What does it take to grow New Zealand businesses internationally without losing sight of the people, systems and leadership needed to make that growth sustainable? In this episode of HR Unlocked, Lisa Oakley sits down with Phoebe Chandler, Chief People Officer at New Zealand Trade and Enterprise (NZTE), to explore international growth, leadership, productivity, organisational design, simplification, AI, employee relations, and the future of HR. Phoebe brings an international perspective to the conversation after spending 10 years offshore before returning to New Zealand. She shares why her time working with New Zealand businesses has made her increasingly optimistic about the country’s ability to compete globally, particularly when it comes to resilience, ingenuity, relationships and resourcefulness. But scaling internationally requires more than a great product. Phoebe describes international growth as a people transformation story. As businesses grow, founders and leaders need to move from being the person who solves every problem to becoming the architect of the organisation around them. Leadership capability, learning agility, curiosity and adaptability therefore need to be built into how organisations hire, make decisions, develop people and design work. Simplification is another major theme. Phoebe argues that organisations experiencing sustained change naturally accumulate processes, controls and ways of working. The challenge is knowing what to stop, consolidate or remove so people have the capacity to focus on what matters most. The conversation also explores productivity and work intensity. As AI removes more routine work, there is a risk that the work left behind becomes increasingly demanding. Phoebe discusses the importance of designing resilience into the organisation itself rather than placing the responsibility entirely on individuals. That leads to one of the central leadership ideas in the episode: people may not always be able to have certainty, but leaders can still provide clarity. Lisa and Phoebe then turn to the future of HR and employee relations. They question whether traditional approaches to investigations, restructuring, consultation and conflict resolution are keeping pace with rapidly changing workplaces. Rather than abandoning fairness or due process, Phoebe suggests returning to enduring principles such as dignity, employee voice, transparency and fairness, while thinking more carefully about risk, proportionality and the outcome organisations are actually trying to achieve. The episode challenges HR professionals to move beyond automatically following familiar processes and instead bring curiosity, adaptability, commercial thinking and good judgement to increasingly complex workplace decisions. What You’ll Learn Why international growth is ultimately a people transformation story What New Zealand businesses can draw on when competing internationally Why founders may need to shift from being the “hero” to becoming the “architect” Why leadership capability should be built earlier than many growing businesses expect How curiosity, learning agility and adaptability can be designed into an organisation Why leadership development does not always require a formal course Why simplification should be treated as a strategic discipline How organisations can create capacity by deciding what to stop Why AI could unintentionally make some work more intense How better work design can support sustainable performance Why organisational resilience cannot sit solely with the individual Why clarity can matter more than certainty during change Why traditional HR processes may need to evolve as work changes How fairness, employee voice and transparency can remain central while processes become more proportionate Why preventative approaches can help resolve workplace issues before they become formal complaints How HR can rethink investigations and restructuring without losing sight of duty of care Why jobs may become more fluid as organisations move towards designing work rather than fixed roles Why curiosity, adaptability, risk awareness and good judgement will be increasingly important HR capabilities Key Takeaways New Zealand businesses have genuine strengths on the world stage, including trustworthiness, resourcefulness, strong relationships, resilience and an ability to solve problems. International growth changes more than the customer base. It changes leadership, systems, processes, capability and the way work gets done. As organisations scale, leaders need to become less focused on personally solving every problem and more focused on building an environment where others can solve them. Simplification is a strategic discipline. Growth and change naturally create more processes and controls, so leaders also need to ask what can be stopped, removed or consolidated. Productivity should not simply mean asking people to do more. Sustainable performance requires organisations to look at how work itself is designed. In uncertain environments, leaders cannot always provide certainty. They can provide clarity about what is known, what matters and what happens next. HR processes should serve the people and business problem they are intended to solve. Fairness, employee voice, dignity and transparency remain essential, but that does not mean every situation requires the same process. The future of HR will require stronger judgement, curiosity, commercial awareness and adaptability as technology, roles and traditional ways of working continue to evolve. About Phoebe Chandler Phoebe Chandler is Chief People Officer at New Zealand Trade and Enterprise (NZTE). Her career spans senior people and employee experience roles across New Zealand and the UK. After spending 10 years offshore, Phoebe returned to New Zealand and joined NZTE, combining her international experience with a strong interest in helping New Zealand businesses grow and compete globally. She is passionate about making work better, simpler and more human, with particular interests in leadership, employee experience, organisational change, work design, productivity and how AI is reshaping the future of work. Why This Episode Matters HR is operating in a world where technology, jobs, organisational structures and employee expectations are changing faster than many traditional processes were designed to handle. Phoebe’s perspective brings the conversation back to the fundamentals: understand what problem you are trying to solve, create clarity, simplify where possible, build capability early, and apply judgement rather than automatically adding another layer of process. For HR professionals, People & Culture leaders, founders, executives and managers, this episode offers a practical look at how organisations can grow and adapt while creating work that remains sustainable, human and commercially effective. Resources & Links New Zealand Trade and Enterprise (NZTE): https://www.nzte.govt.nz/ Connect with Phoebe Chandler on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/phoebe-chandler-0470037a/ HR Unlocked: https://linktr.ee/hrunlocked See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
