential developments of the last Supreme Court Term was the overruling of Chevron v. Natural Resources Defense Council, Inc., the 40-year-old precedent directing courts to defer to agencies’ reasonable interpretations of ambiguous statutes. It came about through two cases: Relentless, Inc. v. Department of Commerce, argued by Roman Martinez, and Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo, argued by former U.S. solicitor general Paul Clement (a past podcast guest).
Today I’m pleased to be joined by Roman Martinez. One of the leading Supreme Court advocates of his generation, Martinez, 45, has argued 14 cases before the Court. But none has been as consequential—or controversial—as the aptly named Relentless.
How does Martinez respond to claims that Relentless will have relentlessly negative consequences for American society? We explore the implications of the overturning of Chevron—along with Martinez’s clerkships for then-Judge Kavanaugh and Chief Justice Roberts, his thoughts on the old versus new SCOTUS argument formats, his style as a Supreme Court advocate, and his “secret weapon” in preparing for high-court appearances—in the latest Original Jurisdiction podcast.
Show Notes:
* Roman Martinez bio, Latham & Watkins
* Roman Martinez profile, Chambers and Partners
* 40 Under 40: Roman Martinez, Washington Business Journal
Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below.
Sponsored by:
NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment at nexfirm dot com.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com

Are we all originalists now? Definitely not; originalism has no shortage of critics.
But as the latest Term of the U.S. Supreme Court made clear, originalism is the dominant mode of constitutional interpretation at One First Street today. As the justices debate the doctrine’s finer theoretical points, such as the proper use of history and tradition, it’s clear that the debate is no longer “originalism or not originalism,” but “which originalism” or “whose originalism.”
So it’s more important than ever to understand the originalist mindset. And if you’re looking for help on that front, I have a book recommendation: Professor Randy Barnett’s new memoir, A Life for Liberty: The Making of an American Originalist. As promised by its subtitle, the book provides excellent insight into originalism as a theory—but as an engaging and enjoyable memoir, it’s far more fun to read than any casebook or treatise.
What drew Randy Barnett to originalism? Why does he view his losses in two landmark Supreme Court cases—Gonzales v. Raich, a Commerce Clause challenge to criminalizing medical marijuana, and NFIB v. Sebelius, a nearly successful effort to topple the Affordable Care Act—as victories of a sort? Why did he decide to write a memoir—and why does he think you should, too? All this and more is revealed—on the latest episode of the Original Jurisdiction podcast.
Show Notes:
* Randy E. Barnett bio, Georgetown University Law Center
* A Life for Liberty: The Making of an American Originalist, Amazon
* Libertarianism Updated, by Randy E. Barnett for Law & Liberty
Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below.
Sponsored by:
NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment at nexfirm dot com.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com

Happy Pride—and happy June 26. As the Supreme Court hands down its final decisions of the Term over the next few days, it’s worth reflecting on how June 26 is the day the Court issued three of its landmark gay-rights decisions: Lawrence v. Texas (2003), United States v. Windsor (2013), and Obergefell v. Hodges (2015).
Obergefell was issued in 2015, the same year that my husband Zach and I got married. And I would say that we—and really all married same-sex couples in the United States—owe a debt of gratitude to my podcast guest for today: Evan Wolfson, founder of Freedom to Marry, the groundbreaking campaign that won marriage equality in the United States and ignited a global movement. Evan has garnered many awards for his work over the years, including recognition as one of the 100 most influential lawyers in America by The National Law Journal and one of the 100 most influential people in the world by Time Magazine.
What led Evan to focus his career on the fight for same-sex marriage? What was his thinking in launching Freedom to Marry? What are some secrets of the success of the marriage-equality movement? And what lessons can it offer to other struggles for social justice?
Check out our conversation to learn all this and more. Thanks to Evan for joining me—and for his decades of work in advancing marriage equality and LGBTQ rights, both in the United States and around the globe.
Show Notes:
* Evan Wolfson bio, Dentons
* What the Freedom to Marry Campaign Can Teach Middle East Peacemakers, by Evan Wolfson for U.S. News & World Report
Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below.
Sponsored by:
NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment at nexfirm dot com.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com

I’ve been honored to have some of the nation’s leading litigators on this podcast. But I have not had a guest who’s both a renowned courtroom advocate and parent of 11 children—until today.
Meet Michael Williams. After graduating from Georgetown Law, summa cum laude and first in his class, he clerked for then-Chief Judge Douglas H. Ginsburg of the D.C. Circuit and Justice Anthony M. Kennedy of the Supreme Court. Mike then joined the D.C. office of Kirkland & Ellis, where he is a share aka equity partner. He has won numerous honors and accolades over the years, recognized by Chambers and Partners, the Legal 500, and The American Lawyer, among others.
Despite his dazzling legal career, Mike is most proud of being a dad. He had his first child while still in law school, two children during his clerkships, and eight children during his time at K&E. In our conversation, we talked about his contrasting clerkship experiences; what it’s like being a litigator at Kirkland, including how the firm has evolved over the years; why at heart he’s more of a trial rather than an appellate lawyer; and most importantly, how he balances his busy practice with the demands of parenthood (although note that he’s not a fan of the term “work-life balance”).
Kudos to Mike on all his professional and personal success, and early wishes for a happy Father’s Day to him and all the other dads out there.
Show Notes:
* Michael F. Williams, P.C., Kirkland & Ellis
* Michael F. Williams profile, Chambers and Partners
* How Does He Do It? Kirkland Partner at Home With 11 Kids, by Vivia Chen for Law.com
Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below.
Sponsored by:
NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment at nexfirm dot com.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com

What’s the most widely cited legal book in the world? If you guessed Black’s Law Dictionary, then congratulate yourself. Henry Campbell Black published the first edition in 1891, and today it’s a must-have for every lawyer and law student. I even make an appearance in Black’s as the coiner of the term “benchslap,” defined as “a judge’s sharp rebuke of counsel, a litigant, or perhaps another judge.”
Who decides whether a term has gained sufficient traction to make it into Black’s? That would be Bryan Garner, the prominent legal lexicographer, lawyer, and legal-writing expert. In the latest episode of the Original Jurisdiction podcast, he explains how he and his colleagues determine whether a neologism has made the cut.
This is actually a bonus episode of the podcast, since I posted an episode last week and I’ll have another episode next week. What’s the occasion? Today marks the publication of the twelfth edition of Black’s Law Dictionary. If you’re looking for a graduation or back-to-school gift for a law student, or maybe a Father’s Day gift for a #LawDad in your life, order your copy today.
Thanks to Bryan for joining me, and congratulations to him and his team on the latest edition of Black’s Law Dictionary.
Show Notes:
* Bryan A. Garner bio, LawProse
* Black’s Law Dictionary (12th ed.), Amazon
* Black’s Law Dictionary: An Interview with Bryan A. Garner, by David Lat for Above the Law
Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below.
Sponsored by:
NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com

Continuing my M&A miniseries here at Original Jurisdiction, I wanted to welcome another dealmaker to the podcast. And as Asian American and Native Hawaiian/Pacific Islander Heritage Month draws to a close, I wanted to interview another AANHPI attorney, including some discussion of their family’s story and how their identity might have shaped their career.
So I was delighted when Paul Shim agreed to join me. A partner at Cleary Gottlieb since 1996, Paul is an established star of the M&A bar, Chambers-ranked in that elite specialty for more than two decades. And we share a few things in common: we’re both the children of Asian immigrants, we both grew up in New Jersey, and we both live in the Garden State today (in neighboring towns, in fact).
Paul’s parents immigrated to the United States after the Korean War. Following in the footsteps of his father, who holds a Ph.D. in engineering, Paul studied the subject at MIT, earning a master’s degree in chemical engineering. So how did Paul end up in M&A as opposed to, say, IP law? What skills does he credit for his success in this high-stakes, high-stress practice area? And how has his AAPI background contributed to everything from his choice of firm to his style as a dealmaker?
Listen to our conversation for the answers to these questions and more—including one of my favorite responses to the final question I pose to all my guests, a request for career or life advice. We can all benefit from Paul’s wisdom, and I’m so glad and grateful that he was able to join me.
Show Notes:
Paul Shim bio, Cleary Gottlieb Steen & Hamilton
Paul Shim profile, Chambers and Partners
Lawyer Limelight: Paul Shim, by Lawdragon
Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below.
Sponsored by:
NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.