Wellness Law Podcast

Barbara Zabawa
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  • Alternative Health

Are you interested in or already have a wellness business? Perhaps you deliver employee wellness services, or practice as a health coach, functional medicine provider, lifestyle or relationship expert, spiritual coach, integrative and holistic health practitioner, or you invent wellness products and devices. Regardless of your role, you need to stay on top of the law that affects the wellness industry. This podcast will feature wellness industry experts and thought leaders and explain how the law affects what they do. You will learn about the latest lawsuits, investigations, and research that can help your wellness business reduce risk and thrive.

  1. Sep 21

    AMA CPT Codes Lawsuit & Corporate Wellness 2.0: Direct Primary Care and Employer Health Plan Disruption | Katie Talento

    Host Barbara Zabawa interviews naturopath and All Better Health/All Better Naturopathy CEO and former White House policy advisor Katie Talento about disrupting healthcare financing and benefits. Talento explains a lawsuit involving Patient Rights Advocate challenging the American Medical Association’s control and monetization of CPT billing codes, arguing codes required by law for Medicare, HIPAA compliance, Medicaid, employer claims, and federal price-transparency rules should not be copyrighted. She then describes All Better Health’s work helping employers replace traditional carrier and pharmacy benefit manager arrangements with independent, transparent vendors and fiduciary-minded contracts, while improving benefits through concierge/advanced primary care, nurse navigation, quality steering, and incentives like waived cost-sharing. They discuss “corporate wellness 2.0” centered on coordinated primary care and scalable direct primary care billed as claims, and a “wellness 3.0” vision incorporating functional care and holistic services. Connect with Katy here. 00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro 01:09 AMA CPT Codes Lawsuit 02:36 Why CPT Codes Matter 03:54 Patient Rights Advocate Fight 07:27 All Better Health Mission 09:41 Firing Carriers and PBMs 11:25 Better Benefits Through DPC 13:33 Corporate Wellness 2.0 15:16 Scaling Direct Primary Care 20:50 Wellness 3.0 and Wrap Up 21:42 Where to Connect 22:17 Podcast Closing Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  2. Sep 8

    Why Wellbeing Programs Fail Without Culture & Leadership: Dr. Rosie Ward

    Host Barbara Zabawa welcomes Dr. Rosie Ward, CEO and founder of Salveo Partners and author of Future-Proofing Leadership and How to Build a Thriving Culture at Work, to discuss her “thriving organization” pyramid, which places 21st-century organizational design and leadership/culture as the foundation and wellbeing programs at the apex. Ward explains her shift from traditional worksite wellness after concluding many programs and ROI claims were ineffective or based on flawed data, and argues organizations often “program” their way out of deeper issues like poor management, lack of mattering, and weak accountability. They discuss how embedding wellbeing into culture and employee experience can improve sustainability and reduce legal risk, including an example where a client’s culture and leadership investments helped in a government legal case. Ward also addresses the Affordable Care Act’s role in boosting but narrowing wellness into incentives-driven “wellness or else.” 00:00 Welcome and Introductions 01:06 The Thriving Organization Pyramid 02:01 From Wellness to Leadership 04:24 Culture Beats Programs 06:29 Legal Risk Reduction Story 08:44 Conference Demand and First Book 11:19 Did the ACA Help Wellness 14:00 Mattering Courage and Culture 16:28 Why Organizations Hire Rosie 19:29 Where to Find Dr Rosie Ward 20:06 Closing Thanks and Goodbye Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  3. Jul 27

    Community as Medicine: Open Source Wellness, YMCAs & Behavioral Prescriptions with Ben Emmert-Aronson

    On the Wellness Law Podcast, host Barbara Zabawa interviews Benjamin Emmert-Aronson, co-founder of Open Source Wellness (OSW), about creating a “behavioral pharmacy” that helps people act on common “behavioral prescriptions” like healthier eating, exercise, stress reduction, and social support—especially for patients in low-income communities who lack resources. Aronson describes OSW’s 90-minute weekly groups combining movement, mindfulness, health education, small-group health coaching, and group medical visits with primary care clinicians for 12-week continuity care. He explains OSW’s expansion through a national YMCA training cohort called the Community as Medicine Learning Collaborative, including clinic referral partnerships and evaluation and sustainability planning, and discusses addressing social determinants of health through produce partnerships and community-based YMCA resources. They also cover OSW’s corporate wellness events, nonprofit funding, and the tension between rigorous health coach credentialing and accessibility. 00:00 Welcome and Introductions 01:33 What Is Open Source Wellness 02:53 Behavioral Pharmacy Model 04:12 Scaling With YMCAs 06:22 Clinic Referrals in Practice 07:32 Who the Groups Serve 09:18 Group Medical Visits 10:11 Tackling Social Determinants 13:32 Corporate Wellness Events 15:39 Health Coach Training Access 19:56 Ethics Standards vs Licensure 22:20 How to Connect and Support 23:44 Podcast Closing Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  4. Jul 20

    Free Speech vs. Licensing Boards: The “Crappy Childhood Fairy” Coaching Case with Pacific Legal Foundation Attorney Christopher Barnewolt

    Attorney Christopher Barnewolt of the Pacific Legal Foundation joins the Wellness Law Podcast to discuss PLF’s lawsuit challenging the California Board of Psychology’s discipline of life coach Anna Runkle (the “Crappy Childhood Fairy”). Barnewolt explains that Runkle, who has openly stated she is not a psychologist or therapist, built a coaching business based on personal experience and techniques that helped her after a difficult childhood, including YouTube content, books, webinars, and paid coaching since 2016. After a 2023 complaint from an attendee in Maine alleging unlicensed practice, the Board issued a final order requiring a $2,500 fine and cessation of activity it deems licensed psychology. The conversation focuses on First Amendment protections, chilling effects on coaches, and the alleged overbroad, vague California definition of “practice of psychology,” while noting PLF’s nationwide pro bono work and related nursing-board overreach in Kansas. 00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro 01:21 Why This Lawsuit Matters 02:13 Anna Runkle Story and Business 03:35 Complaint and Board Discipline 06:19 Broader Pattern of Overreach 09:04 Pacific Legal Foundation Mission 10:14 Overbroad Psychology Definition 14:34 Chilling Effect on Coaches 15:39 Wellness Speech and Access to Care 19:26 Prior Restraint and Fraud Laws 21:13 Closing and Where to Learn More Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  5. Jul 13

    Using Data Science to Build Preventive, Legally Sound Workplace Wellness Programs

    Host Barbara Zabawa welcomes Dr. Romie Morales Rosado, a PhD-trained applied mathematician and data scientist and owner of Legacy Nova, to discuss how workplace wellness programs can better leverage data to prevent problems before they arise. Rosado explains her work helping leaders and institutions make proactive decisions by identifying emerging signals, improving how data is collected, defining a shared lexicon, and creating “connective tissue” across platforms so datasets can speak to each other. Zabawa links this approach to preventive law and the goal of designing employee wellness programs that improve wellbeing and reduce risks such as privacy or ADA-related complaints. They emphasize that organizations often already have the needed data, but require expert analysis to connect it, tell the right story, and answer the questions leadership thinks it is addressing. Contact information for Rosado and Wellness Law resources are provided. 00:00 Welcome to the Podcast 00:31 Meet Dr Romie 02:46 Preventive Law Mindset 04:13 Data Foundations and Lexicon 06:57 Wellness Data Opportunities 08:03 Connecting Data Sets 11:52 Turning Data Into Decisions 13:30 Closing and Contact Info 14:41 Outro and Resources Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  6. Jun 28

    Why Wellness Law Matters: Cynthia Stamer on Policy, ABA Advocacy, and Building Legal Infrastructure for Wellbeing

    Host Barbara Zabawa welcomes Cynthia Marcotte Stamer to the Wellness Law Podcast to discuss how multiple legal disciplines intersect with “wellness law” and why it should be recognized as a distinct practice area. Stammer, an employee benefits and labor and employment lawyer with deep experience in health plans and ACA/HIPAA-related reforms, describes her public health roots and focus on changing systems rather than helping one person at a time. She explains how the American Bar Association enabled early collaboration, mentoring, and policy advocacy that can drive community-wide legal change beyond the profession. Their conversation contrasts wellness and healthcare, highlights inequities between luxury wellness (e.g., med spas, peptides) and basic needs (housing, food, access to medications), and emphasizes multidisciplinary, people-centric infrastructure solutions informed by real-world barriers, especially after COVID. 00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro 03:23 Cynthia’s Wellness Roots 04:52 Building a Practice and the ABA 06:56 ABA Advocacy Beyond Lawyers 08:54 Why Wellness Law Matters 11:31 How New Practice Areas Emerge 14:12 Wellness vs Healthcare Systems 16:26 Med Spas Biohacking and Equity 22:23 Multidisciplinary Solutions via ABA 24:08 COVID Lessons and Systems Thinking 27:55 Closing Thanks and How to Connect 29:48 Podcast Outro and Resources Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  7. Jun 22

    Beyond Silos: Chase Sterling on the Wellbeing Think Tank & Outcomes-Based Wellness

    Host Barbara Zabawa welcomes Chase Sterling, executive director of the Wellbeing Think Tank, a 501(c)(3) founded in 2021 that convenes monthly events and an annual summit to elevate evidence-based, integrated workplace wellbeing practices. Sterling explains she created the organization after seeing workplace wellness treated too narrowly and siloed, arguing wellbeing at work requires supporting individuals while changing organizational systems such as leadership, environment, and policies. The conversation covers a rise in outcomes-based programs tied to biometric standards and healthcare-cost pressures, and the need for employers to stop placing responsibility solely on employees and instead ensure workplaces “at a bare minimum” do not cause harm. Sterling shares tactics for influencing leadership by aligning wellbeing initiatives to business problems, using data, and addressing barriers like paid time for preventive care and manager accountability. 00:00 Welcome and Introductions 01:16 What Is Think Tank 04:19 Outcomes Programs Return 06:40 Shared Responsibility at Work 12:03 Selling to Leadership 15:48 Preventive Care Example 18:21 Who Leads Implementation 22:02 How to Get Involved 23:14 Podcast Closing Notes Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

  8. Jun 13

    Setting Standards for Health & Wellness Coaching in Healthcare - Jennifer Lundman

    Host Barbara Zabawa interviews Jennifer Lundman, executive director of the Institute for Behavior Change, about why the Institute was founded in the last year to develop credible, sustainable standards for health and wellness coaching—especially for coaches working inside healthcare systems. Lundman describes collaborating with coaches, health systems, and healthcare professionals to confront skepticism and stigma around “wellness,” clarify scope of practice, and build governance, integrity, and evidence for the profession. She shares that the Institute has developed standards, psychometrically validated competencies, and will launch a beta exam soon, with next steps including advocacy, implementation science-based clinical workflows, and research to strengthen generalizable evidence and expand access in underserved communities. They discuss billing codes as still “to be determined” and announce the Catalyst Convening in Columbia, Missouri (July 31 reception; August 1–2 main event), with details at instituteforbehaviorchange.org. 00:00 Welcome and Introductions 01:13 What Is the Institute 03:22 Why Standards Matter 05:09 Healthcare Skepticism and Scope 09:10 Validated Competencies and Exam 10:04 Implementation and Research Pillars 13:12 Protecting Coaching as a Profession 15:43 Billing Codes Reality Check 17:10 Catalyst Convening Details 19:34 Wrap Up and Resources Learn more about Wellness Law at www.wellnesslaw.com.

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About

Are you interested in or already have a wellness business? Perhaps you deliver employee wellness services, or practice as a health coach, functional medicine provider, lifestyle or relationship expert, spiritual coach, integrative and holistic health practitioner, or you invent wellness products and devices. Regardless of your role, you need to stay on top of the law that affects the wellness industry. This podcast will feature wellness industry experts and thought leaders and explain how the law affects what they do. You will learn about the latest lawsuits, investigations, and research that can help your wellness business reduce risk and thrive.

Information

  • Creator
    Barbara Zabawa
  • Years Active
    2026
  • Episodes
    48
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2026 Wellness Law Podcast
  • Show Website
    Wellness Law Podcast