[Un]Churned – The No. 1 Podcast for Customer Retention

Gainsight

If you're experimenting with automation, questioning the traditional post-sales model, or trying to drive more value with less headcount, you're in the right place. AI won’t fix churn, but these conversations might. Retention is the new growth & AI is rewriting the rules. Hosted by Josh Schachter, SVP of Atlas at Gainsight, [Un]Churned—the No. 1 podcast for retention and Customer Success leaders—features real talk with the sharpest minds in the Customer Success space. We dig into how teams are scaling smarter, activating AI agents, and redesigning the customer journey for lasting impact.

  1. A Simple Habit That 3x’ed AI Adoption Rates: The 15-Minute Rule ft. Cat Valverde (Enterprise AI Group)

    7 HR AGO

    A Simple Habit That 3x’ed AI Adoption Rates: The 15-Minute Rule ft. Cat Valverde (Enterprise AI Group)

    Why most enterprise AI fails — and how Cat Valverde’s 4-week adoption framework shows that the fix is just 15 minutes a week. Most enterprises are stuck in AI pilot purgatory — running endless experiments that never scale. In this episode of Unchurned, Josh Schachter sits down with Cat Valverde, founder of Enterprise AI Group, to break down what’s really blocking enterprise adoption. Cat shares her research-backed 15-Minute Rule, a simple 4-week framework that’s doubled or tripled adoption rates — all by making AI implementation human-centered instead of tool-centered. If you’re a leader trying to take AI from pilot to production, this is your playbook. What You’ll Learn - Why most enterprise AI initiatives fail to scale past pilot stage - How to reduce adoption friction and create lasting behavior change - The psychological levers that improve user buy-in and learning retention - How to structure a simple 4-week rollout for any AI tool or workflow - What metrics actually matter when evaluating AI adoption success Timestamps: 0:00 – Preview & Intro 1:02 – Meet Kat Valverde 1:42 – What buyers and sellers say in enterprise AI roundtables 3:11 – The challenge of internal adoption 6:20 – The 15-Minute Rule; a 4-week micro-adoption framework 11:45 – The psychology behind AI adoption 12:18 – 2–3× adoption rates and major cost savings 14:45 – Closing thoughts Key Takeaways - Pilot fatigue is real — the biggest blocker to enterprise AI adoption isn’t money, it’s time and cognitive load. - The true KPI: internal adoption, not just model accuracy or ROI. - Fear ≠ just job loss. It’s the fear of asking “dumb” questions or not keeping up with peers. - The 15-Minute Rule: a 4-week program built on psychology that uses micro-commitments to build momentum. - Outcomes: 2–3× higher adoption and ~50% training-cost reduction per user. --- Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: ⁠https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/⁠ --- Where to Find Cat: LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/catvalverde/ Enterprise AI Group: https://www.eais.io/ Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/⁠ --- Resources: The Power of Habit: https://www.charlesduhigg.com/the-power-of-habit

    16 min
  2. Why Your Ideal Customer Profile Is Broken and How AI Can Fix It ft. Mark Roberge (Co-Founder of Stage 2 Capital)

    1 DAY AGO

    Why Your Ideal Customer Profile Is Broken and How AI Can Fix It ft. Mark Roberge (Co-Founder of Stage 2 Capital)

    The Biggest GTM Mistake (Spoiler Alert: Stop Chasing CAC!!!) Mark Roberge shares how AI is transforming sales, customer success, and go-to-market strategy. The former HubSpot CRO, now co-founder of Stage 2 Capital and senior lecturer at Harvard Business School, Mark Roberge breaks down the 4 phases of AI evolution that will redefine how companies sell, serve, and scale. From agentic AI to LTV-driven growth, this is a masterclass on what the next era of go-to-market looks like. Mark Roberge helped take HubSpot from $0 to $100M and literally wrote The Sales Acceleration Formula. Now, he’s turning his attention to the AI transformation sweeping every GTM function. In this episode, Mark explains why it’s time to stop obsessing over CAC and start optimizing for LTV—the customers who actually succeed—and how AI can make that possible at scale. He also shares bold predictions about the future of work, the death of departments, and why capitalism itself may need to evolve for the AI era. Timestamps 0:00 – Preview & Introduction 1:19 – Meet Mark Roberge: Co-Founder, Stage 2 Capital 2:45 – The Early Days of AI in GTM 6:33 – What’s Slowing Down AI Adoption 8:00 – Why Most AI Startups Are Still Too Iterative 12:00 – The "Agentic" Shift: From Co-Pilots to Autonomous Agents 14:15 – The 4 Phases of AI Go-to-Market Evolution 20:35 – Managing Your Agents: The New CRO Skillset 26:00 – Deciding the ICP: It’s Not CAC 29:35 – How AI Breaks Down Department Silos 35:40 – Can Capitalism Survive the AI Era? 46:00 – The Science of Scaling: Mark’s Next Big Book --- What You’ll Learn * Why CAC is the wrong north star metric for GTM leaders * How to use AI to identify and retain high-LTV customers * The 4 phases of AI transformation in go-to-market * How agentic AI will redefine the roles of CROs, CSMs, and RevOps * Why AI will blur departmental boundaries and change the structure of business * How capitalism and work culture must evolve in the AI era --- Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: ⁠https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/⁠ --- Where to Find Mark: LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/markroberge/ Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/⁠ --- Resources mentioned: * Stage 2 Capital Blog – Go-to-Market AI Case Studies: https://www.stage2.capital * The Sales Acceleration Formula by Mark Roberge

    48 min
  3. The Only Agentic AI Guide You'll Ever Need ft. Jacob Bank (Relay.app)

    29 OCT

    The Only Agentic AI Guide You'll Ever Need ft. Jacob Bank (Relay.app)

    The Ex-Google PM Who Spent 14+ Years Building AI Agents ft. Jacob Bank (Relay.app) Jacob Bank has been building AI agents since before they were cool. While the rest of us were just figuring out what ChatGPT could do, Jacob was already 13 years deep into agent research. Now, as founder and CEO of Relay.app, Jacob is making AI agents accessible to everyone, from customer success teams to businesses that install slip-resistant floors. Jacob has a fascinating prediction: within a year, agents will be able to handle virtually any task you do on your computer. The real question won't be "can an agent do this?" but rather "how do I teach, manage, and trust my agent?" Timestamps 0:00 - Preview & Introduction 1:48 - Meet Jacob & An Overview of Relay.app 4:08 - From Stanford AI Research to Google to Founder 4:57 - AI Agents were 15 Years in the Making 8:30 - It Took 2.5 Years to Get the First Customer 12:35 - What Actually Is Agentic AI? 14:55 - Understanding AI Agents 19:45 - How AI Accesses Information: Context Windows, and RAG 24:11 - The Shift from RAG to MCP 25:51 - Understanding MCP: The Restaurant Analogy 30:04 - Real-World Use Cases of Workflows with AI for CSMs 33:51 - When and When Not to Use Agents 37:45 - Why SMBs Move Faster on AI Than Big Enterprises 42:12 - The Two Limitations of Agents Today 44:31 - We're All Managers Now 46:15 - Where to Stay Current on AI 47:36 - The Value of Hands-On Experience with AI Tools What you'll learn: - The critical difference between workflows and agents (and why you need both) - Why "we're all managers now"—even if you're an individual contributor - The future of work isn't about doing tasks; it's about managing and calibrating your agents - Practical use cases of Agentic AI for CSMs - Why spending an hour daily experimenting with AI tools is "worth its weight in gold" Resources mentioned: - Ben's Bytes newsletter - Jeff Siu (YouTube) 11.4

    43 min
  4. Are CSMs the Next Generation of CEOs? ft. Omer Rabin (TLA Ventures) & Chad Horenfeldt (Siena AI)

    22 OCT

    Are CSMs the Next Generation of CEOs? ft. Omer Rabin (TLA Ventures) & Chad Horenfeldt (Siena AI)

    What if the function you were about to join didn’t really exist yet? In 2014, customer success was barely a function—it was an idea in the making. Omer Rabin took a bet on that idea at a time when the industry still needed convincing that managing customer relationships deserved its own tech stack. He went on to become Gainsight’s Chief Evangelist when most people thought “customer success” sounded like corporate cheerleading. Fast forward a decade, and customer success has grown into a multi-billion-dollar industry. But somewhere along the way, many CS teams drifted from their strategic roots, becoming reactive order-takers buried in grunt work. In this episode, Omer Rabin (General Partner at TLA Ventures) and Chad Horenfeldt (VP of CS at Siena AI and author of The Strategic CSM) discuss the past, present, and future of customer success. They take us back to the early days—Pulse local events on Toronto rooftops, the hunter vs. farmer debate, and how Nick Mehta’s pitch about “selling to existing customers” helped create an entire category. WHAT YOU'LL LEARN: • Why customer success emerged as a distinct function (and why it almost didn't) • How CS teams lost their strategic edge—and how to reclaim it • Why AI is bringing CS back to its strategic roots by eliminating grunt work • Why Omer believes the next generation of CEOs will come from customer success • Chad's framework for future customer intelligence • The one question every CSM should ask to align with their CEO's top priority --- Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/ --- Where to Find Chad: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chadhorenfeldt/ The Strategic CSM: https://www.strategiccustomersuccess.com/ Where to Find Omer: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/omerabin/ Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/ --- In this episode, we cover: 0:00 – Preview & Introduction 1:24 – Meet Chad & Omer 2:10 – Pulse Local Events and Building the CS Community 3:52 – Chad’s Origin Story: Being an Early CS Ambassador 4:55 – From Customer Cheerleading to Value Creation 12:45 – The AI Revolution and the Return of Strategic CSMs 18:31 – How Outcome-Based CS Influences Revenue 23:53 – Defining Success Is a Challenge 25:25 – How AI Analyzes Survey Data to Find Customer Sentiment 28:10 – Customizing Product Updates for Customers 29:25 – Tactical Advice for CSMs 30:35 – Aligning with Company Needs

    33 min
  5. From Radio Host to CPO: Why Should You Always Work Backwards from Renewals? ft. Venk Chandran (PathFactory)

    15 OCT

    From Radio Host to CPO: Why Should You Always Work Backwards from Renewals? ft. Venk Chandran (PathFactory)

    The best product leaders don't start in product—they start in customer success. Nick Mehta, former Gainsight CEO, sits down with PathFactory’s CPO & CCO, Venk Chandran, who built his product career from the ground up in CS. Venk reveals why working backwards from renewals changes everything, how CS teams can drive AI adoption with their customers, and why websites are dying in the age of AI agents. Plus: the art of asking better questions, the emotional differences between CS and product roles, and what we owe our customers in the era of AI. WHAT YOU'LL LEARN: - Why starting your career in renewals teaches you to work backwards from value - How customer success is fundamentally a financial business (and why that matters) - Why AI agents are replacing websites as the primary B2B buying experience - How to help customers adopt AI when they're used to manual workflows - The difference between outbound and inbound product managers (and why you need both) - Why is delayed gratification in product harder than the instant wins of CS - How to retrain yourself (and your customers) to ask better questions of AI --- Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/ --- Where to Find Venk: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/venkchandran/ Where to Find Nick: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nickmehta/ Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/ --- In this episode, we cover: 0:00 - Preview & Introduction 1:10 - Venk's Journey From Radio Waves to Product Leadership 7:37 - How Venk Jumped From HR Tech → Sales → CS → Product (and Made It Work) 10:32 - Learning at Salesforce: The Surprising Lesson Venk Learned From Renewals 12:05 - Why CS Is a Financial Business First — The Real Definition of Customer Value 15:19 - CS to CPO: 3 Game-Changing Skills That Make the Transition Possible 17:05 - CS vs. Product: The Emotional Shift No One Talks About 19:51 - PathFactory’s Big Vision — Connecting Content Directly to Revenue (With AI!) 22:28 - Why Websites Are Dying — And What’s Replacing Them 25:35 - Truth, Transparency & Trust: What We Owe Each Other in the AI Era 26:51 - The AI Adoption Problem: Why CS Teams Struggle With Change Management 31:35 - The Art of Asking Better Questions --- Referenced: Salesforce - https://www.salesforce.com/ Perplexity - https://www.perplexity.ai/ ChatGPT - https://chat.openai.com/

    34 min
  6. Inside Pulse: How 7 CS Leaders Are Moving Their Biggest Boulders With AI

    8 OCT

    Inside Pulse: How 7 CS Leaders Are Moving Their Biggest Boulders With AI

    How do you manage 100,000+ renewals or scale AI across thousands of CSMs? CS leaders share how they're tackling their biggest challenges and using technology to drive retention, adoption, and efficiency. In this episode of the [Un]churned Podcast, Josh Schachter sits down with customer success leaders at the 2025 Gainsight Pulse Conference in Las Vegas to explore how they're tackling their biggest challenges - from managing massive renewal volumes to driving adoption at scale. Featuring CS executives from Rockwell Automation, Fleetio, Handshake, Boomi, Dellteck, and SAP, this episode reveals practical strategies for using AI to save time, improve efficiency, and deliver better customer outcomes. What you'll learn: 1. How Rockwell Automation's CS team manages 100,000+ annual renewals with 300 team members across 85 recurring revenue products 2. Why AI-powered engagement signals are replacing time-based customer outreach 3. The importance of building trust in AI-powered insights before teams will adopt them 4. How to aggregate and visualize data from multiple systems to tell a coherent story to stakeholders 5. Why change management is critical when introducing new product features that alter established workflows 6. How relationship-level insights can reveal the full picture of multi-product customer health --- Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/ --- Where to Find the guests: - Angel Rogers - https://www.linkedin.com/in/angel-rogers-leader/ - Sean MacPherson- https://www.linkedin.com/in/seanmacpherson - Tiffany Taylor - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tiffany-taylor-learner/ - Matt Krebsbach - https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-krebsbach-694117163/ - Charlie Ferraro - https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlesferrao/ - Margo Martin - https://www.linkedin.com/in/margomartin-/ - Tony Pante - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tony-pante-9b5419/ --- Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/ --- In this episode, we cover: 0:00 - Introduction 0:27 - Angel Rogers: Managing 100K renewals at Rockwell Automation 5:32 - Sean MacPherson: Aggregating insights from multiple systems 9:48 - Tiffany Taylor: Speed up feedback loops and time-to-value 14:09 - Matt Krebsbach: Prioritization, delivering outcomes and data enablement 18:47 - Charlie Ferraro: Retention, renewals and efficiency 20:35 - From Spidey sense to AI-powered engagement analysis 21:47 - Measuring adoption in agentic products 22:07 - Margo Martin: Stay ahead with real-time defect alerts 25:17 - The value of relationship-level insights 26:10 - Tony Pante: Driving adoption across 2,000 CSMs at SAP 29:35 - Using AI for translation, content creation, and enablement --- Referenced: • Gainsight Pulse Conference: https://gainsightpulse.com/europe/ • Rockwell Automation: https://www.rockwellautomation.com/ • Fleetio: https://www.fleetio.com/ • Handshake: https://joinhandshake.com/ • Boomi: https://boomi.com/ • Dellteck: https://www.deltek.com/en • SAP: https://www.sap.com/ • Staircase AI: https://www.gainsight.com/staircase-ai/ • Reef AI: https://www.reef.ai/ • Gong: https://www.gong.io/de/ • SAP Joule: https://www.sap.com/products/artificial-intelligence/ai-assistant.html

    32 min
  7. Is Agentic AI The End of ARR? ft. Brett Queener (Bonfire Ventures) & Chuck Ganapathi (Gainsight)

    1 OCT

    Is Agentic AI The End of ARR? ft. Brett Queener (Bonfire Ventures) & Chuck Ganapathi (Gainsight)

    "How Agentic AI Is Replacing Subscription Revenue" Chuck Ganapathi, the CEO of Gainsight & Brett Queener, Managing Director at Bonfire Ventures, who previously ran product at Salesforce and helped destroy Siebel, the company where he and Chuck first met. Together, they've witnessed every major shift in enterprise software over three decades, and they believe the biggest one is happening right now. In this conversation, Brett unveils his forthcoming thesis on "the end of ARR," arguing that agentic AI will fundamentally break subscription business models. When products finally achieve what he calls "product purity", actually doing the job they promise without requiring armies of CSMs, endless onboarding, and quarterly business reviews, the entire economic foundation of SaaS collapses. Chuck and Brett discuss whether this is an existential threat or the evolution the industry has been waiting for. What you'll learn: - Why the "friction gap" between product and value created the entire CS industry - What "product purity" means and why it threatens traditional SaaS economics - How agentic AI fundamentally changes the unit economics of software - Why usage-based pricing is inevitable once products actually work - The product marketing playbook that still matters in an AI-first world Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/ Where to Find the Guest Brett's LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/brettqueener/ Chuck's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chuckganapathi/ Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/ In this episode, we cover: 0:00 - Preview & Introduction 1:18 - Meet Chuck & Brett 3:30 - How Brett and Chuck met at Siebel 9:28 - Transition to Salesforce: destruction of Siebel as a goal 14:11 - Changing Nature of Product Marketing in the AI Era 18:00 - Systems of Record vs. Systems of Action 21:13 - Databases as “lossy” representations of reality 29:00 - Brett's thesis: "The End of ARR (And I Feel Fine)" 34:28 - How should agentic applications be priced? 43:43 - Future Outlook: Market paying premium for top agents 47:17 - 10x CSMs enabled by AI agents References: - Brett Queener's blog: https://queener.substack.com/

    52 min
  8. How BMC's CCO Built AI Agents That Triple Productivity ft. Sofia Barbosa (BMC Software)

    24 SEPT

    How BMC's CCO Built AI Agents That Triple Productivity ft. Sofia Barbosa (BMC Software)

    How Human-Centric AI Frees CSMs for Strategic Work at BMC Leading customer success at a global scale is never easy—especially after a company split. For Sofia Barbosa, this meant steering a leaner team while still supporting hundreds of BMC products worldwide. The challenge: deliver more impact with fewer hands. The solution: build Succedo, an AI platform that reimagined how her team worked. The results spoke for themselves—customer success stories accelerated from months to days, output tripled, escalations dropped, and CSMs finally had time to focus on the strategic work that drives growth. In this episode, Sofia shares the inside story of how she’s embedding AI across customer success at BMC. From value summaries and training path recommendations to support prioritization and statements of work, Sofia is proving that AI isn’t about replacing people—it’s about elevating them. She explains how she manages change, structures her AI teams, and why she believes experimentation (and even failure) is the only way forward. What you’ll learn: - How Succedo helped triple the output of customer success stories. - The role of AI in reducing escalations and improving customer sentiment. - How to build specialized AI teams inside a large enterprise. - Why “human in the loop” remains critical in AI adoption. - The mindset shift leaders need to drive AI transformation. Check out the Key Takeaways & Transcripts: https://www.gainsight.com/presents/series/unchurned/ Where to Find Sofia: LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/sofiabarbosa/ Where to Find Josh: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jschachter/ In this episode, we cover: 0:00 – Preview & Introduction 1:40 – Meet Sofia Barbosa (CCO, BMC Software) 3:15 – Sofia’s promotion and the BMC split 6:53 – Why & how Succedo was born 11:30 – The impact of using Succedo 12:55 – Using AI to create value summaries 15:40 – Creating personalized training paths with AI 18:35 – AI for support: prioritization and sentiment analysis 21:18 – Automating statements of work with AI 24:35 – Building “Succedo Forge” and “Succedo Care” teams 27:10 – Managing change and team sentiment around AI 28:45 – Advice for CCOs driving AI transformation Referenced: - Sofia's post: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/sofiabarbosa_customersuccess-ai-bmc-activity-7366224818586685441-q74P

    31 min
See All (169)

About

If you're experimenting with automation, questioning the traditional post-sales model, or trying to drive more value with less headcount, you're in the right place. AI won’t fix churn, but these conversations might. Retention is the new growth & AI is rewriting the rules. Hosted by Josh Schachter, SVP of Atlas at Gainsight, [Un]Churned—the No. 1 podcast for retention and Customer Success leaders—features real talk with the sharpest minds in the Customer Success space. We dig into how teams are scaling smarter, activating AI agents, and redesigning the customer journey for lasting impact.

Information

You Might Also Like