Indebted - Debt and Race in America Convergence Magazine

Welcome to the Season One finale of Indebted! Our episodes have focused on exposing how debt harms Black people and the entire economy—but people are fighting back. There are reasons to hope for a better, debt-free future. In this episode Maurice is joined by four heavy hitters in the fight against debt and its roots in systemic racism. They discuss the many approaches to tackling these problems, from education and legislation to policy advocacy and direct action.



Guests this episode include:




US Senator Elizabeth Warren



Astra Taylor, co-founder of Debt Collective and author of The Age of Insecurity: Coming Together as Things Fall Apart



Louise Seamster, assistant professor of Sociology and African-American Studies at the University of Iowa



Jhumpa Bhattacharya, co-founder and president of Maven Collaborative




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While municipalities in America don't leverage debt in quite the same way an individual or family does (i.e. they can't put it all on a credit card or step into a payday lending office), they still find themselves needing to spend on long-term projects they can't afford through standard taxation. Enter municipal bonds, a type of loan that in ideal circumstances provides stable interest rates and payment schedules for the city and a secure investment for a diverse group of institutional lenders like banks and pension funds. A simplified explanation can make it sound like an easy win-win for all sides. But this isn't always the case.



In this episode, Maurice explains the struggles Puerto Rico, Chicago, and Detroit have in common when it comes to municipal bonds and urban racial inequity. Joining him to further elaborate and help listeners better understand a purposefully complicated system is Saqib Bhatti. Along with Maurice, Saqib co-founded the Action Center on Race and the Economy (ACRE) and currently acts as co-executive director.



ACRE's research reports cited in this episode can be found on their website here.



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The "world's richest man," Elon Musk, purchased Twitter (since renamed X) for $44 billion in 2022. It's estimated he holds $13 billion of that amount as debt from bank and other loans, a sum the average working class person would obviously face severe repercussions for. He didn't have the liquid cash for the purchase and the company only generated $4 billion in revenue in 2022, but he was given loans to make the purchase anyway. The site's always been a long way from seeing a profit, and is in a worse position since Musk's takeover. There's no sign of it earning the revenue necessary to pay off the debts he has incurred. So what's the deal? Why is there a separate set of rules for the rich when it comes to debt? And how do we fight to make these rules more equitable and hold wealthy mega-debtors accountable?



In this episode, Maurice talks with Charles Khan, an organizer with Hedge Clippers, a national campaign focused on unmasking the dark money schemes and strategies the billionaire elite uses to expand their wealth, consolidate power and obscure accountability for their misdeeds. Maurice and Charles explore the commonality of such deals for the wealthy by looking at the history of leveraged buyouts (LBOs), and discuss how we can organize to push back against this separate set of rules for the elite.



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When someone finishes a prison sentence, we often say they've "paid their debt to society." But financial debt doesn't stop chasing us if we find ourselves interacting with the criminal justice system. People charged with crimes who can't make bail can find themselves in jail awaiting trial for weeks and months, unable to work. Or they may need to take out costly bail bonds so they can get out of jail and continue to support themselves and their families. And it's no secret that Black and other people of color are much more likely to have encounters with law enforcement that result in arrests, fines, and fees. A bad interaction with the police on someone's worst day can spiral into years of debt.



The complications listed only scratch the surface of what can be understood as carceral debt. Joining Maurice this episode to discuss the many debt traps and spirals embedded in the American carceral system is Dr. Richelle Brooks, the carceral debt organizer with the Debt Collective.



Citations and resources mentioned this episode:




Brennan Center Study



Bail Debt Dispute Tool from The Debt Collective



Police Abolition 101



We Do This Till We Free Us - book by Mariame Kaba



criticalresistance.org




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No one gleefully spends on medical expenses. These unplanned costs land on people in vulnerable moments. Adding to the stress, many if not most in the US are un- or under-insured. The result? A whopping 85% of people with credit reports hold healthcare debt. Medical costs are so high and unpredictable that people often find themselves seeking emergency care at the latest possible moment in hopes of not incurring such debts. Their care and recovery suffer.



In this episode, Maurice is joined by Dr. Luke Messac, MD/PhD, a physician in emergency medicine and a medical historian and author. Together they discuss how medical debt shows up among Black patients he sees and in his historical research. They'll also preview his upcoming book, Your Money or Your Life: Debt Collection in American Medicine, available early November 2023 from Oxford University Press.



Also joining this episode to discuss her personal experience with medical debt is Angela Peoples, an activist and director of Black Womxn For as well as co-founder of The South.



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You are being graded and given a score based on a multitude of financial details in your life, whether you like it or not. Rent and billing history, loans, credit card purchases... every financial move you make. Of course we're talking about what's known as your FICO Credit Score. And all the data you never agreed to have surveilled? It was hacked and stolen back in 2017 due to a data breach of one of the big three credit bureaus, Equifax.



In this episode Maurice lays out the history of credit surveillance, from individual banks handing out loans based on "vibes" more than anything, to trusting the insecure data systems that led to the 2017 Equifax breach. And all along the way, it's America's Black population that disproportionately suffers the consequences of these experimental models in credit surveillance and lending.



Joining this episode to discuss why our models of credit scoring for lending have impacted Black and other marginalized populations is Tamara K. Nopper, senior researcher with the Labor Futures initiative at Data & Society and an assistant professor of sociology at Rhode Island College.



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