Startups For the Rest of Us

Rob Walling
  • 4.9 (706)
  • Entrepreneurship
  • Weekly

The original podcast for bootstrapped and mostly bootstrapped startups, this show follow the stories of founders as they start, acquire, and grow SaaS companies. Hear when they fail, struggle, succeed, and take you with them through the tumultuous life of a SaaS founder. If you like Mixergy, This Week in Startups, or SaaStr, you’ll enjoy Startup for the Rest of Us.

  1. 3d ago

    Episode 858 | How to Build Products People Want

    If AI can build anything, how do you decide what to build?  In this episode, Rob Walling celebrates the launch of his sixth book, Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants in the Age of AI. He shares why he wrote it, how it started as part of The SaaS Playbook, and why he rewrote it three times. Plus, why every second- and third-time founder still validates before they build, and why AI can speed up building but not learning. Topics we cover: (0:41) – Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants in the Age of AI is available (2:32) – Why Rob wrote another book (4:56) – How the book began inside The SaaS Playbook (6:33) – Rewriting the book three times (8:57) – Why validation still matters with AI (10:50) – Grinding until the work finally clicks (12:22) – Endorsements from Jason Cohen and Derek Sivers  (15:28) – Who Idea to Traction is for (16:25) – What the book covers, from ideas to traction (18:26) – SaaS isn't dead, and moats keep changing Links from the show: Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants in the Age of AI by Rob Walling | Out Today! Start Small, Stay Small by Rob Walling  The SaaS Playbook SaaS Launchpad MicroConf TinySeed Ruben Gamez | LinkedIn Jordan Gal | LinkedIn Bryan Shankman | LinkedIn  LeadTruffle  Jason Cohen (@asmartbear) | X Smart Bear Live Derek Sivers The Dip by Seth Godin  Ep. 834 | Eric Ries Revisits The Lean Startup and Discusses How to Become Incorruptible Ep. 855 | The Eight SaaS Moats that Still Work in the Age of AI The Only SaaS Moats Left in 2026 | MicroConf Rob’s talk Rob Walling | YouTube If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

  2. Nov 3

    Episode 857 | Finding Hidden Multipliers in Your Business (with Jason Cohen)

    What if raising your prices could actually bring in more customers?  In this episode, Rob Walling welcomes back Jason Cohen, founder of WP Engine and SmartBear, to dig into his book, Hidden Multipliers. They talk about finding your profit whales, why raising prices can actually increase sales, and how pitching more value instead of savings can 8x what you charge. Jason also shares the free AI skills he built to grill founders like a rude journalist, and why the best strategy starts with building a company in the shape of you. Episode Sponsors: You're about to close a massive deal, and then your customer's legal team asks what happens if you get hacked.  That's the nightmare YSecurity solves. They're 40 security engineers who've worked at Apple, Uber, Microsoft, Robinhood, Brex, and more. You don't hire them, you rent them by the hour, no massive salary, no expensive consultants. Just real experts helping you get SOC 2, ISO, and more. Set a monthly cap, know exactly what you're spending, and close the deal.  Head to ysecurity.io/startups to book your free strategy call. Your first 8 hours are completely free. Topics we cover: (3:23) – Why Jason finally wrote his first book (5:38) – What makes a multiplier "hidden" (8:06) – Profit whales and your unprofitable customers (14:40) – Raising prices from $35 to $1,300 a seat (18:44) – Why WP Engine lowered its entry price (23:08) – Selling more value instead of savings (28:35) – Charging for implementation and price testing on calls (31:32) – Free AI skills and finding your Carol (38:37) – Inside the Smart Bear Live podcast (41:41) – Building a company in the shape of you Links from the show: MicroConf US 2027┃Austin, April 18–20, 2027 | Promo Code: ROB50 for $50 off TinySeed SaaS Institute Hidden Multipliers by Jason Cohen Skills from A Smart Bear Smart Bear Live A Smart Bear Blog How repositioning a product allows you to 8x its price Rude Q&A: The constructive devil’s advocate WP Engine SmartBear SpareFoot Capital Factory Gallup CliftonStrengths (StrengthsFinder) Jason Cohen | LinkedIn Jason Cohen (@asmartbear) | X If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: i...

  3. Oct 27

    Episode 856 | Key Learnings from MicroConf Europe 2026

    What did you miss at our biggest MicroConf Europe ever? In this episode, Rob Walling and Derrick Reimer recap MicroConf Europe 2026 in Reykjavik, Iceland. They break down the talks on ranking in ChatGPT and AI SEO, Rob's eight moats that still work in the age of AI, and Corey Haines on marketing skills for Claude. Plus, the hallway track, a stunning venue, and a hike to a geothermal river at the top of an Icelandic mountain. Topics we cover: (2:11) – Traveling to Iceland and Rob's road trips (5:12) – Biggest MicroConf Europe ever, by the numbers (8:04) – The Harpa venue and the hallway track (13:30) – George Chasiotis and Aleyda Solis on AI SEO (19:44) – Jacob Wright on UX as a moat (21:26) – Agnese Jaunošāne on riding the AI wave (23:25) – Rob's talk: eight moats in the AI age (34:00) – Will AI stop writing human-readable code? (38:14) – Corey Haines on marketing skills for Claude (41:01) – Excursions and a geothermal river hike Links from the show: Idea to Traction | Pre-order before November 10th and claim the complete pre-order bundle MicroConf Events | Use promo code ROB50 for $50 off your ticket MicroConf US | Austin, Texas on April 18 - 20, 2027 MicroConf Europe | Dubrovnik, Croatia · Oct 3–5, 2027 TinySeed SaaS Institute Harpa Concert Hall and Conference Centre  The SaaS Playbook George Chasiotis  Minuttia  Aleyda Solis | LinkedIn Dabble Writer Agnese Jaunošāne | LinkedIn  Ajelix  Einar Vollset (@einarvollset) | X  Anthony Eden | LinkedIn  DNSimple Campfire by ONCE  Corey Haines | LinkedIn  Marketing Skills for AI Agents by Corey Haines  Conversion Factory Ep. 830 | Breaking Through Plateaus, Zero-Click Marketing, and More from MicroConf 2026 (with Derrick Reimer) SavvyCal (Derrick Reimer) Derrick Reimer (@derrickreimer) | X Derrick Reimer | LinkedIn If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! ...

  4. Oct 20

    Episode 855 | The Eight SaaS Moats that Still Work in the Age of AI

    Which SaaS moats are left in 2026? In this episode, Rob Walling and Einar Vollset walk through the 10 ways AI is attacking SaaS companies, from customers vibe coding the app to per-seat revenue disappearing entirely. They then dig into the 8 moats they believe still work in the age of AI, with real examples like Stripe, Gusto, SignWell, and Gymdesk.  They finish with how founders can go on offense, including why the biggest opportunity may be to stop selling the tool and start doing the work. Topics we cover: (06:02) – The SaaSpocalypse and conflicting market signals (07:24) – How Einar researched durable SaaS moats (11:48) – Which SaaS businesses AI will flatten (14:20) – Attacks 1 and 2: Customers vibe code, competitors catch up (16:52) – Attack 3: Open source gets good enough (17:23) – Attack 4: Platforms ship your feature free (18:06) – Attack 5: Custom software at SaaS-ish prices (19:11) – Attack 6: AI models absorb your product (19:57) – Attack 7: Your customers stop existing (21:48) – Attack 8: Per-seat revenue disappears (22:45) – Attack 9: The roles you serve vanish (23:25) – Attack 10: Your workflow step becomes obsolete (24:09) – Old moats that no longer protect you (25:56) – Eight moats that still work today (26:30) – Moat 1: Buyers know and trust you (28:28) – Moat 2: You're the system of record (30:10) – Moat 3: You're allowed to act (31:28) – Moat 4: Customers don't check your work (32:51) – Moat 5: Someone official already said yes (36:08) – Moat 6: Everyone's already in it (38:03) – Moat 7: Every customer makes you smarter (40:47) – Moat 8: It's hard to keep running (44:14) – How do we not get sideswiped by AI? (54:46) – Why learning loops are the strongest moat Links from the show: Moats Slides, Summary, and Live Q&A TinySeed MicroConf Discretion Capital SignWell Gymdesk  Reimbi  Sidekick Learning Ep. 851 | The Messy Middle of a SaaS Pivot Stripe Radar Gusto ScrapingBee Pieter Levels X post 10x Is Easier Than 2x by Dan Sullivan and Dr. Benjamin Hardy  Ep. 842 | What is the Future of SaaS in an AI World? (Rob Solo) Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X Einar Vollset (@einarvollset) | X If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upco...

  5. Oct 13

    Episode 854 | How to Find Startup Ideas (Sneak Peek Chapter from My New Book)

    Where do the best SaaS ideas actually come from? In this episode, Rob reads a chapter from his new book, Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants in the Age of AI. He walks through the five places problems tend to show up, eight strategic approaches for finding and shaping a product idea (with real examples), and when it makes sense to replicate an existing idea. Pre-order the hardback before November 10th to get bonus PDFs, a seat in a live Q&A to ask your early stage questions, and a free copy of the ebook or audiobook ideatotractionbook.com. Topics we cover: (1:41) – Why Rob wrote Idea to Traction (3:29) – What the new book covers (6:03) – Pre-order bonuses and live Q&A (7:32) – Chapter three: how to find startup ideas (9:09) – Solve a problem, not a moonshot (10:34) – Five places problems come from (12:52) – Approach 1: Translate an idea to a new niche (13:50) – Approach 2: Find a hated competitor (14:57) – Approach 3: Build on your audience (16:04) – Approach 4: Build on your network (16:50) – Approach 5: Undercut a clunky enterprise competitor (17:49) – Approach 6: Enter a fast-growing ecosystem (19:15) – Approach 7: Build on an existing product (20:13) – Approach 8: Audit your day job spending (21:20) – Can you replicate an existing idea? Links from the show: Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants in the Age of AI Start Small, Stay Small  The SaaS Playbook MicroConf State of Independent SaaS Report  TinySeed The Stair Step Method of Bootstrapping Derek Sivers Jason Cohen Basecamp WP Engine Builder Prime Bidsketch  SignWell SparkToro ScrapingBee  ScatterSpoke  Clarity.fm  DealForma  ScoutDNS Baremetrics StaticKit SavvyCal Seriously Simple Podcasting / Castos  CartHook  If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review:

  6. Oct 6

    Episode 853 | How to Become the SaaS That AI Recommends

    How do you get LLMs to actually recommend your SaaS?  In this episode, Rob Walling talks with Ross Hudgens, founder of Siege Media and author of the new book Generative Engine Optimization, about how SaaS companies get recommended by ChatGPT, Gemini, and the AI tools customers now use to shop. They cover why "best X" roundups and versus articles outperform, how much Reddit actually matters, and what a bootstrapped founder should do first to start showing up in AI search.  Topics we cover: (1:28) – SEO's evolution into GEO (3:01) – Why Ross wrote his new AI SEO book (3:58) – An S&P 100 client's SEO team gets laid off (5:29) – Is GEO separate from traditional SEO? (6:33) – Why publish "best category" roundup articles (11:06) – Versus articles: an underrated GEO tactic (14:14) – Handling competitor pushback on comparison pages (16:57) – Recruiting YouTubers and using affiliate listings (21:47) – Reddit's real influence on AI search (25:38) – First GEO steps and how to measure visibility Links from the show: MicroConf US | April 18–20, 2027 · Austin, TX | Promocode: ROB50 TinySeed Siege Media Generative Engine Optimization: The Definitive Guide to AI SEO Peec AI G2 Capterra PartnerStack SelectSoftwareReviews Technology Advice SelectSoftware Reviews Limelight  Passionfroot If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

  7. Sep 29

    Episode 852 | Getting Big Name Customer Case Studies and More Listener Questions (with Ruben Gamez)

    Should you be worried that another founder will steal your idea if you ask them for advice? In this episode, Rob is joined by Ruben Gamez to answer four listener questions: whether reaching out to more advanced founders puts your idea at risk, how to convince big name customers to agree to a case study, what to do when a platform ecosystem (like Shopify's app store) turns hostile, and how to sell a B2G SaaS product when your sales cycle only runs during the hours you're already at a day job. Want to get your question answered? Submit your question for an upcoming episode. Topics we cover: (1:59) – Fear that outreach could get an idea stolen (3:50) – Why no one actually steals ideas (9:12) – Getting copied is inevitable once you're public (13:45) – How to land big brand case studies (15:39) – Using discounts to secure case studies (18:11) – Shopify's fake review extortion (20:21) – Should you move to a standalone SaaS (25:06) – B2G SaaS around a day job (28:29) – Why GovTech rarely attracts angel investment Links from the show: Tiny Summit | December 5–7, 2026 · Cancun, Mexico TinySeed SaaS Institute MicroConf SignWell Ruben Gamez (@earthlingworks) | X If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

  8. Sep 22

    Episode 851 | The Messy Middle of a SaaS Pivot

    How do you pivot your SaaS when things aren’t working? This week Rob talks with Nathan Tyler, founder of BlinkMetrics, about the messy, uncertain process of finding product market fit in real time. Nathan walks through why his original EOS scorecard idea didn't work, how hundreds of coffee chats led to a done for you reporting business, and why he just launched a second product, BlinkPages, right in the middle of it all. Topics we cover: (2:43) – The Staging Pilot exit to Pantheon (4:44) – BlinkMetrics origin story (5:59) – 104 coffee chats, real revenue (8:09) – Why not launch 12 products in 12 weeks (9:39) – Launching a second product: BlinkPages (13:09) – Squarespace to BlinkPages migration (17:03) – Why static sites beat WordPress now (21:02) – Knowing when to pivot (25:26) – Market pull vs. shiny object (32:10) – Pricing migrations, hosting, and AI costs Links from the show: Get your Ticket for MicroConf US - Austin, Texas on April 18 - 20, 2027 | Use promo code ROB50  BlinkMetrics BlinkPages The SaaS Playbook Exit Strategy Book Nathan Tyler | LinkedIn  If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you! Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

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4.9
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706 Ratings

About

The original podcast for bootstrapped and mostly bootstrapped startups, this show follow the stories of founders as they start, acquire, and grow SaaS companies. Hear when they fail, struggle, succeed, and take you with them through the tumultuous life of a SaaS founder. If you like Mixergy, This Week in Startups, or SaaStr, you’ll enjoy Startup for the Rest of Us.

Information

  • Creator
    Rob Walling
  • Years Active
    2010 - 2026
  • Episodes
    329
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © 2025 Startups For the Rest of Us
  • Show Website
    Startups For the Rest of Us

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