NC Tweener Talks

NC Tweener Fund

A podcast for builders by builders in North Carolina. We explore the startup journey and stories with NC founders, from the idea to the exit and everything in between. NC Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.

  1. 16h ago

    [REDACTED] Episode 7: How a Marketer with One Broken Assembly Class Built a Lead-Gen Tool Solo

    Ben Pope, who leads the new AI Solutions business unit at Levitate, joins Redacted as its very first guest. Ben spent five years on Levitate's marketing team as the company grew from six million to roughly fifty million in annual recurring revenue, before shifting a month ago to help small businesses fold AI into their own workflows. This episode is mostly show and tell: Ben screen-shares a lead-scoring web app he built entirely on his own, despite having no formal engineering background, along with the morning briefing and post-meeting automation skills he uses every day to prep for calls and follow up with clients. Along the way, the conversation turns into a practical breakdown of how to actually build with AI tools in a real business. Ben talks through why he prefers lightweight Claude skills over traditional workflow automation platforms, how he decides when a process needs to be deterministic versus handed to an LLM, and how he manages the sprawl of having built around a hundred skills over the past year, many of which he's since retired. What makes Ben's story distinctive is the contrast between his background and his output: a marketer who taught himself to ship production web apps, and whose client consulting work is now feeding directly back into Levitate's core product roadmap. Timestamps00:00 Cold open, welcome to Redacted 00:34 What Redacted is about 01:33 Meet Ben Pope and Levitate's pitch 02:28 Ben's five years at Levitate, from $6M to $50M ARR 03:06 Founding story: Jess, his wife Brooks Bell, and word-of-mouth software 03:58 Ben's new role: launching the AI Solutions business unit 04:40 Levitate by the numbers: 9,000 customers, 300 employees 05:06 Why Ben wanted this role (the GWC test) 08:24 Demo starts: the lead-scoring web app 09:35 Walking through a live example (Union Special bakery) 11:36 Turning a business search into an enriched lead 12:16 What Ben used to build it: Claude, Codex, pre-November 2025 tools 14:20 Hardest parts of building solo, trial and error 17:21 How the scoring tool works under the hood 18:37 Killing Webflow, migrating to a Claude-editable GitHub site 21:03 Claude Club and internal hackathons at Levitate 21:45 Example client: an LA family-law attorney's intake workflow 22:50 Product-market fit and figuring out the sales process 25:29 Building Claude skills to interview clients automatically 26:35 Ben's morning briefing skill, demoed live 29:07 Manual runs vs. cron, why Ben hasn't automated it yet 33:05 Skill bloat: ~100 skills built, many abandoned 35:57 Deterministic vs. probabilistic, when not to trust the LLM 37:24 AI Solutions as Levitate's forward-deployed engineering arm 39:17 Where to find Ben 40:08 Shoutout: Simon Willison's agentic engineering resource 42:04 Show notes, sanitized skills repo, and wrap-up Find Redacted wherever you listen to podcasts, or on YouTube for the full screen share.Show notes from the episode: https://github.com/instanttaylor/redacted-podcast Where to Find David:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidshaner/ Where to Find Taylor:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/taylorcotner/ More about Offline: https://www.linkedin.com/company/offline-media-inc-/ Where to Find Ben: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/benjaminmpope/Levitate: https://www.levitate.ai/ ---  This episode of Redacted is hosted by David Shaner and Taylor Cotner, and presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund. We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    [REDACTED] Episode 7: How a Marketer with One Broken Assembly Class Built a Lead-Gen Tool Solo
  2. 6d ago

    Natrx: The Company Growing Coral Reefs Out of Concrete

    Tad Schwendler, COO of Natrx, joins Scot Wingo to talk about manufacturing concrete structures that work with nature instead of against it. Natrx, a North Carolina company and Tweener Fund portfolio company, has developed a patented dry-forming process that injects moisture into dry material to create rough, complex structures capable of slowing water, encouraging natural sediment buildup, and even supporting live coral growth. Tad walks through the company's founding story, which traces back to coastal engineers doing oyster reef restoration at LSU and a chance meeting with NC State-connected software co-founders, and shares how his own background in corporate development and M&A led him into a hands-on operating role at a manufacturing startup. The conversation covers the physical scale of what Natrx builds, from three-foot units weighing just under a ton to twelve-thousand-pound structures bound for a coral restoration project in Hawaii, along with the company's growth: more than 85 physical deployments, over 100,000 units placed, and roughly 80 percent revenue growth year over year. It's a hands-on, visual episode and the first in a new series on North Carolina's under-the-radar physical manufacturing companies. Timestamps: 00:00 Cold open and sponsor thanks 01:30 Welcome and series intro: NC's under-known manufacturing companies 03:12 Introducing Tad Schwindler, COO of Natrx 04:00 Formal welcome to the show 04:42 Tad's background: Atlanta, Duke, the Triangle 05:56 What does a COO actually do at Natrx? 07:58 Duke, Tulane, and a lifelong pull toward marine science 09:31 The founding story of Natrx 09:43 Two coastal engineers, oyster reefs, and LSU 11:13 Founded in 2018, commercializing by 2021 11:33 Nick's background: mechanical engineering meets software 12:52 What Natrx actually builds 13:13 Stopping water vs. working with it 15:44 Families of shapes: lattice, wave slope, and scaling up 19:02 How big are these things, and how deep do they go 21:12 What is "dry forming"? 22:07 The voxel: injecting moisture into dry material 22:55 The patent and the 10,000 sq ft Louisiana facility 23:37 Walking through the manufacturing process 26:01 How much does a unit weigh? 26:44 Shipping, barges, and why manufacturing stays centralized 29:13 Every unit is a little different: the voxel "snowflake" effect 30:02 How long do these structures last? 31:03 Growing live coral on the structures 32:30 How units get deployed in the water 33:56 Who's the customer? 35:50 Company scale: deployments, team size, revenue growth 37:14 What's next for Natrx, including a Series A 40:16 Why North Carolina is built for companies like this 41:40 Where to learn more: natrx.io 42:15 Credits and close ----- Where to Find Tad SchwendlerLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tadschwendler/Natrx: https://natrx.io/ Where to Find Scot Wingo: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thescotwingo/ Tweener Times: https://www.tweenertimes.com/ X: https://x.com/scotwingo ---  This episode of Triangle Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.  We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    Natrx: The Company Growing Coral Reefs Out of Concrete
  3. Jul 15

    [REDACTED] Episode 6: The 8-Stage "AI-ification Engine" Behind Every Automation Shipped

    David Shaner and Taylor Cotner spend this episode of Redacted screen-sharing everything they've built since the last one, and it centers on a framework David calls the AI-ification engine, an eight-stage method for turning any proven business process into something an AI agent can reliably run. He walks through the full pipeline, from process mapping through ongoing evaluation, and demos a new ClickUp documentation format the team built to keep every automation legible to both people and models. Taylor takes the second half to show how he rebuilt Offline's business development system from the ground up, using a single extended Claude conversation to reconstruct years of relationship history from his email and texts, then turning it into a repeatable five-phase playbook that can research a brand-new target company from a cold start. The conversation covers the practical side of running AI in production, too, why they dropped a synced database in favor of calling the HubSpot API directly with whitelisted fields, and an honest, unresolved discussion of how to evaluate dozens of different AI-run processes once they're all live. Timestamps 00:00 Cold open  00:41 Welcome back to Redacted 01:53 Taylor's back from two weeks in Europe 02:15 The new "AI-ification engine" board in ClickUp 03:05 Offline's marketplace of auto-updating Claude skills 06:50 Origin story of the AI-ification engine 08:25 The 8 stages, back to back 11:30 The hiring analogy: "This is like HR for AI" 14:40 Inside the "house format" ClickUp table 16:00 Ditching the proxy database for direct HubSpot calls 18:05 Old-school SOPs vs. the new house format 20:10 Walking the company-as-lead process step by step 24:10 Why the old nested-SOP approach never got followed 29:30 Handoff: Taylor's turn 29:55 Offline's accountability chart and the visionary/integrator split 32:05 Digging up the original Claude chat that started it all 34:05 The first draft was terrible 36:50 Timeline artifact and Claude for Chrome doing the research 37:50 The five-phase business development playbook 40:00 Slotting the BD system into the AI-ification board 45:35 The hardest open question: evaluating 50 agent processes 47:00 Show notes, GitHub repo, and where to find David and Taylor 47:50 What Redacted looks for in a guest Show notes from the episode: https://github.com/instanttaylor/redacted-podcast Where to Find David:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidshaner/ Where to Find Taylor:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/taylorcotner/ More about Offline: https://www.linkedin.com/company/offline-media-inc-/ ---  This episode of Redacted is hosted by David Shaner and Taylor Cotner, and presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund. We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    [REDACTED] Episode 6: The 8-Stage "AI-ification Engine" Behind Every Automation Shipped
  4. Jul 14

    The Unlocked Door: Ryan Eade on What OpenClaw Users Need to Secure Right Now

    Ryan Eade, Chief Product and Technology Officer at PtEverywhere, gave this talk at the June 10th TweenerClaw meetup, and it covers something most practitioners skip: how to actually keep your OpenClaw instance secure. Ryan walks through the three main ways OpenClaw instances get compromised: an open port that older versions left fully exposed, third-party skills that can carry malicious code (36% of early store listings had prompt injection), and prompt injection delivered through external content like X posts or README files. He also covers the upgrade windows that matter most; the March 12th and April 5th releases each contained critical security patches, and what to do right now: curl port 18789 on your OpenClaw and see if you get a response back. The practical framework Ryan closes with is worth listening to by itself. He calls it "staff not software" with the idea that every access decision for your OpenClaw should mirror how you'd onboard a new employee: scoped API keys with minimum permissions, a purpose-built email account, one-time credit cards for purchasing tasks, and human approval gates before any destructive action runs. If you've been meaning to lock down your setup but kept putting it off, Ryan gives you everything you need to do it in under 20 minutes. Timestamps00:00 Intro bumper  00:16 Sponsor recognition  01:22 Scot's intro  01:56 Introducing Ryan Eade 02:05 Ryan's topic: cybersecurity for OpenClaw 02:50 Ryan Eade  03:28 "Nobody starts with security"  04:10 Why OpenClaw isn't just a chatbot  05:26 The threat landscape  06:09 Early OpenClaw exposure stats 06:40 Threat 1: The open port  07:28 Docker's dirty secret: it bypasses your local firewall 08:07 Fix: bind to localhost and use Tailscale 09:19 What Tailscale is and why it works 09:26 Threat 2: Third-party skills  10:18 How to vet skills: pull the GitHub and read the code 10:58 Threat 3: Prompt injection from the web 11:39 How prompt injection poisons an OpenClaw session 11:47 Real examples  12:51 The full attack chain: README → backdoor → breach 13:52 System prompts vs. session instructions  14:17 The upgrade reality  15:37 Critical release windows: January, March 12, April 5 16:21 "Staff, not software" 16:44 One-time credit cards for purchasing tasks 17:19 Keep your personal email separate 17:57 Least-privilege API keys  19:10 Build in approval gates  19:52 Summary: vet skills, keep it on a leash, have a no-no plan 20:16 The port 18789 check  20:32 Closing remarks ----- Where to Find Ryan EadeLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryaneade/PtEverywhere: https://www.pteverywhere.com/ Where to Find Scot Wingo: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thescotwingo/ Tweener Times: https://www.tweenertimes.com/ X: https://x.com/scotwingo ---  This episode of Triangle Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.  We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    The Unlocked Door: Ryan Eade on What OpenClaw Users Need to Secure Right Now
  5. Jul 7

    Robbie Allen @ Tweener Claw: "3 to 5 of My Agents Fail Every Day: Here's What I've Learned"

    In this episode of Tweener Claw, Robbie Allen, the Founder and Managing Director of Automated Consulting Group and General Partner at NC Tweener Fund, shares a live talk from the June 10th Tweener Club meetup in Research Triangle Park. Robbie has spent the last year and a half deploying AI agents inside real mid-market companies, and he brings three lessons from just the last 60 days: how to build reusable AI skills that compound over time, how to monitor agents when 3 to 5 of your 25-plus will fail on any given day, and why using multiple LLMs to check each other's work has become a standard part of his workflow. Each lesson comes with a real-world example: a three-skill meeting pipeline, a monitor agent that watches the others, and a Codex Opinion skill that consistently finds gaps in Claude's output. The sharpest takeaway: AI build costs have dropped dramatically, but support and maintenance costs have not. Non-deterministic systems are inherently brittle, and anyone telling you otherwise hasn't run them in production long enough. This is a practitioner's talk for practitioners; specific, candid, and immediately actionable. Timestamps01:31 Scot's intro 02:03 60 days of lessons 02:19 Three lessons preview 03:08 Robbie takes the stage 03:25 About Automated Consulting Group 04:13 Reality vs. the AI hype cycle 05:04 The Microsoft / Copilot rant 07:13 Lesson 1: Skills that build skills 08:41 Skills as reusable packages 09:21 "The sawdust of business" 10:58 Building a skills pipeline for meetings 11:57 Skills security risks in the enterprise 12:47 Lesson 2: Agents watching agents 13:44 Build costs are down14:24 "3 to 5 of my agents fail every day" 15:44 Log everything17:33 What causes agents to fail in the wild 18:02 Lesson 3: LLMs checking LLMs 18:13 The LLM Council concept explained 19:44 The case for a multi-LLM strategy 20:36 The "Codex Opinion" skill 21:33 Gemini Opinion & LLM Council in action 23:46 Wrap-up & credits ---  This episode of Triangle Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, and presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.  We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    Robbie Allen @ Tweener Claw: "3 to 5 of My Agents Fail Every Day: Here's What I've Learned"
  6. Jul 1

    [REDACTED] Episode 5: The Rage Log: AI-Powered Lead Gen, a Living Landing Page, and the Trick That Stops Claude From Making the Same Mistake Twice

    Redacted Episode 5 goes inside Offline, and what it actually looks like to wire AI into sales, marketing, and project management without a big engineering team behind you. Co-founders David Shaner and Taylor Cotner each take a turn. Taylor walks through Offline's AI lead gen pipeline: a Claude-assisted Google Places script that geocoded 2,000 restaurant locations in about an hour, a deliberate move away from LLMs toward deterministic code for market geography, and the "outreach brief,"  a context document the system assembles per account before any LLM writes an email. He frames the whole thing as a trust graph, working outward from existing partners in concentric circles. He also gets specific about the human-AI handoff: how a salesperson (Steve) has to trailblaze first, and why you need specific lead-by-lead feedback instead of generalizations to actually improve the system. David then demos the B2B landing page he built entirely with Claude copy from Fathom sales call transcripts, photos pulled from an AI-tagged Google Drive library, live data from the POS back end, and a review filter that's been running for four months without anyone touching it. Taylor closes with the practical bit: after a 36-hour stretch of AI frustration, he asked Claude to audit his own chat logs for recurring failures. Claude named the output a "rage log." He curated it into a "gotcha registry" and baked it into a Claude Code hook that fires during every planning step, so the same mistakes stop happening on repeat. It's a simple technique that doesn't get talked about enough. Timestamps:00:00 Cold open: the rage log preview 01:02 Welcome to Redacted, Episode 5 01:50 Offline's AI lead gen pipeline 04:10 Reducing LLM usage: when code beats prompts 05:00 Geocoding 2,000 restaurants with Google Places API in ~1 hour 07:42 Building the outreach brief 09:14 What salespeople actually need before writing an email 11:46 The information a good brief assembles 14:25 Hot, warm, and cold leads defined 15:54 The B2B Hinge: visualizing your lead network 18:24 Why context-aware outreach wins in an AI-spam world 21:00 The resource-constrained case for a trust graph 23:37 The human-AI handoff: salesperson ↔ automation loop 25:00 Specifics over generalizations: how to debug a sales AI 26:22 Taylor's turn: the AI-built B2B landing page is live 28:50 Tagging Offline's photo library with AI (2,000+ images) 30:36 LLM-filtered reviews: 4 months running, never touched 33:52 Building the events page panel by panel 35:07 The Slack bot experiment: Claude as project manager 37:44 What the agent did right 39:58 Project management in the AI era: ClickUp vs. Docs 42:47 The bad AI days  44:04 The rage log becomes the gotcha registry 45:11 How Claude Code hooks inject the registry into every plan 46:38 Compound Engineering and the Every framework 47:50 Guests coming up, wrap Show notes from the episode: https://github.com/instanttaylor/redacted-podcast Where to Find David:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidshaner/ Where to Find Taylor:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/taylorcotner/ More about Offline: https://www.linkedin.com/company/offline-media-inc-/ ---  This episode of Redacted is hosted by David Shaner and Taylor Cotner, and presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund. We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    [REDACTED] Episode 5: The Rage Log: AI-Powered Lead Gen, a Living Landing Page, and the Trick That Stops Claude From Making the Same Mistake Twice
  7. Jun 30

    The Open Claw Wave 2: 300K Stars, 1,400 Malicious Skills, and a Fork from Every Tech Giant

    A live recording of my talk at the June 10th NC Tweener Fund Open Claw meetup in Research Triangle Park. The second gathering of our local AI agent community. A lot has changed since April. Here's what I cover: - Open Claw by the numbers: 300K GitHub stars, 3.2M active users, fastest-growing project in GitHub history- What went wrong in April; broken updates, 1,400+ malicious marketplace skills, and why the community got nervous about OpenAI's intentions- How the project is stabilizing: monthly releases, long-term support plan, leaner core- The fork landscape: NVIDIA's NemoClaw, Microsoft's Scout, Google's Gemini Spark, Alibaba's Qwen, and Facebook's rumored $200/month Hatch- Hermes: the MIT-licensed open-source upstart getting the most attention in the Triangle right now- Why Satya Nadella said "OpenClaw" 28 times at Microsoft Build (and Tim Cook said it zero times at WWDC)- What Triangle founders are actually shipping with day-to-day Enjoy the conversation. Timestamps:00:02 Welcome & Cold Open00:23 Sponsor Thanks01:25 Scot's Intro: The Open Claw Wave #204:48 Live Meetup Begins05:17 Meetup Sponsors Recognized05:56 Talk Order & How to Give a Future Talk06:17 Big Picture Check-In Since April06:29 Open Claw Stats: 300K Stars, 3.2M Users07:38 LTS Plan, Monthly Releases & Stability Signal08:33 What Broke in April09:27 The Marketplace Crisis: 1,400+ Malicious Skills10:03 Jensen Huang & NVIDIA's NemoClaw at GTC 10:50 "Personal Operating System for AI"11:15 Satya Nadella at Microsoft Build: Scout Announced11:43 Two Worlds: Copilot vs. Open Claw Users13:50 Tim Cook Gets 0 OpenClaw Mentions at WWDC14:09 Chinese Model Forks15:05 The Clone Landscape: Gemini Spark, Hermes, Multus16:07 Facebook's Rumored Hatch ($200/month)16:59 Perplexity Personal Computer 18:04 Hermes Deep Dive18:47 Comparison Chart Walkthrough 19:21 Hand-Off & Wrap ---  This episode of Triangle Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, and presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.  We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    The Open Claw Wave 2: 300K Stars, 1,400 Malicious Skills, and a Fork from Every Tech Giant
  8. Jun 25

    Jesse Lipson, CEO & Founder of Levitate: Building AI Features Won't Save You but Here's What Will

    Jess Lipson, founder and CEO of Levitate, joins host Scot Wingo for a focused, framework-driven conversation on how SaaS founders should think about their businesses in the age of AI. Jess has been building SaaS since before the category had a name. His first company, ShareFile, sold to Citrix and eventually became a billion-dollar business. At Citrix, he ran the company's entire SaaS portfolio. Now at Levitate, a relationship marketing platform serving nearly 9,000 small businesses,  he's spent the last year working out a clear-eyed answer to one of the most common questions Scot hears from Triangle founders: what do you actually do about the SaaSpocalypse? In this episode, Jess introduces two tests every SaaS founder should run: the Removal Test (if you strip AI out of your product, does it still function?) and the Growth Re-acceleration Test (is your growth rate going up or down, and what does that signal to investors?). Scot adds a third indicator from what he's seeing across the Tweener Fund portfolio: churn driven by customers who are now vibe-coding their own replacements. Together, they walk through how the buy-vs.-build equation has shifted 10 to 100 times, why having AI features is now table stakes rather than a competitive advantage, and what it looks like to build a business where new frontier model releases feel like tailwinds instead of threats. Timestamps00:00 Cold Open & Welcome 00:29 Sponsors: Robinson Bradshaw & Bank of America 01:24 Scot's Intro: The SaaSpocalypse 02:31 The February Tweener Times Piece 03:05 Why This Episode Exists 04:08 Welcome Jess Lipson 04:37 How Scot & Jess Know Each Other 05:10 Jess's SaaS Pedigree: ShareFile to Citrix 05:49 SaaS Multiples Have Collapsed 07:00 Salesforce, HubSpot & Workday Are Down Too 08:13 AI Features Are Table Stakes 09:50 Is This the Lowest SaaS Multiples Ever? 11:28 Investment Landscape: Subscale SaaS Is Struggling 12:23 Framework #1: The Removal Test 14:22 Framework #2: Growth Re-Acceleration 15:23 Scot's Third Signal: Vibe Coding Churn 17:32 The Buy-vs.-Build Equation Has Shifted 10–100X 19:29 When Claude Becomes Your "Single Pane of Glass" 19:44 MCP Servers & Levitate's API Revamp 21:50 How Levitate Is Passing Its Own Tests 22:31 New Offering: Helping SMBs Actually Implement AI 23:44 Software + Services as the Durable Model 24:11 The Fear Index: Do You Dread New AI Releases? 24:50 Raleigh Founded & Closing Thanks 25:04 Outro ----- Where to Find Jesse Lipson:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jesse-lipson-625195/Levitate Ai: https://www.levitate.ai/ Where to Find Scot Wingo: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thescotwingo/ Tweener Times: https://www.tweenertimes.com/ X: https://x.com/scotwingo ---  This episode of Triangle Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.  We couldn’t share posts like this without our amazing sponsors:  Platinum: NC IDEA: https://ncidea.org Gold Sponsors: - Balentine: https://www.balentine.com/triangle-entrepreneurs - EisnerAmpner: https://www.eisneramper.com - Robinson Bradshaw: https://www.robinsonbradshaw.com  Silver Sponsors: - Automated Consulting Group: https://automated.co - Bank of America: https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/technology-industry-group.html  ------Triangle Tweener Talks is sponsored by: Atomic Object: https://atomicobject.com/

    Jesse Lipson, CEO & Founder of Levitate: Building AI Features Won't Save You but Here's What Will

Ratings & Reviews

5
out of 5
7 Ratings

About

A podcast for builders by builders in North Carolina. We explore the startup journey and stories with NC founders, from the idea to the exit and everything in between. NC Tweener Talks is hosted by Scot Wingo, presented and produced by NC Tweener Fund, with creative assets and design support from Walk West.