Topline

Pavilion

The #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Tune in every week to hear Sam Jacobs, AJ Bruno and Asad Zaman discuss and debate the trends, news, and developments impacting the B2B tech world. Enjoy the hot takes, strong opinions, and dry humor.

  1. 2D AGO

    The Business Case for Robot Overlords (Or At Least Robots That Unload Trucks) | CEO AJ Meyer

    AJ Meyer, CEO of Pickle Robot, isn't betting on general-purpose humanoid robots. Instead, he's a believer in robots and Physical AI which solve specific, high-volume problems. AJ joins Sam and Asad to reveal how he recently secured a nine-figure enterprise contract and why "boring" logistics tasks are the gateway to mass adoption of robots. But with mass adoption's opportunities, so too are there new risks. AJ shares that while physical safety is an important consideration, the cybersecurity risk of a networked robot workforce is what needs the most attention right now. This and a ton more in this week's episode of Topline with Sam Jacobs (CEO @ Pavilion) and Asad Zaman (CEO @ Sales Talent Agency). Thanks for tuning in! Catch new episodes every Sunday Subscribe to Topline Newsletter. Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast! Chapters: 00:00 Teaser and Introduction to AJ Meyer 02:53 The Convergence of Physical and Digital AI 05:50 Safety Constraints and the "Acrobat" Robot Disaster 09:19 Mobile Manipulation vs. General Purpose Humanoids 12:47 Cybersecurity Risks in Connected Robot Networks 18:52 AI Surveillance and Authoritarian Risks 28:01 Debunking the Myth of Unskilled Labor 34:54 The Moving Goalposts of AGI 38:19 Solving the Open World Generalization Problem 42:09 Why Foundation Models Need Systems Engineering 48:23 Designing Business Models for Enterprise and Mid-Market 53:20 The Nine-Figure "ChatGPT Moment" for Robotics 58:14 Transferring SaaS Go-To-Market Skills to Hardware 01:03:45 Taste and Judgment as Career Differentiators 01:07:50 Hiring Needs and Closing Thoughts

    1h 10m
  2. FEB 8

    Mark Roberge (Ex-HubSpot CRO): "AI Startups Will See the Highest Failure Rate in History"

    Mark Roberge is calling it now: we are about to witness the highest failure rate for a single cohort of startups in the history of tech. As author of Science of Scaling, and co-founder of Stage 2 Capital, Mark joins the pod to dismantle the "growth at all costs" mindset that still plagues founders. He explains why the assembly-line sales model is dead and how AI will force a return to the full-cycle "rainmaker" rep. **Key moments:** The AI Bubble: Why the index fund of the last two years of AI investments is likely doomed. Fixing Your ICP: And how optimizing for CAC or inbound volume without ICP fundamentals in place is a recipe for disaster The 80% Rule: How AI moves reps from 25% selling time to 80%, and what that means for the future of SDR, AE, and CS functions LIR - What it is and Why It Matters: Why every board deck needs a a LIR slide to predict product-market fit before revenue numbers hit **Note:** Mark is donating 100% of the proceeds from his new book to mental health causes. Grab a copy of *The Science of Scaling* on Amazon!   Subscribe to Topline Newsletter. Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast!   Chapters: 00:00 Introduction: Mark Roberge and The Science of Scaling 03:44 Founder Turnover and Loyalty in the AI Era 06:18 Navigating Founder Burnout and Strategic Pivots 16:30 Predicting High Failure Rates for AI-Native Startups 18:57 The Origin Story Behind The Science of Scaling 24:51 Why Most Companies Define Their ICP Wrong 28:34 The Leading Indicator of Retention (LIR) Framework 32:30 Real-World Example: Shifting ICP Based on Retention 37:22 Who Should Own Product-Market Fit? 43:23 Transitioning GTM Strategies from SaaS to AI 47:29 The End of Specialization: Collapsing GTM Roles 51:12 Solving GTM Inefficiency by Increasing Selling Time 56:50 How to Pilot the Consolidated "Ninja AE" Role 01:04:29 Designing Organizations for Rainmakers vs. Average Reps 01:08:01 Mental Health, Gratitude, and Closing Thoughts

    1h 14m
  3. FEB 1

    AI Talent Wars: OpenAI, Thinking Machines & Meta Fighting For Breakthroughs

    The AI arms race is getting ugly. With top talent bouncing between Thinking Machines and OpenAI, the guys debate a critical question for every leader: Is loyalty dead, or has Silicon Valley just stopped pretending? Sam, Asad, and AJ discuss the ethics and dangers of the "secure the bag" mindset and what it means for building enduring companies. They also pivot to the tactical side of leadership, breaking down why most managers wait too long to fire and the hard truth that "what you allow, you encourage." Key topics: The Thinking Machines exodus: Performance issues or corporate sabotage? Do ethics actually matter when the prize is AGI? The one management mantra every GTM leader needs for a high performing team Quitting the content hamster wheel: The hosts' priorities for the next chapter.   Thanks for tuning in! Catch new episodes every Sunday Subscribe to Topline Newsletter. Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast!   Chapters: 00:00 Intro: Top Line, Pavilion Gold, and Today's Agenda 02:28 The Thinking Machines Exodus and OpenAI's Hiring Spree 08:08 Capital Incentives: Why Tech Talent Has Become Mercenary 14:03 The Core Debate: Do Values Matter in Modern Tech? 18:41 The "Get the Bag" Mentality vs. Building Forever Companies 23:00 The Risks of Accelerating into a Future Without Ethics 31:28 Impact on GTM: Shorter Tenures and Transactional Hiring 34:25 Why Swiftly Correcting Underperformance is an Act of Loyalty 45:00 Why Organizational Values Are Useless Without Defined Behaviors 01:00:38 Final Question: What Are You Under-Prioritizing for 2026?

    1h 7m
  4. JAN 11

    The 13 AI Agents Inside a $90 Billion Machine

    MIT reports that 95% of AI initiatives are failing to show ROI. Pablo Dominguez, Operating Partner at Insight Partners, joins the show to explain how to escape that group, and be in the 5% of companies that succeed. Pablo opens the playbook on "Dylan," Insight's internal system of 13 autonomous agents that cut their due diligence process from 35 hours down to 14. Other high points: How Insight used tools like Relevance AI and Gong to build an agent swarm that handles research, analysis, and data cleaning. Why Engineers aren't necessarily who you'd want to build these workflows (and who you need instead) How the CEO of a successful SaaS company is aiming for 5x developer productivity in 2026 Plus the "why" behind some spicy 2026 predictions like: the death of the traditional CRM, Sam Altman's potential exit from OpenAI, and the coming consolidation of "vibe coding" platforms. Thanks for tuning in! Catch new episodes every Sunday Subscribe to Topline Newsletter. Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast!   Chapters: 00:00 Introduction: Pablo Dominguez and Insight Partners 04:57 Insight's Structure and Value Creation Engine 08:12 Why Most Companies Fail to Get AI ROI 11:05 Case Study: Automating Diligence with AI Agents 15:39 Resources Required to Build Autonomous Systems 21:23 Managing Hallucinations and Accuracy in AI 31:09 Scaling AI Literacy and Organizational Fluency 37:15 Measuring Engineering Productivity and Cloud Coding 43:14 Balancing AI Automation with Human Authenticity 52:23 Market Trends: Buyer Behavior and Churn Risks 57:18 The Spectrum: From Workflows to Agentic Systems 01:01:13 Why Retention Issues Are Always Product Problems 01:04:35 Bold Industry Predictions for 2026 01:05:43 The Potential Death of the Traditional CRM

    1h 13m
  5. JAN 4

    He Built a SaaS Monster with $1 Million (And Refused to Raise More)

    Wade Foster (CEO) built Zapier into a profitable powerhouse without traditional VC funding—just $1M post-YC, then profitable ever since. On this episode, the co-founder and CEO shares how that capital discipline shaped their ability to pivot hard when AI hit. Wade also dishes on: The GPT-4 moment that shifted Zapier's roadmap A tested formula for AI agents that actually work How to incentivize internal AI adoption   Thanks for tuning in! Catch new episodes every Sunday Subscribe to Topline Newsletter. Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast!   Chapters: 00:00 Introduction: Wade Foster and the Age of Agents 02:38 Zapier's Origin: Solving the SaaS Integration Problem 04:14 From Zaps to Agents: The Evolution of Automation 05:07 How GPT-4 Changed Zapier's Internal Strategy 06:43 Unstructured Data and the Rise of Vibe Building 09:56 Why Long-Term Product Roadmaps Are Now Obsolete 13:00 Transitioning from PLG to Enterprise Amidst Competition 17:58 What Actually Works: Defining Successful Agentic Workflows 20:59 Building an AI-Literate Company Culture 26:18 Future Outlook: AI Bubbles vs. Product Reality 27:38 Navigating Board Expectations During Technology Shifts 30:23 Zapier's Capital Efficiency and Fundraising History 33:58 Founder Advice: Prioritizing Long-Term Thinking

    39 min
  6. 12/21/2025

    $50k vs $500K vs $50M Sales People - How to WIN In Modern Sales

    We are multi-million-dollar CEOs specializing in sales and go to market teams in tech. We've met more millionaire sales people than you can count. This is exactly how to explode your income in our favorite career path. We are multi-million-dollar CEOs specializing in sales and go to market teams in tech. We've met more millionaire sales people than you can count. This is exactly how to explode your income in our favorite career path. Thanks for tuning in! Catch new episodes every Sunday Subscribe to Topline Newsletter. Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast!   Chapters: 01:46 Sales Market Trivia: Headcounts and Income Statistics 07:14 CRO Compensation Realities and OTE Attainment 11:36 Can You Make $100k in Your First Year? 15:53 Essential Personality Traits for Top Sales Performance 21:25 The Timeline to Earning $200k and $300k 30:23 Strategies for Earning $1 Million in Sales 33:10 Executive Equity and Valuation Multiples in AI 38:10 Debate: Is OpenAI Too Big to Fail? 44:06 Kyle Poyar Joins: The State of AI Growth 45:17 Why AI Implementations Are Missing Expectations 50:32 Product Market Fit and AI-Driven Disillusionment 01:05:10 The Decline of Seat-Based Pricing Models 01:09:44 Emerging Pricing Models: Credits and Pass-Through Costs 01:17:48 The $500 Billion OpenAI Investment Question

    1h 20m
4.8
out of 5
56 Ratings

About

The #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech. Tune in every week to hear Sam Jacobs, AJ Bruno and Asad Zaman discuss and debate the trends, news, and developments impacting the B2B tech world. Enjoy the hot takes, strong opinions, and dry humor.

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