Shaken Not Burned

Felicia Jackson and Giulia Bottaro

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Shaken Not Burned is the podcast that helps you make sense of sustainability. We unpack the big debates shaping climate, business, food, and society: debunking myths, clarifying trade-offs, and sharing ideas you can actually use to think, decide, and act in a changing world.

2D AGO

Do we need deep sea mining? With Seas At Risk

Welcome to the second instalment of our mining arc. After covering the geopolitics of critical minerals (check out the episode here), this week we ask a harder question: is deep sea mining a necessary innovation, or a risk we don’t yet understand well enough to take? Deep sea mining means extracting minerals from the bottom of the ocean, at depths of 200 metres and beyond, no easy feat. It’s often framed as the next frontier for securing the metals needed for the energy transition – batteries, renewables, electrification. But that framing sits alongside a more uncomfortable reality: these ecosystems are among the least understood on Earth, and the consequences of disturbing them may be irreversible. This is a question of baseline knowledge: whether we even understand what normal looks like at those depths, and therefore whether impact can be meaningfully assessed at all. Governance remains contested. Negotiations at the International Seabed Authority (ISA) – the body regulating the mineral resources of the seabed beyond national jurisdiction – have been slow and fraught, reflecting deep disagreement over whether the industry should proceed at all, or under what conditions. In this episode, Giulia speaks with Simon Holmström, senior deep sea mining policy officer at Seas At Risk, an association of over 30 environmental NGOs from across Europe. Together, they unpack the environmental risks, the limits of current knowledge,and the evolving policy landscape. Simon highlights the economic viability of deep sea mining, the need for precautionary measures, and the importance of sustainable practices in the face of growing demand for critical minerals. Their main takeaways are: The deep ocean is one of the least understood ecosystems The economic viability of deep sea mining remains highly speculative Opposition to deep sea mining is growing across civil society and parts of industry The regulatory pathway, and therefore the industry’s future, is still unresolvedWhat emerges is not a simple case for or against, but a more fundamental question: how should we make decisions about technologies where the downside risks are uncertain, potentially systemic and not easily reversible – especially when they are being justified in the name of solving a different global problem? In trying to address climate change, if we introduce new environmental risks we don't yet fully understand, how should those trade-offs be evaluated? Who gets to decide what level of risk is acceptable, and for whom? If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

37 min
APR 2

The geopolitics of critical minerals with Minefield Consulting

Once a somewhat niche industry, critical minerals are now dominating headlines, influencing geopolitical trends and driving international trade. These materials are core components of technologies crucial to the energy transition and defence systems, and heightened interest in these areas is fuelling demand. For example, lithium demand jumped by 30% in 2024, while nickel, cobalt, graphite and rare earths all increased by 6-8% – and it is expected to keep climbing. With the International Energy Agency forecasting demand for these minerals to triple or even quadruple by 2040, the rush for critical minerals will continue shaping international relations, highlighting the need to address major environmental and social implications. In this week's episode, Giulia interviews Olimpia Pilch, critical minerals consultant at Minefield Consulting, on the complex world of critical minerals, their importance in energy transition and defence, and the geopolitical and environmental challenges involved. Their wide-ranging conversation covers: The definition of critical mineralsSupply chain vulnerabilities and geopolitical risksChina's role in critical mineral processing and supplyWhat are the potential and limitations of critical mineral recyclingThe environmental and social implications of mineral extractionWhile the Global North has outsourced polluting industries, including mining, for decades, it’s crucial to understand that clean technologies need these primary sources. Amid geopolitical tensions straining supply chains, achieving the energy transition may require a new world order. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

1h 3m
MAR 26

Why the world feels unpredictable – and what's really going on

The world is starting to feel unpredictable in ways that are difficult to pin down. Not just because of individual events, but because of how many different pressures are building at the same time. Climate impacts are becoming more visible, geopolitics is fragmenting, technology is moving quickly and economic conditions are being shaped by multiple shocks at once rather than a single, identifiable cause. It is tempting to treat these as separate issues. Climate as an environmental problem, geopolitics as a political one, technology as something else again. But that separation is becoming harder to sustain. What we’re seeing instead is how these pressures show up together. Changes in one area increasingly show up in others, shaping costs, constraints and the choices available. Assumptions about work, markets or even where it is safe to invest or build are becoming less reliable. That’s the starting point for this season. In this opening episode, Felicia and Giulia step back to look at what’s changed in how the world is behaving. Why issues that used to be discussed separately are now overlapping and what that means, whether you’re seeing it through your work or simply trying to make sense of what comes next. Once these pressures start to show up together, their effects become harder to separate. Climate risk, for example, is no longer only a question of long-term environmental change. It is increasingly reflected in insurance markets, in the cost of capital and in public finances. Supply chains are being shaped not only by efficiency, but by geopolitical relationships and physical constraints. What might once have been treated as separate risks are now influencing the same outcomes. At the same time, many of the structures that guide decisions, particularly in finance and policy, are still built around shorter time horizons than the risks they are dealing with. That is where things become difficult. There is more information available than ever before, but that doesn’t necessarily make choices clearer: different risks point in different directions and the incentives facing companies, investors and governments do not always line up. And so decisions are often delayed until something forces them. That’s why this season, we’re going to be looking at that reality directly. By going inside specific industries and areas of the economy, the aim is to understand how these pressures play out in practice, where decisions are actually made, and how different parts of the system influence one another. Not to simplify what is happening, but to make it easier to see what matters and how to respond when the path ahead isn’t always clear. Each industry or topic we explore will be paired with a conversation like this one, stepping back to break down what’s happening and what it really means. We hope you’ll find it useful. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

38 min
MAR 19

Season 6: sustainability and resilience, one sector at a time

Two years on, we have reached season 6! We have explored a wide range of topics, from the just transition to the planetary boundaries, through the circular economy and climate risk. Now, it's time to delve even deeper into our quest to help you build sustainability literacy. The current multicrisis is affecting industries in different ways: companies are facing challenges that are unique to the context in which they operate. That’s why, in this season, we’re tackling one sector at a time, exploring the risks and trade-offs behind business as usual. Each arc will comprise four episodes to drill down into fundamental shifts, innovation, and regulation: expect in-depth analysis on mining, fashion, AI, and many more. We are living in turbulent times - what happens next depends on how well we understand the world around us. At Shaken Not Burned, we believe that sustainability literacy is a key tool in identifying where risks and opportunities lie. Join us for season 6 as we decode how the decisions driving our economies, industries and institutions are unfolding in practice. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

1 min
MAR 12

What happens when agriculture stops guessing? With Agzen

The food system underpins our entire society. Its stability is crucial: when it starts to wobble, prices rise, availability becomes uncertain, and stress travels quickly from farms to household. Yet, much of modern agriculture still operates under deep uncertainty. Farmers spend tens of billions of dollars every year on crop protection chemicals, largely without being able to see how much of what they actually apply reaches the plant. When you don't have that visibility, the rational response for many is to manage risk with excess. However, overuse of pesticides has far-reaching impacts not only on ecosystems, but also human health. In this week’s episode, Felicia speaks to Vishnu Jayaprakash, founder and CEO of Agzen, an MIT spinout that has developed an AI-based system that measures and controls the amount of chemicals being sprayed on crops. Its technology helps farmers cut chemical use by 30-50 % without sacrificing yields. The conversation explores the intersection of climate risk, food systems, and the role of technology in making agriculture more efficient and sustainable. Vishnu shares his personal journey into agriculture and what led him to develop Agzen. Sometimes, the fastest, deepest changes will not come from tearing systems down, but from seeing them more clearly and addressing them differently. Whether making industrial agriculture more precise is a bridge to something better, or a way of prolonging a model that ultimately needs bigger change, is an open question. What is clear is that visibility, accountability, and better information shape what's possible. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

42 min
MAR 5

Climate decisions hidden in plain sight with Verdical Group

Buildings shape much of our daily lives, but their environmental impact often goes unnoticed. Yet the built environment accounts for nearly 40% of global energy-related carbon emissions, from the energy used to heat and power buildings to the materials used to construct them. In this episode of Shaken Not Burned, Felicia talks to Drew Shula, founder and CEO of Verdical Group, about the role the construction sector plays in climate action. The conversation explores how decisions made during design and construction can influence emissions, costs and resilience for decades, and why much of the real progress in reducing building emissions is happening at the local level. From energy modelling and building standards to the challenge of scaling sustainable construction practices, this episode looks at how the built environment is becoming both one of the biggest climate challenges – and one of the most practical places to make progress. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

38 min
FEB 26

Why we don't need billionaires with Patriotic Millionaires UK

There are talks of endless economic crises, yet the rich are getting richer. Even though many countries promise a welfare system, healthy job markets, and in general decent quality of life for the masses, the numbers suggest that inequality is only getting worse. According to Oxfam, in 2025 billionaire wealth jumped by over 16% to $18.3 trillion compared to 2024 levels. This massive amount of money is spread among only 3,000 people, who are worth an average of $6.1 billion each. Perhaps more shockingly, billionaire wealth has gone up by 81% in just five years. Is there even a country or industry where average wages have grown at the same rate since 2020? Meanwhile, 25% of the global population can’t afford regular meals, and nearly half are living in poverty. But why are we talking about this in a sustainability podcast? One of the central tenets of Shaken Not Burned is pursuing a just transition: if the world's richest 1% own around 45% of the global wealth, we can’t expect this money to be invested in a way that will benefit all people in an equitable manner. In this week’s episode, Giulia interviews Julia Davies, impact investor at We Have The Power and a member of Patriotic Millionaires UK, on what we can do to recalibrate the world's wealth system. For Julia and her fellow Patriotic Millionaires UK members, the answer is simple: increase taxes on wealth, not on work. The organisation proposes a tax of 2% on wealth above £10 million – however, the UK government doesn’t seem to be listening. The conversation explores the implications of wealth extremism, emphasising the importance of community solutions and systemic change to address these pressing issues, advocating for a more equitable distribution of wealth and resources. Crucially, all of us can do something about this, as individuals or business owners: support the campaign and “vote with our wallets”: that is, buy from ethical companies and small- and medium-sized businesses, rather than massive corporations. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

43 min
FEB 19

Rethinking climate leadership with Sweep

Climate action is facing political backlash, from watered-down EU regulation to the overturning of the EPA’s endangerment finding in the United States. Yet beneath the headlines, systemic climate risk is becoming harder for central banks, insurers and investors to ignore. In this episode of Shaken Not Burned, Felicia speaks with Rachel Delacour, co-founder and CEO of Sweep, about the Climate Contribution Framework, developed with Mirova, ICARE and Winrock International. The framework builds on existing emissions standards but moves beyond footprint alone, assessing how companies reduce emissions, scale low-carbon solutions and finance climate innovation. As investors search for credible signals of long-term resilience, this conversation explores whether we’ve been measuring the wrong thing — and what it would mean to evaluate companies by their full contribution to net zero rather than by emissions alone. Sweep and Mirova Research Center launched the Climate Contribution Framework (CCF): A New Standard for Corporate Climate Action. This pioneering methodology developed by I Care by BearingPoint, and Winrock International offers an unprecedented unified, science-based benchmark to fairly measure and value the full spectrum of corporate contributions to global net zero. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to our newsletter and follow us on LinkedIn, TikTok and Instagram – and why not spread the word with your friends and colleagues?

41 min

Shaken Not Burned is the podcast that helps you make sense of sustainability. We unpack the big debates shaping climate, business, food, and society: debunking myths, clarifying trade-offs, and sharing ideas you can actually use to think, decide, and act in a changing world.

Creator

Felicia Jackson and Giulia Bottaro
Years Active

2021 - 2026
Episodes

110
Rating

Clean
Copyright

© 2026 Shaken Not Burned
Show Website

Shaken Not Burned