Turn on and tune into Field Tripping, a podcast about psychedelics, the people that use them and what our renewed love affair with both says about who we are and where we’re going. Join us on a journey to explore how psychedelics awaken new views on sex, science, business, fitness, life, and death in the lives of our influential and inspiring guests – one epic trip at a time. Learn more at fieldtripping.fm.
The Best Kind of Counter-Culture, Drug Using Criminal | Rick Doblin Pt. 1
Rick is the founder and executive director of MAPS (Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies) – a non-profit research and educational organization that develops medical, legal, and cultural contexts for people to benefit from the careful uses of psychedelics.
In the first of our two-part discussion – Rick talks about his upbringing and education and how he was first introduced to psychedelics. Then, the moment Rick dedicated his life to the study and advancement of psychedelics – which he views as the path for mass mental health in a better world – and a fundamental right. Plus, how MAPS plays a unique role – much like a public utility – to align drug policy reform with drug research and advocate for healing and justice. Finally, Rick agrees to chat more with Ronan in part two.
Rick discusses his entrance into the psychedelic space – and how both the holocaust and his heritage influenced his upbringing (3:05)Rick had a sense of possibility during his childhood that was coloured by immigrant stories of his family (6:00)Initially, Rick believed all the anti-psychedelic propaganda and discusses his approach to resisting the draft – including the implication of a felony conviction, mass incarnation, and the drug-war (7:20)Rick immersed in Russian language to learn about ‘the other’. It’s where his underground career first started when a book was given to him which was partially written under the influence of LSD (11:30)Palmcourt parties were psychedelic parties at college, and it was Rick’s first exposure to psychedelics – and nudist colonies. It was the first time he saw the underground in the open. (14:20)Rick’s first few times with LSD were both emotionally difficult and remarkable (15:20)Rick loves Mescaline – “the most important psychedelic not being studied” (16:40)In 1972 Rick’s guidance counselor gave him an early copy of Stan Grof’s book – which was fortunate (18:00)The moment Rick realized he wanted to work on psychedelics for the rest of his life (20:00)As an 18-year-old, Rick wrote to Stan Grof – and to his surprise – Stan wrote back! That was the genesis for Rick, and he remains his mentor to this day (22:30)Rick describes a pivotal and influential dream he had – which continues to guide him (23:41)Rick discusses some of the accomplishments of MAPS and how it can operate as a non-profit and public-benefit corporation mix. MAPS has a role to play – and part of a national health care approach around the world. It has built public value – and is leading the way in regulatory systems and a credentialing of therapists (30:00)How do we get this covered by national health care – and demonstrate cost-effectiveness? (33:40)Rick views ketamine clinics in different ways: those who offer a pharmacological treatment and those who offer treatment in conjunction with talk therapy – which is much more durable for the patient (35:30)The difference between drug policy reform and drug research – and how they can be aligned (39:00)Ronan apologizes for some public comments he previously made that were misunderstood regarding his views on underground therapy – and Rick talks about a Martin Luther King statue and quote about “those who violate an unjust law to educate others on the injustice have the most respect for the law” (43:20)Rick agrees to join Ronan for a second chat in Part #2 to talk more about the work of MAPS (48:00)
Mass Mental Health | Rick Doblin Pt. 2
Rick is the founder and executive director of MAPS. He’s a pioneer of psychedelic research and the therapeutic advancement of psychedelics. In the second part of his conversation with Ronan, Rick discusses the origins of drug prohibition, the early days of MAPS, and some of his most impactful trips on LSD, DMT and MDMA – including one trip where Rick observed a Hitler rally and it showed him the path to truly helping others. Then, we discuss how memories can heal – even if they’re manufactured. Finally, Rick predicts how the future of humanity can feel interconnected.
Rick talks about how heartbreaking it was to see the DEA administrator criminalize the therapeutic and recreational use of MDMA as Schedule 3 – which lead to Rick's creation of MAPS in 1986. Criminalization was a highly political decision and escalation of the drug war (1:00) The drug war was political, and not intended to reduce drug abuse – it was an effort to persecute minorities, take away the right to vote, and create a vague enemy to blame. Rick traces the origin of drug probations in the United States (3:36) Toxicity studies of MDMA in dogs and rats as the initial studies for the FDA were performed by MAPS – while the rhetoric and hysteria of MDMA neurotoxicity escalated from some scientists and became a premise for the FDA to reject the studies (6:00) Rick discusses how he got a spinal tap as part of initial MDMA research, where he completed his Masters and PhD from the Kennedy School of Government. He applied for the Presidential Management Internship – and got a job at the FDA to understand how it worked (11:00) In 1992, the FDA opened the door to MDMA research, and MAPS started with a safety study, but the neurotoxicity hysteria continued to gain momentum. Since psilocybin was less controversial, research with this substance began (13:00) MDMA research began to be rejected from IRB’s (independent review boards) – despite the compelling science and mounting evidence. Rick jokes about the one time he felt discouragement in his work, so he repainted his house, and felt productive and accomplished (18:00) Rick describes the work that he does, and the healing of trauma, is a response to the holocaust, to people dehumanizing others, and fundamentalism (21:50) Rick discusses some of his psychedelic experiences, and how they have been reaffirming to his work. He took a large dose of LSD to celebrate his 21st birthday, and tried to cram life into a few remaining minutes before a perceived atomic bomb. Then he noticed nature and its vibrancy – seeing the world for the first time (25:30) The combination of LSD with the awareness of death helped Rick to have a deep appreciation of the world – and the loss of this hyperawareness as he came down has always stayed with him. Carlos Castaneda says: “be aware of death over your left shoulder” (30:00) Psychedelics can provide experiences, but they are filtered through our own subjectivity, and should not necessarily be taken as Truth. People can recall deep memories during therapeutic trips – and they can be profoundly symbolic – even if they are more symbolic in nature rather than truthful (35:00) Rick talks about another trip on LSD after a tough breakup and he spent 17 hours in a water flotation tank and had a personal realization about self-hatred and self-acceptance (38:00) Rick talk about his first time smoking DMT, and how he had a sense of universal connection. He communicated with the deepest part of himself, and realized that he is part of everything, including Hitler, which was tough for him to accept. Later that day, when doing Ketamine, Rick has vision of a Hitler rally, to see "the one combining with the many, and the many combining with the one: a vibration of energy". Rick used breath work to get control of his emotions. (43:00) The only way to g
Jesus is Psychedelic | Jackee Stang
Jackee Stang is President and Founder of Delic Corp – an umbrella brand for psychedelic community and wellness. Jackee talks with Ronan about coping in a world that’s seemingly on fire – and how ketamine helps her break the bubble of anxiety to create space for hope. Plus, we talk epigenetics, neuropathway memory, and finding the right substance to be present. And while on ayahuasca, Jackee recalls how she reconnected with religion to realize that Jesus is Psychedelic. Finally, we confront what thought leadership actually looks like.
Jackee talks about life during a pandemic as ‘strange and scary’ and how it has exposed the cracks in society – which is important to acknowledge (1:55)
Jackee describes using psychedelics and ketamine to help break the bubble of anxiety to create space between her default neuro-network. (6:10)
Jackee talks about how her anxiety is related to epigenetics, and her hope for psychedelics to study the phenomena (9:10)
Because the brain is powerful and stubborn psychedelics help Jackee explore her thoughts –while staying on top of her mental health (11:10)
Jackee talks about her first experience with ketamine as a club kid, and her rediscovery many years later with IV ketamine in a clinic. It was ‘legitimately impactful’ (13:00)
Ketamine is a life hack, that allows her to quiet the doubt monster and create a new neuropathway. Concepts of death and consciousness consume her thoughts while on ketamine (16:30)
In the psychedelic conversation, understanding your personal tether is important during exploration. It is what you want it to be, and you can play with it (20:00)
Jackee talks about her religious upbringing, and how it helped her realize that ‘Jesus is Psychedelic’ while on an ayahuasca journey; reconnecting and reconciling without shame (23:00)
Jackee describes working with Dave Asprey at Bulletproof during her early career as one of the most fun experiences of her professional life (27:20)
Jackee talks about creating and running Delic Corp – and how she’s comfortable in the driver’s seat after leaving ‘High Times’ (29:50)
How the pandemic has forced Jackee to confront what thought leadership actually looks like and what it’s really about. (33:30)
Dirty Biker Acid | Operators – Dan Boeckner & Devojka
Dan Boeckner and Devojka are members of the band Operators – and they’re also life partners. They join Ronan – along with Field Trip’s Chief Psychologist Dr. Dominique Morisano – to talk music, revelations from pandemic life, and using psilocybin to deal with anxiety. Then, Dan details what it’s like to feel interconnected through the dissolution of self – and how to apply trips to our communal experience. Plus, Devojka talks about being a product of the D.A.R.E program and her first trip – or lack thereof. And Dr. Dominique encourages us to accept the trip that you need – not the one that you want.
The lines between work life and home life have been erased by the pandemic and has forced many to be a more consistent self (1:25)
Devokja discusses how the pandemic gave her immense relief. She was deeply depressed beforehand, and found some relief – as others around her were also forced to slow down (3:20)
Dr. Dominique talks about how the pandemic has shifted her practice and the increased demand of patients looking for professional counselling (7:00)
Ronan talks about how he prefers to microdose – and his experience of reliving a childhood memory during a heroic dose last year (10:00)
Dan talks about his first experiences with psychedelics – including ‘dirty biker acid’ – starting at the age of 15. Growing up in a small community on Vancouver island – Dan acknowledges the desire to ‘travel without travelling’ and a ‘need to escape’ drove this behaviour (13:17)
Dan and Devokja talk about their recent psilocybin trip. While observing bugs on a log, Dan realizes ‘it’s their house, man’.(15:34)
Dr. Dominique discusses typical themes she’s seen – and how patients using psychedelic-assisted therapy can yield profound personal impacts. And consider that it’s also a connected experience – not necessarily an individual one. Plus she encourages us to look for opportunities to integrate personal realizations (16:50)
Dan talks about their latest album ‘Radiant Dawn’ and working closely with Devojka on the record was a unique experience. For him, the act of performing on stage, gives him emotional catharsis. On psychedelics, he feels interconnected and can process facts that are exposed to him. A fantastical wonder. (21:20)
Devojka talks about being a product of the D.A.R.E program and her first trip – or lack thereof. (24:30)
Dan talks about the appeal of psychedelics, and Devojka talks about how her point of view on psychedelics started to shift with microdosing (28:10)
Dr. Dominique encourages us to accept the trip that you need – not the one that you want. And understand that no one experience will be the same as the next. Her advice: trust, let go, and walk towards it. Set and setting are very important (34:36)
Dan talks about his trip from a few days prior – where he realized that the psychedelic renaissance needs to be contextualized historically (36:40)
Ronan asks who do Dan and Devojka think could use a good trip – and Ronan suggests their next album title (42:20)
Whole | Tom Eckert & Sheri Bessi-Eckert
Tom Eckert and Sheri Bessi-Eckert are professional counselors and life partners leading a historic campaign to legalize Psilocybin Assisted Therapy in their home state of Oregon. They join Ronan to discuss why they believe in the power of psilocybin, share views on the nature of consciousness, and why measure 109 could become a breakthrough initiative for millions. Then, we talk about the connection between healing and wholeness – and how we're the authors of our own next chapter.
Sheri and Tom discuss how they discovered – and then began to advocate for – Psilocybin Therapy (2:33)
Sheri and Tom talk about their effort over the last 5 years in bringing together a ballot initiative with the Oregon Legislative Council (5:35)
Tom details the origins of the Oregon Psilocybin Society (9:30)
Tom and Ronan discuss the FDA process (11:00)
Details on Measure 109 and how it could create access to psilocybin assisted psychotherapy – and what that entails (11:55)
Sheri highlights some of the strict parameters and safety considerations built into the law – and protections of over-commercialization – to maintain a community-based service (13:00)
Sheri discussed how the Psilocybin Service Initiative (PSI) aims to be inclusive, rigorous and will legitimatize practitioners with essential training programs (15:00)
How we bring about drug reform and learn as an industry from the errors of the 60s (17:00)
‘But What If We’re Wrong?' – and what does the narrative look like (20:00)
What the throws of transformation can look like – and how important the history of these plant medicines really are for us to know and pay attention to (21:20)
Consciousness as a final mystery – and the relationship between consciousness and reality. The subject/object split that physics brings into question and how these exact questions are intrinsically healing. And they seem to be related to positive therapeutic outcomes (23:10)
Sheri believes it's important for individuals to have their own genuine experience. We are all our own best guru’s. We can experience awe – and even the cosmos (26:00)
Sheri shares her personal experience with psychedelics, and how her view towards them evolved – from conservative to advocate. Psychedelics helped her see the emotions that were stuck within her – called ‘memory trauma’ (30:20)
Tom talks about his experience with psychedelics and how they helped him cope with the loss of his father (32:50)
Sheri adds how her and Tom experience the universe together when on psilocybin. “It’s a wonderful thing for a marriage” (34:38)
To heal is to become more whole – and suffering is estrangement from the whole. A psychedelic experience can bring the whole together, and to recognize that you are not separate from the cosmos itself (38:00)
Once expanded – you can never go back to your original shape. And for Sheri – that is the work of psychedelics. And for Tom, this idea of neuroplasticity is important; flexibility away from rigid mental loops. (39:00)
Sheri talks about how she challenges the men she works with to ‘sit with their beliefs, and ask themselves: why they believe what they believe?’ (45:30)
Tom discusses the identification of meaning, and how looking forward is a blank page for all of us. You are free to be the author; can be called 'reality creation' (47:00)
The Happy Chef | Edible Dee
Edible Dee, known as The Happy Chef, is a veteran cannabis chef, herbalist and holistic healer. Her third cookbook 'Delic Dishes' is a guide to cooking with psilocybin as the main ingredient in recipes like salad dressing, hummus, sushi and chocolate mug cakes. Dee chats with Ronan about her origin into the space – from underground edibles to large-scale production. Then, Dee shares how psychedelics helped her cope with the sudden loss of her sister Amber. Then, things get spicy as Dee shares her thoughts on how to explore psychedelic sex.
Follow Dee on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter @edibledee, and check out her cookbooks at her website http://edibledee.com
2:00 - How Dee became known as The Happy Chef and why she adopted a number of different aliases in order to protect herself. Ronan and Dee dig into the idea of living behind a different name and how that affects the way a person walks through life.
5:00 - The origin of Dee’s first cookbook and how a music partnership started it all.
7:10 - Dee delves into how people are never taught on how to deal with death, and this was really apparent to her around her sister’s untimely passing. She turned to drinking and stopped eating — but what helped her through it was a set of cannabis brownies that she had made with her sister. That changed her for, what she feels like is, the better and found hope & inspiration out of tragedy and turned that into a career.
12:40 - The impact of pumping patients full of man-made medications and how we can shift our healthcare system to be more in touch with healing the root cause of issues instead of being centred around symptom-relief. Do people in the modern Americas have the tools & space to process their emotions properly, or is our working climate not conducive to this?
15:30 - Ronan breaks down the meaning of one of his favourite phrases, the “metaphysical outlaw"
17:15 - Dee “dishes" on how she transitioned from strictly focusing on cannabis-containing edibles to encompassing psychedelics into her recipes as well, and how that opening-up changed her workflows, her employee relationships and her life as a whole. She started off microdosing psilocybin — in an effort to optimize her productivity — and goes into detail about her regimen and thought process behind how this works best for her.
21:50 - Dee tells Ronan about her life-changing ayahuasca journey in Las Vegas, that helped her heal from a tremendous loss and get in touch with herself in a much deeper way.
25:00 - Her attachments to the world around her diminished Dee’s self-love, and had a tough time coming to terms with the concept of “loving yourself,” which she has done with the help of psychedelics & mindfulness.
27:30 - Celebrate! Dee and Ronan talk about how to be your own biggest fan, and how important it is to ’take pictures’ of those moments.
29:10 - Find out where 80% of your body’s serotonin comes from, which is very apropos for Dee’s work.
30:20 - Sex! Dee details the chapter in her latest book that talks about her intimate adventures while on a psilocybin journey and how that can foster connections in a deep & meaningful way. She compares MDMA- vs psilocybin-assisted intercourse and outlines the differences in her own experiences.
Customer ReviewsSee All
Timely, Topical and Thoughful
There is no better time than now, during what may be the worst year in memory, to be having an open discussion about alternative forms of therapy for mental health and to promote general mindfulness and connection to the natural world. Ronan the host is a thoughtful, knowledgeable, polymath who puts his guests at ease and asks excellent questions that allow them to open up about the intersection between phychedelics and art, culture and mental well being. i highly recommed this podcast.
Excellent new podcast! Very interesting, frank and open discussion on psychedelics and their therapeutic benefits. The host is extremely knowledgeable. I’m very much looking forward to future episodes!
Loved the debut episode - looking forward to more interesting discussions about psychedelics and their role in culture and mental health!