The Market Gardener Podcast JM Fortier

In this episode we chat with David McMillan, chef, author, and co-founder of the famous Joe Beef restaurant in Montreal. David left the restaurant business in 2021 and now resides and works on his small farm, Hayfield Farm, where he is re-discovering the ‘art of living’ in the countryside. In this wide-ranging and colorful conversation we explore the power of cooking with homegrown foods, how social media is hurting regional cuisine, viticulture & natural wines, traditional French food culture, and how David has found true happiness in his new life on the farm.

PLEASE make sure to subscribe to the podcast, download our episodes, and rate them! Your support means the world to us. Thank you!



Timestamps

[4:52] Intro

[5:44] Chef's relationship with farmers

[10:49] David's background working in french kitchens

[12:25] The famed Bresse chicken

[17:27] The story of Joe Beef

[23:55] The art of living - from city chef to countryside farmer

[26:15] The joys and challenges of growing grapes and making wine

[42:16] Deer overpopulation and wild game in restaurants

[55:52] Natural wine deep dive

[57:14] Why has the craft beer movement not embraced organic agriculture?

[1:25:54] Why David is cooking the best food of his career right now at home on his farm

[1:31:23] History of food and the bread of ancient Rome

[1:32:49] Are we losing precious things in our modern culture?

[1:42:23] Is social media ruining regional cuisine?

[1:53:52] Importance of home cooking

[1:57:37] Anthony Bourdain - kitchen culture - Gen-Z vs Gen-X

[2:08:15] Finding happiness on the farm

[2:11:20] New book and TV show in the works (World's oldest restaurants?!)

[2:20:32] A History Of Food by Maguelonne Toussaint-Samat

[2:20:56] Nothing If Not Critical: Selected Essays on Art and Artists by Robert Hughes

[2:23:49] The mystery of David's grandmother's toast



Sponsors

Bootstrap Farmer https://www.bootstrapfarmer.com/ 

Tessier https://info.serres-guytessier.com/en/tessier-mgi10

Use promocode MGI10 for 10% off and free shipping on your first purchase for the Eastern North American regions (Ontario, the Maritimes, and the states of Vermont, Maine, New York, and New Hampshire).

Links/Resources

Market Gardener Institute:  https://themarketgardener.com/ 

Masterclass:  https://themarketgardener.com/courses/the-market-gardener-masterclass/ 

Newsletter:  https://themarketgardener.com/newsletter

Blog:  https://themarketgardener.com/blog 

Books: https://themarketgardener.com/books

Growers & Co: https://growers.co/

Heirloom: https://heirloom.ag/

The Old Mill: https://www.espaceoldmill.com/en/



Follow Us

Website: http://themarketgardener.com 

Facebook: http://facebook.com/marketgardenerinstitute 

Instagram: http://instagram.com/themarketgardeners 



Guest Social Media Links



David:

Instagram:

www.instagram.com/davidmcmillanmtl/

www.instagram.com/hayfieldfarm/ 

www.instagram.com/hayfieldfarmcottage/

Twitter (X):

https://x.com/davemcmillanmtl 

JM:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jeanmartinfortier

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jeanmartinfortier 

In this episode we speak with Orlane Panet, co-founder of Microhabitat, an urban farming company creating roof top gardens in cities all around the world. We discuss urban population growth and why we need to re-imagine the cities' unused spaces and how rooftop gardens can be a gateway for city dwellers to learn about sustainability, ecological agriculture, healthy eating and more. Orlane shares her belief in business as a way to make positive change in the world and how the urban farms of Microhabitat have much greater impact than meets the eye.



To learn more about Microhabitat visit: https://microhabitat.com/ 



PLEASE make sure to subscribe to the podcast, download our episodes, and rate them! Your support means the world to us. Thank you!



Timestamps

[3:56] Microhabitat model and origin story

[10:05] Re-thinking the urban environment

[16:28] Importance of living soil in urban farming

[18:13] Standardization v. improvisation for success in farming and business

[21:54] Social and community impact of urban farms

[29:09] Container growing v. green roofs

[32:48] Alternative career opportunities for farmers

[35:30] Environmental reporting - pollinator tracking with sound and air DNA

[42:41] Covid's effect on urban farming

[49:29] Importance of education in creating change

[53:35] How a grower or property owner can get involved

[1:01:30] How urban gardens help small farms outside the city

[1:05:02] Orlane's personal journey from health issues to organic farming

[1:10:47] Why hydroponics is not the answer

[1:14:10] The meaning of "sustainability"

[1:15:16] Why for-profit business can be more impactful than non-profit

[1:20:30] Why collaborating with the "bad guys" may be the best way to change them

[1:28:47] The Four Agreements by Don Miguel Ruiz



Sponsors

Bootstrap Farmer https://www.bootstrapfarmer.com/ 

Activevista https://www.activevista.com.au/?utm_source=Podcast&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=Market+Gardener+Institute


Use promocode Welcome10 for 10% off your first order!

Links/Resources

Market Gardener Institute:  https://themarketgardener.com/ 

Masterclass:  https://themarketgardener.com/courses/the-market-gardener-masterclass/ 

Newsletter:  https://themarketgardener.com/newsletter

Blog:  https://themarketgardener.com/blog 

Books: https://themarketgardener.com/books

Growers & Co: https://growers.co/

Heirloom: https://heirloom.ag/

The Old Mill: https://www.espaceoldmill.com/en/



Follow Us

Website: http://themarketgardener.com 

Facebook: http://facebook.com/marketgardenerinstitute 

Instagram: http://instagram.com/themarketgardeners 



Guest Social Media Links

Microhabitat:

Website: https://microhabitat.com/ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/microhabitat.ca/ 

Linkedin: https://ca.linkedin.com/company/microhabitat 

Twitter (X): https://twitter.com/microhabitat_ca 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/microhabitat.ca 

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2b2oLw3wSmH5azWjALI7Ig/videos 

JM:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jeanmartinfortier

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jeanmartinfortier 

Thierry Lison is a market gardener, permaculture teacher, AND marine biologist from French Polynesia. In this episode we explore how Thierry's career in marine biology and a passion for surfing led him to focus on the devastating effects of industrial agriculture on coral reefs, and ultimately start a market garden on a tiny tropical island. His farm, Vaihuti Fresh, blends the principles of permaculture with the strategies of high-yield market gardening while making a positive social impact in the unique context of the Polynesian islands.

From coconut-peat soil mix and crabs as garden pests to worldwide biodiversity loss; this wide ranging conversation will give you plenty to think about!



PLEASE make sure to subscribe to the podcast, download our episodes, and rate them! Your support means the world to us. Thank you!



Sponsors

⁠Bootstrap Farmer⁠ ⁠https://www.bootstrapfarmer.com/⁠ 

⁠Market Gardener Institute⁠ ⁠https://themarketgardener.com/courses⁠  

Use promo code podcast15 for 15% off these select courses:


Mastering Greenhouse Production


8 Most Profitable Crops


Season Extension Strategies


Market Gardening & Organic Farming for Beginners


Winter Farming Strategies





Timestamps

[5:51] Background in marine biology studying coral reefs

[9:45] Starting a farm in Polynesia

[14:59] Link between permaculture and market gardening

{24:01] Crabs as garden pests

{24:49] Research with biochar, coconut husk, and mycorrhizal fungi

[34:14] Rewarding farmers for benefitting ecosystem

[36:00] Loss of biodiversity

[38:46] Cooperative cold-storage and nurseries on the island

[43:31] Making coconut-peat

[49:25] Unique history and economy of Polynesia

[50:12] Covid as turning point for food sovereignty

[55:39] Conventional farmers transitioning to organic

[1:02:05] Education on the farm

[1:07:08] Unique challenges of farming on a tropical island

[1:17:05] Indigenous tradition on the islands

[1:26:10] Permaculture Design Handbook by Bill Mollison

[1:26:42] Jean-Marc Jancovici's 'World Without End' 

[1:33:16] Quote from Charles Eisenstein



Links/Resources

Market Gardener Institute:  https://themarketgardener.com/ 

Masterclass:  https://themarketgardener.com/courses/the-market-gardener-masterclass/ 

Newsletter:  https://themarketgardener.com/newsletter

Blog:  https://themarketgardener.com/blog 

Books: https://themarketgardener.com/books

Growers & Co: https://growers.co/

Heirloom: https://heirloom.ag/

The Old Mill: https://www.espaceoldmill.com/en/



Follow Us

Website: http://themarketgardener.com 

Facebook: http://facebook.com/marketgardenerinstitute 

Instagram: http://instagram.com/themarketgardeners 



Guest Social Media Links

Thierry:

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/vaihuti/

Website: https://vaihutifresh.com/ 

JM:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jeanmartinfortier

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jeanmartinfortier 

In this episode, we speak with Pete Russell, founder of Ooooby, an online platform helping growers to increase sales, simplify packing, and optimize deliveries. We go deep into understanding our current food system, exploring how we got here and where we are going. We explore the history of food shopping, shifting consumer behavior post-covid, innovative business models, and why Pete believes we are at the beginning of a new paradigm in our food system. 



Ooooby: https://www.ooooby.com/ 



PLEASE make sure to subscribe to the podcast, download our episodes, and rate them! Your support means the world to us. Thank you!



Sponsors

⁠Bootstrap Farmer⁠ ⁠https://www.bootstrapfarmer.com/⁠ 

⁠Market Gardener Institute⁠ ⁠https://themarketgardener.com/courses⁠  

Use promo code podcast15 for 15% off these select courses:


Mastering Greenhouse Production


8 Most Profitable Crops


Season Extension Strategies


Market Gardening & Organic Farming for Beginners


Winter Farming Strategies





Timestamps

[2:01] Intro

[3:06] Pete's mission to put small-scale back at the heart of the food system

[6:04] How Ooooby helps farmers sell online / customer shopping experience

[11:15] Supply chain deep-dive

[14:01] Impact of 2008 financial crisis on the food system

[18:01] How the 1990 Australian recession influenced Pete to play outside the system

[25:22] How COVID-19 shifted consumer behavior toward online shopping and local food sourcing

[35:29] How new tech is allowing small farms to compete with industrial agriculture

[43:33] Story of Soul Farm

[49:29] How online shopping is bringing a new demographic to local food

[54:30] Centralized v. Decentralized food system

[56:18] Ooooby's innovative ownership model

[1:03:46] Hidden downside of democratic/cooperative business models

[1:12:18] How to get started with Ooooby

[1:21:40] Ooooby features; automatic packing lists, automatic delivery routes, online shop front etc.

[1:28:22] Society is at a turning point, have we gone too far?

[1:31:10] Concept of 'home' and its deeper societal meaning

[1:34:49] The Sovereign Individual by James Dale Davidson & Lord William Rees-Mogg

[1:35:50] Importance of family



Links/Resources

Market Gardener Institute:  https://themarketgardener.com/ 

Masterclass:  https://themarketgardener.com/courses/the-market-gardener-masterclass/ 

Newsletter:  https://themarketgardener.com/newsletter

Blog:  https://themarketgardener.com/blog 

Books: https://themarketgardener.com/books

Growers & Co: https://growers.co/

Heirloom: https://heirloom.ag/

The Old Mill: https://www.espaceoldmill.com/en/



Follow Us

Website: http://themarketgardener.com 

Facebook: http://facebook.com/marketgardenerinstitute 

Instagram: http://instagram.com/themarketgardeners 



Guest Social Media Links

IG: https://www.instagram.com/oooobyhq/ 

X: https://twitter.com/Ooooby 

FB: https://www.facebook.com/oooobyuk/ 

LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/company/ooooby 

Website: https://www.ooooby.com/ 

In this episode, we talk with Stephanie Wang; farmer, activist, and author. Stephanie specializes in growing Asian vegetables and creating transformed products such as kimchi on her farm Le Rizen in southern Quebec. Her passion for food sovereignty was sparked by her experiences with Via Campesina, a peasant rights organization, during her early 20s. 

We take a deep dive into the perils of our current food and agriculture system, the challenges that both growers and consumers face, and we explore actionable solutions for achieving true food sovereignty for communities worldwide.

Stephanie’s book Asian Vegetables: https://www.lerizen.ca/asianvegetablesbook 

PLEASE make sure to subscribe to the podcast, download our episodes, and rate them! Your support means the world to us. Thank you!

Sponsors

Bootstrap Farmer https://www.bootstrapfarmer.com/ 

Market Gardener Institute https://themarketgardener.com/courses  

Use promo code podcast15 for 15% off these select courses:


Mastering Greenhouse Production


8 Most Profitable Crops


Season Extension Strategies


Market Gardening & Organic Farming for Beginners


Winter Farming Strategies



Timestamps:

[2:36] Intro

[3:20] Travels and work in India with Via Campesina 

[10:35] Starting her farm Le Rizen

[15:41] Alternative land access models/farm business models

[25:28] Land trusts

[31:00] Hospital system v. agriculture system

[36:38] Perennial Farms text and the struggles of farmers

[36:49] Documentary Je me soulève (Upwelling) by Hugo Latulippe

[41:20] Value-added products - Kimchi

[47:10] Food Sovereignty

[56:31] Quebec mass producing pork for China

[1:00:44] Agroecology

[1:12:11] State of the family farm

[1:15:22] Asian Vegetables book - Culinary heritage

[1:28:30] Louisa May Alcott’s Little Women and the bond between sisters 

[1:31:00] Burnout as a farmer and The Joy of Burnout by Dina Glouberman

[1:40:42] The film Ru, based on the book by Kim Thúy



Links/Resources

Market Gardener Institute:  https://themarketgardener.com/ 

Masterclass:  https://themarketgardener.com/courses/the-market-gardener-masterclass/ 

Newsletter:  https://themarketgardener.com/newsletter

Blog:  https://themarketgardener.com/blog 

Books: https://themarketgardener.com/books

Growers & Co: https://growers.co/

Heirloom: https://heirloom.ag/

The Old Mill: https://www.espaceoldmill.com/en/



Follow Us

Website: http://themarketgardener.com 

Facebook: http://facebook.com/marketgardenerinstitute 

Instagram: http://instagram.com/themarketgardeners 



Guest Social Media Links

Stephanie:

Book: https://www.lerizen.ca/asianvegetablesbook 

Website: https://www.lerizen.ca/

IG: https://www.instagram.com/le.rizen/

FB: https://www.facebook.com/le.rizen/ 

Contact: info@lerizen.ca 

JM:

IG: https://www.instagram.com/jeanmartinfortierFB: https://www.facebook.com/jeanmartinfortier 

Show Notes

In this episode, featuring Dave Chapman from the Real Organic Project, the discussion explores the struggles and philosophical shifts within the organic farming community, especially concerning the corporate influence on organic certification standards. 

Dave recounts the historical context of organic farming, emphasizing its roots as a movement against conventional agricultural practices and its evolution into a significant market force. He explains how this has sparked a debate within the community about the essence of organic farming and led to the creation of the Real Organic Project, which aims to uphold more traditional organic practices.



Real Organic Project:

https://realorganicproject.org/ 

PLEASE make sure to subscribe to the podcast, download our episodes, and rate them! Your support means the world to us. Thank you!

Sponsors

Bootstrap Farmer https://www.bootstrapfarmer.com/ 

Ooooby https://www.ooooby.com/ (mention the podcast for 75% off onboarding fee)

New Society Publishing https://newsociety.com/ (use code smallfarm25 for 25% off all books)

[2:53] Intro

[4:19] Organic has always been an insurgency

[7:14] History of organic

[8:26] Ivy league kids growing their own food in the 60s

[10:26] Dave's farming story

[13:59] You couldn't find organic at the grocery store in the 90s

[15:03] Early adopters of organic and its importance

[16:32] Fraudulent organic grain in the US

[18:10] The moment it stopped being a "movement"

[19:00] Patrick Holden, Lady Eve Balfour, and Albert Howard

[20:34] Corporate forces co-opting the cultural movement

[23:37] The rapid loss of meaning with "regenerative"

[27:56] Rachel Carson's Silent Spring

[34:43] History of ag in Asia - F.H. King's Farmers Of 40 Centuries

[36:44] Hydroponic becomes organic and the start of the Real Organic Project

[42:00] CAFO's in organic

[44:30] Zephyr Teachout's Break 'Em Up

[45:43] Monopolies were being broken up before Robert Bork changed things in the 1980s

[48:56] 70% of organic berries in the US are Driscoll's berries

[53:23] How can small organic farmers compete with the prices of big organic?

[54:47] Majority of our food production moving to central America

[58:26] Thoreau and ML King's activism

[1:02:48] There has always been bad farming even before chemical agriculture

[1:04:59] Why big companies love "regenerative"

[1:07:12] Monsanto's "climate smart" agriculture

[1:08:04 Is "No-Till" being co-opted too?

[1:12:04] Pepsi claims regenerative?!

[1:13:25] Hope for the future

[1:18:33] The world's best manipulators have all the money, and they're working tirelessly to mislead you

[1:19:09] Seth Godin on the internet

[1:20:20] It was hard for the pioneers in the past, and it won't be easy in the future either

[1:25:30] Europe's field to fork initiative

[1:42:50] The Real Organic Project

[1:45:19] What book have you read more than once?

[1:46:56] What advice did you only appreciate later in life?

[1:49:05] What's the best difficult decision and best mistake you've ever made?

Links/Resources

Market Gardener Institute:  https://themarketgardener.com/ 

Masterclass:  https://themarketgardener.com/courses/the-market-gardener-masterclass/ 

Newsletter:  https://themarketgardener.ac-page.com/newsletter-subscription 

Blog:  https://themarketgardener.com/blog 

Books: https://themarketgardener.com/books

Growers & Co: https://growers.co/

Heirloom: https://heirloom.ag/

The Old Mill: https://www.espaceoldmill.com/en/

Follow Us

Website: http://themarketgardener.com 

Facebook: http://facebook.com/marketgardenerinstitute 

Instagram: http://instagram.com/themarketgardeners 

Guest Social Media Links

Real Organic Project:

https://realorganicproject.org/ 

JM:

https://www.instagram.com/jeanmartinfortier

https://www.facebook.com/jeanmartinfortier 

Chris:

https://www.instagram.com/chris_m_moran