Drafting the Past

Kate Carpenter

Drafting the Past is a podcast devoted to the craft of writing history. Each episode features an interview with a historian about the joys and challenges of their work as a writer.

  1. 5D AGO

    Matthew Avery Sutton Religiously Opposes the Block Quote

    Before we get to the episode, I need a favor: Will you take a minute to fill out this survey about Drafting the Past, and let me know what is and isn't working for you about the show? It will help me bring even better episodes to you. Thanks in advance for your help! In this episode, I'm happy to welcome historian of religion Dr. Matthew Avery Sutton. Matt's newest book is called Chosen Land: How Christianity Made America and Americans Remade Christianity, following the relationship between Christianity and the nation from the arrival of the first Europeans up to Donald Trump's second term in office. Matt is the author of three previous books, along with an edited collection and a documentary history, and he regularly writes about the history of Christianity in America for a general audience. We talked about how he thinks about all those different audiences and how he keeps writing so much despite many personal and professional responsibilities—including seven years as department chair. Mentioned in this episode: Matthew Avery Sutton, Chosen Land: How Christianity Made America and Americans Remade Christianity Matthew Avery Sutton, Double Crossed: The Missionaries Who Spied for the United States During the Second World War Matthew Avery Sutton, American Apocalypse: A History of Modern Evangelicalism Matthew Avery Sutton, Aimee Semple McPherson and the Resurrection of Christian America American Experience: Sister Aimee Jane Sherron De Hart, Ruth Bader Ginsburg: A Life Grant Wacker, Heaven Below: Early Pentecostals and American Culture David Hollinger Stephen King, On Writing: A Memoir of the Craft John le Carré Jill Lepore, These Truths: A History of the United States Matthew Avery Sutton, "The antichrist has long haunted American politics. Now it's rearing its head again," The Guardian Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links.

    47 min

  2. MAR 24

    Rhae Lynn Barnes and the Writing Advice She Didn't Take

    In this episode, host Kate Carpenter is joined by Dr. Rhae Lynn Barnes to talk about book Darkology: Blackface and the American Way of Entertainment. Rhae Lynn is an assistant professor of history at Princeton University. With meticulous research and piles of evidence, Darkology reveals the widespread and persistent use of amateur blackface minstrelsy across the United States from the Civil War through the early 2000s. Rhae Lynn is also the co-editor of three books, the founder of open-access teaching resource U.S. History Scene, and was featured in and served as an executive advisor for the PBS documentary series Reconstruction. Researching and writing Darkology took a stunning amount of research, as well as a mental toll, and I'm grateful to Rhae Lynn for talking about how she grappled with all of it, the unusual challenges she faced when thinking about visuals for the book, and much more. Plus, she shares some excellent wisdom for how to keep going even when it seems too hard, or when you don't feel like you belong. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Mentioned in this episode: Rhae Lynn Barnes, Darkology: Blackface and the American Way of Entertainment Rhae Lynn Barnes, Keri Leigh Merritt, and Yohuru Williams, eds., After Life: A Collective History of Loss and Redemption in Pandemic America Rhae Lynn Barnes and Catherine Clinton, eds., Roe v. Wade: Fifty Years After Rhae Lynn Barnes and Glenda Goodman, eds., American Contact: Objects of Intercultural Encounters and the Boundaries of Book History Rhae Lynn Barnes, "Yes, politicians wore blackface. It used to be all-American 'fun.'" The Washington Post Maya Angelou's 1992 commencement address at Spelman College, in which she tells her audience "bring your people with you" Sandra Cisneros, "I Hate the Iowa Writers Workshop" Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links.

    1h 7m

  3. MAR 17

    Emily Lieb Writes (and Rewrites) Through It

    Historian and writer Emily Lieb's professional history is a fascinating one, from crafting textbooks for kids to leaving a job as a professor to become a full-time writer. She taught history and urban studies at Seattle University for more than a decade. Now, in addition to her work as a historian, she also works for the Derfner & Sons writing agency.   Her first book came out in 2025 after many years of research, writing and revision. It's called Road to Nowhere: How a Highway Map Wrecked Baltimore, and it tells the story of a plan to build an expressway through Black, middle-class community in Baltimore, and how even though the road was never built, the plan paved the way for the destruction of a vibrant neighborhood. It's a history that echoes similar ones in cities across the United States, and Emily uses it to tell a fascinating but frustrating, deeply human story about racial inequality and the resistance of determined residents. Emily had a clear vision of how she wanted to tell this history, right down to the kind of book it should be, and you'll learn a lot in this interview from how she got there and her frank approach to writing and editing. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Mentioned in this episode: Emily Lieb, Road to Nowhere: How a Highway Map Wrecked Baltimore Derfner & Sons  Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird, the origin of the phrase "s****y first drafts" Andrew Hartman also praised editor Tim Mennel in episode 69  Calvin Trillin, "Thoughts Brought On By Prolonged Exposure to Exposed Brick" Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links.

    55 min

  4. MAR 10

    Episode 90: Matthew Delmont Works on Pacing and Character

    In this episode, Kate is joined by Dr. Matthew Delmont. Matt is a professor and associate dean at Dartmouth University, and he is the author of six books. His two most recent books are Half American: The Epic Story of American Americans Fighting World War II at Home and Abroad, which came out in 2022, and Until the Last Gun is Silent: A Story of Patriotism, the Vietnam War, and the Fight to Save America's Soul, which just came out this year. Matt has also worked on numerous digital history projects, and he is the winner of a Guggenheim Fellowship and National Endowment for the Humanities Public Scholar award. In Until the Last Gun is Silent, Matt pairs the story of Coretta Scott King's antiwar activism during the Vietnam War with that of Dwight "Skip" Johnson, who received the Medal of Honor for his service in Vietnam before his life ended tragically after his return to Detroit. It's a combination that illuminates the meaning of the Vietnam War for Black Americans. We talked about how Matt has worked on his voice and narrative style to reach new audiences, as well as how the intriguing historical narrative pairing in this book came to be. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Mentioned in this episode: Matthew F. Delmont, Until the Last Gun is Silent: A Story of Patriotism, the Vietnam War, and the Fight to Save America's Soul Matthew F. Delmont, Half American: The Epic Story of American Americans Fighting World War II at Home and Abroad Matthew F. Delmont, Black Quotidian: Everyday History in African American Newspapers Matthew F. Delmont, Making Roots: A Nation Captivated Matthew F. Delmont, Why Busing Failed: Race, Media, and the National Resistance to School Desegregation Matthew F. Delmont, The Nicest Kids in Town: American Bandstand, Rock 'n' Roll, and the Struggle for Civil Rights in 1950s Philadelphia Tiya Miles Annette Gordon Reed Jeanne Theoharis, The Rebellious Life of Mrs. Rosa Parks and King of the North: Martin Luther King Jr.'s Life of Struggle Outside the South Peggy Pascoe, What Comes Naturally: Miscegenation Law and the Making of Race in America Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links.

    38 min

  5. MAR 3

    Richard Bell Boils and Distills

    In this episode we're taking a look at another great new book on this history of the American Revolution: The American Revolution and the Fate of the World, by Richard Bell. In this book, we get to see how the revolution affected not only North America, but most of the world. To learn more about how you write a book that manages to cover such a massive subject with remarkable alacrity, I'm joined by the author of The American Revolution and the Fate of the World, Dr. Richard Bell. Rick Bell is a professor of history at the University of Maryland and is the author of three books, as well as an edited collection. His first book was We Shall Be No More: Suicide and Self-Government in the Newly United States, which came out in 2012. He followed that up with Stolen: Five Free Boys Kidnapped Into Slavery and Their Astonishing Odyssey Home, an award-winning book that was published in 2019. The American Revolution and the Fate of the World came out at the end of last year. He has also created two streaming courses through the Great Courses series online, with a third on the way. I have to tell you, I was a little surprised at how I absolutely devoured this book, and I was even more surprised to learn how it came together. I think you'll love learning about Rick's approach to writing, his thinking about structure and character, and his habit of wandering the halls of his department, talking to himself. Here's my interview with Dr. Rick Bell. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links. Mentioned in this episode: Richard Bell, The American Revolution and the Fate of the World Richard Bell, Stolen: Five Free Boys Kidnapped Into Slavery and Their Astonishing Odyssey Home Richard Bell, We Shall Be No More: Suicide and Self-Government in the Newly United States Richard Bell on Great Courses Plus: "America's Long Struggle Against Slavery" Richard Bell on Great Courses Plus: "Ordinary Americans in the Revolution" Zotero Octet musical Alan Taylor Jill Lepore Eric Foner Ira Berlin Ilyon Woo, Master Slave Husband Wife: An Epic Journey from Slavery to Freedom Edward P. Jones, The Known World

    57 min

  6. FEB 24

    Sonya Bonczek Gives Us the Scoop on Book Publicity

    In most episodes, I interview an author of nonfiction history about their research and writing process, but in today's episode we get to do something a little different. We're taking a closer look at how authors and presses get the word out about new books. And we're going to do that with an insider's perspective. I'm very excited to be joined in this episode by Sonya Bonczek, the director of publicity and communications for University of North Carolina Press. I have exchanged many emails with Sonya over the past few years whenever I've had podcast guests who publish with UNC Press, and I've been impressed at the great publicity work that Sonya and her team are doing. So when I thought about who might be able to bring us a publicist's perspective, she was first on my list. I was eager to hear from Sonya about how book publicity has changed throughout her career, what works and what doesn't, what she wishes more authors know, and how she's feeling about the state of the book industry today, especially when it comes to nonfiction history. Mentioned in this episode: Support Drafting the Past on Patreon Amanda Ice, Harvard University Press publicist, on Your Words Unleashed UNC Press on Instagram UNC Press on TikTok New York Magazine's 2008 article on whether book publishing would end The New York Times, "'Luddite' Teens Don't Want Your Likes", December 2022 Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more.

    53 min

  7. FEB 17

    Andrew Edwards Wants to Make You Feel Something About Money

    In case you haven't been paying attention—or maybe you don't live in the United States--you should know that this year marks 250 years since the Declaration of Independence. If you prefer funny words, you can call it America's semiquincentennial. Anyway, what this means for us is that there are a shocking number of books about the American Revolution, the early United States, and related subjects coming out this year. You're going to hear some of them on this show, starting with today's episode. One of the fascinating things that these books will show us is just how many ways you can approach history. So first up, in this episode, I'm joined by Dr. Andrew Edwards to talk about his new book, Money and the Making of the American Revolution. Andrew is a lecturer at the University of St. Andrew in Scotland, and a historian of capitalism, money, and early America. In Money and the Making of the American Revolution he takes a deep dive into the role of money—and the meaning of money—as one of the key causes of the American Revolution. Andrew tells the story of money in the American colonies and in Great Britain to explain that it was a fight over money and who got to define it, rather than taxes, that kicked off the colonists' rebellion. If that sounds dry and maybe a little confusing to you, I'm happy to report that Andrew does a remarkable job of telling this history in a way that is interesting even to those of us who don't love making sense of obscure fiscal policies. In our conversation, we talked about just how he did that and why he wrote an avid defense of narrative history in the book's introduction. But first, he tells us about the very winding road he took to becoming a historian in the first place. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Mentioned in this episode: Andrew David Edwards, Money and the Making of the American Revolution Zotero Eelco Runia, "Presence," History and Theory 45, no. 1 (2006), 1-29 Olaudah Equiano, The Interesting Narrative and Other Writings Martha Sandweiss, The Girl in the Middle: A Recovered History of the American West and Passing Strange: A Gilded Age Tale of Love and Deception Across the Color Line (Isabela Morales also mentioned Martha Sandweiss' history writing course in her episode of Drafting the Past) Karl Jacoby, Shadows at Dawn: An Apache Massacre and the Violence of History R. F. Kuang, Katabasis Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links.

    50 min

  8. FEB 10

    From the Archive: Isabela Morales Protects the Writer's Spirit

    Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Hi everybody! I'm taking this week off to work on some things behind the scenes, so I wanted to talk this chance to replay an episode from early in the podcast that I love. I know many of you are devoted listeners who have listened to every episode of the show, but in case you're newer to the podcast, here's a chance to revisit an earlier interview. Back in August 2022, I first released my interview with Dr. Isabela Morales. She had recently published her first book, Happy Dreams of Liberty, and she was working multiple jobs in public history. I particularly love this episode because Isabela speaks so poignantly about her commitment to narrative history and holding on to that writerly spirit in graduate school. I'm very pleased to report that after we spoke, Happy Dreams of Liberty went on to win multiple well-deserved book awards, including the prestigious Frederick Douglass Book Prize in 2023. I reached out to Isabela for an update on what she's working on these days. At the end of 2025, she wrapped up her time at the Stoutsburg Sourland African American Museum, and is now working full-time on her second book. She hinted at that book at the end of this interview, and it's now under contract with Liveright for W. W. Norton and tentatively titled The Black Widow of Hazel Green. Here's what Isabela told me about that book: It is a biography of Elizabeth Dale, a wealthy white plantation mistress and enslaver in antebellum Alabama, who was married six times and to this day is rumored to have murdered some or all of her husbands. While I think six dead husbands is enough to pique most people's interest, I also find Elizabeth Dale interesting historically as an embodiment of white women's deep but often-overlooked complicity in the institution of slavery. Having read Happy Dream of Liberty, I am eagerly awaiting Isabela's new book. In the meantime, though, it's inspiring to revisit this conversation with her. Even if you're heard this one before, I think you'll be rejuvenated by another listen. And if it's your first time, you're in for a treat. I'll be back next week with another fantastic new episode. Until then, please enjoy this marvelous interview from the archive, with Dr. Isabela Morales. Original show notes: For this episode of Drafting the Past, I interviewed Dr. Isabela Morales, writer and public historian. She is the editor and project manager of  The Princeton & Slavery Project and the digital projects manager at the Stoutsburg Sourland African American Museum, central New Jersey's first Black history museum. ​Dr. Morales received her Ph.D. in history from Princeton University in 2019, specializing in the 19th-century United States, slavery, and emancipation. Her first book, Happy Dreams of Liberty: An American Family in Slavery and Freedom, was published earlier this year by Oxford University Press. We talked about how work as a public historian influences her writing, why guinea pigs are essential to her process, and the fiction she reads to learn how to evoke a place and time. MENTIONED IN THE SHOW: Find Isabela Morales on Twitter, @IsabelaWrites Evernote, the software Isabela uses for organizing her research Tiya Miles, Ties that Bind Martha Sandweiss, Passing Strange Erik Larson, The Devil in the White City Hilary Mantel, Wolf Hall and A Place of Greater Safety Martha Hodes, The Sea Captain's Wife Daniel Sharfstein, The Invisible Line Suzanne Lebsock, A Murder in Virginia

    40 min
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About

Drafting the Past is a podcast devoted to the craft of writing history. Each episode features an interview with a historian about the joys and challenges of their work as a writer.

Information

  • Creator
    Kate Carpenter
  • Years Active
    2022 - 2026
  • Episodes
    96
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © 2025
  • Show Website
    Drafting the Past

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