Finding Nature

Nathan Robertson-Ball

Find inspiration and guidance for the change you want to create and learn how others have achieved it in their life and work in pursuit of a more just, safe and healthier future. Nourishment for the change making class.

  1. Modelling A Dangerous Future - Timothy Neal Is Leading The World In Understanding The Economic Impacts Of Climate Change

    1 day ago

    Modelling A Dangerous Future - Timothy Neal Is Leading The World In Understanding The Economic Impacts Of Climate Change

    A category of guest I really enjoy speaking with though are those who are on the way up. People like Holly Ransom or Kal Klanznig or Vanessa Pirotta who are clearly going places - it’s a thrill to spend a little bit of time with them before they accomplish even more. Today’s guest doesn’t have the public or social media profile of those three, but I hope that is to change in next little while. Timothy Neal is a senior scientia fellow in the Department of Economics at the University of New South Wales and also the Institute of Climate Risk and Response. Earlier this year he was named Australia’s leading researcher in probability and statistics with applications and in 2021 was the recipient of the prestigious Paul Bourke Award for Early Career Research by the Academy of Social Sciences in Australia. What does that mean he’s an expert in then for those less initiated with economics, statistics and social science - it means his work at the intersection of climate change, casual inference and econometrics is resulting in entirely new ways by which to understand how much we already have and will continue to lose as a result of a changing climate and our civilisation’s collective commitment in dismissing and avoiding the reality of the losses, impacts, damages and harms that have arrived and are now locked in for decades to come. Tim’s work has re-shaped how I think, talk about and worked on physical climate risk - and his work with UNSW colleagues Ben Newell - a former guest on episode 87 - and Andy Pitman - in 2025 dropped a grenade into conventional economic thinking and modelling regarding climate change. How can we know that human activity has fundamentally altered the chemical, biological and physical reality of our atmosphere and still see company after company, regulator after regulator, reserve bank after reserve bank tell us that their numbers are telling us there is nothing to see here? How can a company write that climate change represents a material financial risk to their business then claim their scenario analysis process presents a near-zero loss future due to climate change? It makes no sense. Tim’s work has helped me understand why that is, what needs to change in economics to redress this and how all of us as lay people can better engage with the real but complex reality of attempting to understand what disaster after disaster means for economic performance nationally and across the globe. In this chat we get into Tim’s recent work on economic losses already able to be quantified and mounting up just in NSW, his seminal work on global macroeconomic loss results as well as what his research into panic buying and hoarding at the onset of Covid may have in stall for us as we face a future certain to be more volatile, dangerous and disaster-prone. Some extra reading relevant to this episode from our friends at Altiorem.  Making the case: Macroeconomic risk & portfolio impact: A tool for system-level investors The macroeconomic impact of climate change: Global vs. local temperature Discourses of climate delay Check out Planet Protein and receive 10% off your first order when you sign up.  Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 32min
  2. Risking Life And Saving Pristine Ecosystems - Sukundemi Walks Before Manu Peni

    30 June

    Risking Life And Saving Pristine Ecosystems - Sukundemi Walks Before Manu Peni

    One person who for a decade now has fought against the construction of what would be the largest mine in the South Pacific in Papua New Guinea by an Australian headquartered but Chinese backed mining operation in a pristine landscape in one of the world’s most seismically active locations. Manu Peni is that man and today’s guest, and I was fortunate to meet and spend time with Manu during his recent trip to Sydney for the premier of the documentary Sukundimi Walks Before Me at the Sydney Film Festival, which won the Sustainable Future Award there too. Captured by the film is the remarkable story of the work Manu has led for ten years in the creation of the Supreme Sukundimi Declaration - a signing by 28 different clans along the Speik River to protect it from the mine and its approval. The Sepik River is over 1,100 kilometres in length and is one of the last unspoiled river systems anywhere in the world, and the plans of the mine would seriously risk its health and that of every person and species living along and relying upon the surrounding ecosystems. Manu’s story is bigger than words allow to describe. He is diligent, charismatic, intelligent, grounded and ambitious, all things he’s needed to be over the course of this battle which has included threats to him and his family. Beyond just the Save the Sepik campaign though, we talk about the concept of imposed development, how climate change has already affected the lives and livelihoods and Papua New Guineans and the deleterious impacts mining projects like Porgera, Ok Tedi and Bougainville have had when western interests have steamrolled the interests and safety of local people. Manu represents a vision of living and the future we desperately need. I hope you’re inspired by listening. Support for this episode comes from: Planet Protein - double the value of your first order at no extra cost.Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 11min
  3. The God We Made - Anna Goldsworthy Wants To Know Why We're Building A Future No One Wants To Live In

    23 June

    The God We Made - Anna Goldsworthy Wants To Know Why We're Building A Future No One Wants To Live In

    Is artificial intelligence here to solve every wicked and intractable problem our society currently faces? Will it morph into Skynet and become a paperclip maximiser that eradicates humanity to optimise for paperclip manufacturing? Will it just slowly degrade our information, political and economic systems? Will it be a net positive for a very small, very powerful and very rich group of white men and create uncertainty and insecurity for the remainder? AI is one of my favourite topics to get into on this show and this week I have Anna Goldsworthy here to chat about it after the release of her recent Quarterly essay; The God We Made, The Threat and Promise of Artificial Intelligence. As someone who recently got the redundancy bullet from an organisation that’s gone into a strategic alliance with one of the biggest AI companies in the world, and who before that saw the pernicious and quite strange ways by which it was being espoused as the elixir to all things human, I was really looking forward to reading Anna’s work and spending some time with her. As you’ll hear in the chat, I don’t have the most optimist view on where this is all going and the case outlined is an unsettling one. Anna’s essay though circles one fundamental question - how to live wisely and agreeably and well? Does AI help this or harm our individual and collective aspirations for life on this planet? There’s myriad answers and potential pathways and this is where context matters. When the context is that a very small number of players are in charge of where this technology goes, when the underlying political and economic system is about growth - no matter if it’s harmful or reckless or generating ghost GDP - and when previous and ongoing calamity and crisis has barely touched the side of a western development mindset, I find it hard not to be cynical about how AI has and will continue to shape and affect our lives. Anna is an unusual voice in this debate which made speaking to her more compelling. A pianist and teacher, her career in academia doesn’t indicate that writing about AI was going to be a feature of her work. It’s entirely relevant though when we step back to see how music, the arts and culture more broadly have been and are transmitted through personal relations, something AI and our compulsive relationship to any and all screens intervenes on. In this conversation we speak a little about some of the darker, more existential perils of the suite of technologies that make up AI, more than that though we talk about what it means to be human and how our humanity has been and is affected by technology. And in AI the threat of losing connection, agency, dignity, meaning and our sense of reality seems possible, if not entirely likely. In the God we Made, Anna makes the argument that we always seemed to know it was going to happen. Prometheus stole fire, pandora opened the box, Icarus flew too close to the sun, Oppenheimer built the bomb. Is that what we’re about to do? Check out the Pope's Encyclical Letter On Safeguarding The Human Person In The Time Of Artificial Intelligence.  Support for this episode comes from: Reposit Power - $500 off your solar battery installation. Planet Protein - double the value of your first order at no extra cost.Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 21min
  4. Imagining And Making A Whole New Human World - Katherine Trebeck On The Pursuit Of Economics As Just A Means

    16 June

    Imagining And Making A Whole New Human World - Katherine Trebeck On The Pursuit Of Economics As Just A Means

    Today’s guest is Katherine Trebeck. Katherine is a political economist, writer and advocate for economic system change and from when I saw her speak at the end of 2024 I knew I wanted to spend some time learning directly from her. She’s the Economic Change Lead at The Next Economy, Strategic Advisor to the Centre for Policy Development and member of the Club of Rome. She teaches at the University of Edinburgh and is a Distinguished Visitor at the Australian National University. Katherine also co-founded the Wellbeing Economy Alliance, spent eight years at Oxfam where she developed their Humankind Index plus co-authored the book The Economics of Arrival. If there is anyone anywhere to talk to about changing our current economic paradigm, Katherine is certainty it. And that’s exactly why I wanted to speak with Katherine - to understand the plausibility and potentiality of economic systems change, and what that would mean for myriad issues our society currently faces. Paradigm shifting is a very long way from being an easy feat, especially when the obstacles to change posed by vested interests and powerful individuals and groups are all on show in our world right now. From blatant billionaire interference in Australia’s media and political systems to the structures that keep locked in regimes that harm people and planet, the time for large-scale change - maybe even whisper it, revolution - seems increasingly palatable for many. Katherine’s work has been at the forefront of understanding how different economic theories and development frameworks offer an opportunity to re-think how we live, how we relate to each other and what we truly value. This conversation goes all over the place - from transparency in political lobbying to the economic change movement, a potential perception gap in how we think others might react to our desires for change and what better questions for creating the society we want to live in are. Throw in references to Wayne Pearce and the Dark Knight Rises and this is a fun, informative and educative chat. It’s undisputed that the trajectory of more of the same will only bankrupt more souls and decimate ecosystems further. Katherine has the knowledge and experience to help us chart a path to a whole new regime.  Katherine has heaps of work online and I’ve linked up her website and link to her book in the show notes. I highly recommend spending some time familiarising yourself with her work, and find a copy of The Economics of Arrival too.  Support for this episode comes from: Reposit Power - $500 off your solar battery installation. Planet Protein - double the value of your first order at no extra cost.Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 39min
  5. Pursuing Impact - Kate Turner On The Twists And Turns In A Career Seeking Change

    9 June

    Pursuing Impact - Kate Turner On The Twists And Turns In A Career Seeking Change

    Now today’s episode is with Kate Turner. Kate is a recognised leader here and abroad in the world of responsible investment, sustainable finance and ESG data, not to mention an all round great person who hikes, triathlons, meditates, parents and in general is pursuing ways to be helpful and service-oriented. I’ve known Kate a few years now, and having her on the show was a great pleasure. Kate has over twenty years of professional experience across environmental and climate law, developing market renewable energy and carbon product origination, ESG data services and responsible investment. She’s worked across multiple sectors, and is currently serving as the Chair of the Responsible Investment Association of Australasia. I related to a lot of Kate’s personal stories of what drove her to go into environmental law in the first place and a career of choices seeking to find places to make an impact, as well as how to parent in a world seemingly inundated with horror, destruction and deviance. In this chat we get through plenty - from working across markets to develop real projects generating real impact prior to the ESG data verification dilemma, the difficult balancing act between laborious ESG data processes and the need to make a real difference, the shifting investor landscape of the past few years, the differences between the value drivers for action on climate change compared to modern slavery, and the need to build bridges, cooperate and make possible the future we want by building the relational fabric and institutional capacity to withstand the change we want to bring about. We end the chat talking about our own experiences of parenthood in this moment. What to share and how to share it with small kids, the importance of a nature loving indoctrination program from a young age, and also how personal practices and professional support are things we all need to do this work and withstand the heartache of pain and suffering in this world. Kate is one of the most thoughtful sustainability practitioners in Australia, so to spend a little time and enjoy and learn from her perspectives were valuable, and I know you’ll get lots from listening to her. Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 29min
  6. Leaving No Worker Behind And Setting World Records - Alexander Horton Is Holding The Tongs

    2 June

    Leaving No Worker Behind And Setting World Records - Alexander Horton Is Holding The Tongs

    Today’s guest is Alexander Horton - or Big Al as he’s seemingly become through his social media alter ego in recent weeks. Alex is in the midst of breaking a Guiness World Record for the biggest BBQ lesson of all time, as part of a larger mission to break and take back for Australia the record for the biggest BBQ ever - somewhere in the vicinity of 45,000 people. But beyond the BBQ record efforts, Alex is someone who works in what is possibly the most substantial next horizon of necessary activity as part of the energy transition, and definitely the most disregarded. Who actually designs, builds, installs and maintains the infrastructure involved in the largest infrastructural transformation in this nation’s history? By every metric Australia is materially distant from the scores of different types of workers and skillsets required to deliver on its decarbonisation aspirations. And beyond the issue of simply not getting this done, the current dynamic of workforce shortages creates perverse and adverse outcomes - like the information about the lack of quality and care involved in the home battery scheme over the last 12 months. Why would I need to take care and do excellent work when firstly the incentive is just to do the minimal amount of work in the shortest amount of time, but when there is a gigantic shortage of who can install hundreds of thousands of batteries? So I wanted to chat with Alex about the workforce dynamics of Australia’s energy transition, as well as the idea of green jobs and a shift required in the education, story telling and policy landscapes to make headway. From the hundreds of large scale renewable projects and the tens of thousands of kilometres of transmission lines required, to household electricians, to new types of procurement expertise required in a new energy system and the ways by which finance could structure collective benefit community battery programs, the task ahead of Australia is both gargantuan but also exciting. In all of this though is the reality of who loses and how do you support workers and communities affected by the phasing out and structural decline of coal and gas? In a context where examples of successful workforce transitions are almost non existent, what lessons do exist and who takes on responsibility for those who will lose high paying jobs in the communities they call home? In this episode we get into all of this, as well as his Big BBQ concept in much more detail. That comes from a desire to speak with whose who aren’t already engaged and believers in the mission of a renewable energy future that powers new economies. Alex is driving new types of conversations in new types of places, and that’s courageous. It’s easy to stay in the echo chamber and express righteous indignation and point the blame at everybody else. But getting out there, and getting out there publicly in a way where the likelihood of success is only as great as the likelihood of failure is brave. Support for this episode comes from: Reposit Power - $500 off your solar battery installation. Planet Protein - double the value of your first order at no extra cost.Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 33min
  7. Beyond Box Ticking And Addressing Competency Greenwashing - Alexander Pui Wants You To Care

    26 May

    Beyond Box Ticking And Addressing Competency Greenwashing - Alexander Pui Wants You To Care

    Alexander Pui is back on the show today for his third appearance. He’s been one of the most popular guests over the history of the Finding Nature podcast and I jumped at the opportunity to chat again while he was recently back in Sydney. For those who know Alex they know they’re in for the usual standard of excellence regarding all things physical climate risk, the state of activity and effort underway to better understand future scenarios and how the science of climate change is outpacing meaningful efforts to mitigate emissions and their long lasting impacts and risks everywhere. For those newer to the show, Alex has been an important figure in my own career when we worked together at a very large yellow coloured bank in Australia, before he moved to Japan a couple of years ago to take on a lead role in climate risk across Asia Pacific with one of the world’s largest professional services organisations.Over the course of his career he’s worked in banking, insurance, reinsurance and consulting, he’s also an Adjunct Fellow at the University of New South Wales and Visiting Scholar at Kyushu University. For our third time around the Finding Nature microphones we get into a lot of topics and themes that are both updates on previous episodes as well as fresh from both of our insights and work over the last 12 months. From the experience of oppressive heat and new heatwave classification systems in Japan to the impacts of storms, flooding and typhoons across Asia in 2025. We get into the expectations and the science of the emerging super El Niño and what the next period of supercharged climate activity is likely to bring, the quality and value of the recently completed Climate Vulnerability Assessment into the Australian insurance industry, where insurers are and aren’t acting, the lessons and practicalities of climate risk management when all the attention is now on box ticking the new Australian climate disclosure legislation, and one of my very favourite topics - competence greenwashing. There’s also an insight into a potential climate resilience idea in Japan for the Australian listener right at the very end, so stay tuned for that one and get in contact if it interests you. Support for this episode comes from: Reposit Power - $500 off your solar battery installation. Planet Protein - double the value of your first order at no extra cost.Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 39min
  8. What It Takes - Adrian MacDonald Leads An Ultra Life

    19 May

    What It Takes - Adrian MacDonald Leads An Ultra Life

    So imagine that it’s 5am and you're standing in the cold and dark in the Blue Mountains, you’re there with 1500 other people. You’re carrying all the gear you’ll need for the next 24 hours, a headlamp on, and what lays ahead is running 100 kilometres through the beauty that is the Blue Mountains. Up and down the cliffsides, through and across the Megalong, Jamison and Kedumba Valleys. For almost no prize money for those that finish as the first few through, little notoriety outside of this niche community, why do these people do something that appears entirely insane, if not downright dangerous to the normal person. To pursue. To seek. To explore limits, potential, to understand what it is we’re truly capable of. And today’s guest is a real treat, and one of the very best in the world at not only running really far, but at speeds that would put him at the front of every running group you’ve ever seen. Adrian MacDonald is one of the world’s best ultra distance runners, and it was both a thrill and a pleasure to speak with him in the lead up to him racing in Ultra Trail Australia over the weekend, where he placed third in an astonishing time of 9 hours and 32 minutes to cover 101 kilometres to go with 4400 metres of elevation. So why would I want to speak with an ultra running distance athlete on what is ostensibly a podcast about sustainability and issues like climate change, corporate incentive structures and justice? Because to me the ultra athlete and the sustainability professional are ultimately the same archetype. Both are seeking to shift norms and seek accomplishments well outside of what the current system ill-defines as appropriate and acceptable. The ultra athlete perseveres, as does the sustainability professional. The ultra athlete needs total clarity of purpose to withstand the ups and downs of whatever a course and race will throw at them, as does the sustainability professional. The ultra athlete is a model for those of us seeking change, to do what seems implausible and to practice action with deliberacy, intention and constant attention to all the small details in pursuit of that grand dream. Adrian’s story though, even for an ultra athlete, where unusual stories and maverick personalities are the regular, really is something else. A track and road marathon athlete of serious note, Covid upended his Boston Marathon ambitions in 2020, and living in Fort Collins, Colorado, nestled against the Rocky Mountains, he hit the trails. Less than 18 months later he won one of the world’s most prestigious ultra marathons - the Leadville 100 - before backing up again 12 months later and also winning another big race in New Zealnd - three from three in his first three ultras. A new star was born. Since then, Adrian’s life has shifted from being a regular financial controller at Colorado State University to a sponsored athlete with one of the world’s leading apparel and shoe brands, and racing in Europe, across the US, Australia, New Zealand, South America and Africa. What he’s achieved is the desired story of every sustainability professional - to work diligently, outside of the limelight, until one day, a largely unpredictable day, shifts how life was and will no longer be how it was again. Speaking with Adrian, being able to spend time with someone of such pedigree, has lit a fire in me. I hope it does the same for you. Support for this episode comes from: Reposit Power - $500 off your solar battery installation. Planet Protein - double the value of your first order at no extra cost.Send me a message Thanks for listening. Follow Finding Nature on Instagram

    1hr 22min
4.6
out of 5
17 Ratings

About

Find inspiration and guidance for the change you want to create and learn how others have achieved it in their life and work in pursuit of a more just, safe and healthier future. Nourishment for the change making class.

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