Brave Proximity: Real Leadership Doesn't Happen at a Distance

Marissa Green & Susan Page

Brave Proximity Hosted by Marissa Green & Susan Page Most leadership podcasts will tell you to "lean in," "build psychological safety," and "align your stakeholders." This isn't that podcast. Brave Proximity is for corporate change makers and people-centered leaders who are exhausted by performance theater and ready for honest conversations about what's actually happening in organizations today and how to build a more humane way forward. The name says it all: brave enough to stop avoiding, proximate enough to stop pretending. Each episode starts with the elephant in the room — the tension too real for a town hall, too human for a slide deck, and too costly to keep ignoring. We don't manage it. We move toward it. Hosts Marissa Green and Susan Page bring decades of real experience in strategy execution, culture, leadership development, and large-scale change — and zero tolerance for corporate euphemisms. Together they name what leaders are already feeling but rarely say out loud: that something essential keeps breaking down, and it isn't the strategy. Expect truth, a little irreverence, and the occasional moment where you think: oh thank god, I'm not crazy. This is for the leaders who know the frameworks aren't enough — and are ready to try proximity instead. About the Hosts Marissa Green has spent 20+ years helping organizations bring strategy and large-scale change to life through human-centered communication. Her conclusion after all of it: without real connection, even the best plans fail quietly. Susan Page is a culture builder and leadership developer with deep roots in Life Sciences, including a Brandon Hall Award for learning programs that actually moved the needle. She coaches through honest conversation — not polished ones. Together, they don't offer another leadership framework. They offer a different way of being with the work.

  1. 6d ago

    The Career Ladder Never Really Existed Anyway: How to Prepare for the Future of Development

    Rethinking Career Pathing: The Future of Development in OrganizationsWhat if the idea of a career ladder is just a mirage? As organizations fast-forward into the future of work, traditional development systems are no longer enough — they're part of the problem. This conversation cuts through the noise, exposing the illusion of linear progress and framing development as agility, project work, and personal ownership. This isn’t about tweaking the system. It’s about dismantling old assumptions and designing new pathways for growth that match the speed and complexity of today’s world. The answer isn’t in more promises, but in real experimentation and brave structural shifts. The future of development requires a different approach—one built on trust, agility, and shared outcomes. Key insights:The concept of a linear "career path" is largely a myth.Organizations often create empty promises around development, masking retention tactics.The existing system is broken, biased, and increasingly disconnected from reality.Moving from job descriptions to project-based work: outcomes as the new organizing principle.Leadership development should be project-focused, not role-focused.Employees must own their development — organizations should enable, not dictate.Pilot new approaches early; scale quickly without waiting for perfection.The importance of agility and experimentation in HR systems.External moves and reputation matter more than loyalty.Design a future where career mobility is a fluid, multi-directional jungle gym.Connect with Marissa and Susan:Brave Proximity Mailing List Leave us a Voicemail on VOXERMarissa Green - LinkedInSusan Page - LinkedIn

    33 min
  2. May 25

    Embracing Your Own Purgatory with Geoff Curtis

    “We’re always expected to be experts whenever we walk into a room... but we’re never experts of ourselves.” What happens when the work goes away? In this special, raw, live-recorded episode of Brave Proximity, Marissa and Susan welcome author Geoff Curtis to pull back the curtain on executive transitions. Many of us have spent decades climbing the ladder, unknowingly using the non-stop demands of our careers as a high-end safety net for emotional avoidance. When that structure is abruptly removed, the resulting emptiness can be devastating. Geoff shares his personal battle with depression after exiting his corporate role, the painful process of unmasking his identity from his job description, and what it actually takes to sit in the discomfort of transition instead of sprinting to the next venture. Key Insights: The Friday-to-Monday Reflex: Why sprinting into a new role or consulting practice is often a defense mechanism against self-awareness.The Corporate Validation Train: How modern corporate environments capitalize on our internal need to "prove ourselves".The Expiration Date on Relevance: Confronting the explicit psychological terror of losing your industry footprint.Intention Over Time: How even breadwinners without financial flexibility can leverage choice and micro-moments of pause.Redefining Success: Shifting your metrics from Amazon best-seller campaigns to meaningful, organic community alignment. Disclaimer: The thoughts and opinions expressed on this show are our own and should not be taken as formal human resources or legal guidance. 👉 DOWNLOAD THE PURGATORY WORKSHEET Are you currently in transition, or desperate to pause? Don't run straight into an unvetted next move. Visit our website to download the free S1 E13 Practice Guide to audit your triggers, process your patterns, and bring real intention back to your life. Website: www.braveproximity.com Marissa's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissa-green1/ Susan's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanraderpage/ Geoff Curtis' LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/geoffreycurtis/

    34 min
  3. May 18

    You Can't Handle My Whole Self at Work

    The Myth of Whole Self at WorkThis conversation cuts through the slick language and exposes what’s really happening when organizations talk about bringing your "whole self" to work. What started as a buzz term became less about sparking genuine authenticity and more about navigating a system that often won’t hold your full reality without cost. Key insights:The phrase "bring your whole self" is a trap, often weaponized by systems that don’t support genuine authenticity.Organizations struggle—sometimes outright refuse—to create spaces where people can feel safe to fully show up.Expecting employees to be their whole selves without structural support is a setup for failure.Leadership’s role is to meet employees in their human moments—offering grace, understanding, and honesty.The gap between organizational promises and reality drives turnover more than anything else.Building authenticity in the workplace requires clarity from leadership, not just catchphrases.The real work is listening without judgment, not overcomplicating the concept of "whole self."Treat time and vulnerability as investments: showing up humanely pays off in loyalty and engagement.Timestamps:00:00 - The disconnect between "whole self" and workplace realities 01:17 - When did "bringing your whole self" turn into a burden? 03:47 - Why creating a safe space for all employees is unrealistic 04:13 - The yo-yo cycle of organizational promises and cancellations 05:23 - Rethinking professionalism and identity at work 06:14 - The pitfall of trying to internalize "whole self" without systemic shifts 09:45 - The disconnect between what we say and what we do in organizations 16:19 - How talent propositions hide gaps instead of facing them 17:45 - Normalizing imperfection in organizational culture Resources & Links: Brave Proximity Website@braveproximity Instagram@braveproximity YouTubeSusan Page - LinkedInMarissa Green - LinkedIn

    32 min
  4. May 5

    Ask Your People: Data Is Not a Substitute for Judgment

    “Waiting for perfect data is how obvious problems spiral out of control.” Ever seen a cultural disaster or a project failure coming a mile away, only to be told: "We need more data before we can act"? In this episode of Brave Proximity, Marissa and Susan unearth the dangerous corporate tendency to use spreadsheets as a shield against making hard decisions. We’ve been conditioned to believe that if it isn't in a dashboard, it isn't real—but your intuition is a data point, and your people are the primary source. Today, we talk about reclaiming Signal Detection as a leadership superpower. We explore why an 8-month data-heavy rollout is often a 0-value strategy, and how leaders can start building "Islands of Coherence" that move faster than any survey. It’s time to stop mining the dashboards and start listening to the humans. Key Insights: The Data Shield: Why we use requests for "more proof" to prolong decisions and shirk responsibility.The "Whitewashing" of Truth: Why engagement surveys often hide the very reality your gut is already sensing.Islands of Coherence: Moving away from failed global rollouts toward small, organic spaces where success can ripple outward.Augmented Intuition: Why judgment and reasoning are the core leadership skill sets of the future—not just data literacy.Acting on Incomplete Info: Why the most effective leaders prioritize speed and human signal over clinical perfection.Time-Stamped Highlights: (00:00) The "Signal Detection" superpower: Seeing the storm before the data does.(01:10) Data as a delay tactic: Are you seeking clarity or avoiding fallout?(10:46) Beyond the dashboard: Why your "inner knowing" is a valid metric.(12:40) The cost of waiting: Why "perfect data" creates stale strategies.(20:52) Leading through crisis: The power of acting on human signals.(25:29) How to build "Islands of Coherence" in a chaotic organization.Connect with Us: [Marissa on LinkedIn][Susan on LinkedIn]Brave Proximity on [Instagram] and [YouTube][www.braveproximity.com]Disclaimer: This podcast reflects personal experiences and perspectives. It is not intended as legal, HR, or organizational policy advice.

    27 min
  5. Apr 27

    Death by PowerPoint: Why Storytelling is the Next Great Leadership Capability

    Leaders who can't tell a story cannot move people. In an era of 80-page pre-reads and bullet-point fatigue, we’ve mistakenly treated storytelling as a charismatic "add-on" rather than a core leadership requirement. Today, Marissa and Susan put the elephant on the table: if you can’t inspire your team to join you on a journey, your strategy and your change initiatives are dead in the water. We explore why storytellers will win the next decade and how to find your "storytelling authenticity"—even if you aren't the charismatic type. From using AI to democratize inspiration to knowing when to give someone else the mic, it’s time to move away from the slide deck and get proximate to the power of connection. Key Insights: The Inspiration Deficit: Change management frameworks often focus on awareness but forget that inspiration is what actually gets people to jump on board. The "WIIFM" Factor: Your team doesn't care about the boxes in your framework; they care about why you’re doing this and what is in it for them. Democratizing Storytelling: You don’t have to be a "main stage" orator to be a storyteller. Use videos, images, or even AI-generated podcasts to deliver insights in human, conversational tones. Testing the Narrative: Good storytellers treat their message like a product—testing different storylines to see what resonates before a major rollout. The Magnet Effect: Leaders who communicate clearly and emotiely become "magnets" in an organization that people are drawn to to get work done. Poking Holes: Don’t fear resistance. When people ask tough questions about your story, consider it a gift of engagement rather than a negative experience. Time-Stamped Highlights: (00:00) Why storytellers are the biggest winners of the next decade. (01:16) The elephant in the room: Storytelling isn't a charismatic add-on; it's a capability. (05:14) Knowing when it’s not your job to be the "charismatic inspirer". (11:45) The strategy disconnect: Why "telling" people isn't the same as them understanding . (15:21) How AI is changing the storytelling game (and killing the PowerPoint). (21:03) Borrowing brilliance: Sourcing storytellers from sales and marketing functions . (25:40) Why storytelling is a highly marketable, demanded skill in the future of work. Disclaimer: The thoughts and opinions expressed on this show are our own and should not be taken as formal human resources or legal guidance. Website: www.braveproximity.com Marissa's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissa-green1/ Susan's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanraderpage/

    26 min
  6. Apr 21

    Burnout Is Not a Leadership Pipeline

    Leaders talk about development — and then expect people to do more, with less. Burnout isn’t a side effect. It’s a sign we’ve lost the plot on meaningful growth. Today, we talk about what it really takes to develop without depleting ourselves or others. Key Insights: Growth confused with piling on projects, with no additional support or pay.Organizations rebrand burnout as “stretch,” expecting high performers to self-develop while doing their day jobs.True development isn’t just about training; it’s about experience, experimentation, and honest support.Leaders often ask their teams to “just do it,” but rarely provide safety or space for failure.The importance of clear boundaries and brave conversations around roles, expectations, and exit strategies.Rethinking investment: shifting budgets from training to experiential learning that fosters real growth.The next generation won’t tolerate burnout like their predecessors. They call the therapist before the crash.Growth in entrepreneurship looks different: results, expansion of identity, and ownership — not just check-the-box tasks.Organizations must create safe, human connections, let people make mistakes, and honor their choices to leave or stay.Leaders and organizations need to rewrite the playbook — it’s not just about skills, but about shifting mindsets and deconditioning. Time-Stamped Highlights: (00:00) Burnout isn’t a leadership pipeline — it’s a failure to develop.(00:14) Organizations promise growth but deliver burnout.(06:18) Drawing boundaries is an act of development and self-respect.(08:43) Training programs alone don’t create real growth — coaching and experience do.(13:01) The environment shapes learning — it should feel safe, not sterile.(15:38) The future of growth isn’t inside companies as we know it.(16:06) Entrepreneurship exemplifies expansion of identity, not just skills.(17:25) Stop dressing people up for opportunities without giving them a place to grow into.(28:53) The core of sustainable growth: honest conversations and understanding motivations. Connect with Us: Marissa on LinkedIn Susan on LinkedIn BP on Instagram, YouTube www.braveproximity.com

    29 min
  7. Apr 13

    The Work No One Needs: The Real Reason We’re Drowning in Work That Doesn’t Matter

    “We’re so busy doing the 'work about the work' that we’ve forgotten what the mission actually was.” In this episode of Brave Proximity, Marissa and Susan unearth one of the most exhausting realities of the modern workplace: The Work No One Needs. We’re talking about the low-value, high-effort tasks—the endless decks, the performative spreadsheets, and the "updates about updates"—that keep us from doing the meaningful work we were hired to do. But this isn't just about bad processes. It’s about the fear that drives us to stay "busy" instead of being effective. We’re peeling back the layers of "Professional Distance" to understand why we keep saying yes to work that doesn't matter and how we can start reclaiming our time for the things that do. In this episode, we explore: The High Cost of Indifference: Why doing "fake work" is a sign that we’ve lost proximity to our mission.The Performative Trap: How we use "busyness" as a shield to avoid the discomfort of real, messy human leadership.The Courage to Delete: Why the most powerful thing a leader can do is stop a process that no longer serves a purpose.Finding Your "Why" Again: Tactical ways to audit your calendar and your team’s output to ensure you're focused on "Mission as Usual." If you’re feeling "soul-drained" by a calendar full of meetings about meetings, this conversation is your permission to stop the cycle. It’s time to move toward Brave Proximity—where we prioritize the work that actually moves the needle and have the courage to let the rest go. Ready to stop the busy-work? Download the S1 E7 Practice Guide: The Low-Value Work Audit at braveproximity.com to help you and your team identify the "Work No One Needs" and start doing the work that matters. Disclaimer: The thoughts and opinions expressed on this show are our own and should not be taken as formal human resources or legal guidance. Marissa's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissa-green1/ Susan's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanraderpage/

    28 min
5
out of 5
15 Ratings

About

Brave Proximity Hosted by Marissa Green & Susan Page Most leadership podcasts will tell you to "lean in," "build psychological safety," and "align your stakeholders." This isn't that podcast. Brave Proximity is for corporate change makers and people-centered leaders who are exhausted by performance theater and ready for honest conversations about what's actually happening in organizations today and how to build a more humane way forward. The name says it all: brave enough to stop avoiding, proximate enough to stop pretending. Each episode starts with the elephant in the room — the tension too real for a town hall, too human for a slide deck, and too costly to keep ignoring. We don't manage it. We move toward it. Hosts Marissa Green and Susan Page bring decades of real experience in strategy execution, culture, leadership development, and large-scale change — and zero tolerance for corporate euphemisms. Together they name what leaders are already feeling but rarely say out loud: that something essential keeps breaking down, and it isn't the strategy. Expect truth, a little irreverence, and the occasional moment where you think: oh thank god, I'm not crazy. This is for the leaders who know the frameworks aren't enough — and are ready to try proximity instead. About the Hosts Marissa Green has spent 20+ years helping organizations bring strategy and large-scale change to life through human-centered communication. Her conclusion after all of it: without real connection, even the best plans fail quietly. Susan Page is a culture builder and leadership developer with deep roots in Life Sciences, including a Brandon Hall Award for learning programs that actually moved the needle. She coaches through honest conversation — not polished ones. Together, they don't offer another leadership framework. They offer a different way of being with the work.

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