Out of Patients with Matthew Zachary

Matthew Zachary Worldwide
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The longest-running independent healthcare podcast, Out of Patients with Matthew Zachary has supplied 17 years of unfiltered truth about American healthcare. A 30-year brain cancer survivor, Matthew built the young adult cancer movement from scratch. Now he channels patient rage into political power, featuring on the air battle-scarred survivors, exhausted caregivers, and the rare insider brave enough to name what's killing us. It’s real stories from real people who refuse to accept that healthcare has to hurt this much. New listeners come for the truth. They stay because finally someone's saying what they've been screaming.

  1. Discharge Instructions Not Included: Shlomit Liberty

    23H AGO

    Discharge Instructions Not Included: Shlomit Liberty

    At 19, Shlomit woke up unable to speak. The right side of her body went numb. An emergency room sent her home and called it stress.  That moment did not end in a diagnosis that changed policy or triggered reform. It sent her into a decade long pursuit of understanding how the brain fails language and how the healthcare system fails patients who cannot advocate for themselves. Shlomit trained as a speech language pathologist and spent years inside acute care hospitals and ICUs, performing endoscopies and treating patients with brain injury, stroke, and dysphagia. She watched medical teams rotate in and out, deliver dense updates, and leave families nodding without comprehension. She stayed behind and translated. Every day, patients told her she was the only one who explained what was happening.   That gap is not an accident. Hospital systems optimize for throughput, not understanding. Patients move through beds based on cost, not readiness. Discharge planning becomes a financial decision wrapped in clinical language. A stay under 48 hours can shift the insurance burden dramatically, leaving patients exposed to higher out of pocket costs.   Shlomit left the system and built Patient Path NYC, a private patient advocacy service. She now spends 15 to 20 hours a week per client reading charts, coordinating care teams, and translating medical decisions into plain language.   Her work sits in the uncomfortable space between healthcare policy and lived experience. Families pay out of pocket to understand their own care. Hospitals benefit from the clarity she provides while maintaining the same structural incentives that created the confusion. This conversation tracks the human cost of fragmented care, the economics behind discharge decisions, and the quiet reality that patients who cannot communicate clearly often lose control of their own outcomes. RELATED LINKS Shlomit Liberty Shlomit Liberty on LinkedIn Patient Path NYC Board Certified Patient Advocate FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    44 min
  2. Standard Deviation S2 E3: The Hidden Curriculum

    5D AGO ·  BONUS

    Standard Deviation S2 E3: The Hidden Curriculum

    In 2020, developmental biologist Dr. Crystal Rogers drove the country roads outside Davis, California crying between grant rejections, wondering whether she was about to lose her lab, her career, and the scientific future she had spent years building. She had already done what academia tells young scientists to do. She earned the credentials. She landed a faculty position at UC Davis. She built a lab. Then the real test began. On this episode of Standard Deviation, Dr. Oliver Bogler examines the unspoken rules that determine which scientists survive academic research and which quietly disappear from it. The conversation follows Crystal Rogers and cancer biologist Dr. Michelle Mendoza as they collide with the “Hidden Curriculum” of biomedical science: the unwritten rhetoric, institutional signaling, and grant writing strategies that often decide who receives funding, tenure, and long term stability. Michelle Mendoza entered a tenure track position at the Huntsman Cancer Institute while raising 3 children, navigating a divorce, and trying to secure major NIH funding during COVID. What looked like objective scientific review turned out to depend heavily on persuasion, presentation, and insider fluency. Established researchers could promise massive research agendas based on reputation alone. Junior investigators faced a completely different standard. Oliver traces how the Life Science Editors Foundation and its JEDI program intervened by pairing scientists with former editors from journals including Cell and Nature. The work had little to do with commas or grammar. Editors challenged logic, structure, and scientific framing before grant reviewers could destroy an application in public. Both researchers eventually secured career defining grants. One realized she would keep her job and not have to move her family. The other celebrated by ordering a personalized “DEV BIO” license plate and driving through Davis blasting nineties hip hop and Beyoncé. The episode exposes how biomedical research funding rewards institutional fluency as much as scientific talent, and how hidden systems inside academic medicine continue shaping who gets to stay in science long enough to make discoveries. RELATED LINKS Dr. Crystal Rogers LinkedIn Dr. Crystal Rogers Faculty Page Dr. Crystal Rogers Lab Dr. Michelle Mendoza LinkedIn Dr. Michelle Mendoza Faculty Page Huntsman Cancer Institute Mendoza Lab Life Science Editors Foundation FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    12 min
  3. Nun, Done, and Uninsured: Katy Talento

    MAY 12

    Nun, Done, and Uninsured: Katy Talento

    In 2008, Katy Talento walked away from Capitol Hill and into a Catholic convent. Within a year, she walked out. Within another decade, she sat inside the White House shaping health policy. Somewhere in between, she got labeled “infertile” after a single cycle of testing and spent years believing it. That label stuck. The pain that came before it never got investigated. Doctors offered birth control and moved on. No one asked why her body was struggling. No one followed the thread. Talento built her career inside the very systems she now critiques. She worked on federal health policy, global disease programs, and later advised the Trump administration on healthcare reform. She helped advance price transparency rules in a system where hospitals can still list 457 different prices for the same service. Then she left. Now she builds employer health plans that bypass insurers, PBMs, and traditional networks. Her approach replaces insurance contracts with direct payment, nurse navigators, and cost sharing models that promise simplicity but raise hard questions about risk and protection. This conversation sits in that tension. Talento describes a healthcare system shaped by layered incentives, where insurers, hospitals, and intermediaries profit from complexity. She argues that employers hold the leverage to disrupt it. The host pushes on what happens when patients fall outside those structures, when contracts disappear, and when community based models fail. The episode moves through infertility, misdiagnosis, insurance design, and the mechanics of employer sponsored care. It tracks how policy decisions made in Washington ripple into exam rooms, billing departments, and family lives. It also confronts a harder truth. Even insiders who understand the system can still get caught in it. RELATED LINKS AllBetter Health Katy Talento Them Before Us An Arm and a Leg Relentless Health Value FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    46 min
  4. Faith, Fraud, and Finding Himself: Ben Unger

    MAY 5

    Faith, Fraud, and Finding Himself: Ben Unger

    In a wooded campground cabin in the early 2000s, 19 year old Ben Unger stood in the doorway and watched 20 naked men form a circle around a crying teenager. A counselor held up two tangerines and shouted, “These are your balls.” The exercise claimed to cure same sex attraction by forcing young men to “reclaim” their masculinity from overbearing mothers. Phones had been confiscated. Parents had paid thousands of dollars. Religion supplied the script. Pseudoscience supplied the props. Ben had grown up in an Orthodox Jewish community in Brooklyn and later studied in Israel to become a rabbi. When he admitted he felt attracted to men, rabbis told him to eat 7 figs a day, immerse in a ritual bath 5 times daily, or marry a woman and trust that “if there’s friction, it works.” At 19, he entered conversion therapy through an organization called Jews Offering New Alternatives to Homosexuality, known as JONAH. He left with depression, religious trauma, and 6 months of silence toward the mother he had been taught to blame. Years later, represented by the Southern Poverty Law Center, Ben helped sue JONAH for consumer fraud in a landmark New Jersey case. The argument centered on evidence, not theology. Sexual orientation cannot be changed. The jury deliberated for 3 hours and ruled against the organization. The verdict helped reshape how states regulate conversion therapy and protect minors from psychological harm disguised as treatment. Today, Ben runs Buff Personal Training in New York City, a gym built on autonomy, mental health, and self respect. His story traces the arc from institutional control to self authorship. The conversation examines religion, LGBTQ rights, conversion therapy, consumer protection law, and the lasting cost of being told your identity is a disorder. RELATED LINKS Ben Unger on LinkedIn Ben Unger on Instagram BUF Personal Training Southern Poverty Law Center JONAH FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    52 min
  5. Defender Energy: Drew Flugstad-Clarke

    APR 28

    Defender Energy: Drew Flugstad-Clarke

    Drew Flugstad-Clarke never planned to work in brain cancer. She planned to play Division I soccer at Georgetown. She planned to paint. She even tried investment banking, answering emails at 4am in a cubicle that never slept. Then in June 2022 her father, Jim, was diagnosed with glioblastoma at 57. He died 1 day shy of 7 months later, just before his 58th birthday. His symptoms began with emotion, not seizures. A steady HR executive suddenly cried. His golf game slipped. By the time he entered the hospital for a scan, he did not leave without surgery. A subway poster for a 5K became a lifeline. Drew showed up. She found a community. She later joined the American Brain Tumor Association as Community Manager for the Eastern Region. This conversation walks through anticipatory grief, caregiving in real time, strategic numbness, and what it costs to curate hope when the median survival clock is already ticking. RELATED LINKS Drew Clark Flukestad on LinkedIn Topor Studios American Brain Tumor Association Georgetown University Women’s Soccer FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    40 min
  6. Not Today, Jesus: Janine Durso

    APR 21

    Not Today, Jesus: Janine Durso

    Janine Durso spent 30 years inside pharmaceutical advertising shaping healthcare narratives before becoming a belief strategist and founder of The Believist. In November 2024, during a routine Zoom coaching session, she felt what she called a sharp, terrible pain in the right side of her head. Within hours she was in surgery for a ruptured brain aneurysm. She does not remember the ambulance, the ICU, or the first weeks that followed. She spent 5 weeks in intensive care, then 10 days relearning how to walk, calculate simple change, and manage basic cognition. Doctors later placed a stent and continue monitoring a second unruptured aneurysm. This episode traces the moment she told her husband something broke in my brain, the 14 days doctors called touch and go, and the slow mental rebuild that followed. It also examines insurance barriers that require 2 direct relatives with aneurysms before screening coverage, and why she now lobbies in Washington for change. RELATED LINKS Janine Durso The Believist Brain Aneurysm Foundation White Plains Hospital Dr. Jared Cooper FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    46 min
  7. Mental Health, Wicked Problems and Dodgeball: Rebecca Benghiat JD

    APR 14

    Mental Health, Wicked Problems and Dodgeball: Rebecca Benghiat JD

    Rebecca Benghiat holds a JD, passed the bar, and skipped corporate law to build mental health systems instead. She now serves as Chief of Staff and Head of Impact at Inner Foundation, where she helps direct capital toward emerging adults ages 18 to 30 and asks a hard question every day: Is this actually working? In this conversation, she dismantles the myth of easy fixes. She explains why mental health measurement resists clean metrics, why a PHQ 9 score starts a conversation but never finishes one, and why “scale” often flatters institutions more than it helps people. She breaks down how impact investing shapes care delivery, why schools need networked systems not slogans, and why friction might be developmentally necessary. The stakes are real. Vulnerable families navigate snake oil, glossy apps, and pay to play algorithms while carrying the burden of choice in crisis. Benghiat lives inside that complexity and refuses to simplify it. RELATED LINKS Rebecca Benghiat Inner Foundation Aspen Ideas Health The Jed Foundation FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    44 min
  8. Standard Deviation S2 E2: The Advocacy Tax

    APR 9 ·  BONUS

    Standard Deviation S2 E2: The Advocacy Tax

    At age 12, Dr. Chrystal Starbird stood by a pond after turning her mother in to the police. She watched tadpoles and fish move beneath the surface and found a strange kind of order. Science became her refuge long before it became her career.   Years later, she built that refuge into a profession. She now serves as an Assistant Professor at the University of North Carolina, studies structural biology tied to cancer and Alzheimer’s disease, and won Cell’s first Rising Black Scientist Award in 2020. On paper, she fits the model of success. In practice, she had to fight for basic access at every stage. Conference travel required upfront cash she did not have. Networking favored pedigree over merit. Mentorship often depended on who knew your name in the room. Chrystal learned those rules, then chose to break them open for others. Oliver Bogler examines what Chrystal calls the advocacy tax. She has delivered over 70 invited talks. Nearly 40 percent focus on equity, mentorship, and policy. Academic reward systems do not count that labor toward tenure. She still does it. Through her leadership at the Life Science Editors Foundation, Chrystal helped build the JEDI program, which pairs underrepresented scientists with editors from journals like Cell and Nature. The program has supported over 100 awardees with more than 1,000 hours of mentorship.   This episode exposes how biomedical science rewards output while ignoring the work required to make the system accessible. It also shows what happens when the people most affected refuse to step back. RELATED LINKS Dr. Chrystal Starbird Starbird Lab Life Science Editors Foundation JEDI Program FEEDBACK Like this episode? Rate and review Out of Patients on your favorite podcast platform. For guest suggestions or sponsorship email podcasts@matthewzachary.com See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

    15 min
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4.9
out of 5
158 Ratings

About

The longest-running independent healthcare podcast, Out of Patients with Matthew Zachary has supplied 17 years of unfiltered truth about American healthcare. A 30-year brain cancer survivor, Matthew built the young adult cancer movement from scratch. Now he channels patient rage into political power, featuring on the air battle-scarred survivors, exhausted caregivers, and the rare insider brave enough to name what's killing us. It’s real stories from real people who refuse to accept that healthcare has to hurt this much. New listeners come for the truth. They stay because finally someone's saying what they've been screaming.

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