Elena Poniatowska, Mexico’s most celebrated journalist and one of the most significant literary voices in the Spanish-speaking world, argues in this conversation that the crisis of contemporary journalism is inseparable from the collapse of critical reading—and that both are symptoms of a deeper cultural abandonment. Born in Paris in 1932 to a French-Polish father and Mexican mother, Poniatowska contends that her formation as a writer was shaped by displacement, by learning to listen to those rendered voiceless by history, and by understanding that journalism must be an act of solidarity before it is anything else. Widely credited with helping to establish the genre of testimonio in Latin American letters, she transformed the voices of the marginalised into literature that forced an entire nation to confront its own silence. She maintains that her landmark work La Noche de Tlatelolco was not a journalistic achievement but a moral obligation, and reflects on her decision to refuse the Xavier Villaurrutia Prize, asking who would award the dead. Poniatowska insists that the greatest threat to literature and journalism today is not artificial intelligence but the disappearance of patience—the willingness to sit with a text, a story, or a life long enough for meaning to emerge. At 94, she affirms her belief in the innate goodness of human beings as not a sentiment but a necessity. Elena Poniatowska, la periodista más célebre de México y una de las voces literarias más significativas del mundo hispanohablante, sostiene en esta conversación que la crisis del periodismo contemporáneo es inseparable del colapso de la lectura crítica—y que ambos son síntomas de un abandono cultural más profundo. Nacida en París en 1932 de padre franco-polaco y madre mexicana, Poniatowska afirma que su formación como escritora estuvo marcada por el desplazamiento, por aprender a escuchar a quienes la historia había silenciado, y por comprender que el periodismo debe ser ante todo un acto de solidaridad. Ampliamente reconocida por haber contribuido a establecer el género del testimonio en las letras latinoamericanas, transformó las voces de los marginados en literatura que obligó a una nación entera a confrontar su propio silencio. Sostiene que su obra emblemática La Noche de Tlatelolco no fue un logro periodístico sino una obligación moral, y reflexiona sobre su decisión de rechazar el Premio Xavier Villaurrutia, preguntando quién iba a premiar a los muertos. Poniatowska insiste en que la mayor amenaza para la literatura y el periodismo hoy no es la inteligencia artificial sino la desaparición de la paciencia—la disposición a permanecer con un texto, una historia o una vida el tiempo suficiente para que emerja el significado. A los 94 años, reafirma su creencia en la bondad innata de los seres humanos no como un sentimiento sino como una necesidad. English transcript: SAVAGE MINDS — Elena Poniatowska Julian Vigo (00:00:15): Welcome to Savage Minds. Julian Vigo (00:00:26): I am your host, Julian Vigo. Julian Vigo (00:00:30): Today’s guest is Elena Poniatowska Amor, Julian Vigo (00:00:33): daughter of a French father of Polish origin, Jean E. Julian Vigo (00:00:37): Poniatowski, and Mexican mother Paula Amor. Julian Vigo (00:00:41): She was born in Paris in 1932. Julian Vigo (00:00:46): She has practiced journalism since 1953 at the newspapers El Día, Excélsior, Novedades, and La Jornada. Julian Vigo (00:00:57): She is the first woman to receive the National Journalism Prize. Julian Vigo (00:01:02): Among her works is La Noche de Tlatelolco, Julian Vigo (00:01:05): a classic since its publication, for which she was awarded the Xavier Villaurrutia Prize, Julian Vigo (00:01:12): which she refused, asking who was going to award the dead. Julian Vigo (00:01:17): Her novels and stories include La Flor de Lis, Julian Vigo (00:01:20): De Noche Vienes and Tlapalería, Julian Vigo (00:01:24): Paseo de la Reforma, Julian Vigo (00:01:26): Hasta No Verte Jesús Mío, Julian Vigo (00:01:28): The Life of a Mexican Soldadera, Julian Vigo (00:01:31): Querido Diego Te Abraza Quiela, Tinísima, winner of the Mazatlán Prize in 1992, La Piel del Cielo, Julian Vigo (00:01:40): winner of the Alfaguara Novel Prize in 2001, and El Tren Pasa Primero, Julian Vigo (00:01:48): about the lives of Mexican railway workers, Julian Vigo (00:01:52): winner of the Rómulo Gallegos International Novel Prize in 2007. Leonora won the Premio Biblioteca Breve Seix Barral in 2011. El Universo o Nada (2013) is the biography of Julian Vigo (00:02:07): astrophysicist Guillermo Haro. Ondas de la Niña Mala is her first poetry collection, and Julian Vigo (00:02:14): her children’s books include Boda en Chimalistac, La Vendedora de Nubes, Julian Vigo (00:02:20): El Burro que Metió la Pata, Sansimonsi, illustrated by Rafael Barajas el Fisgón, and El Julian Vigo (00:02:27): Niño Estrellero by Fernando Robles, and El Charito Cantor by Osvaldo Hernández. Julian Vigo (00:02:34): Her most recent novel, El Amante Polaco, portrays the last king of Poland, Stanisław August Julian Vigo (00:02:41): Poniatowski. Translated into 20 languages. Gabi Brimmer and Las Mil y Una, the story of Julian Vigo (00:02:48): Paulina, Julian Vigo (00:02:49): address social issues. Julian Vigo (00:02:52): After receiving honorary doctorates from UNAM and UAM, Julian Vigo (00:02:57): she was awarded them from the University of Puebla, Julian Vigo (00:03:01): Sonora, Estado de México, Julian Vigo (00:03:04): Guerrero, Julian Vigo (00:03:06): Chiapas, and Puerto Rico. Julian Vigo (00:03:09): She also received honorary degrees from the New School for Social Research in New York, Julian Vigo (00:03:13): Manhattanville College, and Florida Atlantic University in the United States, and from Julian Vigo (00:03:19): Paris 8, Julian Vigo (00:03:19): La Sorbonne, and Pau-Pyrénées, as well as the Maria Moors Cabot Prize for Journalism at Julian Vigo (00:03:27): Columbia University, New York, in 2004, and from the Universidad Complutense, Madrid, in Julian Vigo (00:03:32): 2015. Julian Vigo (00:03:34): She received the French Legion of Honour at the rank of Officer, the Gabriela Mistral Prize from Chile, and in Julian Vigo (00:03:41): 2006, the Courage Award from the International Women’s Media Foundation. Julian Vigo (00:03:43): In 2013 she was awarded Julian Vigo (00:03:49): the Miguel de Cervantes Prize for literature in the Spanish language, and she received the Julian Vigo (00:03:55): Belisario Domínguez Medal in 2022. Julian Vigo (00:03:58): This is the highest honour granted by the Senate of the Mexican Republic, along with the Julian Vigo (00:04:05): Carlos Fuentes International Prize for Literary Creation in the Spanish Language in 2023. (00:04:12): I welcome Elena Poniatowska to Savage Minds. Julian Vigo (00:04:19): I wanted to begin with a memory I have of you. Julian Vigo (00:04:22): In 1993, Julian Vigo (00:04:25): I think, Julian Vigo (00:04:27): or 94 — Julian Vigo (00:04:28): one of those two years — Julian Vigo (00:04:29): I was in Puebla, Julian Vigo (00:04:31): Cholula, Julian Vigo (00:04:32): teaching at the Universidad de las Américas. Julian Vigo (00:04:35): Yes. Julian Vigo (00:04:36): And you came to give a talk at an observatory — I believe it was Tonantzintla. Elena Poniatowska (00:04:44): Yes, of course. Elena Poniatowska (00:04:46): Yes, I remember it, and Julian Vigo (00:04:49): you made a great impression on me that day. But I must confess that your entire life’s work made a great impression on me — not only on me. I wanted to begin with your formation, your life, because you were born in France and Julian Vigo (00:05:12): how do you remember your childhood in France, and what elements of that world did you bring with you when you arrived in Mexico in 1942? Elena Poniatowska (00:05:21): Well, thank you very much for your interest. Elena Poniatowska (00:05:29): I can tell you that I was born in 1932 in Paris, France, because my mother Paula Amor married Elena Poniatowska (00:05:42): Juan Poniatowski, who held a noble title — that of prince — Elena Poniatowska (00:05:54): because the last king of Poland was Stanisław Poniatowski, who was, I believe, one of Elena Poniatowska (00:06:07): the lovers — Elena Poniatowska (00:06:09): one of the younger lovers of the Empress of Russia, Catherine the Great. Elena Poniatowska (00:06:21): My mother was a woman born also in Paris, of Mexican origin, who left Elena Poniatowska (00:06:32): France because of the Mexican Revolution Elena Poniatowska (00:06:36): and went to live with her parents — Pablo Amor and Elena Iturbe de Amor — in Elena Poniatowska (00:06:49): Biarritz, and they later moved to Paris. My mother always spoke Spanish with a French accent. She had two sisters who also lived in France for a long time, Elena Poniatowska (00:07:07): and they were rather Frenchified. She met my father Juan Poniatowski in Paris and Elena Poniatowska (00:07:20): married him, and I was born in 1932 in Paris. Elena Poniatowska (00:07:25): I would like to know Julian Vigo (00:07:31): more about this experience, because as you probably know — especially Americans and Canadians — they think everyone wants to come to their countries. But something they don’t know until they travel is that in Mexico, Honduras, and all of Latin America there is a great deal of immigration, people from every country in the world. Why not? Elena Poniatowska (00:08:01): Her mother was in France; my mother was Mexican, born in France. Her family — she had a grandmother, my mother’s great-grandmother, who was Russian, and in general her father was educated in England, so they were Elena Poniatowska (00:08:29): Mexicans — Amor is a Mexican surname — but they were very closely tied to Europe. For my mother, living in Europe was very natural because Elena Poniatowska (00:08:49): she first attended a boardi