When We're Not Hustling: Sex Workers Talking About Everything But

Jessie Sage
  • 5.0 (17)
  • Society & Culture
  • Updated Semimonthly

When We're Not Hustling is a twice-monthly podcast that explores the lives and identities of sex workers outside our personas. Each episode features a long-form interview with a sex worker, where we talk about everything but work: personal philosophies, ambitions, family, relationships, passions, hobbies, mental and physical health, identity, spirituality, meaning-making, and more. On this show, we learn who sex workers are outside of the work they are known for. When We're Not Hustling is an exploration of the people behind the fantasies.

  1. 03/24/2025

    S3 E12: I Needed to Do Something With My Hands—Now I Make Custom Leather Harnesses with Mia Walsch

    In this special crossover episode of When We're Not Hustling and Hobby Whores, Jessie Sage speaks with Mia Walsch, an Australian leatherworker and former sex worker, about her journey into leather crafting during the extended lockdowns in Melbourne. The conversation explores Mia's transition from sex work to a creative outlet that became a side hustle, as she intricately crafts leather harnesses and other items, emphasizing the therapeutic benefits of working with her hands. They discuss the challenges of selling on platforms like Etsy and the ethical considerations Mia faces as a vegetarian working with leather. The episode also touches on the broader themes of capitalism's impact on creative industries, the communal aspects of crafting, and the personal satisfaction derived from creating tangible art. In this Episode: 02:49 - Introduction of producer Emily Foster and guest Mia Walsh.   04:05 - Start of conversation with Mia Walsh.   06:14 - Discussion of Mia's leatherworking and Etsy experience.   10:04 - Insights on gig economy and capitalism.   17:40 - The joy of crafting and creating.   29:34 - Discussion on ethical considerations in leatherworking.   38:44 - Future plans for leatherworking and community involvement.   41:12 - Mia's memoir and challenges faced during its release. Guest:  Mia Walsch is an author and visual artist from Melbourne, Australia. She studied Creative Writing at the University of Wollongong and has previously published three novels, the first of which won a Victorian Premier's Literary Award. Money for Something is her first non-fiction book. Instagram: @m1a.wal5ch Bluesky: miawalsch.bsky.social   Recommendations:  Books:  Neon Girls, by Jennifer Worely  Music: Gag Order, Kesha The Rest:  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    54 min

  2. 03/17/2025

    S3 E11: What Does It Mean to Be Human? More Importantly, What Does It Mean to Have Humanity? with Zalika

    In this episode of When We're Not Hustling, Jessie Sage speaks with Zalika U. Ibaorimi, PhD, about the complex intersections of race, gender, and sex work. They discuss how Blackness disrupts conventional categories of identity and the limitations of the term "sex worker" in encompassing the diverse experiences within the sex industry. The conversation delves into the historical and systemic dehumanization of marginalized bodies, particularly focusing on the concept of "no humans involved" as a police code and its broader implications in Black studies. Zalika, an anti-disciplinary artist and professor, shares insights from her projects exploring Black femme identities and the societal constructs of humanism. Together, they examine the relational dynamics within sex work, the politics of coalition building, and the nuanced realities of being labeled a "whore." Through laughter and lived experiences, the episode offers a profound exploration of identity, existence, and the ongoing struggle for recognition and rights in both academic and sex work communities. In this Episode: 04:16 - Introduction of guest Zalika U. Mbararimi, her background, and her work on Black sexualities and humanism. 05:08 - Jessie and Zalika discuss their involvement in a book project with Working Girls Press. 09:15 - Explanation of the term "No Humans Involved," its implications, and its relevance to Black studies and sex work. 28:28 - Discussion on the complexities and critiques of the term "sex work" and its political implications. 41:40 - Jessie and Zalika discuss the challenges of coalition building, especially in relation to anti-Blackness and self-serving allies. 01:01:41 - Discussion on how Blackness disrupts traditional gender categories and the concept of womanhood. 01:06:48 - Zalika talks about her excitement for the I Hate My Job book and her critical porno project. 01:07:17 - Closing remarks, where to find Zalika and Jessie online, and podcast sign-off. Guest: Zalika U. Ibaorimi, PhD (she/they), also going under the artist's name n0humaninv0lved (N.H.I.), is a former sex worker, antidisciplinary artist, Assistant Professor of Black Sexualities in the Department of African American and African Studies at the Ohio State University and a 2021-2023 Carter G. Woodson Predoctoral Fellow at the University of Virginia. She engages Black material and digital publics as landscapes to trace the Human sexual geographies between the relation of the Black femme and spectator. Their relationality is tethered to the logics of shame, desire, and pleasure. Additionally, they consider the discursiveness of critical and revolutionary Humanism as modes to chart the (de)figuration of the Black wh0re vis-à-vis the counter and anti-Human. They are currently working on two book projects, Haunted Femmes, Haunting Spectators and (BE)CUM(ING): N.H.I. in Three Acts. Her performance, a crit-p0rno titled (be)cum(ing): on humanist edging, will screen beginning March 2025. Instagram: @hauntedfemme Bluesky: @n0humaninv0lved.bsky.social   Recommendations:  Books:  The Witch's Flight by Kara Keeling Showgirls: Portrait of a Film by Paul Verhoeven Music:  Jazmine Sullivan  Mk.gee The Rest:  Enter to win a custom leather harness by Mia Walsch! Contest closes on 3/21/2025. Visit our socials for instructions!  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    1h 8m

  3. 03/10/2025

    S3 E10: What Do Mobile Peepshows, Burlesque and Non Profits Have in Common? Ruby

    In this episode of When We're Not Hustling, Jessie Sage speaks with Ruby about her extensive work with the Peers Victoria Resources Society, a nonprofit supporting sex workers in Victoria, BC. Ruby shares insights into the organization's history and services, such as night outreach and harm reduction programs. She discusses the challenges sex workers face, including legal issues under the Nordic model and societal stigma, and highlights efforts to reform Canadian sex work laws. Ruby also touches on her personal journey from being sex work-adjacent to advocating for sex worker rights and her creative endeavors, including a traveling peep show and spoken word poetry. The conversation reflects on the importance of community support, inclusivity, and the intersectionality within advocacy work. In this Episode: 00:02:48 Emily Foster, the producer, introduces the episode and announces a giveaway.   00:06:07 Discussion on the Red Umbrella March and efforts to end violence against sex workers.   00:10:05 Overview of Peers Victoria Resources Society and its programs supporting sex workers.   00:15:21 Discussion on the legal challenges faced by sex workers in Canada, including the constitutional challenge against current laws.   00:21:03 Ruby shares her journey from being sex work-adjacent to becoming an advocate and worker.   00:28:12 Conversation on the intersection of burlesque and sex work, and changes in the burlesque community.   00:34:49 Importance of supporting marginalized voices within sex work advocacy.   00:41:00 Ruby discusses personal growth and accomplishments through her advocacy work.   00:48:09 Ruby performs her spoken word piece, "Bimbo," highlighting the sex worker experience.  00:52:03 Ruby describes her mobile peep show project and the challenges faced in promoting it.  01:00:39 Ruby shares her concerns and goals for mobilizing the community against potential conservative government changes.   01:02:02 Closing remarks and where to find more about Ruby and Peers Victoria Resources Society. Guest: Ruby is a bimbo with multiple personalities, an innovative visionary who has owned her own entertainment company for over 15 years. Ruby Entertainments fearlessly recreates the ritual of Bachelor Party Culture by combining sex positivity with consent through a playful platform of dance, connection, and touch. Notably she was granted a moderate sum from the BC government to build the world's first contemporary mobile Peepshow. Ruby's Pop Up Peepshow came to life in 2023!   With a BA in Gender Studies she is the perfect mix of t**s, wits, and glitz. As Ginger Kittens, she is a burlesque dancer in the award winning troupe, The Cheesecake Burlesque Revue. She is also an accomplished poet and playwright. Instagram: @RubyPeepShow X/Twitter: @RubyEntertains Website: RubyEntertainments.com   Recommendations:  Journal:  The Anti-Trafficking Review  Podcasts:  The Oldest Profession by Kaitlyn Bailey Stripped by SIA  The Rest:  Enter to win a custom leather harness by Mia Walsh! Contest closes on 3/21/2025. Visit our socials for instructions!  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    1h 3m

  4. 03/03/2025

    S3 E9: I'm an Immigrant Six Times Over, and My Heart Helps Me Find a Sense of Home with Savannah

    In this episode of When We're Not Hustling, Jessie Sage interviews Savannah, a UK-based full-service sex worker turned webcam model and contemporary artist. Savannah discusses her self-care guide for sex workers, emphasizing the importance of acknowledging sex workers as full people with complex lives beyond their jobs. She shares how art has helped her find a sense of home and belonging as an immigrant and how it aids in processing her experiences of survival and stigma. Savannah's work includes the Self Care for Sex Workers Journal, aimed at promoting well-being and balance for sex workers, and her latest book, Salute the Light Within You, which explores her journey through domestic violence and addiction recovery. The episode underscores the importance of destigmatizing sex work and recognizing the humanity of those within the industry. In this Episode: 00:04:07 Introduction to Savannah, a full-service sex worker and artist, and the topics of the interview including self-care and art.   00:06:46 Savannah discusses her background, her transition from full-service sex work to webcam modeling, and her art practice.   00:11:01 Savannah talks about how her art is a response to her experience of erasure and survival as an immigrant and sex worker.   00:19:09 Savannah and Jessie discuss the difficulty of recognizing safety and security after years of survival mode.   00:28:04 Discussion on the importance of self-care for sex workers and the creation of Savannah's journal.   00:32:42 Conversation about financial stigma and challenges faced by sex workers in managing money.   00:41:43 Discussion about the boundaries and care dynamics in sex work, and how these experiences translate to Savannah's art.   00:56:00 Jessie wraps up the episode with final thoughts and asks Savannah about her current interests and projects.   Guest: Savannah is an Indian Web Cam Model, 6 time Immigrant and Contemporary Artist based in London, UK. In 2022 she published the Self Care for Sex Workers Journal which centres the lives, well being and spirits of Sex Workers as deserving and vital. Born from her understanding of Self Care and Community as Reclamation from a stigma induced Survival Mode existence, the Journal offers a holistic guide to well being through eye opening, step by step guidance around nutrition, finance, rest, pleasure and diversifying in business and life aspirations. Rooted in doing less and letting go, and creating expansion through rest and replenishment, the prompts provide release from the hustle and grind aspects of our Labour, to move from surviving to thriving, from burn out to balance. Instagram: @selfcare4sxwkrs X/Twitter: @selfcare4sxwkrs Website: myspacetobreathe.art   Substack: substack.com/@annaandtheelephant   Recommendations:  Books:  Three Women, by Lisa Taddeo  Queenie, by Candice Carty-Williams Podcasts:  Where Should We Begin? with Esther Perel  How's Work? with Esther Perel  The Rest:  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    1 hr

  5. 02/24/2025

    S3 E8: I Am a Pro Domme and a Pro Wrestler—I Like to Play the Heel with Katarina

    In this episode of When We're Not Hustling, host Jessie Sage and guest Katarina "The Domme Kat" Pierce delve into her journey from TV production and journalism to becoming a co-founder of the Sex Work Survival Guide, a nonprofit providing crucial resources and education to sex workers. The conversation covers the challenges and stigmas within the sex industry, the importance of safety and community, and the unique blend of creativity and empowerment found in wrestling and BDSM. Katarina highlights her passion for wrestling as both an art form and a means of personal expression, illustrating how it allows for a dynamic interplay of strength, storytelling, and connection with clients. The episode also touches on the broader cultural narratives surrounding sex work and wrestling, emphasizing the transformative power of embracing one's true self and the support found within the sex work community. In this Episode: 00:02:49 Emily Foster introduces herself as the producer and talks about upcoming projects, including Jessie's book and TEDx Talk.   00:03:55 Introduction of Katarina, discussing her work and her nonprofit. 00:06:11 Katarina shares the challenges of entering the industry and the purpose behind the Sex Work Survival Guide.   00:09:30 Discussion about the format of the Sex Work Survival Guide conferences and speaker series.   00:18:19 Katarina discusses her journey into sex work and the reasons for choosing this path.   00:28:15 Jessie and Katarina discuss the dynamics of submission and fetishism in their work.   00:42:39 Discussion about the body emphasis in wrestling and how it intersects with sex work.   00:50:12 Katarina explains how sessions are like improv dance and the importance of consent.   00:57:04 Katarina shares one of her most fun sessions, involving role play and exploration.   01:02:02 Katarina and Jessie discuss their intentions for balancing work and personal life.   Guest:  Katarina "The Domme Kat" Pierce is a NYC-based fetish wrestler, ProDomme, adult actress and producer, kink educator and experience creator.   With Tiana "Glittersaurus Rex" and Dr. Ash Dark, Kat co-founded SW Survival Guide, a non-profit dedicated to the idea that life-saving information shouldn't be gatekept because "survival shouldn't be a luxury."   Katarina comes from the world of TV production and print journalism. When she's editing content and her mom calls to ask what she's doing, Kat gets to say, "Using my college degree." Instagram: @domina_katarina X/Twitter:  @TheDommeKat Bluesky: thedommekat.bsky.social Website: theDommeKat.com or www.thedominakatarina.com Recommendations:  Books:  Wake: The Hidden History of Women-Led Slave Revolts, by Rebecca Hall  Music:  Marc Anthony Podcasts:  The Mystery Hour-Rabia Chaudry The Hidden Djinn - Rabia Chaudry  The Rest:  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    1h 4m

  6. 02/17/2025

    S3 E7: I Make Art From Bones and I Like Homesteading, Too with Miss Faith Rae

    In this episode of the When We're Not Hustling podcast, host Jessie Sage welcomes Ms. Faith Rae, a Canadian sex worker and multidisciplinary artist. The conversation explores Faith's life outside her work persona, delving into her passions for sustainability and art. Faith shares her unique craft of creating art with ethically sourced animal bones, a practice that connects her with nature and offers a sense of healing and honoring life cycles. Her dedication to sustainability extends to her lifestyle choices, including plans to build a homestead with permaculture principles. Throughout the discussion, Faith reflects on how these practices have reshaped her relationship with life and death, and how they align with her broader commitment to environmental care. The episode is a deep dive into the personal philosophies and creative endeavors that define Faith Rae beyond her professional identity. In this Episode: 00:02:40 Introduction to the guest, Faith Rae, a Canadian multidisciplinary artist and sex worker.   00:03:10 Faith Rae discusses her art with bones and her interests in sustainability.   00:06:03 Discussion on ADHD and creative processes.   00:10:54 Faith Rae talks about her connection to nature and how it influences her art.   00:13:28 Discussion on how working with bones has changed her relationship with death.   00:19:49 Faith Rae talks about her interest in sustainability and thrifting.   00:31:19 Faith Rae discusses her plans to move and her vision for a sustainable homestead.   00:43:12 Discussion on permaculture and sustainable farming practices.   00:52:24 Faith Rae shares her excitement for the future and her personal journey.   00:53:01 Closing remarks and where to find Faith Rae's work.   Guest:  Faith Rae is a Canadian sex worker of over twelve years, whose career is rooted in Femdom content creation and online sessions. When she's not making men cry for money, she can be found hiking with her dog, making art out of ethically sourced animal remains, or learning new ways to incorporate sustainability and eco-consciousness into her day-to-day life. Bluesky: missfaithrae.bsky.social Website: missfaithrae.com Reccomendations:  Books:  Children of Time, by Adrian Tchaikovsky Music:  A Perfect Circle  Deftones  STARSET The Rest:  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    54 min

  7. 02/10/2025

    S3 E6: Stripping and Cam Modelling Isn't as Fun as Making Instant Noodles with Steph Sia

    In this episode of When We're Not Hustling, host Jessie Sage sits down with Steph Sia, a multidisciplinary artist and content creator from Vancouver, to discuss her diverse experiences in the adult industry. As a stripper, podcaster, and online content creator, Sia shares insights into balancing work and personal life while navigating the challenges and misconceptions surrounding sex work. The conversation also explores her unique YouTube channel, Sia Slurps, where she reviews instant noodles, highlighting her passion for creative expression beyond the industry. Throughout the episode, Sia emphasizes the importance of destigmatizing sex work and creating content that connects with mainstream audiences, fostering greater understanding and visibility. In this Episode: 00:02:41 Introduction to guest Steph Sia, her background, and podcast "Stripped by Sia".   00:03:57 Overview of Steph Sia's career in the adult space and her various roles.   00:05:01 Steph shares her travel plans to Hawaii and family life.   00:07:55 Conversation about Steph's multiple jobs and how she manages them.   00:12:24 Introduction and discussion of Steph's noodle review channel "See a Slurps".   00:24:00 Discussion on managing work and personal life, including setting boundaries to prevent burnout.   00:32:01 Steph discusses her transition from feature dancing to focusing more on online work.   00:58:27 Conversation about the realities of working in the sex industry and the impact of COVID on new entrants.   01:01:35 Reflections on the connections and friendships formed within the industry.   01:02:23 Jessie and Steph talk about their current reading and music interests.   01:04:59 Steph shares where listeners can find her content online.   01:06:33 Closing remarks by Jessie Sage.   Guest:  Steph SIA (aka SIA) is a content creator, podcaster, dancer, and multidisciplinary artist based out of Vancouver, BC. She has been in the adult space since 2013, starting out with in-person companionship, dancing professionally across clubs in Vancouver, fetish work and most recently, branching off into online work via paid subscription sites, camming and sexting. Steph SIA shares a love for dancing and movement which lead her to her naturally gravitating toward a career in the strip industry. Instagram: @strippedbysiapodcast X: @strippedbysia Bluesky: @strippedbysia Website: siaoncamera.com Reccomendations:  Books:  Thriving in Sex Work: Heartfelt Advice for Staying Sane in the Sex Industry, by Lola Divina  Music:  Thủy The Rest:  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    1h 7m

  8. 02/03/2025

    S3 E5: The Most Taboo Subject in the World Isn't Sex, It's Perimenopause

    In S3 E5 of When We're Not Hustling, Jessie Sage sits down with Jet Setting Jasmine, an award-winning adult film director, psychotherapist, and master fetish trainer, to discuss perimenopause, evolving identities, and the challenges of navigating life, family, and sex work with autonomy and care. They explore the impact of bodily changes, the importance of boundary-setting, and Jasmine's unique approach to parenting and education through travel. This episode offers a candid look at embracing new phases of life with confidence, community, and self-acceptance.  In this Episode: 00:02:51 Introduction of guest Jet Setting Jasmine  00:03:47 Discussion on perimenopause and its impact on daily life.   00:06:33 Conversation about the symptoms and lack of awareness regarding perimenopause.   00:10:28 Exploration of mood changes and personality shifts during perimenopause.   00:14:37 Concerns about sex drive changes due to perimenopause and how it affects sex work.   00:19:23 Discussion on adaptability in sex work as one ages and changes.   00:26:51 The impact of perimenopause on relationships and personal life.   00:41:51 Changes in family dynamics and embracing new roles as children grow.   00:54:49 Traveling with children and accommodating their needs in new environments.   01:01:32 Closing thoughts on perimenopause, its broader impacts, and the importance of sharing experiences with others going through similar life stages.   Guest:  Jet Setting Jasmine is an award-winning adult film director, entertainer, and master fetish trainer. She is also a licensed psychotherapist and educator who uses her expertise in mental health to advocate for a more inclusive and ethically-sound adult entertainment industry. Challenging Conventional Approaches to Sex, Jasmine is the co-owner, along with partner King Noire, of Royal Fetish Films, a multi-channel adult-entertainment business that resists the discriminatory tropes common in the art of entertainment and the mainstream adult industry. The filmmakers at Royal Fetish Films combine love for artistic and sensual film, with the need for authentic sexual representation. The result is blazing-hot content that stimulates the audience to explore their sexual boundaries in an area free from stigma. Her work on the decolonization of sex and pornography, as well as her advocacy for sex-positive parenting, recently landed her on Comedy Central's The Daily Show. She has also appeared in major publications such as Vice, Playboy, Forbes, Cosmopolitan, NPR, Essence, BBC, and Psychology Today. Instagram: X: @JetSetJasmine Bluesky: @JetSettingJasmine.bsky.social XXX Content: RoyalFetishXXX.com Website: jetsettingjasmine.com The Rest:  Host: Jessie Sage Producer: Emily Foster Music: Benjamin J Benamati Sponsor: Assembly Four Powered by Black Venom Digital When We're Not Hustling is a 501(c)(3) non-profit project of the Social Good Fund. You can support our show with your tax-deductive donation HERE.

    1h 4m
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About

When We're Not Hustling is a twice-monthly podcast that explores the lives and identities of sex workers outside our personas. Each episode features a long-form interview with a sex worker, where we talk about everything but work: personal philosophies, ambitions, family, relationships, passions, hobbies, mental and physical health, identity, spirituality, meaning-making, and more. On this show, we learn who sex workers are outside of the work they are known for. When We're Not Hustling is an exploration of the people behind the fantasies.

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