How NOT To Start A Damn Brewery: the podcast

Kelly KfM Meyer
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People of Earth, I would like to welcome you to the How NOT To Start a Damn Brewery: the podcast. In this podcast I consider it my duty to share the sometimes gory but always honest truth hidden in the craft beer industry. Mainly that it rarely operates like a business. Margins are trash, distributors are garbage and capital expenditures are a raging dumpster fire. But many of the people are badasses. I autopsy deceased breweries, retailers and distributors. I talk with wineries, breweries and distilleries. All in the search for ways to lure out profitability and best practices.

  1. Black Hops Brewery - Dan Norris

    09/29/2025

    Black Hops Brewery - Dan Norris

    In the early days of Australia’s craft beer explosion there was a brewery that out cooled all the others. I remember seeing their tight branding, the confidence that exuded from their marketing and their insane growth trajectory and just being immediately jealous of Black Hops Brewery.  When I sat down to write my book in 2019 I even found out these guys had already written one about their start-up process. And they did a podcast. They looked successful. People were raving about them. They were beating the odds.  Then a few years ago I heard that the brewery had fallen on hard times and that one of the owners, Dan Norris, had even left the brewery he had co-founded with his 2 friends.  So I reached out. Didn’t get a yes. But I’m not the give up type of guy. I really wanted to hear this story and needed to share it with you so I kept pinging Dan over the next few years.  Finally Dan reached a point that he wanted to share the story, set the record straight and vent out some of his experience. My guests and I, and many of you, know exactly what that feels like.  I truly had no idea what I was about to hear. The story of Dan’s brewery had many of the same struggles we’ve covered before. But his brewery was selling millions of dollars of beer every year, expanding exponentially and raising so much money that Black Hops was valued right into the stratosphere.  The brewery was killing it, right up until it wasn’t.  And what you’re about to hear will inspire you, concern you, make you question and give you pause. I doubt it will convince you to start a mid-sized brewery on the Gold Coast, but it will teach you a lot about How NOT To Start A Damn Brewery.  They have a website

    1h 24m
  2. Rule G Brewing - Ralph and Lisa

    09/08/2025

    Rule G Brewing - Ralph and Lisa

    Ralph Rapa wanted to open a small craft brewery on his terms. He wanted it to reflect his life in the American railroad industry. He wanted it to be comfortable, unpretentious and fun.  So he enlisted his longtime friend Lisa Henrie to handle marketing, HR and PR, raised some capital and shoveled coal in the engine of Rule G Brewing Company in South Florida.  After a solid start, the brewery was plagued by catastrophe after calamity. Anyone who doesn’t listen to this show would be shocked to hear what they went through. But you’ll hear many of the same tragic tribulations that other guests have shared.  Of the things that make their story unique, Ralph and Lisa faced down their troubles inside of their first year, eventually shutting down just in time to enjoy Easter with a little peace.  Ralph and Lisa both have a full bucket of emotions around their experience fighting to open, run and eventually attempting to save a craft brewery in 2024/2025. And thanks to them sharing THAT story we’re all about to know a little more about how NOT to start a DAMN brewery.

    1h 39m
  3. Einhorn Beer Company - Doug Martin

    08/15/2025

    Einhorn Beer Company - Doug Martin

    Doug Martin is a guy who has just about done it all.  From working in beer in Germany to opening a brewery in California to pivoting to non-alcohol products, he’s followed many of the playbooks that the craft beer talking heads are claiming will save your business.  But he’s on this show because the many beer-related businesses and non-beer production businesses he had his hands in have all closed down.  Doug has a wealth of experience to share with us about what he tried, why it didn’t work and what he thinks that says about the future of craft beer.  And he was generous enough to share all of what he’s seen and what he knows with us so we’ll know, How NOT To Start a Damn Brewery.

    1h 12m
  4. Elsewhere Brewing - Sam and Sara Kazmer

    05/08/2025

    Elsewhere Brewing - Sam and Sara Kazmer

    Sam and Sara Kazmer brought great craft beer to a market they felt was underserved - Atlanta, Georgia when they flipped on the lights at Elsewhere Brewing in 2020.  They wanted to produce award-winning beer in a unique, community-event driven taproom. They wanted to create space, community and memories for themselves and every customer that shared in their dream. And, as we’ll hear in the 4th segment, they were successful.  The whole project was an amalgamation of the experiences they had researching craft beer while traveling the world. Drinking, tasting, connecting and experiencing beer when it’s more than beer in other countries and continents.  In the 3rd segment we’re joined by 6 month-old Sofie as she woke up from her nap. And that’s about the time we really get into the struggles they faced at elsewhere Brewing.  As their fan starts to really fill up with shit, Sam and Sara knew that they needed to throw a Hail Mary pass quickly. So in the Spring of 2024 they hired a new ops manager, built a team and a strategy around her and did everything they could to rally the ATL community around the beer and the vision of Elsewhere Brewing. They set a July deadline for profitability and as you may have guessed, they are a guest on this podcast because it didn’t work.  We learn a couple of handfuls of lessons in this episode, including whether you can change the culture of your community/city/region around how, why and how often they enjoy craft beer as part of a healthy lifestyle. To do or do not to do in regards to having a restaurant in your brewery. The management of multiple tasting rooms. And why you can’t find someone to do the owner’s job for 20K/year.  This was a moving episode and a special one for me. So open up your hearts and ears and maybe you’ll learn something about How NOT To Start A Damn Brewery.  You can reach the Kazmers at Sarakazmer26@gmail.com Samkazmer@gmail.com

    1h 29m
  5. Landmark Beer Company - Kiernan May

    03/21/2025

    Landmark Beer Company - Kiernan May

    Kiernan May is a cool guy.  He transitioned from a corporate career to open a brewery in New York with big dreams and a bigger bag of passion.  His brewery was built on Kiernan’s analytic and logical understanding of the world that surrounded him. He put the pieces and plans together in a way that was structured and strategic. He grew sensibly, understanding his limitations and how to operate within them. He leveraged his contact brewing model and the flexibility that it gave him to utilize other sales channels and distribution options.  And he did it before the last huge swell in craft breweries. Opening in 2004 should have (and to an extent it did) given him an advantage compared to the brewery business landscape of 2025. But, as you’ll hear, even operating in a climate of just over 1000 breweries didn’t protect his business from escaping a fate fans of this show know happens all too often these days.  So listen in to the story of Kiernan May and the Landmark Brewery’s 8-year run and you might just learn How NOT To Start A Damn Brewery.  5th Anniversary Announcement

    1h 13m
  6. Tumbledown Brewing - Matthew Swan

    12/05/2024

    Tumbledown Brewing - Matthew Swan

    You’re about to hear the story of Matt Swan and the late Tumbledown Brewery from Farmington, Maine.  Opened in 2014 and closed late 2025, Matt’s experience is varied and truly interesting.  His is the first brewery we’ve talked to from Maine and the only one with a red ale as it’s flagship. We cover a lot of ground from distribution, burnout, capitalization and contract brewing. One of my favorite parts of this story is that he opened as the only brewery around for miles and the only brewery in Farmington. But a farmhouse taphouse/restaurant opened right before Covid and put the screws to his business.  How are people still telling me there’s always room for one more brewery? Anyways, Matt is a truly cool guy that was open, honest and willing to share everything he learned in 11 years. He and I both hope it helps you to understand a little better, How NOT To Start A Damn Brewery.  Tumbledown Website Tumbledown Insta Tumbledown Facebook Article about opening Episode Sponsored by: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Accubrew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Brewery Direct⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Arryved Brewery Software⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Gorman Smith⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Somnifix⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (use DAMNBREWERY at checkout for 10% off) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Where to get my Damn Book⁠

    1h 18m
  7. Tanglefoot Brewing - Andy Martinec

    10/29/2024

    Tanglefoot Brewing - Andy Martinec

    Tanglefoot made some solid lagers in an unlikely place. Temple, TX is a town of about 90K people about an hour to Austin. A huge segment of that population has Czech blood in their veins and a thirst for beer from the Old Country.  But as Andy Martinec found out the hard way, that didn’t necessarily mean they would support a local business making great examples of Czech lagers. You’re about to hear his story of struggling to make beer into a business for a few years before having to announce a final service day in June, 2024.  Tanglefoot was one of my favorite lagers here in TX so this is the interview I never wanted to do. But I caught up with Andy in the brewery a few weeks after closing and he was gracious enough to share his story with all of us. And I know it will help you to understand a little more about HOW NOT TO START A DAMN BREWERY.  Tanglefoot YouTube Tanglefoot Facebook Tanglefoot Instagram Episode Sponsored by: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Accubrew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Brewery Direct⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Arryved Brewery Software⁠ ⁠Gorman Smith⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Somnifix⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (use DAMNBREWERY at checkout for 10% off) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Where to get my Damn Book⁠

    1h 30m
  8. Pono Brewing - Larry Clouser

    09/25/2024

    Pono Brewing - Larry Clouser

    Pono Brewing of Portland Oregon was conceived as a lifestyle as much if not more than a beer brand. The beers were lively, fun, inventive and everything a craft brewery should be.  Larry Clouser and his partners grew from humble beginnings as a contract brewery to statewide distribution to opening a brewpub/restaurant before finally closing the doors in 2023.  Larry’s story covers contract brewing in a market that wasn’t sure how it felt about it. And partners that struggled to decide how they felt about it. We’ll touch on partnerships in general and the financial pitfalls in particular. Hell, we’ll even get on Kool-aid beers before we’re done talking today.  When Pono Brewing finally poured it’s last beer, Larry faced head-on the same anxiety and depression many of of did.  But with the help of friends and family, he overcame the hardships, rose back up and is now on the path to creating a less stressful life for his family. And his openness and honesty will hopefully help you consider the role of your family on your current or future dream of owning a craft brewery.  Thanks to Larry’s priceless lessons and advice all of us will have a better understanding of How NOT To Start A Damn Brewery. Pono Facebook Pono Insta Pono Closing Article Episode Sponsored by: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Accubrew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Brewery Direct⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Arryved Brewery Software Gorman Smith ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Somnifix⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (use DAMNBREWERY at checkout for 10% off) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Where to get my Damn Book⁠

    1h 55m
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About

People of Earth, I would like to welcome you to the How NOT To Start a Damn Brewery: the podcast. In this podcast I consider it my duty to share the sometimes gory but always honest truth hidden in the craft beer industry. Mainly that it rarely operates like a business. Margins are trash, distributors are garbage and capital expenditures are a raging dumpster fire. But many of the people are badasses. I autopsy deceased breweries, retailers and distributors. I talk with wineries, breweries and distilleries. All in the search for ways to lure out profitability and best practices.

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