LawNext

Populus Radio, Robert Ambrogi
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LawNext is a weekly podcast hosted by Bob Ambrogi, who is internationally known for his writing and speaking on legal technology and innovation. Each week, Bob interviews the innovators and entrepreneurs who are driving what's next in the legal industry. From legal technology startups to new law firm business models to enhancing access to justice, Bob and his guests explore the future of law and legal practice.

  1. 4 HR AGO

    How AI Is Transforming the Way Law Firms Win Business, with Ikaun President Jason Noble

    Law firms sell experience — but for decades, harnessing and operationalizing that experience has been a largely manual, chaotic process. In this episode, recorded live at the Legal Marketing Association annual conference in New Orleans, host Bob Ambrogi sits down with Jason Noble, president and chief of product strategy at Ikaun, to talk about how his company is changing that. Ikaun is a managed service and technology platform that helps law firms streamline the proposal and RFP response process — from capturing and organizing matter experience data to using AI to assemble and draft competitive pitches. Jason explains how the platform works, how the arrival of generative AI transformed what was previously possible, and why Ikaun positions itself as a managed service rather than a self-serve SaaS tool. Jason and Bob also get into the bigger picture of how law firms are responding to AI-driven changes in the competitive landscape, whether the billable hour can survive in an AI-augmented world, and whether the RFP process itself will look the same in the years ahead — or whether we're moving toward a future where agents are submitting and responding to proposals with minimal human involvement.   Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out.   Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner).   Chapters   (00:00) Introduction to ICON and Legal Tech Innovations (02:30) Jason Noble's Journey and Background (05:20) The Evolution of ICON and Its Focus (07:09) Experience Management in Legal Firms (10:30) Gathering Experience Data in Litigation (11:48) How ICON's Platform Works (14:05) The Impact of AI on Proposal Processes (18:07) Current Landscape of RFP Responses (20:31) Differentiating ICON from Competitors (22:45) Knowledge Management vs. Experience Management (24:01) Tailoring Solutions for Law Firms (25:49) Qualities of Successful Law Firms (27:24) Law Firms' Response to AI Integration (29:54) Pricing Strategies in RFP Responses (31:21) Competitive Landscape and AI's Influence (33:27) The Future of Billable Hours (35:50) The Future of RFPs and AI's Role (39:33) Client Satisfaction and Future Directions   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    41 min
  2. You Might Also Like: On Purpose with Jay Shetty

    4 HR AGO ·  BONUS

    You Might Also Like: On Purpose with Jay Shetty

    Introducing HAYDEN PANETTIERE: The Truth Behind the Headlines (Finally Telling Her Story In Her Own Words) from On Purpose with Jay Shetty. Follow the show: On Purpose with Jay Shetty Sometimes the hardest part of healing isn’t what the world did to you, it’s unlearning the version of yourself you became just to survive it. Today, Jay sits down with Hayden Panettiere for a raw and powerful conversation where she shares the truth behind a life the world thought it knew, but never truly understood. What unfolds isn’t just a story about fame, it’s a powerful reckoning with identity, pain, and resilience. From losing the innocence of a normal childhood to carrying the emotional weight of growing up in the spotlight, Hayden shares how early success came with hidden costs, bullying, isolation, and a lifelong struggle to feel like she truly belonged. This conversation goes beyond the headlines and into the heart of a woman who has spent decades learning how to separate who she is from who the world decided she should be. As the conversation deepens, Hayden opens up about the hidden battles that shaped her adulthood, including addiction, postpartum depression, and the weight of living her trauma both privately and in public. She reflects on the surreal experience of playing a character whose struggles mirrored her own, where the line between performance and real life pain began to blur. Together, they unpack the patterns, the pressure to please, and the emotions she never had the space to process that kept her stuck in cycles she couldn’t break. Within it all, a powerful truth emerges: healing isn’t linear, and even in the darkest moments, there’s a quiet strength still fighting to rise. Through grief, loss, and unimaginable challenges, Hayden is learning to reclaim her voice, trust herself again, and step into a new chapter defined not by survival, but by intention. In this episode you'll learn: How to Heal When Your Identity Was Shaped by Others How to Rebuild Self-Trust After Years of Self-Doubt How to Break Free from Toxic and Abusive Cycles How to Cope with Anxiety That Feels Never-Ending How to Navigate Postpartum Depression Without Shame How to Stop Living for Approval and Start Living for Yourself How to Let Go of the Need to Fix Everyone How to Set Boundaries with People You Love How to Keep Going When Life Keeps Breaking You If you see parts of yourself in this story, the doubt, the pain, the patterns you wish you could break, know that you’re not alone, and more importantly, you’re not stuck. Healing doesn’t happen all at once, and it doesn’t require perfection. This Is Me: A Reckoning is Hayden’s memoir where she shares a rare and intimate glimpse into her life behind closed doors, opening up about postpartum depression, addiction and recovery, trauma, domestic abuse, and loss. To get a copy, visit: https://www.amazon.com/This-Is-Me-A-Reckoning/dp/B0G7L8QSTK  With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty JAY’S DAILY WISDOM DELIVERED STRAIGHT TO YOUR INBOX Join 900,000+ readers discovering how small daily shifts create big life change with my free newsletter. Subscribe https://news.jayshetty.me/subscribe   Check out our Apple subscription to unlock bonus content of On Purpose! https://lnk.to/JayShettyPodcast  What We Discuss: 00:00 Intro 01:53 A Childhood Memory That Shaped Your Strength 03:11 Realizing Your Childhood Wasn’t “Normal” 05:03 Feeling Too Much While Trying to Find Where You Belong 08:08 Turning Early Bullying into Inner Strength 12:12 Growing Up Before You Were Ready 14:55 The Moment You Stop Living for Your Family’s Expectations 18:09 Releasing the Need for Everyone’s Approval 22:33 Meeting Your Real Self For the First Time 24:42 Choosing Yourself and Finding Peace 27:07 Finding Strength When You Don’t Feel Safe 31:21 Learning to Rise After Betrayal 35:18 Learning to Trust Yourself Again After Being Let Down 37:04 Staying Steady When Everything Around You Isn’t 39:19 The Cost of Living for Applause 44:21 Letting Yourself Love Again 48:25 Finding Strength Through Anxiety 55:35 The Reality of Postpartum No One Talks About 01:00:27 Losing Everything You Built and Starting Again 01:03:52 The Truth About Postpartum Depression 01:07:41 Letting Go Even When It Hurts 01:14:57 Choosing What’s Best for Your Child 01:17:18 Staying Close Even When You’re Far Apart 01:21:16 Finding the Strength to Leave an Abusive Relationship 01:30:41 Rebuilding Yourself After Trauma 01:35:36 Finding the Courage to Ask for Help 01:37:46 Walking Away and Reclaiming Your Power Episode Resources: Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/haydenpanettiere/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information. DISCLAIMER: Please note, this is an independent podcast episode not affiliated with, endorsed by, or produced in conjunction with the host podcast feed or any of its media entities. The views and opinions expressed in this episode are solely those of the creators and guests. For any concerns, please reach out to team@podroll.fm.

  3. 27 APR

    Legal Marketing Association President Rachel Shields Williams On AI, Innovation, and Why People Still Come First

    Recorded live at the annual meeting of the Legal Marketing Association in New Orleans, this episode features a conversation with Rachel Shields Williams, president of the LMA and director of client intelligence at Sidley Austin, where she has spent 17 years building out roles at the intersection of marketing, business development, knowledge management and data. Earlier this year, Rachel was named a recipient of ALM's Monica Bay Women in Legal Tech Award. Rachel and host Bob Ambrogi discuss how AI is reshaping the work of legal marketers, and why she believes the marketing community is uniquely positioned to help law firms move past the "I'm curious, I want to click the buttons" stage of AI adoption to sustained, repeatable value. They get into the state of innovation in big law — including Rachel's view that firms cannot use AI or money to "skip the canyon of despair" in change management — and why she thinks meaningful innovation often looks less like a headline and more like getting one percent better every week. The conversation also covers the changing competitive landscape facing traditional firms, from AI-native entrants like Norm AI to MSOs and a resurgent ALSP market; the long-running debate over the billable hour; the four interrelated elements Rachel sees at the heart of every law firm's data — documents, clients, matters, and people; and what firm leaders should be doing right now to stay competitive over the next decade. Throughout, Rachel returns to a theme about which she calls herself an "unapologetic humanist" — technology and process will keep changing, but the firms that win will be the ones that put the right people in the room first.   Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out. Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner).   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    45 min

  4. 15 APR

    Built on a Weekend: Damien Riehl and Mike Bommarito Show What Vibe Coding Can Really Do

    We don't usually say this, but for today's LawNext, you're going to want to watch the video version, if you can. The audio will be good, but the video will be great. You can find it on YouTube.  Why? Because we're going to be talking today about vibe coding, and you're going to want to see what our guests are showing today, not just hear them tell about it. Those guests are Damien Riehl and Michael Bommarito. By day, Damien works on AI products at Clio and Mike is CEO of 273 Ventures, a company that provides AI strategy and services for law firms and legal professionals. But outside their day jobs, they are also founders of the ALEA Institute, the Institute for the Advancement of Legal and Ethical AI, where a central focus of theirs is the FOLIO Project, which is seeking to develop and maintain open legal standards and a comprehensive ontology to enable different legal systems to communicate with each other. FOLIO is an outgrowth of the SALI Alliance, whose ontology was largely developed by Damien. So what does any of this have to do with vibe coding? Well, in connection with their FOLIO project, Damien and Mike have been building an array of tools for tagging and enriching legal documents (FOLIO Enrich), for mapping law firm taxonomies (FOLIO Mapper), for browsing and editing legal ontologies (FOLIO Ontology Explorer), and much more. (See the full list of FOLIO resources.) And they've built all of it by vibe coding. Not over months, not with a team of developers, but on their own, often in a single weekend day, using AI coding tools. When Damien first showed LawNext host Bob Ambrogi what he and Mike were developing, Bob thought, "It's not enough for me to just write about this. It really has to be seen, in action." So he asked Damien and Mike to come on LawNext, share their screens, walk us through what they've been building, and show us what vibe coding actually looks like in action when it's applied to serious legal technology problems.    Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out.   Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner).   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    1hr 2min

  5. 7 APR

    Learned Hand's Shlomo Klapper on Why Courts Are the Next Frontier for Legal AI

    Are courts the next frontier for legal AI? Shlomo Klapper, founder and CEO of the AI-driven judicial case-preparation platofrm Learned Hand, believes they are. A former litigator at Quinn Emanuel and law clerk for the 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, Klapper is building what he calls a "reasoning engine" for judges — AI tools designed to help them manage crushing caseloads by organizing case materials, flagging when lawyers bend the truth, and drafting bench memos and orders. LawNext host Bob Ambrogi interviews Klapper on the heels of significant news: Learned Hand just announced a partnership with the Superior Court of Los Angeles County, the largest trial court in the nation, to explore how AI can support judicial officers across the full arc of a case — from filing through drafting. The company's technology  — the only AI built exclusively for the judiciary — is also used by the Michigan Supreme Court and trial courts in 10 states. In today's conversation, Klapper discusses why courts are the next frontier for legal AI, what it takes to earn the trust of judges, and how Jevons Paradox — the idea that as legal services get cheaper, demand will explode — is reshaping the justice system. They also dig into the difficult questions around how Learned Hand addresses concerns about bias and hallucinations, and how it can overcome judges' skepticism about AI and achieve broad judicial adoption.    Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out.   Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner).   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    1hr 7min

  6. 31 MAR

    Mary Technology Wants to Solve Litigation's 'Fact Chaos' Problem

    E-discovery platforms have gotten great at narrowing millions of documents down to manageable sets. But what happens next — the grueling work of extracting facts, organizing them, and building a reliable case narrative — has remained largely manual. In this episode of LawNext, host Bob Ambrogi talks with Daniel Lord-Doyle, cofounder and CEO of Mary Technology, about the Australian startup's bet that "fact management" is the missing layer in litigation technology. Mary's approach is distinct from the large AI platforms that store documents as embeddings in vector databases. Instead, the company extracts every individual fact, enriches it with metadata, and links it directly back to its source — creating what Lord-Doyle calls a verifiable chain from work product to evidence. He makes a compelling case that in litigation, where fault tolerance is low and the stakes are high, the nuance lost by compression-based AI systems is exactly what matters most. The company just closed a $7 million (Australian) seed round led by OIF Ventures and is expanding into the U.S. with a new San Francisco office and a new self-serve platform that lets smaller firms try it without a sales process. Lord-Doyle also talks about the concept of "productive friction" — why Mary deliberately won't let lawyers skip the verification step — and what he's learned about bringing an Australian legal tech product to the American market.   Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out.   Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner).   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    44 min

  7. 19 MAR

    LawNext on Location: Visiting Everlaw's Headquarters For A Conversation with AJ Shankar, Founder and CEO

    For the final installment of our LawNext on Location series, Bob heads across the bay, from San Francisco to Oakland, to the headquarters of e-discovery company Everlaw, where he sits down with founder and CEO AJ Shankar for a conversation about technology, AI and being in it for the long game.  AJ grew up in Connecticut, came west in 2002 for a computer science PhD at UC Berkeley, and has lived within a few blocks of the Berkeley campus ever since. He stumbled into the legal industry almost by accident — recruited to serve as a technical expert in litigation involving how the internet worked — and quickly realized that the legal world was home to some of the most technically fascinating and underserved problems he'd ever encountered. He never left. AJ had a prior startup, a computer vision company that was acquired, before launching Everlaw in 2011. The company was cloud-native and ML-infused from the start, built on the conviction, AJ says, that there's no single way to find the needle in a discovery haystack, and that building a genuinely useful litigation platform requires solving for collaboration, ease of use and scalability all at once.  The bulk of the conversation focuses on generative AI, and how Everlaw has approached it differently than much of the market. Rather than bolting on a chatbot, AJ says, Everlaw embedded AI deliberately throughout the platform — document summarization, coding suggestions, deposition analysis, fact extraction — always grounding responses in the actual documents at hand and citing sources so users can verify the work. The December launch of Deep Dive, which lets litigators pose a question and get a synthesized, cited answer drawn from an entire document corpus in about a minute, is the feature AJ calls a "new era" for discovery — one he genuinely believes represents a categorical shift. As Everlaw continues to grow, it also remains independent, with no private equity and no outside majority owners. As for AJ, he says he is in it for the long game, and has never included an exit slide in a fundraising deck.   Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out. Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner).   Chapters   00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene 03:23 The Journey to Founding Everlaw 08:36 The Evolution of Everlaw's Technology 11:06 Incorporating Generative AI into Legal Processes 14:04 Deep Dive: A New Era in Discovery 19:17 Transformative Experiences in Legal Discovery 22:27 Previewing Innovations at Legal Week 25:03 Understanding AI's Limitations in Legal Contexts 28:11 Navigating Hype in Legal Technology 30:47 The Impact of Foundation Models on Legal Software 34:36 Future Vision for Everlaw and Legal Tech 38:13 Closing Thoughts and Company Philosophy   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    40 min

  8. 5 MAR

    LawNext on Location: At A Sonoma Winery, A Conversation with Briefpoint CEO Nathan Walter about Discovery, Disruption and, Of Course, Wine

    Continuing his on-location interview tour of San Francisco, Bob heads an hour north to Santa Rosa to sit down with Nathan Walter, cofounder and CEO of Briefpoint, over a bottle of red wine at Paradise Ridge Winery, a spot literally around the corner from Nathan's house, sitting on the edge of the Mayacamas Mountain Range that divides Sonoma and Napa counties. It is a fitting setting for a founder who grew up in Sonoma wine country, where wine is less a luxury than a way of life, and where his family's most treasured heirloom was a bottle from the year he was born.   Nathan's path to founding Briefpoint is an origin story rooted in genuine frustration with the legal system. A U.C. Santa Barbara philosophy major who drifted into law school for lack of better options, he ultimately landed in civil litigation – and grew increasingly disillusioned with how discovery was weaponized to bleed defendants dry financially, even when they had done nothing wrong. After a particularly infuriating mediation where opposing counsel openly admitted the shakedown strategy, Nathan decided to do something about it. He taught himself to code from YouTube videos, built vaporware prototypes, cold-called attorneys to test demand, and eventually found his technical cofounder through a Discord gaming community he had created to build a social life after moving to Orange County.   What followed was a years-long grind – including an 18-month stretch working days as an entry-level sales rep at another legal tech company and nights building Briefpoint, until a close acquaintance invested $100,000 of her own money so he could focus full time. Briefpoint launched in June 2022, before the ChatGPT wave, focusing narrowly on automating discovery responses – drafting objections, pulling relevant documents and generating formatted Word documents ready to sign. Nathan talks about the company's deliberate "go deep, not wide" strategy: rather than expanding into motions or other legal workflows to chase the AI hype cycle, Briefpoint is doubling down on doing discovery so exceptionally well that firms will pay for it alongside broader AI platforms, the way teams use Slack alongside the full Microsoft suite.   The conversation also covers the threat to legal tech companies posed by foundation models such as Claude and GPT, the psychology behind why attorneys are resistant to automation (Nathan has a theory about "superstitious control" and lucky jerseys), the parallels between winemaking and product development, and the advice he'd give an aspiring founder: burn the ships, go full time and put yourself in a corner with no way out but forward. As for what varietal Briefpoint would be? A Russian River Pinot Noir – not a life-changing Cab, but reliably excellent at exactly what it promises.   Thank You To Our Sponsors This episode of LawNext is generously made possible by our sponsors. We appreciate their support and hope you will check them out. Paradigm, home to the practice management platforms PracticePanther, Bill4Time, MerusCase and LollyLaw; the e-payments platform Headnote; and the legal accounting software TrustBooks. Briefpoint, eliminating routine discovery response and request drafting tasks so you can focus on drafting what matters (or just make it home for dinner). Legalweek, March 9-12, North Javits Center, New York City.   If you enjoy listening to LawNext, please leave us a review wherever you listen to podcasts.

    51 min
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About

LawNext is a weekly podcast hosted by Bob Ambrogi, who is internationally known for his writing and speaking on legal technology and innovation. Each week, Bob interviews the innovators and entrepreneurs who are driving what's next in the legal industry. From legal technology startups to new law firm business models to enhancing access to justice, Bob and his guests explore the future of law and legal practice.

Information

  • Creator
    Populus Radio, Robert Ambrogi
  • Years Active
    2018 - 2026
  • Episodes
    339
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Copyright 2024 Robert J. Ambrogi
  • Show Website
    LawNext

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