"Can we design a small enough hospital where the intimacy of care matches the human scale, more residential than institutional?" — Mike McKay on the Healthcare Interior Design 2.0 podcast On today's episode of Healthcare Interior Design 2.0, Cheryl welcomes Mike McKay, AIA, ACHE, EDAC, LEED AP, Healthcare Market Sector Leader at Erdman. Mike's relationship with architecture began early — really early. In kindergarten, he was already building little cities in his basement to the scale of his Matchbox cars. Years later, during his last year at Ball State, a difficult four-day hospital stay gave him a deeply personal understanding of how healthcare environments can affect patients — and why, as Mike says, "we can do better." Cheryl and Mike explore Erdman's fascinating roots through founder Marshall Erdman, whose relationship with Frank Lloyd Wright helped shape the firm's early thinking around design, construction, prefabrication, and integrated project delivery. They also discuss Erdman's 1950s Doctors Park concept, a forward-thinking model that brought multiple physician practices together in a more accessible, community-based setting. The conversation also touches on Beverly Willis, FAIA, women in Frank Lloyd Wright's studio, Erdman's "under one roof" legacy, and the role of daylight, nature, evidence-based design, collaboration, and human scale in healthcare environments. At the heart of the episode is a question that feels both simple and profound: can we design healthcare environments where the intimacy of care actually matches the human scale? In this episode, Cheryl and Mike discuss: Mike's early path into architecture and healthcare design How a difficult personal patient experience shaped Mike's healthcare design perspective Marshall Erdman's relationship with Frank Lloyd Wright Erdman's early work on the First Unitarian Society Meeting House in Madison Prefabrication, industrialized construction, and Erdman's "under one roof" approach Doctors Park and the early evolution of community-based healthcare design Beverly Willis, women in Frank Lloyd Wright's studio, and women's leadership in healthcare design How Erdman's integrated project delivery mindset continues to influence the firm today Why healthcare projects need a clear "why" before design begins Data-informed design, advisory services, and strategic planning in healthcare The importance of daylight, nature, gardens, comfort, and domestic-scale spaces Why healthcare design must consider inward-facing and outward-facing spaces differently Mike's reflections on favorite Erdman projects, including senior living, emergency care, pediatric oncology, and behavioral health The importance of human scale in hospitals and healthcare environments Why the client, patient, staff, and community experience must remain at the center of every project KEY TAKEAWAYS Mike McKay's path into healthcare design was shaped by both professional opportunity and personal experience. An early hospital stay as a young architecture student left him with a vivid memory of how healthcare environments can affect patients — and a belief that design can do better. Erdman's roots are deeply connected to founder Marshall Erdman's relationship with Frank Lloyd Wright, beginning with Erdman's work as the contractor for Wright's First Unitarian Society Meeting House in Madison, Wisconsin. Marshall Erdman was ahead of his time in thinking about integrated project delivery, prefabrication, industrialized construction, affordability, quality, and the total cost of ownership. Erdman's early Doctors Park concept was a forward-thinking healthcare model for the 1950s, bringing multiple physician practices together in an accessible, community-based setting at a time when many physicians worked from downtown offices, hospitals, or even made house calls. The firm's "under one roof" model — bringing planning, design, construction, delivery, and advisory thinking together — continues to influence Erdman's culture, even as the firm has evolved beyond its earlier design-build structure. Mike emphasizes that healthcare projects need a clear "why." A project should be the right project, in the right place, at the right time, and sustainable for the owner and the community it serves. Women have played an important role in Erdman's history and continue to shape healthcare design today, particularly through interior design, architecture, patient perspective, and multidisciplinary collaboration. Healthcare environments need to be designed at a human scale. Mike challenges the tendency to create large, complicated healthcare footprints that designers then spend enormous energy trying to humanize. Daylight, nature, gardens, respite, views, and access to the outdoors are not decorative extras. They are essential to how patients, families, and staff experience care. Interior design and interior architecture are especially important in healthcare spaces that cannot always have daylight or views, such as imaging, treatment, or technology-heavy environments. Mike's work and thinking are grounded in evidence-based design, patient-centered design, and multidisciplinary collaboration. At the heart of Mike's message is a reminder that healthcare design is not about the architect's ego or the firm's portfolio. It is about the people who use the building: patients, families, staff, clinicians, owners, and communities. RESOURCES MENTIONED ERDMAN https://www.erdman.com/ Mike McKay, AIA, ACHE, EDAC, LEED AP, NCARB — ERDMAN https://www.erdman.com/about/mike-mckay-aia-ache-edac-leed-ap-ncarb/ Uncommon Sense: The Life of Marshall Erdman https://www.amazon.com/Uncommon-Sense-Life-Marshall-Erdman/dp/1931599319 First Unitarian Society Meeting House https://www.unitarianmeetinghouse.org/ Frank Lloyd Wright Foundation — Unitarian Meeting House https://franklloydwright.org/site/unitarian-meeting-house/ Beverly Willis Architecture Foundation https://bwaf.org/ A Girl is a Fellow Here: 100 Women Architects in the Studio of Frank Lloyd Wright https://bwaf.org/resources/film-collection/a-girl-is-a-fellow-here The Center for Health Design https://www.healthdesign.org/ The Center for Health Design Touchstone Awards https://www.healthdesign.org/certification-outreach/awards-recognition/touchstone-awards Institute for Patient-Centered Design http://www.patientcentereddesign.org/ Ball State University — Estopinal College of Architecture and Planning https://www.bsu.edu/academics/collegesanddepartments/cap LECOM Medical Center and Behavioral Health Pavilion, formerly Millcreek Community Hospital https://lecomhealth.com/location/lecom-medical-center-and-behavioral-health-pavilion/ Lehigh Valley Hospital–Cedar Crest https://www.lvhn.org/locations/lehigh-valley-hospital-cedar-crest MEMORABLE GUEST QUOTES "We can do better. I know we can do better." "It started out more holistically with, 'Is there a better way to deliver projects?' The notion of integrated project delivery—Marshall was all about that in 1950." "Marshall was always concerned about the efficiency of the process and the cost at the end of the day. That being said, he was also all about quality and maintaining quality." "It has to be right. It has to serve a purpose. It has to be sustainable." "It's data-informed design." "We spend all of our time as designers… trying to mitigate the challenges that such a large footprint starts to create for the humans inside of this footprint." "Frank was all about connecting his architecture to the space and place and to nature." "We're human creatures. We want to see if it's sunny outside or raining." "It's a constant dialogue, Cheryl, and it takes a multidisciplinary team, in my opinion, to do it well." "Can we design a small enough hospital where the intimacy of care matches the human scale, more residential than institutional?" "Be mindful of the scale of what we're proposing and keep it human-centered." "It is the client's project. It is the stakeholders, the users of that project that matter." "At the end of the day, it's about the people that are using that project. They have to matter most." CONNECT WITH MIKE Mike McKay, AIA, ACHE, EDAC, LEED AP Healthcare Market Sector Leader, ERDMAN LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelmckayaia/ Email: mmckay@erdman.com ERDMAN: https://www.erdman.com/ OUR SPONSOR This podcast is sponsored by Porcelanosa. Download the latest issue of Lifestyle magazine to see award winning architecture, interior design and wellness projects worldwide. Just go to Porcelanosa.com and search Lifestyle magazine to access the complete library…. and be inspired. OUR INDUSTRY PARTNERS The world is changing quickly. The Center for Health Design is committed to providing the healthcare design and senior living design industries with the latest research, best practices and innovations. The Center can help you solve today's biggest healthcare challenges and make a difference in care, safety, medical outcomes, and the bottom line. Find out more at healthdesign.org. Additional support for this podcast comes from our industry partners: The American Academy of Healthcare Interior Designers The Nursing Institute for Healthcare Design Learn more about how to become a Certified Healthcare Interior Designer® by visiting the American Academy of Healthcare Interior Designers at: https://aahid.org/. Connect to a community interested in supporting clinician involvement in design and construction of the built environment by visiting The Nursing Institute for Healthcare Design at https://www.nursingihd.com/ FEATURED PRODUCT Porcelanosa are at the forefront of sustainable manufacturing – clients not only expect this of their suppliers but are increasingly asking to see the receipts. Let'
