Love At First Try

Jim Zarkadas
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A SaaS product design podcast for non-designers. The Love At First Try Podcast explores how SaaS products become unforgettable. We unpack the idea of taste in product and brand design, deconstruct what makes beautiful products beautiful, and show how to merge growth with delight. If you’re a SaaS founder, CEO, or developer building products people love, this is for you.

  1. 14: Why great brands are stolen, not created — and how to find your visual direction w/ Zach Stevens

    5 DAYS AGO

    14: Why great brands are stolen, not created — and how to find your visual direction w/ Zach Stevens

    This is Love at First Try — a podcast for SaaS founders and developers who care about design but aren't designers themselves. Zach Stevens is one of the co-founders of Conversion Factory, a marketing agency that works with growth-stage software companies. He runs their design team and has spent years helping SaaS brands go from scrappy to polished — without losing what makes them unique. I wanted to talk to Zach because he's a growth-focused designer. He doesn't just make things look good — he thinks about how design serves the business. And in this episode, we get into how to define your brand's vibe, why stealing from the right references matters, and how to make sure your design supports your marketing instead of fighting against it. 🧠 What you'll learn in this episode:0:00 - Intro0:25 - Who Zach is and what Conversion Factory does for SaaS companies1:00 - Zach's origin story: from almost joining the Marines to meeting mentors who shaped Amazon's brand strategy4:45 - The difference between a designer who just makes things pretty and one who solves business problems7:15 - Aphantasia: why some people can't visualize ideas and what it means for design11:50 - How Zach defines taste as a designer13:58 - The Gap by Ira Glass: why your taste develops faster than your skills17:27 - Why great brands are stolen, not created — and how Liquid Death proves it21:20 - How AI changes the role of creative direction (you don't need to draw it yourself anymore)23:40 - When beautiful design hurts conversions: the Adeline website breakdown30:06 - The fine line between design that serves marketing and design that's just art34:35 - How to add humanity to SaaS websites without looking like a stock photo catalog38:43 - Why the emotion you want to convey matters more than how technical your audience is43:12 - The branding spectrum exercise: masculine vs feminine, luxury vs affordable, subtle vs expressive47:09 - Brands on fire vs brands on ice: how to stay creative without losing consistency50:43 - Why typography alone can completely shift your brand's vibe53:53 - The Mentor Cruise rebrand: from utilitarian to premium using vintage Porsche ads as inspiration1:00:04 - How much should founder taste influence brand direction?1:04:04 - Zach's favorite products right now: Cora, Mile IQ, and ChatGPT for thinking out loud 💡 Actionable takeaways from ZachSteal these quick wins: Define the feeling before the visuals. Before picking colors or fonts, ask: "How do I want people to feel when they interact with my brand?" Everything else follows from that answer. Use the branding spectrum exercise. Map where your brand sits on spectrums like masculine vs feminine, luxury vs affordable, subtle vs expressive. It helps you spot mismatches before you start designing. Steal from what makes you feel the way you want others to feel. Zach's team pulled from vintage Porsche ads for Mentor Cruise because Dominic wanted that timeless, premium vibe. Find your reference points outside your industry. Design should serve marketing, not lead it. If your website looks amazing but the message gets buried, you've prioritized aesthetics over conversions. Copy first, then design around it. Add humanity carefully. Photos of people can make your SaaS feel more relatable — but only if the vibe matches. A playful brand like PostHog uses pixel art hedgehogs instead of faces. Match the emotion, not the tactic. Typography sets the tone. The same sentence in a geometric sans-serif feels modern and clean. In a serif with thick-to-thin contrast, it feels wise and nostalgic. Pick fonts that match your intended feeling. Stay between fire and ice. "Brands on fire" are chaotic — nothing matches. "Brands on ice" are boring and rigid. The best brands have consistency with room for spontaneity depending on context.

    1hr 8min
  2. 13: Why tactical playbooks fail & the money moments framework w/ Marc Thomas

    2 APR

    13: Why tactical playbooks fail & the money moments framework w/ Marc Thomas

    Marc Thomas wrote an annual upgrade email for Senja that listed 10 stupid products you could buy with the $58 you'd save. A scarf shaped like a receipt. Random Amazon finds. People took screenshots and shared it on Twitter and LinkedIn. That's the kind of marketing brain I wanted on the podcast. Marc's path: magazine journalist → SaaS founder (live polling tool) → Head of Growth at Powered by Search (working with $10-100M ARR clients) → Growth at Podia → now independent lifecycle marketing consultant. What I appreciate about him: he doesn't look or feel like a typical marketeer. More playful, more artistic. He understands the fundamentals but puts a creative twist on everything. 🧠 What you'll learn in this episode: 0:00 - Intro1:01 - Marc's journey from journalism to SaaS marketing9:51 - Why tactical playbooks are dead by the time you hear them15:25 - The Senja annual upgrade email that went viral19:27 - How Podia found undervalued influencers in their own user base26:07 - How Marc defines taste (and the Tony Wilson / Factory Records story)31:00 - Habits for developing your creative taste34:47 - Why filtering yourself kills your best ideas37:49 - The "money moments" framework for lifecycle marketing40:13 - How Podia restructured onboarding based on actual buying behavior44:29 - Why you're probably not sending enough email (and the data to prove it)47:31 - How many emails to send in an onboarding sequence50:54 - The key emails every trial sequence needs54:09 - Marc's favorite tools: Sunsama, Whisper Flow, Manus 💡 Steal these quick wins from Marc: 1. Separate strategic from tactical playbooks. Strategic = "emails help because people live in their inbox." Tactical = "do this exact LinkedIn ad format." Strategic playbooks stay valuable. Tactical ones are saturated by the time you hear about them. 2. Find your money moments. Any moment where someone could give you money or take it away deserves a dedicated email sequence. Not just onboarding and win-back. 3. Send pricing early. Don't wait. Day 2 or 3 of your trial, send an email explaining your plans and who each one is for. People don't look at your pricing page as much as you think. 4. Send more email than feels comfortable. At Podia, they went from 4 emails/month to 12. Result: 12% bump in paid conversions on email days, with a trailing effect for days after. Another client saw 60% revenue increase on email days. 5. Front-load your onboarding. Day 1 and 2 are the most important. Marc sends 2-3 emails on day 1 alone for some clients. Then taper off: daily for week 1, then less frequent through day 30. 6. Make your emails worth sharing. The Senja email worked because it was useful AND entertaining. Brand win + referral win in one.

    55 min
  3. 12: How to build an experimentation culture (even with low traffic) w/ Lucia Van Den Brink

    26 MAR

    12: How to build an experimentation culture (even with low traffic) w/ Lucia Van Den Brink

    Lucia Van Den Brink has run nearly 1,000 experiments in 14 years. She's worked with 100M+ brands, founded The Initial to help companies build experimentation in-house, co-founded Women in Experimentation, and teaches at CXL. I invited her on Love at First Try to talk about something most SaaS teams get wrong: how to actually make data-driven decisions without overcomplicating it. This episode is for you if you've ever thought "we don't have enough traffic to test" or "A/B testing is too expensive for us." Lucia challenges both of those assumptions. 🧠 What you'll learn in this episode: 0:00 - Intro: what this podcast is about and who it's for0:25 - Who is Lucia and why experimentation matters for smaller SaaS teams2:59 - The real difference between random testing and building an experimentation culture6:36 - Why experimentation is actually about scaling leadership (insight from Booking.com)9:15 - What counts as an "experiment" beyond simple A/B tests11:32 - How a news website validated a 6-month feature before building it12:57 - Why starting with removing elements is one of the biggest growth levers16:22 - How to validate your data before trusting any experiment19:05 - How to prioritize what to test (and where to start)21:34 - Why you shouldn't segment your tests when you're just starting25:41 - How to measure the right KPIs (including delayed metrics)31:28 - Why you should never measure just one metric36:45 - Real example: reducing churn in the first two weeks with a get started page43:10 - Why "obvious UX improvements" still need testing (the humbling 20-30% win rate)48:09 - The biggest mindset shift from junior to senior in experimentation 💡 Actionable insights from Lucia: 1. Start by removing, not addingOne of the biggest growth levers is removing elements from your pages. Most tools let you hide elements without code. Try removing a field, a section, or a step in your funnel. You'd be surprised how often less friction means more conversions. 2. Run an AA test before any real experimentBefore you trust your data, run an empty test (control vs. control). This tells you if your tracking actually works. Skip this and you might be making decisions on broken data. 3. Measure multiple KPIs, not just onePick a main metric, but always track 2-3 supporting metrics. If you're testing onboarding changes, measure signups AND activation AND delayed metrics like paid conversions. One number never tells the full story. 4. Consider negative testingInstead of building a big new feature to test, try removing the opposite. Want to know if onboarding calls help? Test what happens when you remove them. You learn faster and cheaper. 5. Calculate the business case for "losing" metricsSometimes a test hurts one metric but helps another. If showing a phone number increases support calls but also increases conversions, do the math. The revenue might cover the cost.

    52 min
  4. 11: Designing AI video tools you can't prototype in Figma (w/ Lewis Dingley)

    5 MAR

    11: Designing AI video tools you can't prototype in Figma (w/ Lewis Dingley)

    Lewis Dingley spent years at Renault, Sky, and Dyson building his CV with big names. Then he realized: he was one designer among 50. No ownership. No real impact. So he jumped into startups — and now he's designing AI-powered video tools at VEED.io that you literally cannot prototype in Figma. What this episode is aboutThis is Love At First Try — a podcast about building SaaS products people actually love. I sat down with Lewis Dingley, Senior Product Designer at VEED.io — the AI-powered video editor that's making video creation accessible to everyone. Lewis has a wild background. Design school in France. Vehicle dashboards at Renault. TV products at Sky. Physical products at Dyson. And now — AI video tools at VEED. What made me want to talk to him: VEED is building generative AI features you simply cannot design in Figma. Text-to-video. AI avatars. Image-to-video editing. Real AI models doing real things. So how do you design for that? Lewis vibe codes. He prototypes with real APIs. He rebuilt an entire product in a day using Google AI Studio. If you're designing AI-powered products (or thinking about it), this one's for you. 🧠 What you'll learn in this episode:0:00 - Lewis's journey from French design school to Renault, Sky, Dyson, and VEED5:22 - Why he left big corporations for startups and what changed10:45 - Why product designers need to be closer to leadership15:26 - Vibe coding: how Lewis rebuilt VEED's text-to-video product in one day18:13 - Google AI Studio vs Lovable — which is actually useful for prototyping21:04 - Why you should always present prototypes, never static screens26:44 - The trick to making AI tools understand your design system29:15 - How VEED's AI Playground integrates 30+ image and video models34:00 - Why Kling's new model made months of their work obsolete overnight36:29 - The biggest barrier for users is starting from scratch44:01 - VEED's AI agent that nobody used and what it taught them50:18 - Why education can't keep up with AI and what that means for designers55:07 - Short-form video addiction and why Lewis uses Do Not Disturb mode1:00:10 - Why some industries will never adopt new tech and that's okay1:08:27 - How Lewis defines taste as a designer1:12:25 - How he develops his taste with Mobbin, competitors, and adding his own ingredients1:14:12 - His least favorite SaaS (Slack) and why he pitched them a podcast feature 💡 Actionable takeaways from Lewis→ Prototype, don't design static screens. Present interactive prototypes to leadership instead of static Figma screens. Lewis says it's the difference between getting a "maybe" and getting a "wow, yes." Seeing is believing — especially when you're trying to get buy-in for new ideas. → Start with functionality, then UI when vibe coding. When using AI tools like Google AI Studio to prototype, build the working functionality first. Don't try to make it look pretty from the start — the AI gets confused and loses the functionality. Get it working, then refine the visuals. → Describe your design system in words, not just screenshots. AI tools are bad at replicating your UI from a screenshot alone. Instead, describe your design system: "minimalist design, these kinds of buttons, this iconography style." Once the AI understands the theme, it can generate consistent UI without constant screenshots. → Give users presets, not blank canvases. The biggest barrier for users is starting from scratch. Instead of asking them to write prompts or create from nothing, give them templates, presets, and examples they can tweak. Lewis saw this work at VEED — users don't want to type "sunrise lighting," they want to click a visual example. → Use Do Not Disturb mode aggressively. Lewis realized he was addicted to his phone — checking it every 10 seconds for notifications he didn't need. Now he uses Do Not Disturb so he only checks his phone when he has time, not when it demands attention. → Look at competitors and make it better. Lewis's approach to developing taste: research direct and indirect competitors, see what they're doing, then add your own ingredients. Don't start from scratch — start from inspiration and build on it.

    1hr 18min
  5. 10: User-centric growth, 60-second aha moments & why the best onboarding is no onboarding (w/ Kate Syuma)

    26 FEB

    10: User-centric growth, 60-second aha moments & why the best onboarding is no onboarding (w/ Kate Syuma)

    Kate Syuma spent 6+ years at Miro redesigning their onboarding. Now she advises Autodesk, ManyChat, and Dealfront on activation. I invited her on the podcast because she's one of the few growth people who actually cares about delight — not just conversions. She calls it "user-centric product growth." And after this conversation, I get why. 🎙️ 𝗪𝗵𝗮𝘁 𝘁𝗵𝗶𝘀 𝗲𝗽𝗶𝘀𝗼𝗱𝗲 𝗶𝘀 𝗮𝗯𝗼𝘂𝘁 Kate and I go deep on taste, activation, and how AI is changing the way we onboard users. If you're a SaaS founder or dev without a designer — and you want your product to feel intuitive without hiring a full UX team — this one's for you. 🧠 𝗪𝗵𝗮𝘁 𝘆𝗼𝘂'𝗹𝗹 𝗹𝗲𝗮𝗿𝗻 𝗶𝗻 𝘁𝗵𝗶𝘀 𝗲𝗽𝗶𝘀𝗼𝗱𝗲: 0:00 - Why taste is built through exposure (and how to train it)4:12 - How your prompt reveals your taste in the AI era8:45 - The risk of chasing speed and shipping "good enough"12:30 - Why the best onboarding is no onboarding at all16:20 - AI voice assistants that onboard users in real-time (Obby by Core)21:15 - Agentic AI: giving commands instead of clicking through menus26:40 - How Miro used pre-recorded humans to blend self-serve with human touch30:10 - Domain matching: the activation tactic that grew Mobin's expansion revenue by 20%35:25 - Fixing your core value action vs. adding more tooltips38:50 - Mini aha moments: getting users to value in under 60 seconds42:30 - Why users need to invest (the IKEA effect in SaaS)45:00 - Kate's favorite apps: Granola and Dream Notes 💡 𝗔𝗰𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝗮𝗯𝗹𝗲 𝘁𝗮𝗸𝗲𝗮𝘄𝗮𝘆𝘀 𝗳𝗿𝗼𝗺 𝗞𝗮𝘁𝗲 → 𝗔𝗱𝗱 𝗱𝗼𝗺𝗮𝗶𝗻 𝗺𝗮𝘁𝗰𝗵𝗶𝗻𝗴 𝘁𝗼 𝘆𝗼𝘂𝗿 𝘀𝗶𝗴𝗻𝘂𝗽 𝗳𝗹𝗼𝘄When someone signs up with the same company domain as an existing user, prompt them to join that team instead of creating a solo account. This is how you turn individual users into expanding teams — without extra marketing spend. → 𝗔𝘂𝗱𝗶𝘁 𝘆𝗼𝘂𝗿 𝗰𝗼𝗿𝗲 𝘃𝗮𝗹𝘂𝗲 𝗮𝗰𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻Find the one thing users need to do to experience your product's value. If that experience is broken or buried, no amount of tooltips will save you. Fix the core flow first. → 𝗔𝗶𝗺 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗮 𝗺𝗶𝗻𝗶 𝗮𝗵𝗮 𝗺𝗼𝗺𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗶𝗻 𝟲𝟬 𝘀𝗲𝗰𝗼𝗻𝗱𝘀Use AI to pre-fill content, pull data from their website, or generate a proof of concept on signup. It won't be perfect — but it builds momentum and motivates users to invest further. → 𝗥𝗲𝗽𝗹𝗮𝗰𝗲 𝗽𝗮𝘀𝘀𝗶𝘃𝗲 𝘃𝗶𝗱𝗲𝗼𝘀 𝘄𝗶𝘁𝗵 𝗮𝗰𝘁𝗶𝘃𝗲 𝘁𝘂𝘁𝗼𝗿𝗶𝗮𝗹𝘀If your onboarding relies on explainer videos, test a hands-on flow instead. Users learn by doing, not watching.

    46 min
  6. 09: Stop writing copy. Let your customers write it. Deep dive into emotional targeting w/ Talia Wolf

    19 FEB

    09: Stop writing copy. Let your customers write it. Deep dive into emotional targeting w/ Talia Wolf

    "What happened in your life that made you look for this tool?" This one question changed how I think about copy. Talia Wolf dropped this on the latest episode of Love at First Try — and I had to sit with it. Talia has been doing conversion optimization for 13+ years. She built the Emotional Targeting methodology and runs GetUplift, an agency that's helped SaaS companies stop guessing and start converting. I wanted her on because she's the person who taught me (through Chris Silvestri) that customers should write your copy — not you. Most SaaS founders are "data-driven." They know their users' job titles, company size, location. But they don't know why people actually buy. So they default to talking about themselves. Features. Pricing. Technology. And their landing page sounds like every other SaaS in their space. Talia's framework flips this. You stop optimizing elements and start solving emotional problems. 🧠 WHAT YOU'LL LEARN 0:00 - How Talia went from social media marketing to building the emotional targeting methodology 4:37 - The survey question that gets customers to write your copy for you 9:16 - Why "data-driven" companies still fail at conversion 13:35 - A landing page example that nails emotional resonance (Prompt Cowboy) 17:37 - How to do emotional targeting when you have multiple ICPs 25:33 - The "what would you miss" question that reveals what customers actually value 32:14 - Why retention problems are often research problems, not feature problems 44:29 - How to actually use AI for customer research without getting garbage 50:14 - Why buying decisions now happen off your website (Reddit, LinkedIn, communities) 58:36 - How CRO is changing in the age of AI and LLMs 💡 STEAL THESE QUICK WINS → Replace "why did you sign up?" with "what happened in your life that made you look for this?" This forces customers to tell you the trigger, not just the surface reason. You get emotional context, not "pricing" or "needed a tool." → Ask: "If you could no longer use this product tomorrow, what would you miss most?" Instead of "what do you like about us?" — this reframes around loss. People reveal what they actually depend on, not what sounds polite. → When using AI for research, demand quotes from your data Tell ChatGPT: "Support every claim with 5 direct quotes from this dataset." Otherwise it hallucinates patterns that don't exist. → Treat your homepage as a springboard, not a catch-all Different ICPs need different journeys. Let them self-select where to go next instead of trying to speak to everyone at once. → Optimize your narrative across the web, not just your website Buying decisions happen on Reddit, LinkedIn, YouTube. If you're not shaping the conversation there, you can't influence what AI tells buyers about you.

    1hr 1min
  7. 08: Copying Superhuman the right way, saying no to feature requests & forcing users through onboarding (w/ Mitchell Tan)

    22 JAN

    08: Copying Superhuman the right way, saying no to feature requests & forcing users through onboarding (w/ Mitchell Tan)

    Your most requested feature? Might be the worst thing you could build. That's one of the lessons from my conversation with Mitchell Tan, co-founder of Kondo. Kondo is the Superhuman for LinkedIn DMs — a tool that turns the messy LinkedIn inbox into something you actually want to use. Keyboard shortcuts, labels, split inboxes, reminders. Built by a 3-person team. No public roadmap. And they say no to almost everything users ask for. I've been using Kondo for months and it's genuinely changed how I handle LinkedIn. If you use LinkedIn professionally, you have to try it. So I had to get Mitchell on the podcast to understand how they think about product. 🧠 𝗪𝗵𝗮𝘁 𝘆𝗼𝘂'𝗹𝗹 𝗹𝗲𝗮𝗿𝗻 𝗶𝗻 𝘁𝗵𝗶𝘀 𝗲𝗽𝗶𝘀𝗼𝗱𝗲: 0:00 - What is Kondo and how it started1:40 - From recruiting firm to building a Superhuman-inspired SaaS7:45 - Why "copying" great products is harder than it sounds9:11 - The invisible UX details that make Superhuman feel faster (even when it's not)13:52 - How LinkedIn DMs are fundamentally different from email19:43 - Why Kondo has no public roadmap and ignores most feature requests23:52 - The 3-question framework to decide what to build next38:52 - How to define your aha moment (and why it's different for everyone)49:33 - Why one-on-one onboarding calls still matter (and when to stop doing them)55:51 - Forcing users through onboarding vs letting them explore freely1:01:14 - Linear's hidden UX gems that inspire Kondo 💡 𝗔𝗰𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝗮𝗯𝗹𝗲 𝘁𝗮𝗸𝗲𝗮𝘄𝗮𝘆𝘀 𝗳𝗿𝗼𝗺 𝗠𝗶𝘁𝗰𝗵𝗲𝗹𝗹: → 𝗕𝗲𝗳𝗼𝗿𝗲 𝗯𝘂𝗶𝗹𝗱𝗶𝗻𝗴 𝗮𝗻𝘆 𝗳𝗲𝗮𝘁𝘂𝗿𝗲, 𝗮𝘀𝗸 𝟯 𝗾𝘂𝗲𝘀𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝘀Does it let you charge more? Does it convert non-payers? Does it reduce churn? If all three are no — don't build it. → 𝗖𝗼𝗽𝘆 𝗴𝗿𝗲𝗮𝘁 𝗽𝗿𝗼𝗱𝘂𝗰𝘁𝘀, 𝗯𝘂𝘁 𝘂𝗻𝗱𝗲𝗿𝘀𝘁𝗮𝗻𝗱 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗶𝗻𝘁𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗳𝗶𝗿𝘀𝘁Superhuman tracks your mouse direction to adjust UI response times. You can't just copy pixels — you need to understand why things work before deciding what to borrow. → 𝗞𝗻𝗼𝘄 𝘄𝗵𝗮𝘁 𝗡𝗢𝗧 𝘁𝗼 𝗰𝗼𝗽𝘆Superhuman's split inbox works for email. But LinkedIn DMs are different — all conversations with one person live in one thread. So Kondo built labels that create split tabs instead. Same goal, different execution. → 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗰𝗲 𝘂𝘀𝗲𝗿𝘀 𝘁𝗵𝗿𝗼𝘂𝗴𝗵 𝗼𝗻𝗯𝗼𝗮𝗿𝗱𝗶𝗻𝗴 — 𝗯𝘂𝘁 𝗸𝗻𝗼𝘄 𝘆𝗼𝘂𝗿 𝗮𝘂𝗱𝗶𝗲𝗻𝗰𝗲Superhuman blocks clicking during their tutorial — keyboard only. Kondo allows clicking because not everyone buys for shortcuts. Be opinionated, but match it to why people actually pay you. → 𝗣𝗲𝗿𝗰𝗲𝗶𝘃𝗲𝗱 𝘀𝗽𝗲𝗲𝗱 > 𝗮𝗰𝘁𝘂𝗮𝗹 𝘀𝗽𝗲𝗲𝗱Kondo had the same response times as Superhuman but felt slower. The difference? Micro-animations. A subtle slide when you archive. Small details that make software feel alive.

    1hr 5min
  8. 07: No backlog, no hype — how Moneybird built the #1 bookkeeping software in the Netherlands w/ Edwin Vlieg

    8 JAN

    07: No backlog, no hype — how Moneybird built the #1 bookkeeping software in the Netherlands w/ Edwin Vlieg

    I pay for software I barely use. Just because I love how it's designed. My accountant has me on Exact Online for bookkeeping. It works. But the UX is so ugly I refuse to create invoices there. So I pay for Moneybird every month — just to use one feature: invoicing. I could skip it entirely. Save the money. But I don't want to. The brand, the experience, the attention to detail — it makes me want to open the app. That's the power of great design in B2B. And that's why I had to get Edwin Vlieg on the podcast. Edwin is the co-founder of Moneybird — the #1 bookkeeping software for entrepreneurs in the Netherlands. 400,000+ users. 80-person team. 17 years bootstrapped. 🧠 𝗪𝗵𝗮𝘁 𝘆𝗼𝘂'𝗹𝗹 𝗹𝗲𝗮𝗿𝗻: 0:00 - How Moneybird started in 2008 when everything was on-premise2:38 - The market back then and why competitors didn't survive5:19 - Starting with invoicing, not accounting (and why that mattered)7:32 - Why they built for entrepreneurs, not accountants10:26 - The positioning that made them #1 in the Netherlands14:44 - Design culture and team structure at Moneybird16:21 - How ShapeUp works with rotating teams (and why it prevents silos)24:51 - Why process is the product that builds the product29:16 - How they decide what to build next (hint: no feature backlog)31:26 - Framing vs shaping: how they avoid wasting time on bad ideas33:46 - Phased rollouts with feature flags and the surprising feedback they got41:43 - Why good ideas bubble up and you don't need a backlog44:15 - Support engineer rotation: why builders should feel their own bugs45:24 - Their approach to AI: rule-based engines + AI, not pure hype50:06 - Redesigning purchase invoices with AI (and what users did that they never expected)56:56 - Why they launched an MCP instead of building a chatbot1:03:32 - Edwin's favorite products and the terminal UI movement 💡 𝗔𝗰𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝗮𝗯𝗹𝗲 𝘁𝗮𝗸𝗲𝗮𝘄𝗮𝘆𝘀: → 𝗥𝗼𝘁𝗮𝘁𝗲 𝘁𝗲𝗮𝗺𝘀 𝗯𝗲𝘁𝘄𝗲𝗲𝗻 𝗽𝗿𝗼𝗷𝗲𝗰𝘁𝘀Fresh eyes catch what the original team missed. → 𝗙𝗿𝗮𝗺𝗲 𝗯𝗲𝗳𝗼𝗿𝗲 𝘆𝗼𝘂 𝘀𝗵𝗮𝗽𝗲If leadership isn't excited at the framing stage, don't waste weeks on detailed specs. → 𝗣𝗵𝗮𝘀𝗲𝗱 𝗿𝗼𝗹𝗹𝗼𝘂𝘁𝘀 𝘄𝗶𝘁𝗵 𝗳𝗲𝗮𝘁𝘂𝗿𝗲 𝗳𝗹𝗮𝗴𝘀Start small. Get feedback. Scale to 100% after you've learned. → 𝗠𝗮𝗸𝗲 𝗯𝘂𝗶𝗹𝗱𝗲𝗿𝘀 𝗳𝗶𝘅 𝘁𝗵𝗲𝗶𝗿 𝗼𝘄𝗻 𝗯𝘂𝗴𝘀When you might be fixing bugs next cycle, you ship better code this cycle. → 𝗦𝗸𝗶𝗽 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗯𝗮𝗰𝗸𝗹𝗼𝗴Good ideas bubble up. No need for a graveyard of feature requests.

    1hr 11min
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About

A SaaS product design podcast for non-designers. The Love At First Try Podcast explores how SaaS products become unforgettable. We unpack the idea of taste in product and brand design, deconstruct what makes beautiful products beautiful, and show how to merge growth with delight. If you’re a SaaS founder, CEO, or developer building products people love, this is for you.

Information

  • Creator
    Jim Zarkadas
  • Years Active
    2025 - 2026
  • Episodes
    14
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2026 Jim Zarkadas
  • Show Website
    Love At First Try