The Innovation Show

The Innovation Show

A Global weekly show interviewing authors to inspire, educate and inform the business world and the curious. Presented by the author of "Undisruptable", this Global show speaks of something greater beyond innovation, disruption and technology. It speaks to the human need to learn: how to adapt to and love a changing world. It embraces the spirit of constant change, of staying receptive, of always learning.

  1. Jeff & Staney DeGraff — The Art of Change (DeGraff Trilogy Finale)

    27 APR

    Jeff & Staney DeGraff — The Art of Change (DeGraff Trilogy Finale)

    "Organisations love innovation, but they hate their innovators." Jeff and Staney DeGraff return to The Innovation Show to close out Aidan McCullen's DeGraff trilogy with their book The Art of Change. Their argument is direct: change rarely fails because of bad strategy or weak execution. It fails because leaders bring the wrong mindset — treating change like a linear project when change is actually a paradox to be held. In this conversation, Jeff and Staney reveal: Why the man who saved Operation Warp Speed got passed over for promotion — and what his story tells every innovator about the cost of being right The Jonas Salk warning every change-maker should hear: they won't notice, then they'll say you're doing it wrong, then they'll call you unprofessional, then they'll take credit for your work Why apathy and alignment are the deadliest signs in any organisation The seven core paradoxes of change — and the four-step paradox mindset cycle that breaks the deadlock Why facts don't change minds (the Harriet Beecher Stowe story Lincoln told to prove it) How Sears actually invented the digital economy and how mindset cost them the future Why "deviance first, alignment later" is the funnel every leader gets backwards The CIO joke that isn't funny: Career Is Over as soon as you take the job Why the first pancake is never a good pancake — and what FAIL really stands for Chapters: 00:00 Innovation in the AI era 01:03 Sponsor and book intro 01:40 Why change fails 02:36 Trilogy origins 06:12 Paradox and mindset 07:58 Why organisations punish their innovators 10:28 Luis, Rapid X, and Operation Warp Speed 16:52 Meaning over happiness 18:06 Time, not targets 19:45 The paradox mindset cycle 24:34 Marriage and money paradox 28:15 Conflict fuels change 32:27 Missed futures examples 36:44 Practice beats theatre 38:04 Builders versus bureaucrats 41:05 Skin in the game 42:35 Blocked by superiors 43:45 Leaders spot talent 44:49 Disruptors and failure 48:05 Boundaries create freedom 51:43 Innovation needs hideouts 53:59 Stories build culture 59:45 The seven paradoxes explained 01:07:38 Deviance, then alignment 01:13:10 The paradox mindset cycle 01:18:26 Final takeaways and wrap About Jeff and Staney DeGraff Jeff DeGraff is the "Dean of Innovation" — Clinical Professor of Management at the Ross School of Business, University of Michigan, founder of the Innovatrium, and author of multiple bestselling books on creative leadership. Staney DeGraff is co-founder of the Innovatrium and Jeff's longtime collaborator. Together they've worked with half the Fortune 500 on what it actually takes to make change stick. 📘 The Art of Change — https://amzn.to/48mhX54 🌐 https://jeffdegraff.com About The Innovation Show The Innovation Show with Aidan McCullen is the Thinkers50-recognised podcast where square pegs find their place in a world of round holes. Each week, Aidan sits down with world-class authors, scientists, and practitioners to call out the "Emperor is naked" moments and explore disruption, transformation, leadership, and the ideas shaping tomorrow. Connect 🌐 https://theinnovationshow.io 📨 Substack (and a chance to win a copy of The Creative Mindset): https://thethursdaythought.substack.com 🎧 Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/ie/podcast/the-innovation-show/id1148455669 🎧 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/63nFKf4bsSWo3W72gWtOsK?si=b62d9614237c4450 🔗 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aidanmccullen Sponsor This series is brought to you by Kyndryl. Learn more about Kyndryl and the Kyndryl Institute at https://www.kyndryl.com. #ParadoxMindset #JeffDeGraff #TheArtOfChange #Innovation #ChangeManagement #Leadership #TheInnovationShow #AidanMcCullen #Thinkers50 #InnovationPodcast #LeadershipPodcast #DisruptionTheory

    1hr 23min
  2. Creativity Is a Skill: Jeff & Staney DeGraff on the C.R.E.A.T.E. Method (Clarify to Evaluate)

    22 APR

    Creativity Is a Skill: Jeff & Staney DeGraff on the C.R.E.A.T.E. Method (Clarify to Evaluate)

    Description: Creativity isn't reserved for geniuses—it's a skill you can learn, practice, and compound over time. In this episode of The Innovation Show, Aidan McCullen sits down with Jeff and Staney DeGraff to explore their practical framework for everyday creativity: the C.R.E.A.T.E. method. Based on decades of research and real-world application, they break down how innovation actually happens—not through lightning bolts, but through small, iterative wins. From clarifying the real problem to evaluating ideas effectively, this conversation reframes creativity as a disciplined, learnable process. Sponsored by Kyndryl, this episode also includes a giveaway for subscribers. What You'll Learn: Why creativity is a learnable skill (not a talent) The power of small wins and iterative thinking How to identify the real problem before solving it Techniques like SCAMPER, analogies, and storyboarding Why evaluation—not ideation—often determines success How constraints and failure fuel innovation The C.R.E.A.T.E. Framework: Clarify – Define the real problem through iteration Replicate – Reapply ideas across domains Elaborate – Generate ideas using creative techniques Associate – Connect ideas through analogy and systems thinking Translate – Turn ideas into compelling stories Evaluate – Select the best ideas using structured methods Timestamps: 00:00 Sponsor and Giveaway 00:45 Creativity as Learnable Skill 04:59 Find Your Creative Rhythm 11:11 Constraints and Small Wins 20:57 Clarify the Real Problem 25:25 Replicate and Reapply Ideas 29:01 Elaborate With Wordplay 36:43 Associate Through Analogies 40:43 Translate Into Story 46:09 Evaluate Ideas Wisely Featured Book: The Creative Mindset by Jeff & Staney DeGraff Find the DeGraffs: https://jeffdegraff.com Aidan McCullen is a Thinkers50 Innovation Award winner, keynote speaker Ireland, and host of The Innovation Show—the only podcast ever to receive a Thinkers50 award.

    51 min
  3. Innovation Isn't Harmony—It's Conflict | The Innovation Code Explained

    15 APR

    Innovation Isn't Harmony—It's Conflict | The Innovation Code Explained

    What if the real driver of innovation isn't alignment—but conflict? In this episode of The Innovation Show, Aidan McCullen is joined by Jeff and Staney DeGraff, co-authors of The Innovation Code, to explore a powerful idea: innovation emerges from the tension between opposing perspectives—not from consensus. Drawing on decades of research and real-world application, they introduce four archetypes that shape how individuals and organisations innovate: The Artist (creation & ideas) The Engineer (process & execution) The Athlete (performance & results) The Sage (values & culture) Each brings strengths—and blind spots. The key? Not eliminating conflict—but orchestrating it.  In this episode: Why alignment can actually kill innovation The role of constructive conflict in high-performing teams How different mindsets clash—and why that's essential The lifecycle of innovation and who leads at each stage Why organisations fail when they can't change their worldview How to build cultures of adaptability and reinvention Featured Book: The Innovation Code by Jeff & Staney DeGraff Find the DeGraffs: https://jeffdegraff.com Aidan McCullen is a Thinkers50 Innovation Award winner, keynote speaker Ireland, and host of The Innovation Show—the only podcast ever to receive a Thinkers50 award.

    57 min
  4. AI and the Octopus Organization: Autonomy, Distributed Intelligence & Faster Decision-Making

    8 APR

    AI and the Octopus Organization: Autonomy, Distributed Intelligence & Faster Decision-Making

    AI is triggering a "big bang" in how organizations operate—and those that adapt fastest will win. In this episode, Stephen Wunker and Jonathan Brill explore the concept of the Octopus Organization, where intelligence is distributed, decisions happen at the edge, and workflows—not jobs—are automated. Drawing on biology, they explain how autonomy, governance, and visibility can coexist to unlock speed, resilience, and innovation. The discussion dives into overcoming organizational debt, avoiding groupthink and analysis paralysis, and shifting from rigid hierarchies to adaptive "kill web" structures. Real-world examples—from L'Oréal's rapid product cycles to AI-powered patent creation at Deep Invent—highlight how companies are already transforming. This episode is essential listening for leaders looking to redesign their organizations for the AI era.

    44 min
  5. Split the Pie: Barry Nalebuff on Fair Negotiation

    1 APR

    Split the Pie: Barry Nalebuff on Fair Negotiation

    How do you negotiate firmly, fairly, and effectively — without becoming a jerk?   In this episode of The Innovation Show, Aidan McCullen speaks with Barry Nalebuff — Yale professor, entrepreneur, and author of Split the Pie — about a principled approach to negotiation built around one simple idea: identify the pie, the extra value created only when both sides reach agreement, and split it equally.   Rather than relying on pressure, posturing, or arbitrary bargaining, Barry shows how negotiation can become a logical, ethical, and data-driven process. Drawing on cooperative game theory and real-world business experience, he explains why most people misunderstand what is actually being negotiated — and how that confusion leads to bad deals and bad relationships.   The conversation includes examples from: Barry's mother buying her rented home, Coca-Cola's acquisition of Honest Tea, a negotiation with a domain-name squatter, grant funding and workload-sharing examples, lease-breaking, tax-loss mergers, and everyday fairness disputes.   This is a practical episode for founders, executives, investors, academics, negotiators, and anyone who wants to create better outcomes through principle instead of power plays.   What you'll learn in this episode:   What Barry Nalebuff means by "the pie" Why fairness starts with understanding the real source of value How to negotiate without aggression or manipulation Why principles beat arbitrary numbers How game theory can improve business and life decisions How to avoid accepting less than your fair share     Timestamps 00:00 Sponsor Message 00:28 Negotiation Without Jerk 01:50 Split The Pie Idea 03:29 Dollar Bill Example 05:15 Mom House Deal 11:49 Talmud Cloth Principle 14:22 Honest Tea Coke Bottles 17:16 Coke Buyout Terms 22:02 Domain Troll Negotiation 27:33 Holding Firm on Fairness 28:36 Principles Over Arbitrary Numbers 31:17 Anju and Bharat Interest Puzzle 35:35 Power and Hidden Pie Ethics 37:23 Game Theory and Spock Logic 42:09 Sisyphus Grant Split Example 48:46 Breaking the Lease Loss Pie 52:01 Mergers Tax Losses and Equality 53:12 Fairness Equity and Negotiation Ethics 56:28 Where to Find Barry 57:29 Sponsor and Sign Off

    58 min
  6. Nokia Saw iPhone Coming - So What Went Wrong?

    24 MAR

    Nokia Saw iPhone Coming - So What Went Wrong?

    What if Nokia saw the iPhone coming and still couldn't stop it? In this episode, strategy professor Timo Partanen, former Nokia market intelligence leader (2001–2009), reveals what was really inside Nokia's internal iPhone threat briefing presented to senior leadership. Nokia had tracked Apple for years. They saw the signals like touchscreen innovation, strategic hires, and shifting user expectations. The iPhone's hardware wasn't the surprise. The real shock was Apple's ecosystem. From its exclusive partnership with Cingular (AT&T) to alliances with Google and Yahoo, Apple didn't just launch a product, it launched a new business model. One that exposed Nokia's blind spot: a hardware-first culture in a platform-driven world. We explore why clear warnings didn't lead to action, how strategy broke down between leadership and execution, and what today's companies can learn about disruption, partnerships, and transformation. This is a story about missed shifts, internal friction, and the difficulty of turning insight into impact.

    57 min

  7. 18 MAR

    Nokia's Comeback Explained: Emotion, Strategy & Boardroom Decisions

    How did Nokia survive one of the most dramatic collapses in business history? In this episode, we explore the hidden driver of strategy under pressure: emotion. Drawing on research based on 100+ interviews inside Nokia between 2007 and 2013 , INSEAD's Quy Huy and Aalto University's Timo Vuori join Aidan McCullen to explain how large organizations can execute radical pivots—not just through analysis, but through structured emotion regulation. We unpack how Nokia moved from denial, fear, and rigid thinking to a disciplined, data-driven, and emotionally aware strategy process that enabled it to exit mobile phones and rebuild around networks and 5G. You'll learn: Why strategy fails when emotions go unmanaged How boards can shape better decisions by regulating—not suppressing—emotion The role of consultants, teams, and partners in expanding strategic thinking Why discussing failure systematically leads to better outcomes How to design strategy processes that work under uncertainty This is not just a story about Nokia—it's a blueprint for any organization navigating disruption, uncertainty, and high-stakes decisions. Sponsored by Kyndryl – helping the world's leading organizations modernize and run mission-critical systems for smarter decisions and lasting competitive advantage.

    1hr 4min

  8. 10 MAR

    Everyone Thinks the iPhone Killed Nokia. They're Wrong!

    Most people believe the iPhone killed Nokia. But the real story behind Nokia's collapse is far more complex — and much more human. At its peak Nokia controlled nearly 50% of the global mobile phone market and had over one billion customers. Yet within a few years the company lost the smartphone war as Apple and Google reshaped the industry. In this episode we continue our deep dive into the research of Quy Huy and Timo Vuori, whose study reveals how fear inside Nokia distorted communication and decision-making. Senior leaders felt intense pressure from competitors and investors, while middle managers feared delivering bad news. The result was silence, denial, and what the researchers call "collective lies." We explore how Nokia became trapped by its Symbian platform, how short-term financial pressures undermined long-term innovation, and why leadership dynamics and organizational culture can determine the fate of even the most dominant companies. The lesson: strategy often fails not because of technology — but because leaders stop hearing the truth.

    1hr 5min
See All (739)

Trailers

5
out of 5
29 Ratings

About

A Global weekly show interviewing authors to inspire, educate and inform the business world and the curious. Presented by the author of "Undisruptable", this Global show speaks of something greater beyond innovation, disruption and technology. It speaks to the human need to learn: how to adapt to and love a changing world. It embraces the spirit of constant change, of staying receptive, of always learning.

Information

  • Creator
    The Innovation Show
  • Years Active
    2016 - 2026
  • Episodes
    739
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © The Innovation Show
  • Show Website
    The Innovation Show

You Might Also Like