Jeremy Ryan Slate on Rome, oligarchy, currency, and the breakdown of the West Graham Dunlop and Darren Grimes sit down with Jeremy Ryan Slate for a wide-ranging conversation about civilizational collapse, using Rome as the main historical lens. Jeremy argues that the West is following a familiar pattern of monetary debasement, immigration strain, and declining political ethics, while Darren and Graham push the discussion toward technology, energy, election integrity, and whether there is any humane way to stabilize the system. We discuss why the Roman pattern may be repeating across the US, Canada, the UK, and Europe, what actually causes collapse, and whether reform is still possible through currency, production, and energy. Key topics Jeremy lays out his "Roman pattern" framework with three main drivers of collapse: monetary debasement, immigration pressure, and the loss of ethics among political leaders. The conversation turns to whether the West should be viewed as one collapsing bloc or as a set of countries moving at different speeds through the same decline. Jeremy argues that modern democracy has already drifted into oligarchy, pointing to executive power, elite control of money, and the replacement of candidates as evidence. The hosts compare modern politics to Rome's client patron system, where voting and public policy often rewarded whoever could hand out the most benefits. A major thread is the 1913 turning point in the US: the 17th Amendment, federal income tax, and the Federal Reserve Act. The group also discusses the War Powers Act, executive war-making, and how crises are used to expand state power. Jeremy says collapse is usually slow, not cinematic, and compares it to Rome's long degradation rather than a sudden movie-style fall. Darren and Graham explore whether universal high income, automation, or energy abundance could replace broken welfare and monetary systems. Jeremy pushes back on the idea of unconditional handouts, arguing that any workable system still needs incentives, value creation, and consequences for bad behavior. The most optimistic path, in Jeremy's view, is a two-pronged fix: cut waste and rebuild industrial production. They also dig into energy as the next big frontier, especially nuclear power, grid modernization, and the idea of backing currency through actual productive capacity. The episode closes with Jeremy explaining his work on The Roman Pattern, Hidden Forces in History, and the Athenian Book Club. Timestamps 00:00 - Jeremy Ryan Slate returns to discuss Rome, collapse, and the modern West 02:30 - Are the US, Canada, the UK, and Europe collapsing together? 04:12 - The three pillars of the Roman pattern 05:50 - Does democracy naturally degrade into oligarchy? 07:45 - Candidate replacement and why that does not feel democratic 10:13 - Rome's voting tribes and patronage politics 12:57 - Why 1913 matters: the 17th Amendment, income tax, and the Federal Reserve 14:48 - War powers, executive overreach, and the legacy of crisis politics 20:56 - Why Jeremy is conflicted on Trump 23:32 - Canada's media capture and lack of a pressure release valve 28:20 - The Eastern Roman Empire, Christianity, and gold-backed stability 31:10 - Universal high income versus production-based living 35:05 - Energy production as the next frontier 36:47 - Nuclear power, outdated grids, and the need for more capacity 41:39 - Darren's version of UBI and the idea of covering necessities only 45:41 - Meritocracy, innovation, and the return of useful standards 50:46 - Which empires handled decline best, and why the English lasted so long 54:19 - Currency, inflation, and why debased money destroys civilizations 59:46 - Collapse as a slow multigenerational decline 62:49 - Where the US sits compared to the Roman timeline 69:21 - Trump, the midterms, and whether anything can really get fixed 70:06 - Election integrity, local reporting, and the problem of fraud 73:43 - Cutting waste, shrinking debt, and reducing the state's burden 79:14 - AI, efficiency, and finding waste faster 81:55 - Jeremy's hopeful path: industry, tax reduction, and waste cleanup 84:13 - Jeremy's broader work: history, culture, and the Athenian Book Club 86:49 - Wrap-up and final thoughts west v usa is this just organic how would we fix it ww1 Studying civilizational collapse through Rome. 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