Business Lunch Roland Frasier

There are three ways to buy a business—a normal acquisition, a no-money-down acquisition, and a no-money-out-of-pocket acquisition. 
 
Of those three kinds of deals, Roland Frasier has a favorite. Roland has bought and sold a lot of businesses over the course of his career, so he knows what he’s talking about. In this bite-sized snackable episode, he shares which acquisition deal is his favorite and why—and how you can make it happen for yourself. 
 
3 Types of Deals and the Distinctions Between Them
 
A lot of people ask Roland what the ROI is on no-money-down deals, but first you need to make a distinction between the three main types of deals. 
 
Traditional acquisition deals No-money-down acquisition deals No-money-out-of-pocket acquisition deals.  
With a traditional acquisition deal, you need a lender, whether that’s a bank or a fund or an individual or an SPAC (special purpose acquisition company) or whatever. Typically, they’ll provide 70%-90% of the funding. That’s going to be debt. These creditors will loan you this money, then expect you to come up with the difference, the down payment. They typically don’t want that to be borrowed. It has to be your money so you have skin in the game.
 
Let’s say you’re going to acquire a $5M company. You get a loan for $4.5M and put $500k of your own money down. You do some cool things with it, grow it, and sell it for $10M. That’s a 100% return on your investment, but it’s a 2000% return on your $500k down payment.
 
That’s when we start thinking of more creatively financed deals, where we’re not coming out of pocket at all. That means our ROI is really going to be infinite, because we have zero investment.
 
The first kind of deal where you’ll get infinite return is no money down. These are rare as you get into larger deals. There is literally no money going into the seller’s pocket at closing. You’ve got to find a seller that’s totally cool with 100% financing. These deals are very common in small companies, but less common as you get above $1M. You’re probably buying a company from a motivated seller that’s not that great.
 
The quality of deals, size of deals, and number of available deals with a “no money down” deal is pretty low.
 
The “No Money Out Of Pocket” Deal
 
In between the “no money down” deal and the traditional deal is a deal Roland likes to do, and that’s called “no money out of pocket.” No money out of pocket is significantly different because the sellers often receive a whole lot of cash at closing. The only difference is that it’s not coming out of your pocket. And you don’t have to tap your personal credit or assets.
 
Roland and his team have come up with 219 different ways you can finance your company without getting a commercial loan, and adding to that list all the time. They teach this in an 8-week course, and even then they don’t scratch the surface. What it boils down to is that you’re using the assets that exist in the company and some other creative financing techniques to provide the seller with whatever down payment they want at closing. 
 
You can do hybrid deals where you use some of these strategies and some commercial loans, but it’s really fun to play the game of “how can I do this without any commercial lending?” One thing you can do from the standpoint of credit is use an SPV (special purpose vehicle), a company that’s set up for a special purpose of acquiring the business. 
 
Those are the three types of deals you’re looking at doing. When we think of ROI, we’ve had to come out of pocket zero dollars, we’ve gotten the seller money at closing, so it increases how many deals are available, and we’ve come up with creative ways of financing. And we’re not limited to how much money we have. 
 
When you do a no money out of pocket deal, it’s a win win win. You can buy an infinite number of companies, you don

Are you getting in the way of your company growing, scaling, and becoming all it can be? Maybe it’s time to hand over the reins and step away. 
 
In today’s episode, host Roland Frasier sits down with Cody Bjugan, Founder of VestRight, a company that transforms lives through real estate. Specifically, they teach people how to put together raw land deals in the real estate space. Cody recently handed the company over to a CEO and stepped into a founder/visionary role.
 
Listen in as he shares his entrepreneurial journey, mistakes he made along the way, and the challenges of handing over your business so it can continue to grow.
 
An Early Start to the Entrepreneurial Journey
 
When Cody was 12 years old, he loved to collect sports cards. He grew up in the small town of Damascus, Oregon with its solitary streetlight, and he’d go to the flea market on the weekends. He’d set up a booth and buy, sell, and trade sports cards. 
 
Cody’s grandfather was a homebuilder and land developer. He passed away when Cody was 15, but Cody still pulls inspiration from his life and accomplishments. His father had the spirit but didn’t have the mindset to be successful as an entrepreneur. He got injured and never got back to self-employment after that. Cody says he programmed himself not to give up like his father had done when he was met with failure.
 
When Cody turned 15, he bought his first car for $800. Throughout high school, he bought and sold cars, put lipstick on them, and turned them. He had plans to go to college, but his girlfriend got pregnant, and he got married two months after high school instead. He entered the workforce in the floor and counter industry in the union to get health benefits to pay for his unborn child. 
 
His coworkers told him he was so lucky to be starting at 19, because he could retire when he was 40. But all he could think was, “I’m miserable. Why would I want to be miserable for my most prime 20 years?” As soon as he got health insurance, and the baby was born, he bailed, and got a job in a private business in the same industry. 
 
Unfortunately, he says, he failed his family, hobbies, health, and spirit by becoming a workaholic. He took this company that was doing $70k a month and turned it into a business doing $1M a month. He was making really good money in his early 20s, but it came at a high cost. 
 
He had gotten to know a lot of homebuilders and land developers as clients. One thing led to another, he networked, and in 2002, he faced his fears and jumped off the cliff into the land development space. It’s been a journey, he says. Entrepreneurship isn’t easy.
 
The Importance of Mentorship
 
Cody made a phone call recently. He reached out to the guy who gave him that first job after he left the union and thanked him. He says, looking back, that man was his first mentor. 
 
He admits that he never put much value in mentorship until three years ago. He would always say he was an introvert and wouldn’t put himself out there. He would fly under the radar, hide under rocks. It was just an excuse, he says. He didn’t want to be uncomfortable.
 
He has joined a few masterminds where he seeks mentorship from groups of individuals. “I’ve grown more in the last three years than I did the previous 18 years of my career,” he says. “I’ve allowed people to speak into my life and help me see things in a different way.” He says he went into these relationships with two important perspectives:
 
If I don’t go in there being real and transparent and vulnerable, these guys won’t get to know the real me and be able to touch me like they could.  I’m here to also give and pour into their lives.  
He says he’s still growing in that second area. He’s always had a giving heart when it comes to money, but giving of himself and his time has been a huge process for him. 
 
He recently hired an executive coach to help him throug

If you’re thinking about acquiring a business, pass it through this set of filters first. 
 
Roland Frasier has bought—and sold—a lot of businesses over the course of his career. He knows what to look for, and what to stay away from, and he shares his expertise in this snackable episode.
 
Listen in for 9 things to consider when looking to acquire a business. 
 
#1: Buy a profitable business. 
 
Don’t buy one that’s in trouble and needs a turnaround. That’s a whole different skill set and a lot of extra work. There are plenty of profitable businesses out there that you can acquire.
 
#2: Know if you want to work in, on, or above the business.
 
There are three places you can work when it comes to a business. You can work in it where you’re doing all the work. You can work on it where you’re more of a CEO/manager. Or you can work above it—Roland’s choice—where you’re thinking more of the business as a product or an investment. Where do you want to fit in the hierarchy? 
 
If you want to be above, then you need to look for a business that’s not owner-operated. But owner-operated businesses are more affordable and readily available. If you do decide to buy one, you look first at the owner who’s selling. Maybe they don’t want to leave the business entirely. Maybe they still want to work there; they just don’t want to own it and have all the responsibilities. 
 
If the owner wants to leave, and you don’t want to be the operator, there’s a good chance that there’s someone in a managing role in the business (the CFO, CMO, COO, or CRO) who would like to run it. That’s a good person to think about interviewing, because they already have the experience.
 
If not them, then maybe a key employee who has been there 15-20 years would love to step up into the role. Even if they’re not qualified to do everything, you can hire someone to support them.
 
If not them, look at consultants or contractors the company has hired in the past for key roles. They have a long history and knowledge of the company. 
 
The next level is to query your network, to ask around. If that doesn’t work, you can hire a recruiting company. 
 
#3: Stay away from industries with a lot of regulations.
 
If you want simplicity, steer clear away from these. If it’s in the health space, and you don’t have experience/credentials in the industry, stay away from it. 
 
#4: Think about industries where you already have experience.
 
This will be very helpful and will give you a head start in growing your business.
 
#5: Consider an industry where you already have contacts or connections.
 
Do you have people who could advise or consult with you or connect you with people who could help?
 
#6: Find a business in an industry that’s growing.
 
One of the best ways to grow a business is to find one in an industry that’s already on a growth trajectory. A rising tide raises all ships.
 
#7: Find a business that’s likely to last. 
 
Don’t buy a business that’s just a fad, like a Y2K business. That’s a very ephemeral industry. It’s fleeting. It’s not going to last long.
 
#8: Find a business you love.
 
If you’re passionate about it, it will be way easier. Just make sure all the other qualifications apply too (no regulations, in a growing industry, likely to last, etc.).
 
#9: Find a business that doesn’t require a lot of capital investment to keep it going.
 
An audio/visual business, for example, has a lot of technical equipment that has to be constantly updated. You’ll spend a lot of money on things that depreciate quickly. If you can find a business that’s simpler, and doesn’t require that capital expenditure, go for that one instead. 
 
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Martha Stewart headlined at T&C 2021 and gave attendees an up close and personal look at her empire, her passions, and her life.
 
In this episode, host Roland Frasier sits down with Martha and a long list of questions (something he’s famous for and Martha compliments him on). They talk about everything from CBD gummies to peacocks to Snoop crashing her daughter’s tea party and a whole bunch more.
 
Listen in for an entertaining conversation with one of the most brilliant entrepreneurs of our time. 
 
What do we need to make a good cocktail?
 
You shouldn’t skimp on the quality of the booze you buy, Martha says. Your bar should be elegant. If you’re going to drink, you might as well drink the really good stuff. Her liquor of choice is Casa Dragones tequila. She has a new wine coming out, but the details are hush hush. She’s pretty excited about the name. Stay tuned. 
 
Tell us about some of the new things you’re doing now.
 
They just soft-launched Martha.com, where you can buy all of Martha’s products plus other people’s products that she’s curated. She has two words that help her choose the products: Need & Want. There are a lot of things that look great, but do you need it and want it? If you live by those two words, you won’t waste money. You’ll save money. You won’t clutter your home, and you’ll have good things. 
 
What did you mean when you said “it’s a good idea to re-pot yourself every 10 years?” 
 
I think change is good, Martha says. When you’re through changing, you’re through. Change often enough that you surprise people and keep them on their toes. Make sure you stay out there, not back here. Look to the future. It can get very boring doing the same thing over and over again. Branch out, try new things, look ahead, adapt and adopt. 
 
What’s your favorite Snoop story?
 
Snoop called one day and asked Martha if he could come over. Her daughter and her friends and kids were over at the farm. Snoop said he was bringing three people, then showed up in his Mercedes bus with a group of eight. They were all sitting on the terrace of her farmhouse and Snoop asked, “what’s that building down there?” (It was Martha’s stable.) “I’m going to go down there and look for some grass,” he said. Every adult followed him.
 
Tell us about creating this category of entertaining that didn’t exist before. 
 
I looked for the void, Martha says. At that time, she wanted a magazine that taught people how to run a home, go to work, take care of the kids, be a well-rounded woman, homemaker, business woman. She was making all these painstakingly handmade Christmas decorations and realized that a lot of women would love them for their homes but didn’t have the time to make them. “Let’s make it for them,” she said. That’s how the product line started. 
 
What is Canopy?
 
Canopy is one of the largest cannabis companies in the world, and the founder told her, at the behest of Snoop, that she should be getting involved. She’s in the CBD world; Snoop is in the THC world. Her gummies are the #1 gummies in America right now, and she has new products coming out for the holidays. She tried hard to emulate the French confection that you get at the end of a dinner in a restaurant in France.
 
You’re on the board of AppHarvest. Tell us about that.
 
Martha says she’s very concerned about feeding the world. She wants everybody to have good food. She visited acres of greenhouses in Russia where everything is grown because the climate is so cold. AppHarvest is doing the same thing in Appalachia (Kentucky). It’s a very central location so that people can eat fresh tomatoes instead of shipping them from far away. It’s sustainable agriculture using a fraction of the water. 
 
You were one of the first people to realize the value of owning your own media. 
 
In 1997 she put together a deal to acquire all her media from Tim

You know what they say about the word “assume,” right? Well, it’s true.
 
Welcome to another snackable episode with Roland Frasier, where he shares bite-sized actionable strategies to help you take your business and life to the next level. 
 
Two separate events happened to him recently that had one important thing in common: someone made an assumption, and things did not go well. Listen in as Roland tells both stories and what he learned from them.
 
Assumption Tale #1:
 
Roland just finished their newest event, Scalable Impact Live, in Austin. He had invited a family member to the event who was there when Roland got off the plane. Apparently he was eight feet away from Roland, but Roland didn’t see him because he was texting/calling his team, trying to get a VIP guest checked in. 
 
He texted the family member the next morning, “I’m at breakfast. Want to join me?” He ended up sending 5-6 texts with no response. Finally Roland texted, “Are you okay? I’m worried about you.”
 
They responded. “I’m upset with you. I waved at you when you got in, then we were standing a couple people behind you in line, and you turned around and looked, but you didn’t say hi. So we went home the next day.”
 
He thought Roland was blowing him off, but he wasn’t. He just wasn’t focused on looking for him. He didn’t walk in thinking he would be there. He said Steve Wozniak made him aware of the fact that he has this inability to recognize faces out of context. Between that and actually looking for someone else, he accidentally blew off a member of his family. 
 
They patched it up, but whew. What a mess.
 
Assumption Tale #2:
 
The second episode happened earlier, but Roland just found out about it last weekend. At Traffic & Conversion Summit, there’s a private room set up for Roland, Ryan Deiss, and Richard Lindner where they meet with celebrities before they go on stage. It’s called the Founders’ Room. They also have a Mastermind called the Founders’ Board. You’ll see where the confusion comes in.
 
Roland walked into the Founders’ Room with Chip Wilson, the founder of lululemon, and there were some people in there who weren’t supposed to be in there. He asked if he could help them, and they said, “No, we’re just having a meeting.” He said, “Well, you can’t. This is a private room, so I’m going to have to ask you to leave.” They were very upset with him. 
 
Roland got a text from one of those people this past weekend and he said he was upset. The guy had asked the event team, “Hey, do you have a place where I can do a meeting?” They asked if he was a founder, and he said yes (because he’s part of the Founders’ Board), and they pointed him to that room.
 
This room is super private, because celebrities have it in their contract that they get a room where no one can bother them while they get ready to go on. But this guy didn’t know that. He was told by the team working the show that he could go in the room. Then Roland came in and kicked him out. He didn’t understand why there would be a lounge for people in the Mastermind, and then he’d get thrown out of it. It didn’t make any sense. 
 
Thankfully that one got straightened as well.
 
Don’t Make Assumptions
 
It comes back to one thing. And it’s one of the Four Agreements in the excellent book by Don Miguel Ruiz. Don’t make assumptions. 
 
Roland’s family member shouldn’t have made the assumption that Roland saw him but blew him off. He could have asked himself, what other version of this story could be at play here? Roland shouldn’t have made the assumption that the guy was in the room without permission. And the guy shouldn’t have made the assumption that Roland was a jerk. 
 
Whatever situations we find ourselves in, if something doesn’t seem right, or someone is treating us unfairly, what else might be going on? What important information

Over the next few podcast episodes, we’ll walk through the 7 Levels of Scale—everything you need to know to grow and scale your business.
 
Co-hosts Roland Frasier and Ryan Deiss just wrapped up their newest event, Scalable Impact Live, where they had their first opportunity to roll out a new framework they call the 7 Levels of Scale. People are always asking them, “Where do I start?” The 7 Levels of Scale answers that question.
 
It took a long time to develop the framework. They had all the pieces, but they needed to tie it together in a simplified way that was transferable and repeatable. In this episode, they unpack the first two levels, but here are all seven:
 
Level #1: Sell and serve 10 customers. Level #2: Build a growth flywheel. Level #3: Build an upgraded scalable operating system. Level #4: Double your take-home pay. Level #5: Build your board. Level #6: Complete an acquisition for expansion. Level #7: Hit your number.  
Two things to keep in mind as you work through these levels one by one. #1: Sequence matters. This is the absolute order of operations. And #2: You can’t skip a step. If you do, it won’t work.
 
Level #1: Sell and Serve 10 Customers
If you have not sold and served 10 unaffiliated customers, that’s the only thing you should be thinking about. Before you get business cards and a logo designed—and that’s just busy work that won’t make you money—you have to prove that people actually want what you’re selling. They want it, and they’ll buy it. And these are 10 people who aren’t your friends and family. 
 
Nothing else matters until something is sold. But there are two phases to it. Sell and serve. Let’s say you sell 10, but you can’t deliver. Or you sell 10 people, but none of them are happy; they’re not getting what they want. You don’t have any business scaling until you’ve sold and served 10. No automation until you’ve sold and served 10. Sell and serve 10, then make a list. Congrats, high five. You’ve ascended beyond Level 1 to Level 2. Now you can think about automation.
 
Level #2: Build a Growth FlyWheel
Now you want to make things predictable and build a system around that. There’s a three step process for doing this: 1.) Map. 2.) Measure. 3.) Plan to improve the measurement.
 
Step 1: Map your growth engine. How are you going to initiate general awareness? Maybe there are multiple awareness channels. What are the biggest 2-3? Do some basic business process mapping to show the flow. At DigitalMarketer (Scalable’s sister company), they do customer value journey mapping. It’s simply mapping/documenting how customers happen from point of awareness to engagement to subscription to that initial point of conversion to ascension and delight.
 
Having a visual map of the journey is the first part. Step 2 is having a scorecard to show you how something is performing. Not random metrics in no particular order. No vanity metrics. Let’s say you’re buying ads on Facebook and Instagram. How do you know it’s working? Let’s track our average cost per click. Let’s track the click-through rate. And let’s track our ROAS. The scorecard shows poor, acceptable, good, awesome. 
 
It’s color-coded, and a human goes in there each week and says, for this metric, here’s what it was and updates the status to red, yellow, or green. Doing it manually changes your perspective. When people are accountable to a metric and have to record it manually, they actually know their numbers. 
 
Creating a growth flywheel isn't just about putting in a lot of automations. It’s about aligning your sales and growth process—and the people who are responsible for it—toward a common objective.
 
Everybody agrees that this is how a customer happens. Then everybody agrees what “good” is at each stage and creates the dashboard. Then there are people responsible for each of those. 
On the front end, this is how it should be—t