Third Option Leadership Podcast

Middle Way Institute
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There’s a better way to lead. Hosted by the team at the Middle Way Institute, The Third Option Leadership Podcast explores how to stay grounded, curious, and courageous in leadership. Learn to influence without controlling, correct without crushing, and lead from the middle — where wisdom and presence thrive.

Episodes

  1. 16 Jun

    The Leadership Shift No One Prepares You For With Tanya Dempsey

    What happens when the skills that made you successful stop being enough? In this candid conversation, Tanya Dempsey, Co-CEO of CSG Advisors, shares her journey from being a highly driven, results-focused leader to discovering that the next level of leadership required an entirely different set of skills. Along the way, she learned hard lessons about delegation, trust, emotional intelligence, communication, and the power of curiosity. Tanya opens up about the mindset shifts that transformed her leadership, including learning to let go of control, asking better questions, investing in people instead of simply driving outcomes, and realizing that leadership is about building capacity in others—not proving your own competence. Whether you're a business leader, team manager, pastor, entrepreneur, or simply someone trying to grow professionally, this conversation offers practical wisdom and honest insights about what it takes to move from doing the work to leading the people who do it. If you've ever felt like leadership is harder than you expected, this episode will remind you that growth is part of the journey—and that the best leaders never stop learning. Key Takeaway The skills that get you promoted aren't the skills that help you scale. Great leadership begins when you stop trying to do everything yourself and start developing the people around you.

  2. 14 Apr

    Episode 5: Scaling Your Leadership

    𝗪𝗛𝗔𝗧 𝗖𝗛𝗔𝗡𝗚𝗘𝗦 𝗪𝗛𝗘𝗡 𝗬𝗢𝗨 𝗠𝗢𝗩𝗘 𝗙𝗥𝗢𝗠 𝗠𝗔𝗡𝗔𝗚𝗜𝗡𝗚 𝗧𝗔𝗦𝗞𝗦 𝗧𝗢 𝗟𝗘𝗔𝗗𝗜𝗡𝗚 𝗔𝗡 𝗢𝗥𝗚𝗔𝗡𝗜𝗭𝗔𝗧𝗜𝗢𝗡? In this episode of The Third Option Leadership Podcast, Bobby McGraw sits down with coaches Dean Harbry and Janalee Rainwater to unpack Stage 3 of the Leadership Lifecycle: Corporate Leadership—the transition from manager to senior leader. At this level, leadership is no longer about personal productivity. It’s about judgment, influence, and building systems that move the organization forward without your constant involvement. You’ll learn how to think like a CEO, create leadership leverage, and develop leaders who can operate without you as the bottleneck. If you’re leading leaders—or preparing to—this episode will help you shift from doing more… to leading better. 𝗪𝗛𝗔𝗧 𝗬𝗢𝗨’𝗟𝗟 𝗟𝗘𝗔𝗥𝗡 Why senior leaders are paid for judgment and influence, not output How to develop system-wide thinking across your organization What managerial leverage is—and how to build it Why great leaders push thinking down, not pull problems up The mindset shift required to move from control → cultivation 𝗞𝗘𝗬 𝗧𝗔𝗞𝗘𝗔𝗪𝗔𝗬𝗦 1. 𝗧𝗛𝗜𝗡𝗞 𝗟𝗜𝗞𝗘 𝗔 𝗖𝗘𝗢 Senior leadership requires a new vantage point. You must see how every part of the organization connects—and where breakdowns impact the whole. 📺 “You’re no longer responsible for doing the work—you’re responsible for how the work works.” 2. 𝗕𝗨𝗜𝗟𝗗 𝗠𝗔𝗡𝗔𝗚𝗘𝗥𝗜𝗔𝗟 𝗟𝗘𝗩𝗘𝗥𝗔𝗚𝗘 You’re no longer leading one-to-one—you’re leading one-to-many. Your job is to: Multiply your thinking Scale your culture Equip leaders to lead without you 📺 “If your leadership doesn’t scale through others, it eventually stalls with you.” 3. 𝗣𝗨𝗦𝗛 𝗧𝗛𝗜𝗡𝗞𝗜𝗡𝗚 𝗗𝗢𝗪𝗡 If you’re still solving every problem, you’ve become the bottleneck. Great leaders: Ask better questions Develop decision-makers Let go of being the hero 📺 “The higher you go, the less you should do—and the more you should develop.” 𝗧𝗛𝗘 𝗕𝗜𝗚 𝗦𝗛𝗜𝗙𝗧 (𝗦𝗧𝗔𝗚𝗘 3 𝗟𝗘𝗔𝗗𝗘𝗥𝗦𝗛𝗜𝗣) Moving into senior leadership means transitioning from: Doing → Designing systems Managing tasks → Leading leaders Being efficient → Being effective on the right things Solving problems → Developing problem-solvers 𝗣𝗥𝗔𝗖𝗧𝗜𝗖𝗔𝗟 𝗔𝗣𝗣𝗟𝗜𝗖𝗔𝗧𝗜𝗢𝗡 One simple place to start: Identify your top 3 responsibilities as a leader Audit your calendar—what doesn’t belong there? Equip your team to make decisions without your constant approval Small shifts → scalable leadership. 𝗥𝗘𝗦𝗢𝗨𝗥𝗖𝗘𝗦 & 𝗡𝗘𝗫𝗧 𝗦𝗧𝗘𝗣𝗦 If you want help applying these principles: Join our free monthly Leadership as a Profession call Explore executive coaching or team workshops Access tools and resources at: 👉 TheMiddleWayInstitute.com 𝗖𝗢𝗠𝗜𝗡𝗚 𝗡𝗘𝗫𝗧 𝗘𝗣𝗜𝗦𝗢𝗗𝗘 The Sponsor Stage — The Final Step Most Leaders Miss Learn how to: Develop your successor Step out of the spotlight Leave a lasting leadership legacy 𝗖𝗟𝗢𝗦𝗜𝗡𝗚 𝗧𝗛𝗢𝗨𝗚𝗛𝗧 📺 “Leadership isn’t about doing it all—it’s about building people who can do it without you.”

  3. 02/12/2025

    Delegate to Elevate

    In this episode of The Third Option of Leadership Podcast, Bobby sits down with Dean Harbry and Janalee Rainwater to unpack one of the most difficult—and most defining—shifts in a leader’s journey: the move from doing the work to developing the people who do the work. Drawing from the Middle Way Institute’s leadership lifecycle and the core principles of “leadership as a profession,” the team explores why so many managers feel overwhelmed, burned out, and stuck. The reason? They’ve been promoted but haven’t made the mindset shift required to lead. Listeners will learn how to: • See delegation as a developmental tool, not a dumping ground. • Use managerial questioning to push thinking down the ladder. • Redefine success as building the capacity of others rather than doing more yourself. • Apply practical frameworks like the Freedom Scale to build judgment, independence, and confidence in their teams. • Take the first “baby steps” toward multiplying their leadership rather than bottlenecking it. This episode gives leaders permission to let go of the myth that “I must do everything myself” and embrace a professional mindset that says, “My success is measured by who I develop—not what I personally accomplish.”

  4. 18/11/2025

    The Map for Growing Your Leadership

    Episode Theme: A practical, visual roadmap showing the four stages of leadership development — and what every leader must learn at each stage to grow without burning out. 🔥 Key Idea Where you are in your leadership journey determines what you need next. Without a map, leaders feel overwhelmed, stuck, or burned out. With a map, they grow with intention. 🧭 The Four Stages of Leadership 1. Individual Contributor (The Doer) Everyone starts here — even PhDs. Known for technical skill and task completion. Where potential future leaders are spotted, not developed. Focus: Vocational effort. The Trap: Believing excellence in technical work automatically means you’re ready to lead. 2. Manager / Director (The Organizer) Transition from doing work to leading people. Requires an entirely new skill set: Delegation as development Managerial questioning Clear role definitions Effective meeting management Healthy accountability without micromanaging Must begin tapering down vocational tasks. The Trap: Trying to lead and keep all your old technical work → burnout. 3. Corporate Leader (The Leader of Leaders) You no longer manage individual contributors — you manage managers. Leadership influence becomes more important than technical ability. Skills: Managerial leverage Scaling leadership Building leadership capability in others Letting go of personal “value” tied to doing the work Vocational tasks should now be minimal. The Trap: Staying attached to technical work because it feels like your value. 4. Sponsor / Successor Developer (The Legacy Builder) Final stage: preparing others to take the baton. Transition from external-facing to internal-facing work. Focus: Succession-style delegation Documenting hard skills & soft skills Transferring relationships, judgment, values, tone Intentional leadership exit or transition. The Trap: Difficulty letting go of control. 📌 Coaching Example Janalee shares a story of a leader drowning in responsibilities because she kept her old vocational tasks while leading a team. Through delegating, setting freedom levels, and clarifying roles, she got her life back — evenings restored, team strengthened. 💡 Big Takeaways Leadership is not intuitive — it requires new skills at each stage. Most leaders don’t fail because they’re lazy. They fail because no one gave them a map. You can’t scale leadership if you stay attached to technical work. Your leadership identity must rise as your vocational identity decreases. Legacy comes from intentional handoff, not accidental replacement. Leaders shouldn’t feel stuck or alone — support exists. 🔜 Next Episode Tease The most common leadership trap: the shift from Doer to Developer — and why delegation is one of the most powerful leadership tools on the planet. 🔗 Learn More Visit MiddleWayInstitute.com to: Access leadership tools for all four stages Join the free Leadership as a Profession monthly call Schedule a complimentary coaching conversation 🎧 Closeout Line Lead with purpose — and remember, leadership isn’t just a position; it’s a profession.

  5. 31/10/2025

    Episode 2: Staying in the Balcony

    Leadership often feels like an emotional roller coaster — conflict, pressure, and unpredictable people. In this episode of The Third Option Leadership Podcast, host Bobby McGraw sits down with Dean Harbry and Janalee Rainwater from the Middle Way Institute to explore one of the most powerful metaphors in leadership: “the balcony.” The balcony represents a leader’s ability to rise above the drama — to see clearly, stay grounded, and respond instead of react. Together, the team unpacks: • The difference between professional leadership and amateur leadership • How to practice emotional poise in real time • The Leader’s Recovery Loop — what to do when you’ve already been pulled into the drama • Practical ways to describe emotions instead of disguising or demonstrating them • How to use self-coaching questions to stay curious and compassionate under pressure Whether you lead a company, a team, or a family, this episode will help you build the emotional strength and perspective to lead from clarity, not chaos. 📍 Learn more about the Middle Way Institute and join a free monthly “Leadership as a Profession” call at middlewayinstitute.com.

  6. 14/10/2025

    Episode 1: How to Stay in Control Without Controlling People

    Leadership can feel like walking a tightrope—expectations are high, feedback is rare, and support is often missing. In this first episode of The Third Option Leadership Podcast, host Bobby McGraw sits down with Dean Harbry and Janalee Rainwater from the Middle Way Institute to explore a central leadership tension: 👉 How do you stay in control without controlling people? Together they unpack: The difference between influence and manipulation Why some leaders drift toward abuse (dominating) or abandon (detaching)—and how to find the Middle Way The role of executive presence and emotional intelligence in building trust and consistency How to give feedback that’s firm but not harsh, clear but not cold The “balcony metaphor” — how to step out of the drama and lead with calm objectivity Whether you lead a team, a business, or a congregation, this episode will help you regain balance, reduce stress, and grow your influence by leading from the middle. 📍 Learn more about Middle Way Institute or join a free Leadership as a Profession call at middlewayinstitute.com.

  • 6 Episodes

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There’s a better way to lead. Hosted by the team at the Middle Way Institute, The Third Option Leadership Podcast explores how to stay grounded, curious, and courageous in leadership. Learn to influence without controlling, correct without crushing, and lead from the middle — where wisdom and presence thrive.

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