Industry Relations

Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson
  • 4.9 (33)
  • TECHNOLOGY
  • UPDATED WEEKLY
Industry Relations

This is Industry Relations, a podcast that is at the intersection of real estate and technology from an insider’s perspective. Hosted weekly by Rob Hahn (The Notorious ROB) and Greg Robertson.

  1. 3D AGO

    Has the fat lady sung on CCP?

    **This podcast was recorded the Friday BEFORE the announcement from NAR on CCP** In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg dissect the latest drama surrounding NAR’s Clear Cooperation Policy (CCP), the DOJ’s stance on MLS rules, and the future of PropTech in a shifting real estate landscape. They analyze how recent DOJ statements are being interpreted (or misinterpreted), debate whether the MLS still holds power over large brokerages, and discuss the potential consequences of a fragmented listing system. Key Takeaways • DOJ’s Footnote Controversy: Did the DOJ “call out” misleading claims about CCP, or is the industry reading too much into a footnote? • The Power Struggle Over MLS Data: Rob argues large brokerages are taking control over listing distribution, while Greg questions whether MLSs still provide enough value to keep them in check. • The PropTech Dilemma: What happens to tools like CMAs, reverse prospecting, and analytics when listings become fragmented across private networks? • Compass’s Playbook: Is Compass leading the charge toward a new listing system, or just using exclusive listings as a leverage play? • Enforcement vs. Policy: Greg insists MLS rules work because agents police each other, while Rob questions whether large firms can simply ignore the rules with no real consequences. Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    1h 2m

  2. MAR 19

    Organized Real Estate's Head Spinning Week

    In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg break down three major real estate bombshells—the rumored Compass acquisition of Berkshire Hathaway HomeServices (BHHS), the Redfin-Rocket merger, and the potential shake-up of NAR’s Clear Cooperation Policy (CCP). They discuss whether Compass is actually in talks with BHHS or if this is just Wall Street speculation, how Redfin and Rocket could disrupt the brokerage model, and why NAR might be making CCP optional to dodge legal liability.  Key Takeaways • Compass x BHHS Rumors: Wall Street Journal reported that Compass was acquiring BHHS—but BHHS CEO Gino Blefari strongly denied it. So what’s the truth? • The Redfin-Rocket Power Move: Why Rocket’s mortgage empire could turn Redfin into Zillow’s biggest competitor—and how Respa exemptions give them an edge. • NAR’s CCP Shake-Up: Is NAR making CCP optional just to shift legal liability onto MLSs? Rob and Greg debate whether this is NAR’s “race to irrelevance.” • Does Warren Buffett Want Out of Real Estate?: If BHHS is actually up for sale, what does that say about the future of traditional brokerages? • How the MLS Landscape Could Change: If MLSs get to decide CCP for themselves, will we see regional MLS battles over compliance and cooperation?   Be the first to see the new app, Tuesday! Register here   Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    53 min

  3. MAR 13

    More questions than answers

    In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg tackle three major industry shake-ups: Gary Keller selling a stake in Keller Williams, REX losing its lawsuit against NAR and Zillow, and the launch of a new NAR alternative, AREA, by Mauricio Umansky and Jason Haber. They debate what these moves mean for the future of real estate, the ongoing battle over commission structures, and whether the DOJ’s real target is the MLS monopoly. If you’re looking for sharp analysis with a side of sarcasm, this episode delivers.   Key Takeaways • Keller Williams Goes Private Equity: Gary Keller sells a stake to Stone Point Capital—what does this mean for KW’s future and private equity’s role in real estate? • The Death of REX?: REX loses its lawsuit against Zillow and NAR. Was this just a bad case, or is the DOJ preparing to take a bigger swing? • AREA’s New MLS Policy: Mauricio Umansky and Jason Haber’s new NAR alternative introduces a Clear Collaboration Policy—but is it just a repackaged CCP? • DOJ’s Real Endgame: Rob argues that the Department of Justice doesn’t care about commission lawsuits—it’s after MLS monopolies. • The Free Market MLS Debate: Should agents have multiple MLS options? Greg and Rob debate the risks and rewards of breaking up the monopoly. Watch Us on YouTube        Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    1h 4m

  4. MAR 5

    The Duel over Dual Agency

    In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg dive into the controversy surrounding dual agency, private networks, and the MLS’s role in protecting small brokers. They break down the industry’s long-standing acceptance of brokerage-level dual agency while questioning why teams are getting a pass. Plus, they debate whether Compass’s push to double-end deals is just standard brokerage strategy—or an attempt to reshape the industry. If you want unfiltered takes on where real estate is headed, this episode is for you.   Key Takeaways • Is Brokerage Dual Agency Bad? Rob argues that the industry has historically supported it—so why the sudden outrage? • The Compass Controversy: Greg and Rob discuss whether Compass is playing the same game as everyone else or trying to blow up the MLS for its own benefit. • The Team Dual Agency Dilemma: Should teams be held to a different standard? Rob questions why brokerages get a pass but teams don’t. • MLS Protection for Small Brokers: Rob suggests the MLS has always been designed to protect smaller brokerages—should that continue? • The Future of Private Listings: If brokers create exclusive networks, will they face lawsuits—or is that just scare tactics? Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    54 min

  5. FEB 26

    Let Freedom Ring!

    In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg break down the latest in the ongoing battle over NAR’s three-way agreement and how Phoenix Realtors’ recent compromise with NAR might reshape the industry. They explore whether this is a true win for NAR or just the beginning of a major shift, debating the rise of the “Freedom Plan” and how it could spread across the country. With bold predictions, deep industry insights, and a fair amount of sarcasm, this episode is a must-listen for anyone keeping an eye on real estate governance.   Key Takeaways • Phoenix Realtors’ “Compromise”: Did they cave to NAR, or did they find a way to rewrite the rules on their own terms? • The Freedom Plan vs. Realtor Membership: How the rebranded “Non-Member MLS Access” could be the start of a larger movement. • Will Other Associations Follow?: If Phoenix can do it, why wouldn’t Scottsdale and other local associations jump on board? • State Associations’ Next Move: Will Arizona Realtors create their own version of the Freedom Plan to retain members? • Is the Three-Way Agreement Dead?: Rob argues that this move could mark the beginning of the end for NAR’s traditional membership structure   Inman News: NAR, Phoenix Realtors settle fight over MLS Choice   Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    58 min

  6. FEB 19

    Live from the Virtual MLS Summit its Rob and Greg!

    Overview In this special live episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg broadcast from the Virtual MLS Summit, where they tackle one of the biggest questions in real estate today: What does “cooperation” mean in a post-settlement world? They explore how the industry’s shift away from compensation impacts the role of MLSs, debate the long-standing relationship between brokerages and associations, and challenge whether MLSs should truly be considered “broker cooperatives.” This episode is packed with bold insights, historical context, and plenty of Rob vs. Greg fireworks.   Key Takeaways • The Evolution of Cooperation: With compensation no longer tied to MLS participation, what does cooperation actually mean now? • MLS Governance and Broker Control: If MLSs are broker cooperatives, why are associations still making the rules? • The Fiduciary Duty Dilemma: Can cooperation exist when agents owe full fiduciary duties to their clients? • The Government’s Potential Role: If the industry doesn’t self-regulate effectively, will federal regulators step in and take over? • Lessons from Global Real Estate: Why other countries envy the U.S. MLS system—and what we risk losing if we dismantle it. Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    39 min

  7. FEB 12

    What to do about Zombies

    In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg dive into one of the most heated debates yet—was NAR’s fight for survival a necessary battle, or did it do more harm than good? They analyze the fallout from the settlement, discuss the rise of leaders like Michelle Harrington who are ditching corporate-speak for real talk, and debate whether NAR should have surrendered years ago to avoid the lawsuits entirely.   Key Takeaways • Michelle Harrington’s Blunt Truths: The First Team CEO calls the settlement “bulls***,” and Rob and Greg love her authenticity. • Corporate-Speak vs. Real Talk: Why real estate leaders should ditch the PR fluff and embrace straight-shooting communication. • The $2 Billion Club Controversy: Why independent brokerages feel abandoned and how the settlement exposed them to legal threats. • Should NAR Have Surrendered in 2018? Rob argues they could have avoided everything if they had just given in earlier. Greg pushes back. • Zombie Members or Hostages? Rob says NAR fought to protect dues from disengaged agents. Greg insists they were an opportunity, not a liability.   Inman story on FirstTeam CEO, Michelle Harrington; "A broker left out of NAR settlement gets candid: 'I'm still pissed'" Todd Carpenter's LinkedIn post on "Zombie members vs. Super members" Rob Substack, "Between Black Pill and White Pill"   Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    59 min

  8. FEB 5

    MLS Reset Recap

    In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg recap Greg’s recent MLS Reset conference and dive into key industry insights. They discuss governance reform, competition between MLSs, data sharing agreements, and bold ideas for innovation in the real estate world. From pitch battles for tech innovation to thought-provoking commentary on leadership, this episode offers plenty of takeaways for industry professionals. Key Takeaways • MLS Reset Conference Recap: Greg shares highlights, including impactful presentations by Brian Boero, Michael Wurzer, and Curt Beardsley, Ben Graboske, who challenged the industry to embrace optimism. • Governance Reform: Rob emphasizes the importance of reducing board sizes and increasing nimbleness • Data Sharing and Competition: Rob and Greg debate whether MLSs should compete on services, price, and tech while maintaining data-sharing agreements. • Source MLS Branding: A conversation on Michael Wurzer’s Source MLS concept as a trusted, transparent data brand.   Watch Us on YouTube    Connect with Rob and Greg:  Rob’s Website Greg’s Website   Our Sponsors: CoreLogic Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board   Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    56 min
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4.9
out of 5
33 Ratings

About

This is Industry Relations, a podcast that is at the intersection of real estate and technology from an insider’s perspective. Hosted weekly by Rob Hahn (The Notorious ROB) and Greg Robertson.

Information

  • Creator
    Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson
  • Years Active
    2017 - 2025
  • Episodes
    100
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Rob Hahn & Greg Robertson
  • Show Website
    Industry Relations

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