In this episode of the Ephesiology Podcast, Andrew Johnson, Michael, and guest Lance Ford delve into the themes of church leadership, the disconnect between leadership and the body of Christ, and the systemic issues that plague modern church structures. They discuss the impact of Lance’s book, ‘The Atlas Factor,’ which emphasizes the need for a shift in leadership paradigms, focusing on Jesus as the head of the church rather than human leaders. The conversation also addresses the prevalence of spiritual abuse, the importance of vision and mission in church leadership, and the necessity for systemic change to foster healthier church environments. Lance shares insights on how to navigate leadership challenges, differentiate between bad leadership and narcissism, and the role of the church in addressing these issues. The episode concludes with a call to center on Jesus and the hope for restoration within the church community. Keywords church leadership, Atlas Factor, spiritual abuse, church movement, leadership structures, restoration, community engagement, Jesus, church health Sound bites “It’s the system, stupid.” “We need to start in our seminaries.” “Jesus is our hero. He is our savior.” Takeaways The church’s leadership structure often disconnects from Jesus as the head. Lance’s book, ‘The Atlas Factor,’ emphasizes shifting leadership focus. Spiritual abuse is prevalent in many church contexts. Leadership systems need to be reformed for healthier church environments. The importance of vision and mission in church leadership cannot be overstated. Staff members often feel oppressed and manipulated in their roles. Differentiating between bad leadership and narcissism is crucial. A systemic change is necessary for true church reform. The church must engage in community and address leadership issues. Hope for restoration lies in centering on Jesus. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to the Ephesiology Podcast 02:45 The Atlas Factor: Leadership in the Church 05:35 Misalignment in Church Leadership Structures 08:49 The Disconnect Between Leadership and the Body of Christ 11:47 The Role of Vision and Mission in the Church 14:26 The Impact of Leadership Models on Church Growth 17:31 Understanding Spiritual Abuse in Church Leadership 20:36 The Consequences of Management Systems in the Church 24:45 The Dark Side of Church Leadership 26:17 Navigating Abuse in Church Settings 34:30 The Role of Systems in Church Leadership 41:06 Building a New Church Leadership Model 47:18 The Future of Church Leadership Education Connect With Us Follow Ephesiology: Website | Twitter | Instagram | YouTube Follow Andrew Johnson @thediscfan.bsky.social If this episode encouraged you, please leave a review and share it with others exploring missional living in post-Christian contexts. Thanks for doing theology in community with us today! If you have a question or topic that you’d like to hear addressed on the Ephesiology Podcast, just send it to Andrew at thediscfan@gmail.com. Donate Find the podcast on your favorite podcast app Just search for “Ephesiology” Our Podcasters Michael Cooper Professor | Missiologist | Author Michael is the missiologist in residence with East West where he focuses on equipping and empowering church leaders in evangelism, discipleship, leadership, and catalyzing church planting movements in the most difficult to reach places on the planet. He is the author of Ephesiology: The Study of the Ephesian Movement as well as many other books and academic articles. He has lectured at universities around the world and serves as affiliate faculty at Kairos University where he facilitates the degree programs in partnership with Ephesiology Master Classes. Andrew Johnson Ministry Lead, West Village Church Andrew is a proud husband, father and pastor who desires all to know the one true King. He is honored to serve at West Village Church in Victoria, BC. Previously, he’s ministered in Houston, Chicago, Indy, Flagstaff and Tempe in a variety of church contexts. Andrew has a BA in Christian Ministry from Trinity International University and an MA from Phoenix Seminary. He is currently a Doctor of Ministry student at Kairos University and is the co-host of the Ephesiology Podcast. When not at work, he’s an avid disc golfing, vinyl playing, Spider-Man following/collecting fellow. Go Pacers. Do you enjoy the Ephesiology Podcast? Partner with the Pod The Ephesiology Podcast comes to you from a desire to engage in community conversations about the intersection of theology and culture. We do not believe such dialogue should come with a cost so the podcast will always be free. However, if you’ve benefited from the Ephesiology Podcast, would you consider a nominal $5 per month donation? All proceeds from the podcast go toward helping bring needed theological education to the majority world through our Ephesiology Master Class initiative to end a theological famine. We’d be honored to partner with you to continue providing solid biblical, theological, and missiological content for listeners around the world. Donate Empowering Future Church Leaders Imagine a world where passionate, equipped Christian leaders spread God’s Word in areas with the greatest need—leaders grounded in both deep theology and practical ministry skills, trained to make a lasting impact in their communities. Through your support, this vision can become a reality for students from countries like Malawi, Tanzania, Kenya, Nepal, and India who are eager to teach and multiply disciple-makers in their own regions. Learn More Ephesiology: A Study of the Ephesian Movement If you want to understand principles for the growth of Christianity in the first century, the place to begin is the city of Ephesus. In this winsome study, Ephesiology offers readers a comprehensive view of the empowering work of the Holy Spirit in the most significant city of the New Testament, and compels us to ask the question: how can we effectively connect Christ to our culture? “Masterfully handling the book of Ephesians and using its content as a definitive guide, Michael Cooper lays a theologically strong foundation that is both corrective and directive to disciple making movements. The principles he gleans from the book of Ephesians and related texts, help to ensure the on-going multiplication and maturation of a movement. Because these are supra-cultural principles, they are applicable anywhere in the world.” Marvin J. Newell, Staff Missiologist, Missio Nexus, Author of Crossing Cultures in Scripture Buy This Now! Educating to Shift the Tracks of History To shift the tracks of history requires leaders who are equipped to critically assess and engage the contours of contemporary culture. As a new initiative in collaboration with the Movement Leaders Collective, Kairos University, and Ephesiology, we deliver just-in-time theological education focused on issues important to you, mxAcademy is designed as the theological and missiological foundation to unlock your potential as a movement leader and catalytic thinker. mxAcademy is a dynamic and innovative educational experience rooted in mDNA.We dream of a church fully equipped, fully mature, fully mobilized, and fully alive. A church that lives and breathes the Good News of Jesus! Learn More Join a Community Conversation at Ephesiology Master Classes Areopagus Symposium Taking its inspiration from the historical and philosophical legacy of Athens, Greece, the Areopagus Symposium focuses on intellectual and philosophical topics related to Christology, missiology, and ecclesiology. We invite scholars, theologians, and practitioners from diverse backgrounds to engage in a profound exploration of the theological landscape at the intersection of these vital disciplines. Sign up for an Ephesiology Master Classes account and gain free access to the Areopagus Symposium. Check it out! The Ephesiology Podcast and Ephesiology Master Classes are ministries of TELOS.GO, a registered 501c3 non-profit agency committed to imaginatively missional ways of engageing culture, church planting, and theological education. Your donation to the podcast is tax deductible.
