The Experience Edge

Jochem van der Veer
  • 5.0 (2)
  • Marketing
  • Updated Weekly

Hosted by Jochem van der Veer, customer-obsessed founder of TheyDo, this weekly podcast dives into conversations with senior professionals, pioneers, and industry leaders at the forefront of CX. Guests openly share their experiences on customer journeys, voice of the customer, customer-centric transformation, journey management, and best practices for lasting impact.

  1. 7h ago

    Will half of CX teams become redundant?

    Half of CX teams are still just running surveys. The other half stopped reporting and started operating. Bill Staikos spent two decades in customer experience leadership at companies like American Express, BNY Mellon, and JPMorgan, and now writes the newsletter AI Not KPI. In this conversation, he explains why CX is splitting into a "bottom 50%" still stuck in survey-and-dashboard mode and a "top 50%" rebuilding around AI, data architecture, and operating models - and argues the role's most important relationship is shifting from the CFO to the CIO.KEY TAKEAWAYS - Half of CX teams still only run surveys- the rest have moved to an operating model. - When CX and the Chief Product Officer have "no daylight" between them, transformation accelerates. - The closed-loop model needs two new loops: orchestration (AI acting in real time) and learning (feedback improving the system). - CX leaders need data literacy and curiosity about tools like semantic layers and MCP, not just survey skills. - Start with the biggest business pain point, not the biggest customer pain point — the experience issue usually surfaces there anyway. CHAPTERS 00:00 Introduction 03:09 Why half of CX teams are stuck doing surveys 05:48 The CX–CPO relationship as the biggest marker of change 07:11 How insight teams are getting into product planning cycles 11:02 What the top 5% of CX leaders do differently 13:16 Should a survey-background CX leader be a red flag? 15:45 Business acumen vs. data vocabulary — CX needs both 17:32 Rethinking Bain's closed-loop model: adding orchestration and learning loops 22:01 Should these loops be intentionally governed or left emergent? 24:45 Hijacking existing rituals like PI planning to drive CX decisions 26:59 A real example: redesigning how teams are measured beyond output 29:52 From raw data to signal, context, intelligence, and impact 33:04 Is CX at a crossroads about its own purpose? 35:05 Why the most important CX relationship is now with the CIO, not the CFO 39:09 Where to start building an internal customer context layer 43:34 Why incentives and change leadership determine whether any of this works 45:30 Inside Bill's newsletter: turning frameworks into usable artifacts LINKEDIN Guest: Bill Staikos — https://www.linkedin.com/in/billstaikos/ Host: Jochem van der Veer — https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/ THEYDO Learn more about Journey Management with TheyDo: https://www.theydo.com#TheExperienceEdge #Staikos #AIinCX #DataArchitecture #ClosedLoopFeedback #CustomerExperience #JourneyManagement #CX #TheyDo #podcast

    49 min

  2. Jun 24

    Ontology: Fix Your AI Quality by Fixing Your Data

    Your AI agents aren't failing because the models are bad. They're failing because your data was built for humans, not machines.  Jochem has spent years working on the structural problem underneath failing enterprise AI initiatives. In this episode, he breaks down why CX AI pilots stall after six to eight weeks, what an experience ontology actually is and how it differs from a taxonomy or tag list, and why the architectural decision of where your ontology lives - data layer versus AI layer - determines whether your AI investment compounds or drifts.  KEY TAKEAWAYS AI pilots fail because the data environment was designed for human interpretation, not machine reasoning. Tagging the same word across systems is co-location, not integration — AI can't bridge that gap reliably. An ontology defines not just what things are, but how they relate and what an agent can do with them. Location primitives (journey, phase, step) give disparate data a shared address so it can finally connect. The architectural choice of where the ontology lives — data layer vs. tool layer — determines whether it scales or drifts. CHAPTERS 00:00 Introduction — Why AI pilots hit a wall after six to eight weeks 01:45 The three lenses enterprises use to understand customers 03:10 Why co-location isn't integration and what breaks when humans leave the loop 04:47 The core problem: confident AI output with no traceable foundation 06:20 What an ontology actually is — and how it differs from a taxonomy 08:00 Location primitives: journey, phase, and step as shared address 09:30 Connecting VOC evidence and BI metrics to the same structural coordinate 10:30 Pattern primitives: spotting recurring opportunities across journeys 12:00 The KYC banking example — one named object, many product teams 13:30 The third job of an ontology: structural rules for what agents can do 15:00 Why data binding is where most CX data efforts actually break down 16:30 How a working ontology creates a self-reinforcing context layer 17:54 The critical architectural decision: data layer vs. AI layer 19:30 Why CIOs and CX leaders need to make this call together 21:00 Bringing it back: the real fix isn't a better model, it's a better foundation 22:00 How TheyDo is built as the data layer AI agents run on LINKEDIN Jochem van der Veer — https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/ THEYDO Learn more about Journey Management with TheyDo: https://www.theydo.com Subscribe to The Experience Edge for weekly conversations on customer experience, journey management, and the future of enterprise CX. Share this episode with someone who's thinking about how their organisation connects customer insight to real decisions. #TheExperienceEdge #vanderVeer #ExperienceOntology #CXAI #EnterpriseAI #CustomerExperience #JourneyManagement #CX #TheyDo #podcast

    21 min

  3. Jun 4

    How To Turn Messy CX Data Into AI-ready Team Action

    Your teams are drowning in customer data but can't act on it. Here's a 5-level framework that makes the customer journey your operating system. IN THIS EPISODE Why another dashboard won't fix your customer data problem How to connect what customers say with what they actually do Why the customer journey — not your org chart — should organize your data How a "meaning layer" creates cross-team alignment without reorganizing teams How journey-structured data becomes an ontology that AI and agents can reason over CHAPTERS 00:00 The real problem: a data organizing problem, not a data problem  02:19 The five layers, and why the journey is the organizing principle  02:19 Level 1 — Evidence: the qualitative voice of the customer  04:46 Level 2 — Measurement: KPIs and what customers actually do  06:00 The journey as the backbone that joins the dots  07:15 Pinning every signal and KPI to a moment in the experience  08:00 Level 3 — Meaning: surfacing the "why" (the Lufthansa baggage example) 09:38 Level 4 — Cross-team connection and natural alignment  11:58 Level 5 — Business impact and competitive advantage  14:03 Putting it together: the journey as your operating system Follow Jochem on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/ CONNECT WITH US: Website:    https://www.theydo.com/ LinkedIn:   https://www.linkedin.com/company/theydo-journey-management/ #CustomerExperience #CustomerJourney #JourneyManagement #CXStrategy #DataStrategy #VoiceOfCustomer #CustomerData #CXOps #AIagents #ProductStrategy

    15 min

  4. May 27

    Why Your CX Message Isn't Landing

    Your CX pitch lands with practitioners but dies with CEOs. Here's the messaging framework that fixes it.  IN THIS EPISODE Why CX leaders keep pitching the wrong message to the wrong room — and how to diagnose it How to talk to a CEO or COO about customer experience without mentioning customer experience What product leaders actually need to hear before they'll prioritise CX on the roadmap When to lead with technology — and why it's only right for one specific audience The two most common messaging mistakes CX teams make and how to avoid them CHAPTERS 00:00 Intro — Why CX storytelling breaks down  01:04 The real-world example: energy company, call volume, cost mandate  02:10 Three audience buckets: Out-of-CX, CX-adjacent, CX expert  03:29 How to pitch the out-of-CX crowd (CEOs, COOs)  05:00 How to pitch the middle layer (product, marketing, brand)  08:08 How to pitch CX practitioners — and when to lead with technology  09:49 The full messaging stack: outcomes, use case, technology  10:30 Two mistakes to avoid: stacking arguments and mixing audiences  12:12 Key takeaways — same work, three different messages Follow Jochem on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/ CONNECT WITH US:Website:    https://www.theydo.com/ LinkedIn:   https://www.linkedin.com/company/theydo-journey-management/ #TheExperienceEdge #CustomerExperience #CXStrategy #CXLeadership #CustomerJourney #JourneyManagement #CXMessaging #CostToServe #VoiceOfCustomer #CustomerInsights

    13 min

  5. Apr 29

    Ep. 73 - Rethinking Empathy In High Stakes Moments

    Is empathy a staffing choice or a design decision? We often assume that emotionally charged moments demand a human touch. This episode challenges that instinct. In a world where AI is always available, always calm, and increasingly capable, the real question isn’t human versus machine - it’s whether we’ve misunderstood what empathy actually requires in the first place. In this video: Why empathy is not inherently human, but contextual How rigid automation creates frustration in high-need moments When AI provides a safer, more effective interaction than people What defines a “moment that matters” in customer experience How to design support models around need, not channel Why defaulting to human vs AI is the wrong framing entirely If empathy isn’t about who delivers it, but how it’s experienced, what should you be designing for? Follow Jochem on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer Learn more about Journey Management with TheyDo:https://www.theydo.com #CustomerExperience #JourneyManagement #ServiceDesign #CustomerCentricity #DigitalTransformation #AIinCX #ExperienceDesign #OrganizationalDesign #CXStrategy #DesignThinking #CustomerJourneys #DecisionMaking #ProductStrategy #HumanCenteredDesign

    4 min

  6. Apr 22

    Ep 72 - Why AI Needs Journey Context to Actually Work

    Mark Smith and Raymond Gerber, former competitors turned co-founders of the Institute for Journey Management, join Jochem van der Veer to unpack how enterprise CX is evolving in the age of AI. Drawing on decades of experience across Kitewheel and Thunderhead, they explore how journey orchestration is being reshaped by generative AI and organizational transformation. At the center is a key tension: AI enables scale and personalization, but without journey context and operational alignment, it risks amplifying broken experiences. The conversation reveals why journey context is no longer just a customer-facing construct, but a critical internal capability for aligning decisions, breaking silos, and enabling truly adaptive, value-driven CX. Guest Bio Mark Smith is a pioneer in customer analytics and journey orchestration, with over 30 years of experience in predictive modeling and customer engagement. He founded Kitewheel and led it to become a market leader in journey orchestration. His work has consistently focused on aligning data-driven decisioning with business constraints and customer value. He now co-leads the Institute for Journey Management. Raymond Gerber is a leading voice in journey orchestration and enterprise CX, with multiple patents in the field. As former CEO of Thunderhead, he helped shape the category before its acquisition by Medallia. His expertise spans AI, decisioning systems, and operating model design. He is now focused on advancing journey-centric transformation through the Institute for Journey Management. Key Takeaways - Journey context is multi-dimensional, combining temporal, situational, directional, and constraint-based elements that guide both AI decisions and business actions - Generative AI shifts value from prediction to prescription, enabling continuous, closed-loop learning driven by real-time customer intent - Internal alignment is the real bottleneck, journey context matters more inside the organization than for customers who simply “live” the experience - Hyper-personalization evolves from static next-best actions to dynamic, conversational interactions powered by structured and unstructured data fusion - Journey management must evolve from project-based initiatives to an embedded operating model tied to value exchange between customer and business Chapters 00:00 Why journey context matters for AI agents and workflows 00:03 Defining customer journey context in enterprise CX 00:08 AI in customer experience and the shift to non-deterministic journeys 00:12 Hyper-personalization and next best action evolution 00:15 Breaking down silos with shared journey context 00:19 Structured vs unstructured data in journey orchestration 00:23 Internal alignment and journey management strategy 00:28 Journey-centric operating model vs project mindset 00:33 Predictive vs prescriptive AI in customer experience 00:38 Enterprise CX transformation and journey-led value management LinkedIn Profiles Guests: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mapsmith/https://www.linkedin.com/in/golfergerbs/Jochem van der Veer: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer/ #EnterpriseCustomerExperience #CustomerJourneyOrchestration #CXTransformationStrategy #CustomerExperienceLeadership #JourneyCentricity #CXOperatingModel #CustomerExperienceInnovation #AIJourneyOrchestration #IntelligentCustomerEngagement #AIPoweredPersonalization #ConversationalAIExperience #AIForCustomerJourneys

    1h 12m

  7. Apr 15

    Ep. 71 - Why Omnichannel Is Slowing AI Adoption in Enterprises

    Over the past decade, many companies pursued omnichannel by adding touchpoints rather than designing continuity. The result is fragmented data, repeated customer effort, and teams optimizing for channels instead of journeys. In this environment, AI becomes a high-speed engine running on incomplete context. The real shift isn’t about better models, but about building shared, journey-level context — where aligned data, KPIs, and language turn AI from a surface tool into a system-wide capability that reshapes how organizations understand and act on customer reality. In this episode: Why adding AI to fragmented journeys increases cost instead of reducing it How “more channels” became the false proxy for omnichannel maturity What journey-level context actually means — and why AI depends on it When cross-functional KPIs outperform channel optimization How shared experience language makes both teams and AI effective What it takes to turn AI from a responder into a true context engine If AI is only as good as the context it operates in, what does your organization actually enable it to understand? Follow Jochem on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer Learn more about Journey Management with TheyDo:https://www.theydo.com #CustomerExperience #JourneyManagement #ServiceDesign #CXStrategy #DigitalTransformation #AIinBusiness #OrganizationalDesign #CustomerJourneys #DataStrategy #ExperienceDesign #BusinessTransformation #CustomerCentricity #OperatingModel #DecisionMaking

    8 min

  8. Apr 8

    Ep. 70 - What Warner Bros Discovery Gets Right About CX

    Katie Duncan, former CX leader at Warner Bros. Discovery, joins The Experience Edge to unpack what it actually takes to operationalize customer experience inside complex, high-growth media organizations. Drawing from scaling CX across major streaming launches, she brings a grounded view on turning strategy into execution. The conversation centers on the gap between customer-centric ambition and operational reality. Katie argues that most companies lose customer insight during execution, and that true CX maturity comes from embedding insights into decision-making across the full lifecycle, not just measuring outcomes after the fact. Guest Bio Katie Duncan is a customer experience leader with over 15 years of experience driving CX transformation across media and technology organizations. At Warner Bros. Discovery, she built and scaled CX operations supporting major streaming launches including Discovery Plus and Magnolia. Her work spans operational design, customer insights, and cross-functional alignment at scale. She is known for bridging strategy and execution in complex enterprise environments. Katie has led large teams and influenced CX integration across product ecosystems during periods of rapid growth and organizational change. Key Takeaways Customer centricity often exists as cultural language rather than operational reality, breaking down when insights are not embedded into decision-making processes CX impact comes from preventing friction early in the journey, not reacting to issues after they surface in metrics Treating CX as a reporting function limits influence, while positioning it as a decision partner enables real business impact Hidden defects in customer journeys often exist between touchpoints, requiring end-to-end analysis rather than isolated optimization AI accelerates insight generation but increases the need for governance, intentional design, and human-led context shaping Chapters 00:00 The illusion of customer centricity in enterprise CX 03:30 Why customer insights fail to influence decision making 08:00 Strategy misalignment and CX execution gaps 12:30 From seat at the table to owning customer experience decisions 16:00 Customer journey orchestration and decision context 20:30 Moving beyond VOC reports to behavioral insights 25:00 Identifying hidden friction in customer journeys 29:30 Scaling CX impact through early intervention 34:00 Building business acumen in CX teams 38:30 AI in customer experience and shifting roles 43:30 Context shaping and cross-functional alignment 49:00 Governance in enterprise CX transformation 54:00 Designing customer journeys from the start LinkedIn Katie Duncan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherine-g-duncan Jochem van der Veer: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jochemvanderveer Hashtags #EnterpriseCustomerExperience #CustomerJourneyOrchestration #CXTransformationStrategy #JourneyCentricOperatingModel #BreakingDownSilosInCX #CrossFunctionalAlignmentCX #CustomerExperienceLeadership #OperationalizingCustomerExperience #ExperienceDrivenGrowth #TheyDoPlatform #CustomerExperienceTransformationFramework #EnterpriseCXStrategy

    54 min
See All (85)

Ratings & Reviews

5
out of 5
2 Ratings

About

Hosted by Jochem van der Veer, customer-obsessed founder of TheyDo, this weekly podcast dives into conversations with senior professionals, pioneers, and industry leaders at the forefront of CX. Guests openly share their experiences on customer journeys, voice of the customer, customer-centric transformation, journey management, and best practices for lasting impact.

Information

  • Creator
    Jochem van der Veer
  • Years Active
    2024 - 2026
  • Episodes
    85
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Jochem van der Veer
  • Show Website
    The Experience Edge