The podcast where better is definitely better than bigger.
Do you think growing infinitely on a finite planet is an oxymoron? If the answer is yes, then this podcast is for you.
In each episode of the Post-Growth Australia Podcast (PGAP), host Michael Bayliss talks to experts to unpack the notion of post-growth societies and what this means for us, for future generations and for the planet.
Each episode will also play an environmental themed song from local artists.
PGAP is made possible by the support of Sustainable Population Australia (SPA).
Solving climate change through ethical investment - with James Regulinski from Carbon Collective
In this episode of Post-Growth Australia, we interview James Regulinski, co-founder of Carbon Collective, a company providing low-fee, diversified investment portfolios built for solving climate change. Inspired by the work of Project Drawdown, James and his business partner Zach Stein tackle climate change by encouraging investors to support environmentally friendly enterprises.
For a podcast on Degrowth with a bias toward the anti-capitalist end of the spectrum, James is a very different kind of guest on PGAP and one who inspired much pithy discussion. For most of us in the post-growth movement, there can often be some tension around whether to ‘tap in’ and to use financial leverage to encourage improvements in the current system (e.g. Green investment, divestment, supporting the ‘green new deal’ etc.) Or, whether to ‘tap out’ or fight the system altogether. Hats off to James to going down the rabbit hole with me here, where we conclude that a mix of both approaches is the best way forward. That is, any change we do needs to have a transition to a Degrowth society as the modus operandi. On the other side of the coin, it is currently very difficult, if not impossible, to tap completely out of today’s growth based economic paradigm.
To find out more about Carbon Collective, visit their website here. This includes a fantastic introductory video from James.
On PGAP, we’ve had a few discussions around the challenges of tapping out of the growth based system. In our interview with Dr. Alex Baumann (currently our top performing episode), he discusses why the private housing market provides a financial barrier to opting out of the matrix. We’ve also had a few guests on who have made a successful change to off grid living (tapping out if you will). Mike Stasse from Tasmania is one great example. Artist as Family (based near Daylesford Victoria) discuss how they made the change on a shoestring budget.
Please share this and other episodes of PGAP with your friends, family and networks. Rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Any feedback or ideas for future episodes? Contact us here.
All views, opinions and legacies of our guests are exclusive theirs and do not necessarily reflect those of PGAP.
Special Guest: James Regulinski.
Women for Conservation with Isabella Cortes Lara
On November 15 2022 the global population hit 8 billion. Despite the fact that half of all the world’s pregnancies are unplanned, any talk of global approach to family planning and reproductive health care in the global south remains controversial. So often, this is debated across the global north without including stakeholders who live in the global south and work with the issues first hand. PGAP aims to make amends for this oversight by inviting Isabella Cortes Lara to the podcast, Vice President of ‘Women for Conservation’, who work alongside rural communities in Colombia and Nepal. An incredible artist and storyteller, Isabella shares with PGAP how W4C started, the decision to focus on family planning and reproductive healthcare as a solution to the environmental and reproductive issues affecting rural Colombia, and how her artistic and spiritual approach to life intersect and inform her activism.
You can find out more about Women for Conversation here. Please consider supporting their great work, by spreading the word or by making a donation. You can also read more W4C at the Sustainable Population Australia Newsletter here. The full interview can be read at the SPA website here.
On this episode, we played the track ‘Aguita de Paramo” that Isabella recorded under her artist name ‘Isavibe’. You can follow Isavibe’s music at her Spotify account here.
This interview with Women for Conversation is part of a wider dialogue on mythbusting when it comes to family planning and reproductive healthcare, especially for the global south. PGAP has been an active part in this debate. In season two we spoke with Florence Blondel, Ugandan born journalist, feminist and sustainable population advocate. In season one we spoke with CHASE Africa who work with communities in Kenya (a QandA with founder Robin Witt can also be read on the SPA website).
(Artwork from Isabella under the artist name 'Isavibe).
Of course, this discussion is not just exclusive to the global south. In season two PGAP spoke with proud childfree women living in the USA and Australia. We spoke with Nandita Bajaj, executive director of Population Balance, whose organisation aim is to counter systemic pro-natalism. Last but certainly not least, we spoke with Prof. Anne Poelina, Chair of the Martuwarra Fitzroy River Council and a Nyikina Warrwa Traditional Owner. She brings to the table Indigenous wisdom and insight into the degrowth and population sustainability debates. The Martuwarra-Fitzroy river region is currently under much environmental stress with flash flooding in the Kimberley. Our thoughts are with all communities who live in this beautiful part of the world, human and non-human.
(Image courtesy of Isavibe).
PGAP is made by the kind support of Sustainable Population Australia (SPA). No strangers to tackling controversial issues, PGAP would like to take the opportunity to thank SPA for allowing us to take on the broader controversial issues of post-growth and degrowth with autonomy, including guests who may share different or opposing views on population. This is a good opportunity to remind that all perspectives and legacies of PGAP guests and their respective organisations are their own and may not always reflect those of PGAP and SPA.
During the interview, Isabella referred to the fantastic work of Kate Raeworth (of doughnut economics). A link to her Ted Talk can be watched here.
As always, we strongly encourage you to spread the post-growth message. Share this episode with your friends, family, colleagues and networks. Rate and review PGAP on Apple Podcasts. Contact us with your feedback, suggestions and guest recommendations.
Want to find out more about your hosts? You can find out more about Mark Allen, Holistic Activism and Town Planning Rebellion here. You can find out more about Michael Bayliss at his website here.
Special Guest: Isabella Cortes Lara.
Fuzzy Logic on a Fragile Planet with Rod Taylor
Rod Taylor is a multi-talented broadcaster, videographer based in Canberra. In addition to hosting the "Fuzzy Logic Science show", he is author of the 2020 book “10 Journeys on A Fragile Planet”. This extraordinary book details the personal journeys of extraordinary environmentalists and game changers.
This episode is dedicated to the memory of Dr. Haydn Washington. Haydn was a prolific and passionate writer and speaker on sustainability, degrowth, the need for population stabilisation and denialism against both climate and population realities. He wrote or edited many books. He was active in CASSE and the Ecological Economics community. The Australian Degrowth movement owes much to Haydn’s work. A tribute to Haydn can be found on Rod’s ‘Fuzzy Logic’ science show here. The link includes an interview that Rod did with Haydn at the 2013 Fenner Conference, organised by Sustainable Population Australia.
You can find out more about "10 Journeys on a Fragile Planet" here.
Want to find out more about the Fuzzy Logic Science show? You can listen via Canberra’s radio 2XX or via the Fuzzy Logic Podcast.
As a prolific and energetic volunteer for Sustainable Population Australia, Rod worked with PGAP co-host Michael Bayliss with many of SPA’s video productions, including: “Talking Heads: Choosing to have children...or not” and an interview with the Ambassador of Costa Rica, “Pura Vida Costa Rica with Ambassador Armando Vargas”. Michael owes much to Rod’s impeccable talent for camera angles and lighting.
Rod was also co-editor of "Sustainability and the New Economics" (Springer, 2022) with Steve Williams. PGAP interviewed Steve on a season 3 episode of PGAP. This volume is an invaluable addition to the post-growth economic movement.
"The path to sustainable civilisation" co-written by Rod Taylor and Mark Disendorf is set to be published in mid 2023. With the tag line - 'civilization's broken, this is how we fix it" - we can't wait for the launch!
Sustainable Population Australia has recently launched a new discussion paper, “How many Australians? The need for Earth-centric ethics” authored by Patron Dr. Paul Collins. Paul was also interviewed for a season 3 edition of PGAP here.
Find out more about co-host Mark Allen’s Holistic Activism movement here.
Support PGAP! Share this episode and others with your friends, family and networks. Rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Got any feedback or a suggestion for a future episode? Contact us here.
It has been an epic 2022 for PGAP and the hosts. Thank you for being with us through this journey and see you again in the new year.
Special Guest: Rod Taylor.
Organic, Regenerative & Carbon Negative: Oranje Tractor Winery with Murray Gomm
For season 4 of Post-Growth Australia Podcast (PGAP), we will be highlighting some extraordinary work being done by extraordinary Western Australians, who are bucking the dominant narrative of exploitation on scale on an ecologically unique yet fragile part of the world. In this episode, we speak to Murray Gomm from Oranje Tractor, award winning organic, regenerative and carbon negative winery/small farm holding near Albany.
Oranje Tractor certainly punches above its weight. It was the winner of the Gourmet Traveller Wine, Australia's Best Cellar Door Awards 2019. Oranje Tractor Farm was the winner of ACCI's Great Southern Business Awards for Environment and Sustainability in 2019 and was a Case Study for Circular Economy WA in 2022. It has been endorsed by Charles Massy (previous PGAP guest) and visited by then Prince Charles – now king (and not YET a PGAP guest).
But how do you produce good quality wine, along with an impressive variety of fruits, nuts and vegetables, in a manner that improves soil integrity and sequesters more carbon than what is emitted? Murray Gomm shares what happens ‘behind the scenes’ of how they do it and why Oranje Tractor is capturing the interest and imagination of so many people. Murray also provides some insight into the wider regenerative movement and the agricultural zeitgeist that is slowly beginning to influence new ways of approaching farming in the Great Southern of Western Australia.
For the introduction and outro of this episode, Michael is joined by co-host Mark Allen as they pick each other’s brain on topics such as: regenerative agriculture and permaculture; progress on the Asbestos campaign (as discussed in the last episode); and the result of SPA’s 8 billion competition and the commentary from the mainstream press for 8 billion day, which was reached on the 15th of November.
Timestamp for the episode
Intro (Michael Bayliss and Mark Allen): 0:00:00 – 0:06:37
Oranje Tractor interview with Murray Gomm: 0:06:38 - 0:58:24
Outro (Michael Bayliss and Mark Allen): 0:58:25 - End
Liked this episode and the themes of regenerative agriculture? You will love our interviews with Charles Massy, Shane Simonsen, Artist as Family and David Holmgren.
Like PGAP? Rate and review us on Apple Podcast and share the podcast widely with your family friends and networks.
Have a question for us? Got any suggestions for future discussion topics or interview guests? Contact PGAP anytime on our contact page here.
Further links you may be interested in:
Independent Australia published an article co-written by Mark and Michael: “Working towards an asbestos-free future.” A more extensive version can also be read on the PGAP blog. Our various asbestos misadventures were discussed in the season 4 premiere of PGAP.
There is an excellent article, published by Carbon8, showcasing FarmHand wines, another excellent regenerative winery. Written by Elena Burger Guimaraes. Currently available to read on Facebook.
ABC has interviewed Oranje Tractor on several occasions. Examples include here and here.
SPA (who supports PGAP) announced the winners of the 8 billion writers' competition here.
You can find out more about Mark Allen's other work with Town Planning Rebellion here.
You can find out more about Michael Bayliss at his website here.
Special Guest: Murray Gomm.
Welcome to Asbestosville! Season 4 Premiere with Michael Bayliss and Mark Allen
We can’t believe that PGAP is into its fourth season already! So, to shake things up, Michael is joined by Mark Allen from Town Planning Rebellion and Holistic Activism as the co-host for this season. You may remember Mark from his two previous guest appearances on PGAP here and here.
This first episode of the season is the culmination of a personal journey for them both. For Michael it is an opportunity to share his lived experiences in the West Australia rental market (in what has been labelled as the asbestos capital of the world) - that is too broken to care about whether the basic health and safety needs of renters are being met. Mark who shared in some of those experiences, goes on to look at how it all fits into a wider discussion on the systemic changes that are so urgently required in our town planning and housing sectors.
These experiences have also been written down in the form of a blog: “A Year in Asbestosville: A Farcical Tale of Systemic Failure.” This can be read on the PGAP blog or at Michael’s author profile on Medium. You are spoiled for choice!
In addition to our personal journeys, we also discuss some Degrowth related current affairs. For example…
Did you know that November 15th is the date that our global population will reach 8 billion people. Yay! But what does 8 billion mean for the planet, the environment and for you? Sustainable Population Australia (SPA), who support this podcast, are inviting you to answer this very question in 100 words (or less!) for your chance to win a prize. A link can be found to the competition here. The competition is open to all Australian residents who are not currently members of SPA and it is open until November 11th.
Also, how could we not talk about Liz Truss on a program about Degrowth? Before her six weeks as PM was over, Truss bemoaned the supposed anti-growth coalition. So, a growing number of people thought that this was a great idea and started one up. Mark is currently in conversation with the coalition about how best to frame the population issue in a way that prevents it from becoming overly divisive. Want to find out more? You can visit their website here.
(image found through internet image search).
Finally, we would like to give a nod to Dr. Alex Baumann, who has just released a YouTube video, “The Land Issue | A Social Science Sustainability Breakthrough". Our season 3 interview with Alex, ‘A Public Housing Revolution for Degrowth’ has become PGAP’s highest performing ever episode. Hopefully this will help bring the importance of public housing and its role in our transition to degrowth, further into public consciousness.
Perhaps we are making a difference because this year, PGAP nudged into the top 6% of global podcasts! With your help, we can get PGAP into the top 5% of listens, which we would like to think is where it belongs. You can do your bit by sharing this and other episodes of PGAP with your friends, family and networks. You can also rate and review us on Apple Podcasts so that others may be inspired to give us a go. Let’s help to build a movement of movements 😊.
You can find out more about Mark, Holistic Activism and Town Planning Rebellion here
You can find out more about Michael at his website here
Season 3 Finale with Charlie Mgee from Formidable Vegetable
From the very beginning, PGAP has delighted in playing music from Formidable Vegetable on our permaculture themed episodes. So, for the final episode of Season 3, host Michael Bayliss is especially thrilled to meet with Formidable Vegetable mastermind Charlie Mgee at his new eco village home at Living Waters, Denmark WA. An engaging storyteller as well as musician and performer, Charlie shares the incredible history of forming the permaculture themed band and their mission statement from the get go. We also explore the role that music place in activism and societal change and we cap it off with Charlie’s vision for a Post-Growth future.
Want to explore more of the Formidable Vegetable discography? The video for ‘No Such Thing as Waste’, the featured song for this episode, can be seen here. We also play brand new track 'Short Attention Span' from brand new album 'In Real Life' at the end of the interview. Bandcamp is the best place to go to hear all the back catalogue. Link here.
PGAP will be taking a – hopefully – short break before rejuvenating with Season 4 later this year. Just because we’re on pause doesn’t mean you have to be! Share this and other episodes of PGAP with your friends, family, colleagues and networks. Rate and review us on Apple Podcast. Contact us here to give us your feedback and especially what topics and guests you’d like to see for season 4.
In the meantime, if you enjoy the permaculture theme you may also like PGAP’s interview with David Holmgren (who Charlie lived with back in 2020) or Meg and Patrick from Artist as Family. Or you may be interested in the Tasmanian Perspectives series of interviews in season 2, including the quiet permaculture revolution of Tassie’s northern shores, or Charles Massy, regenerative farmer, from Season 3. Most of these episodes have Formidable Vegetable providing the music.
If you want to find out more about host Michael Bayliss, please head to my website here.
Otherwise, episode timestamp below and see you all in a few months! Until then, until then….
0:00:00 - 0:08:13 Introduction with Michael Bayliss
0:08:13 - 0:10:59 'No Such Thing As Waste' - Formidable Vegetable, reproduced with permission. All rights reserved.
0:11:00 - 1:03:11 Interview with Charlie Mgee
1:03:11 - 1:04:05 'Short Attention Span' - Formidable Vegetable, reproduced with permission. All rights reserved.
1:04:06 - 1:06:31 Outro with Michael Bayliss
Special Guest: Charlie Mgee.
Outstanding & life-changing!
THESE are the topics that everyone should be talking about! With unfailing sharp wit and a most pleasant voice, Michael takes a deep dive into the most controversial topics of our time, reminding all of us what really matters for humanity and the planet. A must-hear for everyone who cares about the future.
Eye opening and informative
Important fringe ideas. Hard topics to discuss in the modern world. But glad this podcast is getting the message and ideas out there, thank you
Opened minded PGA & relaxing/chill
This podcast has opened my mind on Post Growth, it interests me in some way & the way we live. I found this one Easy listening, the interviews & music has inspired me, I listen to it when I take public transport in perth & I find it very Gentle. it helps my brain to think about what’s around me like (transport/eco) so I can distract myself from the COVID-19. It’s the kind of podcast I would listen to with my cup of coffee. It’s one of my favourite podcasts so far. Keep up the good work Mike.