Upwardly Dependent Upwardly Dependent

Kayla and Lauren have been online friends for 10 years, writing and mothering in similar spaces. This conversation takes a deep dive into the relationships parents have with others who mothered our children both before and after they joined our families. Kayla writes heartfelt prayers for parents who are in need of a ministry of words in seasons of deep grief or spiritual dryness. Her top-rated Substack newsletter offers weekly breath prayers, playlists, and encouragement for raising safe and whole families. 

Kayla is also the author of “Every Season Sacred” and “To Light Their Way.” With a background in journalism, she hopes to bring curiosity and compassion to how she shows up not only as a writer and podcaster but also as a neighbor, friend, and parent. She considers herself a contemplative extrovert and is the creator of the popular Liturgies for Parents Instagram and Podcast. Her wonder-shaped writing has been featured in a vast array of books, devotionals, and Bible studies. She lives in a former convent with her pastor husband, four kids, and two dogs in her Iowa hometown.

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Episode Highlights


Kayla Craig Introduction (1:52)
Parenting and how motherhood changes you (11:15)
The formation of women in our lives (12:50)
Parenting adopted children (17:52)
Expanding the network of safety and influence outside the home (26:44)
Recognizing the importance of people in the lives of our kids before we met them (31:40)
Kayla’s second book “Every Season Sacred” and spiritual rhythms (36:40)

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For more information, details, and episode transcriptions, visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠upwardlydependent.com/shownotes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

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Links


Kindred Exchange - Become a monthly donor to support this show and our mission
Think Orphan - Learn more and listen to the podcast

Emmaus House - Learn more about their work with orphaned youth in Haiti 

Kayla’s Personal InstagramLiturgies for Parents Instagram

Liturgies for Parents Podcast - Tune into Kayla’s podcast for a moment of peace in the chaos of life.

“Every Season Sacred” - Reflections, Prayers, And Invitations To Nourish Your Soul

And Nurture Your Family Throughout The Year

“To Light Their Way” - A Collection of Prayers & Liturgies for Parents

Liturgies for Parents Top Substack - Follow along with Kayla’s weekly newsletter, playlists, and breath prayers

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Connect with Lauren

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Leave a Review⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Connect with Kayla

Instagram / Facebook / Substack

Once you see how institutionalizing children can be harmful to their development, how do you continue to be involved with the care of orphans and vulnerable children? Brent Phillips, CEO and Programs Manager at Cherish Uganda, shares how this organization has evolved over the years to best center families within their care strategy. Brent speaks candidly and truthfully about the unique challenges of this transition, and how the posture of programming organizations is critical to the success of marginalized communities.

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Episode Highlights


Introduction to Brent (2:31)
Brent’s work with Cherish Uganda (3:08)
Pushback to the switch to family based care (6:57)
Donors reactions to organization’s narratives about orphan care (10:56)
Story behind the short film from Cherish Uganda (16:07)
Pastoring donors and inviting them into the story (23:17)
How Cherish Uganda differentiates themselves from other organizations in Uganda (25:06)
Encouragement to make the shift to pivoting approach to orphanages (30:46)

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For more information, details, and episode transcriptions, visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠upwardlydependent.com/shownotes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

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Links


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kindred Exchange⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Become a monthly donor to support this show and our mission
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Emmaus House⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Learn more about their work with orphaned youth in Haiti
⁠Konbit Haiti⁠ - See how a group of people is transforming communities in Haiti
Cherish Uganda - Learn more about the work they do with children with HIV/AIDS. 
World AIDs Day video - Walk in the shoes of a person living with HIV, to increase awareness of the stigma and treatment.

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Connect with Lauren

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Leave a Review⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Connect with Brent

Linkedin / Instagram / Facebook

It is critical to center the voices of lived experience experts in any human rights conversation. This episode is sure to give you pause at different moments, as David Sanon shares his experience growing up in a boarding school in Haiti, where American donors sponsored his education. After meeting Steph DeLuca Robinson and other trusted partners, he found an opportunity to lead and develop his fellow Haitians into independent, sustainable solutions that promoted their freedom from foreign money. 



If you are currently sponsoring an ‘orphan’ or an ‘orphanage’ somewhere in the world, don’t listen to this episode unless you are open to having your perspective rattled by the childhood experience of institutionalized care.

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Episode Highlights


How David and Steph met and eventually founded Konbit (4:35)
What is misunderstood about Haiti + David’s story (10:00)
How the phrase “White Saviors” relates to David’s Story (15:30)
A formal apology from Lauren in the way she engaged with Haiti in the past (20:48)
Attachment issues with institutionalized care (22:09)
The cost of orphanages > Supporting parents (29:10)
Sexual abuse in orphanages and sex trafficking once a kid ages out (33:18)
Isolation and the prevalence of suicide after youth exit care (26:16)
Why Konbit supports families instead of children (38:05)
David’s hope for Haiti (42:43)

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For more information, details, and episode transcriptions, visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠upwardlydependent.com/shownotes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

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Links


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kindred Exchange⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Become a monthly donor to support this show and our mission
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Emmaus House⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Learn more about their work with orphaned youth in Haiti
Konbit Haiti - See how a group of people is transforming communities in Haiti

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Connect with Lauren

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Leave a Review⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Connect with Steph

Linkedin / Instagram / Facebook

Connect with David

Konbit Haiti's Website

Eric Gott began working with kids who hold difficult narratives as a play therapist in Nashville, Tennessee. He then became a foster dad, and after 3.5 years of courtroom appointments, he and his wife, Leah, became the legal parents of four young children. Eric now serves as a Children’s Minister in Birmingham, Alabama, where he has brought trauma-infused thought to the way the church creates inclusive spaces for kids who may need help regulating emotions and behaviors. And, you’ll hear him admit that their new sensory room is a huge hit for adults who may need a change of scenery, too.



In this episode, you’ll hear how one therapist’s philosophies of best practice were challenged when his home also needed to become a therapeutic environment, and how the ways his commitment to his children has been infused into the ways he perceives holistic care for vulnerable kids. Whether you are a therapist, a parent, a church member, or simply a curious listener, you are SURE to take tangible wisdom from this conversation.

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Episode Highlights


Guest Introduction for Eric and his professional journey (2:20)
How to find the right therapist for your family (4:15)
Therapists choose a specialty or theory that leads their practice (6:10)
A deeper conversation of play therapy and Lauren’s experience with Eric’s sandbox (8:30)
Age ranges for certain types of therapeutic modalities (13:19)
Attachment-based play and developmental trauma vs. DSM diagnoses (15:00)
Practicing “Delight” in our kids, even in the midst of chaos (18:47)
Treating our children as their emotional age rather than their biological age (23:39)
Where American churches should grow in meeting the needs of kids (32:58)
Communicating your needs to your community (40:36)

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For more information, details, and episode transcriptions, visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠upwardlydependent.com/shownotes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

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Links


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kindred Exchange⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Become a monthly donor to support this show and our mission
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Emmaus House⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Learn more about their work with orphaned youth in Haiti
“The Explosive Child” by Ross Greene, PhD
“The Connected Child” by Karyn Purvis, PhD, et al.
“You Should be Grateful” by Angela Tucker
“What White Parents Should Know about Transracial Adoption” by Melissa Guida-Richards

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Connect with Lauren

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Jamie Finn is no stranger to the attachment journey for children and families. Having shared her life as a foster mother for a decade, Jamie knows the beauty and the sorrow of loving kids with difficult beginnings. In this episode, you’ll hear Jamie share the ways her heart posture has changed over the years. If you’re considering becoming a foster parent, if you’re currently walking through the attachment journey yourself, or if you’d like to learn how to better support families wrapped up in the foster system, this episode is for you!

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Episode Highlights


Introduction to Jamie and her journey with caring for kids in foster care (2:26)
The reality of being complicit in trauma (7:13)
Redefining ‘home’ in terms of attachment (10:21)
Co-regulation when a child does not feel safe (14:34)
Trauma-informed, gospel-centered parenting (20:22)
What can I do? Identifying needs and gifts and neighboring well (32:45)
How to engage with Jamie and her work (42:58)

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For more information, details, and episode transcriptions, visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠upwardlydependent.com/shownotes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

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Links


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kindred Exchange⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Become a monthly donor to support this show and our mission
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Think Orphan ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠- Learn more and listen to the podcast
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Emmaus House⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Learn more about their work with orphaned youth in Haiti
Foster the Family Website - Learn more about the organization, dive into the blog, and tune into the podcast today
Foster the Family Book - Order your copy of Jamie’s book today

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Connect with Lauren

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Leave a Review⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Connect with Jamie

Instagram

In a law-oriented society like the United States, it is critical to engage legal professionals who frame our understanding of adoption and foster care policies in the field of child advocacy. Elizabeth Kirk, who holds a doctorate in law from Notre Dame, is passionate about adoption policy because of the way her own life started and the way she and her husband have grown their family. As a leading voice in both the legal community and the Catholic pro-life movement, Dr. Kirk sheds light on the interpretation of abortion legislation and the way forward after the Dobbs decision.

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Episode Highlights


Elizabeth Kirk and her work (1:49)
Society’s focus on infant adoption (8:29)
Equality and gender roles in abortion law and other areas of society (13:24)
Misconceptions of adoption (25:05)
Possibilities for the future of foster care and adoption policies (30:52)
What does it mean to be pro-life? (36:53)
How could government funding support adoption? (40:09)

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For more information, details, and episode transcriptions, visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠upwardlydependent.com/shownotes⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

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Links


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kindred Exchange⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Become a monthly donor to support this show and our mission
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Think Orphan ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠- Learn more and listen to the podcast
⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Emmaus House⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Learn more about their work with orphaned youth in Haiti


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Connect with Lauren

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ / ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Leave a Review⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Connect with Elizabeth

Email / X